N8/N25/N40 - Dunkettle Interchange [open to traffic]

hans aus dtschl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119388170#Comment_119388170

I had the Southbound Bloomflield/Carrs Hill in mind, where people are trying to take the Rochestown slip at the same time as people are trying to get to Carrs Hill. Again, speed limited and it's generally OK. I don't think I've seen crashes there

DylanQuestion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119388422#Comment_119388422

I agree about Douglas, especially as most people know the West exit as South Douglas Road and the East exit as (main/front) Douglas Road. Most people also have no idea what R610 or R851 mean. I agree that S DOUGLAS RD | GRANGE for Douglas (West) and DOUGLAS | BALLINLOUGH for Douglas (East) makes much more sense. Rochestown wouldn't work as the next junction is labelled for Rochestown, same as how Blackrock would probably be better for Douglas East but that's already further down the road. I also think Turner's Cross could work here. Around 2012, the council replaced all "City Centre" signs on the South Douglas Road with "Turner's Cross"

AugustusMinimus

One other point from driving past this morning. They’ve really started work on the Tunnel to N8 (City Centre) movement. An easy win to get done too. I think they were delaying this due to upgrades between Dunkettle Interchange and Dunkettle Roundabout which saw reduction to one lane at times.

Chris_5339762

I'm not 100% sure that'll open immediately - my guess is they need that space for four lanes of diversions - ie: move the current stuff out of the tunnel northbound to the west a bit, so they can build the N25(W) - M8(N) embankment where those lanes and the current roundabout is at the moment. I don't know if there'll be space to build the N40(N) to N8(Cork) freeflow.

Once the Little Island junction is partially opened I reckon a lot will change quite quickly though. Close the Ibis sliproad and open M8(S) to N25(E) within a week.

freshpopcorn

Sort of off topic I know but keep an eye out for it!

DylanQuestion

Good. If they want it to be 60km/h, the current situation was dangerous as a lot of people chose to ignore it. This was likely a dangerous situation as those drivers then try to overtake people going the actual speed limit. I think 60km/h is way too slow for the area, but speed limits aren't advisory

KrisW1001

About time. I’ll admit to breaking that speed limit every time I’ve driven that stretch, but I find that if I do anything less than 80 km/h in the 60 zone, cars behind me will start aggressively tailgating and/or trying dangerous passing moves.

hans aus dtschl

Yep absolutely. Genuinely difficult/dangerous to do 60 there at the moment.

Mother Trucker

Let them tailgate. They're breaking the law and/or driving dangerously, not you.

AugustusMinimus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119395741#Comment_119395741

That’s great until they crash into you which at worst will lead to damage to your car, potential need to rent a car, hours of trying to get a claim on the others insurance and hours spent dealing with the claim. At worst the claim could be contested. No thanks.

hans aus dtschl

I have a reasonably high threshold for ignoring tailgating, but with kids in the car and large vehicles a metre from the bumper, going through a building site I must admit I sometimes react

Mother Trucker

Fair point, I suppose.

I guess it's different if you're in a rig instead of a car, full of kids.

Chris_5339762

Speed enforcement was actually mentioned in the last email update! No-one spotted it!

DylanQuestion

I definitely find it hard to stay at 60km/h, but I do. If someone wants to break the speed limit, that is their choice and they are free to overtake (although I completely understand how hard it is not to break to the pressure of someone behind trying to speed you up). Whether you agree with it or not, the speed limit is the speed limit

AugustusMinimus

Looking at todays drone video, I’m convinced that before the roundabout stops being used, that the Tunnel to N25 east movement will be facilitate by a temporary slip road off the roundabout and under the new M8 bridges. The gradient to go under the M8 bridges I don’t think is an issue.

that will eliminate the need for the current roundabout to N25 east slip and facilitate construction of the loop for the N8 east to Tunnel movement.

cantalach

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119403400#Comment_119403400

But isn’t what you describe essentially what the final Link A will be? Coming out of the tunnel, Link A follows the line of the existing traffic flow but then goes off the existing roundabout to drop down under the new M8 bridges. I fully agree though that that needs to happen (along with opening ST09 for the N8-S to N25-E movement) before they can build the N25-E to N40-S movement.

AugustusMinimus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119417289#Comment_119417289

The slip off the roundabout I’m describing can only start to decline after coming off the roundabout.

You rightly point out that Link A will follow a similar path. However, I don’t think it’s gradient will be as steep as it can start to decline much earlier (Likely on the south side of the current flyover).

cantalach

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119417443#Comment_119417443

Yes, agreed. The final Link A will hopefully be a metre or more lower than the level of the current roundabout at that point so as to make for a less steep descent down under the new M8 bridges. That said, I passed through the Red Cow Interchange yesterday (the M50-S to N7-W movement) and I was really struck by how steep some of the gradients are.

Chris_5339762

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slAJMbYOdAg

New Dronehawk video out today.

I still think quite a bit will change suddenly once the new Little Island junction opens. That immediately allows the Ibis Slip to close, provided the junction is tied into the current arrangement temporarily, and the M8S to N25E to open.

hans aus dtschl

I just spotted the huge amount of work going on at either side of the tunnel itself: hadn't noticed that until now!

Also some very strange earth work going on to the East of the new Little Island link road (from 4:40 onwards). That's all going to need to be undone by the Co Co in the next year or two. Frustrating to see that, they're not co-ordinating well here.

Also, the slip/merge that we've all discussed at length is finally visible at 6:20 and 8:07 now, with cones helpfully laid out showing us the lanes/flows! For the first time it's fully confirmed to me that the Dublin/N8 traffic definitely will have to weave across the Tunnel/N40 to Little Island traffic to get to East Cork.

cantalach

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119418888#Comment_119418888

Why do you say that they’ll need to undo those earthworks to the east of the new Little Island link road? Apologies if I’m missing something really obvious.

mcburns07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119421432#Comment_119421432

Yeah I'm curious about this too

hans aus dtschl

Yes, I used the phrase "ALL going to need to be undone" but to be fair that's hyperbole. More accurately, SOME of it will need to be undone.

There's an approved Co Co scheme to bring a pedestrian and cycle route in to Eastgate from the West, as part of the "Little Island Sustainable Transport Interventions" scheme. Unfortunately with the revamp of the Cork Co Co website, most of the original links are no longer available so you'll have to trust me that I didn't just invent this myself but it was approved by Council in 2021. The PDF is 15MB so I've just added a snippet here. One of the better Co Co schemes I've seen if I'm honest.

Little Island Sustainable Transport Interventions.PNG

For clarity on what I'm saying, at 4:53 or so in the video there's a very nice fence, there's a kerb on either side of the link road, and there's a green mound of earth on the right (East). That's where the drawing I've attached is located. So they'll need to change the kerbs, break through the fence and move a chunk of that green mound. It's frustrating because that green mound is all new: it was previously a tarred, flat, lined road. Soon a team from the council will need to move the mound and put in....a flat, tarred road!

So it seems like the tunnel scheme designers doing are something without knowledge (or maybe care?) about the Council designers. A missed opportunity, is all, not a major issue.

Pete_Cavan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119422525#Comment_119422525

Ah the interchange project predates that by years, of course it wasnt considered in the design. The work that "needs to be undone" seem very small, particularly as part of a much bigger package of works. They could get Sisk to dig out some of the mound now but it would still have to be paid for and it would serve no purpose yet. I dont see how it is a missed opportunity at all, the Little Island Sustainable Transport Interventions just does that little bit, along with all the other work it requires.

Is there any reason why they cant have buses turn off the new link road to get onto that road and over to the proposed bus gate road? That would seem to be something which would give buses a big time advantage, rather than having to compete with cars at the junction further south.

hans aus dtschl

Yep it's not a major issue. I was just hoping to have this junction/opening completed during the link road works because it will be very attractive. Even without the Eastgate section completed, it will cut some distance and will be on a quiet route. As I say, one of the better Co Co schemes, so I'm disappointed to see that they didn't get the interchange team to not bother completing the earthworks, kerb, fence there, and speed up end delivery.

I'm not saying that Sisk should dig out the mound now, only that they could have been told not to bother with it in the first place! Probably a few days work wasted on both projects, that's what I meant by missed opportunity.

You're right about the bus turn. Yesterday before I looked at the drawing, I had thought that the bus also went through that gap, and I thought that even more earthworks would need to be undone. I don't know what their rationale was but all I can think of is that the bus route is bi-directional. They wouldn't want West-bound buses joining the link road at that point and maybe they weren't comfortable with "splitting" the West-bound route from the East-bound route? Just a guess.

DylanQuestion

The VMS signs have had some rejigging. The destinations shown so far have been:

• N40 J1 (N22)
• N40 J6 (N27)
• N40 J9 (N28)
• CITY CENTRE (N27)
• AIRPORT
• RINGASKIDDY
• M8 J18

They have now been updated to also include:

• N40 J11 D'KETT (swaps between just N40 J11, adding D'KETT and adding D'KETTLE depending on size)
• N25 J2
• N40 J3 (N71)
• J10 MAHON
• CITY (N8) out at Carrigtwohill

It makes way more sense adding these extra ones, especially in places like N28 at Maryborough where N25 J2 replaces N40 J1. They should make it a bit clearer though I think that N25 J2 is Little Island. I imagine most people don't know the road numbers, let alone the junction numbers. I think they should have instead:

• N40 J1 BALLINCOLLIG (N22)
• N40 J3 BISHOPSTOWN (N71)
• N40 J6 KINSALE ROAD (N27)
• N40 J9 BLOOMFIELD (N28)
• N40 J10 MAHON (R852)
• N40 J11 DUNKETTLE
• M8 J18 GLANMIRE
• N25 J2 LITTLE ISLAND
• CITY CENTRE (N27/N8)
• AIRPORT (N27)
• RINGASKIDDY (N28)

That covers all the major junctions with other national primary roads, the main employment/industry hubs and the main transport hubs

marno21

N40 J3 N71 was always there westbound just after the Togher exit but it was out of action for several months. It's completely useless anyway as its never more than 2 mins from there to the destination unless there's a crash in which case the sign changes to tell you there's a crash.

Good to see the proper destinations finally added, I had always assumed they were waiting for works to advance at Dunkettle so the civil works for these cameras could be done. Dunkettle and Little Island are destinations that vary far more and provide far more useful information on the N40.

The reason they show "N40 J6 (N27)" instead of what you suggest is because there is a short character limit of 12-13 characters on these signs to make them readable at 100km/h. This won't be changing unfortunately.

Chris_5339762

Good. I'd be intrigued to see quite how they all serve what. It always bugged me that there was no N25 J2 or M8 J18 VMS coming eastbound before the Kinsale Road junction - which is prescisely where you'd want to divert. Maybe that was purposeful, I dunno.

The other problem I have is that there is no VMS coming from Cobh until you hit Little Island. I feel there should be an extra one westbound just after Cobh. The one on the Carrigtwohill bypass I think it badly situated.

AugustusMinimus

Some works focusing on Links A and E. Given the current N25 surfacing to tie these 2 links into the N25, we could see an opening for both links in the next few months. Link E in particular could open with very little work.

Mushy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119432348#Comment_119432348

Probably not going to happen, but assume anything to do with the flyover there won't be for ages, looked like a huge amount of work left to do on the northern side of that dumbell. Was hoping that'd be much further along, but guess they need to allow construction traffic use the bridge more.