A job vacancy!! We are in fu**ed

javaboy

SWL wrote: »

Yes i have

Gis a job.

thelordofcheese

SWL wrote: »

Yes i have

I suspected as much. Best of luck with that, but i still don't agree it's the panacea for this crisis.

green123

Dudess wrote: »

Jesus ****ing wept... again: there is no guarantee all of those people are foreign, just because they have brown skin. Yes, most of them are likely to be foreign, but there is no guarantee all of them are, because a significant number of brown-skinned people are Irish. You have no way of knowing this til you speak to every one of them. It's not me being at pains to be "PC", it's just being logical instead of hysterical.
Where did you get the 99% from? Oh actually I've a fair idea...

I think very few would dispute it is an issue of major concern if there are too many people coming into this country to live when the economy is in such a bad way, but what's being objected to is the blanket "all the foreigners in this country are out to fleece us" crap


What the ****? Irish people are on the dole and emigrating, not because the economy is down the ****ter but because the jobs are all going to the immigrants? Priceless.

... because the door has been left wide open for them. But it's so much easier to blame all foreign workers indiscriminately.

Do you have stats for this "cherry picking" you speak of? Anyhoo, again, if Ireland is the soft touch, then it's Ireland's fault.

Blame the system.

most of the people applying for jobs with dark skin are not irish. 99% i said, you thought i was so very wrong. i was only 4% out.
so you were wrong.
15 - 20 years ago there was almost nobody in this country with dark skin, so therefore the people with dark skin, who are of an age old enough to be applying for jobs are not irish.

they are out to fleece us, they are here for their own gains.
they are not here to do ireland a favour.
ok yeah the system is soft, the door is wide open, but that is still no reason to come here and take advantage of the system, and make fools of the irish and ireland.

90% of new jobs are going to immigrants, so yes it is immigrants fault that irish cant get jobs and have to go on the dole.
how can you argue with that ?
ok maybe irish dont want them jobs but if no immigrants took the job, then the irish would have to take it

javaboy

green123 wrote: »

most of the people applying for jobs with dark skin are not irish. 99% i said, you thought i was so very wrong. i was only 4% out.
so you were wrong.

How was she wrong? She didn't say there wasn't a foreign majority. She said we cannot know yet. In fact she said they most likely are all foreign.

they are out to fleece us, they are here for their own gains.

Foreign people applying for a job are out to fleece us? How?

Dudess

green123 wrote: »

most of the people applying for jobs with dark skin are not irish. 99% i said, you thought i was so very wrong. i was only 4% out.
so you were wrong.

How was I "wrong"? I didn't say anything for definite - I just urged people to be openminded and not dive straight into making assumptions. I didn't say many of those people weren't Irish, I said to just bear in mind that a number of them (even if small) might be. And I mentioned the 99% because you didn't actually get it from anywhere, you just said it. Oh and speaking of "wrong" YOU were actually wrong in this case - if the figure is 95%... but where did you get that from?

15 - 20 years ago there was almost nobody in this country with dark skin, so therefore the people with dark skin, who are of an age old enough to be applying for jobs are not irish.

You said "almost nobody", not "nobody".

they are out to fleece us, they are here for their own gains.
they are not here to do ireland a favour.

Who's "they"?

ok yeah the system is soft, the door is wide open, but that is still no reason to come here and take advantage of the system, and make fools of the irish and ireland.

Of course it is. And why is it "making fools of the Irish and Ireland"? The Irish government and its FF voters are doing a very good job of that already.

90% of new jobs are going to immigrants, so yes it is immigrants fault that irish cant get jobs and have to go on the dole.
how can you argue with that ?

I'll tell you how I can argue with that: someone has to give those immigrants the jobs, the immigrants don't hold a gun to their heads, so it's not the immigrants' fault. I know though, you just want an easy target to blame.

ok maybe irish dont want them jobs but if no immigrants took the job, then the irish would have to take it

Skewed logic if ever there was an example.

green123

javaboy wrote: »

How was she wrong? She didn't say there wasn't a foreign majority. She said we cannot know yet. In fact she said they most likely are all foreign.

she tried to make out that i was was way off the mark.
she was wrong because i was not way off the mark. infact i was very close.
too complicated for you to work out ?

Dudess wrote: »

How was I "wrong"? I didn't say anything for definite - I just urged people to be openminded and not dive straight into making assumptions. I didn't say many of those people weren't Irish, I said to just bear in mind that a number of them (even if small) might be. And I mentioned the 99% because you didn't actually get it from anywhere, you just said it. Oh and speaking of "wrong" YOU were actually wrong in this case - if the figure is 95%... but where did you get that from?


I'll tell you how I can argue with that: someone has to give those immigrants the jobs, the immigrants don't hold a gun to their heads, so it's not the immigrants' fault. I know though, you just want an easy target to blame.

you were wrong in trying to make out that i was way off the mark with my guess.
the 95% figure was linked to already in the thread if you read it properly, and it was a quote from the employers in a newspaper.

if the immigrants were not here, then the employers would have to give the jobs that are created in ireland to irish people.

dr.bollocko

green123 wrote: »

if the immigrants were not here, then the employers would have to give the jobs that are created in ireland to irish people.

Any first world economy thrives on immigration.

Your point of view is far too simplistic in a global economy. You can't just kick out all the immigrants and assume everything will be OK as a result.
Cos it won't be.

Dudess

green123 wrote: »

she tried to make out that i was was way off the mark.
she was wrong because i was not way off the mark. infact i was very close.
too complicated for you to work out ?
you were wrong in trying to make out that i was way off the mark with my guess.

Nope. I was just pointing out how you pulled the figure of 99% out of your arse - I wasn't suggesting you were way off the mark, just finding it amusing that a person would post a figure here they plucked from thin air... and not feel a bit silly

if the immigrants were not here, then the employers would have to give the jobs that are created in ireland to irish people.

Well yes, and there needs to be control on immigration (doubt the government has been letting so many immigrants in though out of the good of its heart) but until then, blame the system. Don't blame immigrants for coming here to work when they probably can't get jobs at home (I emphasise "work" not social welfare scamming before you bring that up - because this thread is about a particular job). And again, students from outside the EU (hugely comprised of Asians) are pumping extremely badly needed money into the third level sector.

Acacia

green123 wrote: »

they are out to fleece us, they are here for their own gains.
they are not here to do ireland a favour.
ok yeah the system is soft, the door is wide open, but that is still no reason to come here and take advantage of the system, and make fools of the irish and ireland.

ok maybe irish dont want them jobs but if no immigrants took the job, then the irish would have to take it

Oh my god- people coming to another country to work and earn money- are here FOR THEIR OWN GAINS? :eek: Shock-horror.

Wow, a little paranoid, aren't we. Who exactly is 'out to fleece us'? As far as I can see the only people making fools of the Irish are the Irish themselves for voting in this crap government and letting them get away with so much. Including this 'soft system'.

But hey, it's always easier to blame the Polish lad working in Spar than to get off our own asses and do something about that.

Scapegoating, I think they call it.

Your last sentence makes absolutely no sense- so you don't want them to take the jobs they've been offered? Should they instead go on the dole?

Immigrants can't win here- they're either ''tuking our jawbs'' or ''dole-spongers''.

But I expect some folks would rather they didn't come here at all. ''Ireland for the Irish'' and all that bullsh1t.

God, some of the anti-immigration rubbish I've read on here is pretty embarrassing.

green123

Dudess wrote: »

Nope. I was just pointing out how you pulled the figure of 99% out of your arse - I wasn't suggesting you were way off the mark, just finding it amusing that a person would post a figure here they plucked from thin air... and not feel a bit silly

it wasnt plucked from thin air,
again if you read the thread properly you would see that i gave a reason for coming to that figure. (almost none here 20 years ago, so almost all here now seeking jobs are not irish born)
the only silly thing is that people like you cant see it

green123

Acacia wrote: »

Oh my god- people coming to another country to work and earn money- are here FOR THEIR OWN GAINS? :eek: Shock-horror.

Your last sentence makes absolutely no sense- so you don't want them to take the jobs they've been offered? Should they instead go on the dole?

Immigrants can't win here- they're either ''tuking our jawbs'' or ''dole-spongers''.

But I expect some folks would rather they didn't come here at all. ''Ireland for the Irish'' and all that bullsh1t.

i posted the bit about them being here for their own gains because i am sick listening arguements that we needed them so much , as if they were doing us a big favour by coming to ireland.

my last sentance does make sense because whatever about a few years ago, we certainly dont need them now. if their was less of them here the irish would have to take them jobs and therefore we would have less irish on the dole.

yes, ireland for the irish

we have enough social problems already , i dont want any ghettos based on colour or nationality in ireland.

immigrants have ruined parts of england and america, i dont want the same to happen here

Rabies

green123 wrote: »

if the immigrants were not here, then the employers would have to give the jobs that are created in ireland to irish people.

But the crazy thing is, a huge amount of those have been here paying they're way for the past few years. Sure some of the money has gone back to their home country. But they helped build Ireland to what it was before the down turn.
They can look and fight for the jobs with everyone else. No reason why not.

SWL

Rabies wrote: »

But the crazy thing is, a huge amount of those have been here paying they're way for the past few years. Sure some of the money has gone back to their home country. But they helped build Ireland to what it was before the down turn.
They can look and fight for the jobs with everyone else. No reason why not.

People have to pay their way whether they stay at home or go aboard. Some posters logic would have you believe the boom has created by EU accession countries, which is simply not true; in fact I think in the long run it was a bad thing, as it resulted in the construction boom continuing into dangerous levels of unsustainable and becoming overheated as a result of rental properties being in short supply.[/OLOR]
[/COLO]
And before any body starts throwing the race card around I am not "blaming the foreigners". I think immigration policy should have been handled better, too many too soon. We have an over supply and over valued property market which has direct effect on individuals under 40. but hindsight is 20/20 vision[/COOR]

Rabies

Ya, the boom was great. We made loads of money. Everyone did. Those the came here and those that were born here.
We were the poster country of the whole world. The little country with the booming housing maket, high wage scale, low unemployment, skilled work force... What could we do wrong? Nothing. Then things go worng on a global scale and we get hit, and hit hard.
When giants fall, they fall hard.
It was all about making money while the going was good. Any government in power at the time would have done the same. Get the people in while its strong, build your country and make yourself strong economicaly. The fall wasn't expected to be so rapid, but we knew it could sustain.

This recession has made Ireland even more racist than it was before.


Side note:
SWL, I'm not racist but, stop with the black text.

SWL

Side note:
SWL, I'm not racist but, stop with the black text.[/quote]

Sorry - It is fnormal text on my PC - not sure what the problem is, had this a few pages back as well

Dudess

green123 wrote: »

it wasnt plucked from thin air

99% was of course plucked out of thin air - you just blurted it out, you didn't actually get it from anywhere...

again if you read the thread properly you would see that i gave a reason for coming to that figure. (almost none here 20 years ago, so almost all here now seeking jobs are not irish born)

Oh I read that all right - and still, no source for the figure of 99%. "Most" (which I wasn't disputing) does not mean the same thing as "99%".

The only silly thing is that people like you cant see it

Can't see what? That "de fardiners are comin' over here and fleecin' us" - such intelligence!

javaboy

Dudess wrote: »

Can't see what? That "de fardiners are comin' over here and fleecin' us" - such intelligence!

Cut that out.

green123

Dudess wrote: »

99% was of course plucked out of thin air - you just blurted it out, you didn't actually get it from anywhere...

Oh I read that all right - and still, no source for the figure of 99%. "Most" (which I wasn't disputing) does not mean the same thing as "99%".

sources ?
can you not figure it out for yourself ?
do you always need a source to tell you something ?
you should be able to work it out for yourself
i figured it out for myself by the above reasoning, and i was very accurate

Acacia

green123 wrote: »

i posted the bit about them being here for their own gains because i am sick listening arguements that we needed them so much , as if they were doing us a big favour by coming to ireland.

But that's another argument completely. In the mid-nineties at least we did need them to fill jobs- and now that the boom's over should all the people who've lived here for years be kicked out? "Sorry, we don't need you any more, see you later!"

My point is the people who move around the world looking for work are obviously doing so for ''their own gains''- why else would they do it? What do want from them? If they've paid taxes here, integrated into the community and see Ireland as their home, I really can't see what they've done wrong, tbh.

green123 wrote: »

my last sentance does make sense because whatever about a few years ago, we certainly dont need them now. if their was less of them here the irish would have to take them jobs and therefore we would have less irish on the dole.

There is always going to be competition for jobs, though. Why should an Irish person be given preference over a qualified, capable immigrant? If the Irish person is right for the job, they should get it, if the foreign person is right , he should get it. I don't see why we should discriminate based on nationality.

green123 wrote: »

yes, ireland for the irish

Oh sweet Jesus...should we call back all the Irish who are in Europe, Australia, Asia and America so? Never mind where an individual person wants to live, the fact that they were born on a particular piece of the earth means they have to stay there their whole life...

green123 wrote: »

we have enough social problems already , i dont want any ghettos based on colour or nationality in ireland.

So you acknowledge that we already have social problems- due to Irish people , I take it? How would reducing immigrants solve that problem?

Once again I notice the old scapegoating in full force here- let's not sort out our problems, then, just blame it on someone else.


Why do you presume the immigrants will form ghettos ? Oh yes, they're all poor people who can't speak English and won't fit into the community...despite the fact that there have been immigrants here for the last 15 years , I've yet to see any ghettos...except in Limerick, where the ghettos are full of anti-social Irish people. :rolleyes:

green123 wrote: »

immigrants have ruined parts of england and america, i dont want the same to happen here

BNP-type, scaremongering rubbish.

Ya see, England and America (particularly America) have been getting immigrants for hundreds of years. You could in fact say that immigrants built America...but I suppose once the immigrants aren't Irish or European, they're obviously trouble and will ruin the country.

green123 wrote: »

sources ?
can you not figure it out for yourself ?
do you always need a source to tell you something ?
you should be able to work it out for yourself
i figured it out for myself by the above reasoning, and i was very accurate

People usually ask for a source for statistics because otherwise it just seems like the person is talking nonsense...anybody can make up a statistic and present as fact.

book smarts

Europe has huge problems from immigration, and so will we. While there may be a net benefit in the short term with cheaper labour, in the long term ghettos form and all the problems associated with that. Look at the huge Turkish ghettos in Germany, Morrocan ghettos in Amsterdam. South Circular Road is showing the beginnings of our own ghetto. France is nearly 10% muslim. London has more then 1 million muslims. Ireland, the UK and Sweden were the only countries to allow the new accession states workers in in 2004. France and Germany didn't, with good reason. Do you want our people, our culture and our way of life to be destroyed? Because that's what's going to happen in your little "multiculturalist" paradise. Malaysia is only 60% Muslim, yet is an Islamic state, so that could well be Europe's future.

Why shouldn't we stop them working here? We owe them nothing. We can't work in their countries. When the economy gets really bad you might change your tune.

javaboy

book smarts wrote: »

Europe has huge problems from immigration, and so will we. While there may be a net benefit in the short term with cheaper labour, in the long term ghettos form and all the problems associated with that. Look at the huge Turkish ghettos in Germany, Morrocan ghettos in Amsterdam. South Circular Road is showing the beginnings of our own ghetto. France is nearly 10% muslim. London has more then 1 million muslims. Ireland, the UK and Sweden were the only countries to allow the new accession states workers in in 2004. France and Germany didn't, with good reason. Do you want our people, our culture and our way of life to be destroyed? Because that's what's going to happen in your little "multiculturalist" paradise. Malaysia is only 60% Muslim, yet is an Islamic state, so that could well be Europe's future.

Why shouldn't we stop them working here? We owe them nothing. We can't work in their countries. When the economy gets really bad you might change your tune.

Are we talking about foreigners or Muslims?

Acacia

book smarts wrote: »

Europe has huge problems from immigration, and so will we. While there may be a net benefit in the short term with cheaper labour, in the long term ghettos form and all the problems associated with that. Look at the huge Turkish ghettos in Germany, Morrocan ghettos in Amsterdam. South Circular Road is showing the beginnings of our own ghetto. France is nearly 10% muslim. London has more then 1 million muslims. Ireland, the UK and Sweden were the only countries to allow the new accession states workers in in 2004. France and Germany didn't, with good reason. Do you want our people, our culture and our way of life to be destroyed? Because that's what's going to happen in your little "multiculturalist" paradise. Malaysia is only 60% Muslim, yet is an Islamic state, so that could well be Europe's future.

Why shouldn't we stop them working here? We owe them nothing. We can't work in their countries. When the economy gets really bad you might change your tune.

The economy is really bad for me- I'm unemployed, no chance of a job, etc,etc. Yet I still don't feel right blaming the 'immigints' for everything.

I don't see how letting foreign people work here equates to our way of life being destroyed. More scaremongering. Perhaps if we put some effort into keeping out culture (Irish language, etc) it wouldn't be destroyed. But again it's easier to blame the foreigners.

The great irony in all of this is that certain people don't mind foreign investment and American companies coming to Ireland. Nor do they mind watching 'foreign' tv programmes and supporting 'foreign' football teams like Man Utd.

But as soon people from outside Europe come here, they're forcing their foreign cultures on us.

javaboy wrote: »

Are we talking about foreigners or Muslims?

Oh you know, the 'bad' foreigners a.k.a Muslims.

Dudess

Yeah it's kinda like "good AIDS, bad AIDS" - good AIDS is that which is contracted through blood transfusions, bad AIDS... well obviously through ho-mo-sekshuals sodomisin'...

Good immigrants - a combination of some or all of the following: white, English-speaking, Christian (Jewish at a push), from developed countries.
Bad immigrants - a combination of some or all of the following: non white, non English-speaking, any religion besides the Judeo-Christian ones, from poor/war-torn/corrupt/repressed countries.

SWL

book smarts wrote: »

Europe has huge problems from immigration, and so will we. While there may be a net benefit in the short term with cheaper labour, in the long term ghettos form and all the problems associated with that. Look at the huge Turkish ghettos in Germany, Morrocan ghettos in Amsterdam. South Circular Road is showing the beginnings of our own ghetto. France is nearly 10% muslim. London has more then 1 million muslims. Ireland, the UK and Sweden were the only countries to allow the new accession states workers in in 2004. France and Germany didn't, with good reason. Do you want our people, our culture and our way of life to be destroyed? Because that's what's going to happen in your little "multiculturalist" paradise. Malaysia is only 60% Muslim, yet is an Islamic state, so that could well be Europe's future.

Why shouldn't we stop them working here? We owe them nothing. We can't work in their countries. When the economy gets really bad you might change your tune.

France will have a Muslim majority in less than 90 years - thus an Islamic state, The Muslim population in Western Europe is on the rise rapidly. It will be interesteding to see how the EU copes with Turkey joining which they will eventually in the next 10 -15 years.

thelordofcheese

green123 wrote: »

i dont want any ghettos based on colour or nationality in ireland.

YEAH!
Who are they to be commin' over here and tryin' to steal our ghettos! We made them ourselves long before they showed up, tuppin' johnny-come-latelys trying to muscle in on our social problems.

The bloody cheek.

javaboy

SWL wrote: »

France will have a Muslim majority in less than 90 years

Link?

thus an Islamic state

No. A majority of one religion does not necessarily lead to the state adopting that religion.

SWL

Dudess wrote: »

Yeah it's kinda like "good AIDS, bad AIDS" - good AIDS is that which is contracted through blood transfusions, bad AIDS... well obviously through ho-mo-sekshuals sodomisin'...

Good immigrants - a combination of some or all of the following: white, English-speaking, Christian (Jewish at a push), from developed countries.
Bad immigrants - a combination of some or all of the following: non white, non English-speaking, any religion besides the Judeo-Christian ones, from poor/war-torn/corrupt/repressed countries.

Yes it will be interesting to see how women’s rights will be affected in Islamic countries within the EU over the next 100 - 150 years; most of the progress through equality which you enjoy today may not be enjoyed by heirs. what will your view be then.

thelordofcheese

SWL wrote: »

Yes it will be interesting to see how women’s rights will be affected in Islamic countries within the EU over the next 100 - 150 years; most of the progress through equality which you enjoy today may not be enjoyed by heirs. what will your view be then.

I imagine she'll be dead.

renraw

OMG! Is that footage for real? Why are there soo many foreign nationals applying? Why are there soo many people being permitted to work in ireland when we are in crisis? Im saddened to see this because most of us have paid insurance stamps and PAYE all of our working lives. And so many people are being allowed entry into the country and benefit from a generous social welfare system. It wont be long before Mr Cowen and the gang have to start dipping in the nestegg of 26 billion that they have stashed away if they continue to let soo many foreign nationals in to the country when soo many Irish people can't get jobs. Its definitely a very sad time.

javaboy

SWL - don't post propaganda videos like that here again. That is not a valid source.

thelordofcheese

renraw wrote: »

OMG! Is that footage for real? Why are there soo many foreign nationals applying?

Because they want a job? I would have thought that'd be obvious.

renraw wrote: »

Why are there soo many people being permitted to work in ireland when we are in crisis?

Irish job for irish people, is it? What nonsense.

renraw wrote: »

Im saddened to see this because most of us have paid insurance stamps and PAYE all of our working lives. And so many people are being allowed entry into the country and benefit from a generous social welfare system.

As has been pointed out most of the people in the queue wouldn't be eligible benifit from our social welfare system.

renraw wrote: »

It wont be long before Mr Cowen and the gang have to start dipping in the nestegg of 26 billion that they have stashed away if they continue to let soo many foreign nationals in to the country when soo many Irish people can't get jobs. Its definitely a very sad time.

It is, but not for the reasons you think it is.

Dudess

SWL wrote: »

Yes it will be interesting to see how women’s rights will be affected in Islamic countries within the EU over the next 100 - 150 years

But then again, more than likely they won't be affected at all. In fact, I'm pretty darn certain e.g. the French wouldn't allow an Islamic take-over just because there are a lot of Muslims living there. It doesn't work like that. What do you think will happen? A coup d'etat? Who'd sanction it? America?

renraw wrote: »

OMG! Is that footage for real? Why are there soo many foreign nationals applying? Why are there soo many people being permitted to work in ireland when we are in crisis?

Because they're students (who pay huge fees here if they're from outside the EU)/here since before the recession. The government is not permitting immigrants to work here out of the kindness of its heart you know. And you'd swear those immigrants have physically forced Irish people not to apply for jobs. If they're more likely to get a job, it's because they're cheaper labour - in which case, blame the unscrupulous employers. Some employers clearly are taking advantage of this, with e.g. people who have no English being put to work on tills in late-night garages etc.

Im saddened to see this because most of us have paid insurance stamps and PAYE all of our working lives. And so many people are being allowed entry into the country and benefit from a generous social welfare system.

I thought your concern was over them applying for a job? Which is it that's bothering you? Foreign nationals being on social welfare or working?

It wont be long before Mr Cowen and the gang have to start dipping in the nestegg of 26 billion that they have stashed away if they continue to let soo many foreign nationals in to the country when soo many Irish people can't get jobs.

Like they're going to do that... Their main concern is to get OUT of this mess they've created (for which "da fardiners" all too often get blamed).

AnonoBoy

thelordofcheese wrote: »

Because they want a job? I would have thought that'd be obvious.

Irish job for irish people, is it? What nonsense.

As has been pointed out most of the people in the queue wouldn't be eligible benifit from our social welfare system.


It is, but not for the reasons you think it is.

Quiet you with your facts and reasoned approach to the issue. This isn't a website for such ridiculous notions.

*looks around*

Oh wait.... this isn't Stormfront.

*ahem*

Carry on.

Lockstep

I've handed out 60 CVs in the past few days.
There's a fair few places taking on staff (especially for the summer) but the competition is extremely fierce.

Nehaxak

my last sentance does make sense because whatever about a few years ago, we certainly dont need them now. if their was less of them here the irish would have to take them jobs and therefore we would have less irish on the dole.

If they worked and paid their taxes etc., then no matter their original nationality nor the colour of their skin - they're perfectly entitled to their social welfare if they are now out of work, like any other Irish person.
If they're applying for assistance then they'll be means tested like anyone else.

I don't see the problem here ??

yes, ireland for the irish

Thing is though, like some others who posted in this thread, who are YOU to decide who is and is not "Irish" ?

we have enough social problems already , i dont want any ghettos based on colour or nationality in ireland.

Then why mention colour or nationality at all ? If anything, most of the students that were in that original video of the Londis job interview are probably in paid student digs or digs in affluent area's close-by to their college.

immigrants have ruined parts of england and america, i dont want the same to happen here

Why do you care about England or America and what you perceive immigrants have "ruined" there ? Did you forget about places in the UK like Liverpool where there was a huge influx of Irish over the years ? Let's not even mention America and the Irish influx over the years there...

Ghetto's as you're calling them are created not by the people but the the state, or more in point, the failure of the state itself - it has nothing to do with a persons original nationality nor the colour of their skin.

The colour of a persons skin in particular should have no bearing whatsoever and far as I can see is only being used as an excuse for blatant racism.

SWL

Dudess wrote: »

But then again, more than likely they won't be affected at all. In fact, I'm pretty darn certain e.g. the French wouldn't allow an Islamic take-over just because there are a lot of Muslims living there. It doesn't work like that. What do you think will happen? A coup d'etat? Who'd sanction it? America?

I am afraid it does work like that, it’s called democracy and last time I was in France, it still had a democratic elected government, the majority of French voters are Muslim, Candidates stand for election seeking an Islamic state and their elected in the majority. Thats how it works in the real world.

And I pity the fool who decides to tell the majority of voters in France, there not getting what they voted for.

thelordofcheese

SWL wrote: »

I am afraid it does work like that, it’s called democracy and last time I was in France, it still had a democratic elected government, the majority of French voters are Muslim, Candidates stand for election seeking an Islamic state and their elected in the majority. Thats how it works in the real world.

And I pity the fool who decides to tell the majority of voters in France, there not getting what they voted for.

There is a world of difference between having elected officials who are muslim and having a Islamic state.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

There is no way in hell I would stand in that que... Not that desperate for a part time job... lol.

SWL

thelordofcheese wrote: »

There is a world of difference between having elected officials who are muslim and having a Islamic state.

Not if elected officials are interested in forming an Islamic state

thelordofcheese

SWL wrote: »

Not if elected officials are interested in forming an Islamic state

Elected officials can be interested in all sorts of things, that doesn't mean that will or can make it a reality.

In order for that to happen Muslims would have to be in control of every aspect of the french nation and all in cahoots, like some kind of religious hivemind.

What you're espousing is the same nonsense we get from up the north, where people have honestly and openly said that catholics are trying to breed their way to a united ireland. We don't accept that kind of shit from them, why should we pay any more attention to something similar from you?

SWL

thelordofcheese wrote: »

Elected officials can be interested in all sorts of things, that doesn't mean that will or can make it a reality.

In order for that to happen Muslims would have to be in control of every aspect of the french nation and all in cahoots, like some kind of religious hivemind.

What you're espousing is the same nonsense we get from up the north, where people have honestly and openly said that catholics are trying to breed their way to a united ireland. We don't accept that kind of **** from them, why should we pay any more attention to something similar from you?

We are going way off topic - so this is my final word on this.

Go back and reread my post I said if the majority of elected official s stand before the electorate and state France will be an Islamic state and are elected on that basis it will happen. Not all elected officials are like ours some do have principles.

The Majority of countries under Islamic law have Muslim followers in the majority

Unless you have knowledge of the living in an Islamic state you are taking bull (I have by the way). The world isn't a perfect place, I suggest you wise up because from your post you clearly have some travelling to do

javaboy

SWL wrote: »

Go back and reread my post I said if the majority of elected official s stand before the electorate and state France will be an Islamic state and are elected on that basis it will happen. Not all elected officials are like ours some do have principles.

Politicians with principles? I don't care what religion they follow. Let's get them over here ASAP.

The Majority of countries under Islamic law have Muslim followers in the majority

That's fairly obvious. It would be very surprising if that wasn't the case. It doesn't necessarily mean that every country with a Muslim majority is an Islamic state.

meditraitor

SWL wrote: »

We are going way off topic - so this is my final word on this.

Go back and reread my post I said if the majority of elected official s stand before the electorate and state France will be an Islamic state and are elected on that basis it will happen. Not all elected officials are like ours some do have principles.

The Majority of countries under Islamic law have Muslim followers in the majority

Unless you have knowledge of the living in an Islamic state you are taking bull (I have by the way). The world isn't a perfect place, I suggest you wise up because from your post you clearly have some travelling to do

Way way of topic but I think this thread is just about run its course and Id like to comment on your post.

I believe that when/if France has a Muslim majority it will be a moderate Muslim population. Education is a great leveller and unlike most of the present day Muslim nations there will be no tolerance for hardliners. ignorance will be wiped out and basic humanity will prevail.
The type of Muslim nations you see now will be gone in 100 years......... Look at the power the catholic church had 100 years ago and look at the said nations now. Education will wipe out the crazies

A differant type of Jihad will take over..........

conorlechance

book smarts wrote: »

Europe has huge problems from immigration, and so will we. While there may be a net benefit in the short term with cheaper labour, in the long term ghettos form and all the problems associated with that. Look at the huge Turkish ghettos in Germany, Morrocan ghettos in Amsterdam. South Circular Road is showing the beginnings of our own ghetto. France is nearly 10% muslim. London has more then 1 million muslims. Ireland, the UK and Sweden were the only countries to allow the new accession states workers in in 2004. France and Germany didn't, with good reason. Do you want our people, our culture and our way of life to be destroyed? Because that's what's going to happen in your little "multiculturalist" paradise. Malaysia is only 60% Muslim, yet is an Islamic state, so that could well be Europe's future.

Why shouldn't we stop them working here? We owe them nothing. We can't work in their countries. When the economy gets really bad you might change your tune.

Irish culture was destroyed a long long long time ago due cultural genocide and a national inferiority complex among its people and is basically going to be finished in 20 years with increasing Americanisation.

I would say cultures evolve and are never fixed but this is not true in Irelands case.

I agree with you about the Islam stuff but it has nothing to do with anything, its like you found it on some website and just decided to quote it for no reason.

immigrants have ruined parts of england and america

oh jesus, how can a nation like the usa or brazil which prides itself on a nation of immigrants have parts ruined by immigrants.

Nehaxak

More Brazillians the better I say anyway, we might even get some decent footballers playing for us in the future for once...

green123

Acacia wrote: »

What do want from them? If they've paid taxes here, integrated into the community and see Ireland as their home,

So you acknowledge that we already have social problems- due to Irish people , I take it? How would reducing immigrants solve that problem?


Why do you presume the immigrants will form ghettos ? Oh yes, they're all poor people who can't speak English and won't fit into the community...despite the fact that there have been immigrants here for the last 15 years , I've yet to see any ghettos..

People usually ask for a source for statistics because otherwise it just seems like the person is talking nonsense...anybody can make up a statistic and present as fact.

they have not integrated into our community.
some have , but most have not.
they mostly stick together and do not mix that much with irish.
sure there is even a school in swords that has all black kids.
how is that integrating ?

of course i acknowledge that we already have problems created by ourselves. the clue was when i said we already have enough problems :rolleyes:
why do you need to question that ? when i said exactly that earlier.
i dont want an extra problems that immigrants bring, like the ghettos for example. why would i want extra problems in my country ?

i presume that they will form ghettos because they have done so in every other country that the go to. ireland will not be any different. we can see it starting already in parts of dublin.

the problem is too many immigrants have arrived in too short a time.
the cannot integrate that quickly.
if we did it properly and only allowed small numbers in at a time , i think it would have worked out better.
as it is we have been swamped by immigrants, and as a small nation are struggling to cope with the huge influx

re statistics : like i explained earlier, i reasoned it out logically for myself ( something which you people seem incapable of without being spoon fed ), and i was right

javaboy wrote: »

Are we talking about foreigners or Muslims?

same thing obviously.
like my above 99% statistic - fck all of either here 15 years ago , so all 99% of muslims are foreign

Dudess wrote: »

..

Good immigrants - a combination of some or all of the following: white, English-speaking, Christian (Jewish at a push), from developed countries.
Bad immigrants - a combination of some or all of the following: non white, non English-speaking, any religion besides the Judeo-Christian ones, from poor/war-torn/corrupt/repressed countries.

well from your example, the good immigrants are closer to the irish culture and way of living, so they would stand a better chance of integrating.
but again only in small numbers and slowly, otherwise we will have all of the same immigrant problems that so many other countries have

Dudess

green123 wrote: »

same thing obviously.
like my above 99% statistic - fck all of either here 15 years ago , so all 99% of muslims are foreign

I think the question was: are you focusing on foreigners in general or Muslims? That answer doesn't make sense. And not all brown-skinned people are Muslim - could be Hindu, could even be Christian. I saw mention of Brazilians - they tend to be Catholic.

Acacia

renraw wrote: »

OMG! Is that footage for real? Why are there soo many foreign nationals applying? Why are there soo many people being permitted to work in ireland when we are in crisis? Im saddened to see this because most of us have paid insurance stamps and PAYE all of our working lives. And so many people are being allowed entry into the country and benefit from a generous social welfare system. It wont be long before Mr Cowen and the gang have to start dipping in the nestegg of 26 billion that they have stashed away if they continue to let soo many foreign nationals in to the country when soo many Irish people can't get jobs. Its definitely a very sad time.

They're applying because they want a job, maybe?

But you're also complaining about a 'generous social welfare system'- so what's the problem, immigrants taking 'our' jobs or taking 'our' dole?

Oh and plenty of immigrants have paid their PAYE, by the way.

green123 wrote: »

they have not integrated into our community.
some have , but most have not.
they mostly stick together and do not mix that much with irish.
sure there is even a school in swords that has all black kids.
how is that integrating ?

Loving your broad sweeping generalizations. Pray tell, how should 'they' fit in with 'us', more than they have done already?

Play some Gaa, perhaps? Oh I forgot, wasn't there a black teenager in Carlow (who's lived here for most of his life, I believe) who got taunted with racist jibes at a Gaa match he was par-taking in? I mean, with that kind of openness and tolerance, it's clearly all the immigrants fault for not trying to fit in...:rolleyes:

Of course, there are some who don't make an effort- like any group of people- anywhere. But to try and make out that all, or even a large amount, don't try and fit in is laughable. But I'm only speaking from my experience.Clearly you must have some official statistic (you seem to be adept at plucking them out of thin air) to prove how many of da immigints don't try and integrate?

I'd love to know more about this school for black children- it's not that there is large number of black kids living in the area by any chance, is it? No, they just must be refusing to let Irish kids in as part of a plot to 'Destroy Irish Culture'....

green123 wrote: »

of course i acknowledge that we already have problems created by ourselves. the clue was when i said we already have enough problems :rolleyes:
why do you need to question that ? when i said exactly that earlier.
i dont want an extra problems that immigrants bring, like the ghettos for example. why would i want extra problems in my country ?

I'd be wary of trying to be sarcastic when you're completely missing the point. Doesn't work very well.

Anyway, my point is if you acknowledge that there were anti-social Irish people here before immigrants arrived, then you must also agree that instead of trying to fix these problems , you're just apportioning blame onto people that have nothing to do with it.

You could try and put pressure on the government to maybe sort out these problem areas...but nah, ranting about immigrants is much easier.

What 'extra problems' do immigrants bring? Where are these imaginary ghettos?

I mean, there have been a large number immigrants here for 15-20 years (and smaller numbers before that)- and nope, none of those ghettos have popped up yet.

green123 wrote: »

i presume that they will form ghettos because they have done so in every other country that the go to. ireland will not be any different. we can see it starting already in parts of dublin.

Oh you 'presume'...well, forgive me, but I'll take your presumptions with a pinch of salt if you don't mind, given your skill for making up numbers and all that.

I certainly can't see 'ghettos' forming in Dublin.

Note: a group of foreign people living in your area does not mean it's turning into a ghetto.

green123 wrote: »

the problem is too many immigrants have arrived in too short a time.
the cannot integrate that quickly.
if we did it properly and only allowed small numbers in at a time , i think it would have worked out better.
as it is we have been swamped by immigrants, and as a small nation are struggling to cope with the huge influx

Ah, so it's not about them fleecing us or being out for their gains, then? It's just the number of them that you object to?

green123 wrote: »

re statistics : like i explained earlier, i reasoned it out logically for myself ( something which you people seem incapable of without being spoon fed ), and i was right

Reason? Logic? I'm not seeing very much of it here, tbh.

People simply won't accept a statistic which you pulled out of your *cough* ear...that's not wanting to be spoon-fed, that's wanting proof for your (extremely unbelievable) claim.

green123 wrote: »

same thing obviously.
like my above 99% statistic - fck all of either here 15 years ago , so all 99% of muslims are foreign

Sterling statistical analysis there again, I see.

The funny thing is, before 9/11, I seriously doubt most people complaining about the Muslims knew the first thing about them or their religion or how many of them were living in Europe. But as soon as The Sun and Sky News tells them to be afraid they're suddenly scared of Da Muzzies Taking Over. They're just the world's bogeymen at the moment , it seems.

Sorry to Godwin the thread, but it kind of reminds of how much people feared the Jews pre-WW2 because of propaganda and the like.

green123 wrote: »

well from your example, the good immigrants are closer to the irish culture and way of living, so they would stand a better chance of integrating.
but again only in small numbers and slowly, otherwise we will have all of the same immigrant problems that so many other countries have

Why do you think an African Muslim for example wouldn't integrate as well as a Polish Catholic? Sure, the cultures are different that doesn't mean he would be completely in-capable of fitting in...people are more than their skin colour or religion, you know.

Dudess

green123, if you don't want non white, non English speaking, non western, poor people living in Ireland, well in fairness that's your opinion. But just say so, instead of trying to dress it up with all these spurious "reasons", which is just really easy to see through...

j1smithy

Where ever the job applicants came from I don't think is relevant. I wouldn't want to work there no matter how bad things got, I can't imagine them being a great employer. I mean they were willing to use desperate people, and potential employees as a marketing gimmick, how badly must they treat actual staff. I know it won't effect them but I will never buy anything in griffin group shops again.