Manchester United v Tottenham Hotspur (EPL) 5.15pm 25/4/09 Setanta Sp 1

killwill

Penalty or not United were on the verge of scoring. They were the better team. Spurs had two chances to score and did, but United in the second half were fantastic. Ronaldo was great, Berbatov put in a great shift and Rooney when he went on the left was amazing.

Pigman III

And here's my imitation of a Liverpool supporter; "Wah!"

Pigman III

Pigman III wrote: »

And here's my imitation of a Liverpool supporter; "Wah!"

Here's my impression of you!

''I am a cúnt''

Pigman III

Ah now, that's not nice!

Pro. F

What a performance in the second half today by United.

The penalty was a bad decision. Maybe the Refs angle was hard to judge it from, I don't know, but Gomez sent the ball away at such an angle I don't know how it could be thought he didn't get contact on it.

Who knows what would have happened if United hadn't got the penalty - but I don't care!
The team took full advantage of the good fortune. In world class style.

Rooney, Berbatov and Ronaldo were on fire. They tore into Spurs. Tevez did well too but it was more Rooney sorting out our left wing that was important.

I didn't think that Nani did too bad in the first half. He put in some decent crosses but we needed more cover for Evra - Rooney did that and his link up play was better.

On the down side our defence still looks dodgy. I know too many crosses came into the box today but Ferdinand hardly covered himself in glory and Rafael is still learning.

Paul Tergat

wow. have so much to say on this match its untrue.

firstly, and most importantly - the reaction you just saw was that of champions. whether you like utd or not (personally i love them ) you have to admit that a lot of players stood up and were counted.

At time i find ronaldo so damn frustrating but so often he comes up with the goods. Everyone can talk about his heart not being in it etc etc but he gets us the goals and gets us points that NO other player can.

Delighted for Tevez - his energy right from the moment he was put on really got us going at the start of the 2nd half. I do hope we sign him and i 100% disagree with the general criticism of him. if he gets a proper run of games, not in and out of the team and playing in the lesser games and as second fiddle, he will deliver the goods. he needs a run of games to get to the same level he was at last season. i was very happy with him and rooney as our strike force last season and would gladly go back to that now (move onto berba in a mo). i really want us to sign him, he puts everything into the game and does have the quality we need from him to be a FIRST CHOICE.

Berbatov....well....i really do not like him. I was happy with him being brought in because it was deadline day and i felt we needed more options up front. he doesnt look to be the option we need. we need a striker, someone to lead the line, get i nbehind and stretch the defence. someone who can be a goalpoacher and let rooney drop off and do what he does best. i believe that fergie will not go back on his 'error' in signing him - stubborn but i cant criticise SAF at all after todays sub and the turnaround.

Rooney today and as always was great. hes consistently our best all round player. to echo another poster earlier i hope he never, ever leaves utd.

have to say also that Nani doesnt deserve anymore chances. he constantly gives the ball away. there is no end product, apart from the occasional long ranger but he tries so much that one has to go in now and again. i fail to see anything positive about this guy and was delighted he came off at H/T. not a utd quality player imo.


**** the doubters (any negative utd fans at H/T).

all those criticising refs it all comes round full circle. you easily forget the times you get the decisions yourselves and tend to dwell on the ones that went against you (thats if pool = spurs).




I could say so so much more but i dont need to. That kind of reaction is why we should be champions come the end of the season.


Keep the red flag flying high.

Mr. Presentable

Denis Irwin wrote: »

Of course Liverpool have never ever gotten any debateable decisons. :rolleyes:

*cough* Mascherano diving for the free kick that led to their 1st goal today *cough*

Ah, sound. If a player in another game cheats then that excuses all.

Mr. Presentable

Pro. F wrote: »

What a performance in the second half today by United.

The penalty was a bad decision. Maybe the Refs angle was hard to judge it from, I don't know, but Gomez sent the ball away at such an angle I don't know how it could be thought he didn't get contact on it.

Who knows what would have happened if United hadn't got the penalty - but I don't care!
The team took full advantage of the good fortune. In world class style.

Rooney, Berbatov and Ronaldo were on fire. They tore into Spurs. Tevez did well too but it was more Rooney sorting out our left wing that was important.

I didn't think that Nani did too bad in the first half. He put in some decent crosses but we needed more cover for Evra - Rooney did that and his link up play was better.

On the down side our defence still looks dodgy. I know too many crosses came into the box today but Ferdinand hardly covered himself in glory and Rafael is still learning.

Good post. Others could learn a lot from you Pro. F.

Iang87

Pigman III wrote: »

And here's my imitation of a Liverpool supporter; "Wah!"

and my imitation of a united fan; "performance of champions"

note to united fans, champions dont go 2 down to spurs in the first half etc anyway about that match just meh nothing more to say. same **** different team

adox

Iang87 wrote: »

note to united fans, champions dont go 2 down to spurs in the first half

Well they do actually, considering they are the champions and they went 2 nil down to Spurs in the first half!

Bobalicious93

Iang87 wrote: »

and my imitation of a united fan; "performance of champions"

note to united fans, champions dont go 2 down to spurs in the first half etc anyway about that match just meh nothing more to say. same **** different team

bitter much?

Paul Tergat

Iang87 wrote: »

and my imitation of a united fan; "performance of champions"

note to united fans, champions dont go 2 down to spurs in the first half etc anyway about that match just meh nothing more to say. same **** different team

do champions play well every half of every season. answer is no. during a season things happen like that - do you honestly think spurs played well enough to deserve a 2 goal lead - no way. but they got the breaks and put away the chances, fair play to them.

its how you react to these situations. if it was pool who did this - like the way they showed amazing fighting spirit against chelsea 2 weeks ago ive no doubt your tune would be different.

you sound like you're really bitter.

Dave!

Iang87 wrote: »

and my imitation of a united fan; "performance of champions"

note to united fans, champions dont go 2 down to spurs in the first half etc anyway about that match just meh nothing more to say. same **** different team

Ronan|Raven

It is like 100 children in the play ground arguing over what exactly? Liverpool got a lucky free kick for their first, Utd got a joke of a penalty for their first..

Its football, its a pin in the hole and believe me id have loved to see UTD draw or loose today but its the way it goes, and sadly Longford lost.. sad but not surprising. It is a **** of a game but thats the way she goes dude...

the constant wankfest / bitchfest on here is embarassing.

Paul Tergat

lol dave, you have pics ready for pretty much anything. wp sir!

Unearthly

Iang87 wrote: »

and my imitation of a united fan; "performance of champions"

note to united fans, champions dont go 2 down to spurs in the first half etc anyway about that match just meh nothing more to say. same **** different team

http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/8991/tripgj9.swf

Iang87

ha ha ha ha lovin it, united fans classic. some liverpool fans might get bitter and moan after a game but jesus the vast majority of ye are the worst winners there are

thegen

Superb second half performance. The hair dryer worked wonders. The introduction of Tevez and the Scholes who added a little bit of his bite is what was required. Rooney and Ronaldo were a different class. Not quite sure on Berbatov though. Was OK in second half but that was after Spurs decided that the game was over.

Headshot

Iang87 wrote: »

ha ha ha ha lovin it, united fans classic. some liverpool fans might get bitter and moan after a game but jesus the vast majority of ye are the worst winners there are

you

and what ever gets you through the week

whatawaster

Fair play to Utd, they were brilliant in the second half - Rooney in particular.

Howard Webb is a c*nt though

Headshot

whatawaster wrote: »

Fair play to Utd, they were brilliant in the second half - Rooney in particular.

Howard Webb is a c*nt though

thank you whatawaster at least some of your post isnt bitter

Mr.Nice Guy

What a weird day. I came back from the dentist half-loopy from anaesthetic and decided to try and watch the United game but ended up falling asleep. I wake up and suddenly we're losing 2-0 to Spurs and I'm wondering if this is a bad dream. I fall asleep again and wake up to find it's 2-2. At this point I've no idea if this is actually happening or if I'm hallucinating. Luckily I stayed conscious for the rest of it and have to say I enjoyed it immensely. :cool:

Also, had to laugh at the whingeing on MOTD. They must have said 'the peno was the turning point' about 5 times. Wrong fellas, Sir Alex Ferguson was the turning point.

Bring on the Arsenal!

whatawaster

Headshot wrote: »

thank you whatawaster at least some of your post isnt bitter

unfortunately an awful lot of me is. I'm just glad i wasn't near a computer at 7 o'clock

JerryHandbag

I said to myself before this game "All I want is a scrappy dour 1 or 2-nil win, none of this 4-4 draw nonsense that the others are carrying on with" :rolleyes:

Rooney, Ronaldo stood up to be counted, 5 goals in 22 mins, stuff of champions. And I aint bothered about the peno, we were robbed last weekend.

Great substitutions by Meester Ferguson tbh

Iang87

Headshot wrote: »

you

and what ever gets you through the week

i'd safely say theres a lot of bitter liverpool fans today not just me, jesus love to see your posts if ye didnt win christ you're annoyin happy wonder what you're lik annoyed

Paul Tergat

I dont understand your points Iang, are you here tjust to try get a reaction? are you saying something about the game or what?

bad winners are not people who react to someone being blatantly bittter.

Iang87

p_larkin99 wrote: »

I dont understand your points Iang, are you here tjust to try get a reaction? are you saying something about the game or what?

bad winners are not people who react to someone being blatantly bittter.

my initial point was to a united fan taking the piss out of liverpool fans so no not trying to get a reaction just replying to that thanks for asking tho

Paul Tergat

no problems, ill ask away mate.

well how about you respond to what people ask you - do you honestly think that great teams will never go 2 goals behind? can you not recognise the character in coming back from that and end up winning the game convincingly? is this not the mark of champions?

Iang87

p_larkin99 wrote: »

no problems, ill ask away mate.

well how about you respond to what people ask you - do you honestly think that great teams will never go 2 goals behind? can you not recognise the character in coming back from that and end up winning the game convincingly? is this not the mark of champions?

to an extent it is the mark of champions yes. we were 2 down at city this year and won, so we gonna be champions too

Theresalwaysone

Lol Liverpool fans. So bitter.

Lads was anything said on any of the analysis' about Palacios' tackle on Ronaldo?

Theresalwaysone

Iang87 wrote: »

to an extent it is the mark of champions yes. we were 2 down at city this year and won, so we gonna be champions too

Wow. Hmmm, and 2 down to Portsmouth wasnt it. So ye should be twice the champions we were.

JerryHandbag

Iang87 wrote: »

to an extent it is the mark of champions yes. we were 2 down at city this year and won, so we gonna be champions too

So going by your logic a team that aspires to be champions should NEVER fall behind at any stage of a game. EVER.

Pretty high standards!!

Denis Irwin

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Lol Liverpool fans. So bitter.

Lads was anything said on any of the analysis' about Palacios' tackle on Ronaldo?

Didn't see most of the analysis but it wouldn't suprise me if they didn't as they were too busy having an ABU wankfest by continuously debating the peno.

Paul Tergat

Iang87 wrote: »

to an extent it is the mark of champions yes. we were 2 down at city this year and won, so we gonna be champions too

yes BOTH teams will be champions :rolleyes:

what it shows is that there is character there. i would say yes that at the end of the season should Pool win the league you look back on those types of games and results and say thats where we really dug in and grounded out a result where it looked like we were ****ed.

you said above that champions do not go behind 2-0 at HT against spurs. its how you react to it that makes you winners in the long term.

Dave!

Denis Irwin wrote: »

Didn't see most of the analysis but it wouldn't suprise me if they didn't as they were too busy having an ABU wankfest by continuously debating the peno.

Never been to one of those

Unearthly

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Lol Liverpool fans. So bitter.

Lads was anything said on any of the analysis' about Palacios' tackle on Ronaldo?

Not 1 mention of it on Match of the day

Theresalwaysone

Unearthly wrote: »

Not 1 mention of it on Match of the day

Thats unusual. I would have expected something to be said. Im not for one second believin its in any way suspicious but it is sure unusual.


It was a horrible tackle, I dont even know what he could have been thinking but only trying to "do" Ronaldo.

cardshark202

Just reading through this now. The amount of idiocy on display in this thread is absolutely unreal.
It's a conspiracy bla bla bla
Ref's favour 'big four clubs'
lol lol

So wrong. The more you attack, the more chances you create, the more chances opposition teams take in defence. Hence, the more penalties/free kicks you win. Some may be wrong, but in general attacking play is rewarded. Mistakes happen. You make your own luck and get what you deserve.
Sure sometimes the result of a game is influenced by a bad decision, but taking today as an example, anyone watching the game would have seen how utd finished the 1st half very strongly and started the second even better. It was only a matter of time before we scored.

Another thing, whilst utd have been lucky to get some good decisions in our favour over the years, lets not forget we have been robbed as much as any team too. CL v porto when scholes scored and the ref decided to disallow it for no reason. Ferdinand banning. Last week v everton to name just a few.

IT DOES EVEN OUT.

SlickRic

right...just in now and iv not read any of this thread since I left it at 5.45pm, and I'm not trawling through pages of what I'm sure is carnage.

Unbelievable comeback, I hate to say. Utd seem to dangle the carrot of hope in front of Liverpool so often, but just snatch it away every time. Their ability to come back like they did today is just deflating when you're trying to chase. But sometimes you have to hold your hands up and say well done. For whatever reason, they just get the job done.

They had a helping hand of course. The penalty was a joke. I watched it with utd fans, they watched the replay, and still believed it was a penalty. I had to leave the room before I said something I regretted. Webb should hang his head, but these things happen. What is unforgiveable, is the capitulation we witnessed by the Tottenham rear guard. It was so bad that the penalty, for me, was rendered meaningless almost. Utd were going to score, they always do, and when they did Spurs folded. This would have probably happened whenever Utd scored. It still doesn't excuse the penalty decision. Awful stuff.

To have a bit of a moan though...why the f**k do teams sit off utd. I'm genuinely tired of teams pressing them, then dropping 20yds back after a while. The first tactic seems to work, why change it?

Palacios could have been off, but he was class in midfield I thought. Even though Utd won 5-2, he was one of the stars. Bossed the game for the majority. That Utd won so convincingly is a testament to Rooney, Ronaldo, Berba, and the Spurs defence, nothing else.

Draining game, and that's surely it for the title race. Us Kopites still have a puncher's chance, but not much else it pains me to say. It's been a great race, and I still expect it to go until at least the 37th game, but the time is coming where we may have to put our hands up for this season.

We're still going to fight all the way though, no doubt about that.

Paul Tergat

cardshark202 wrote: »

Just reading through this now. The amount of idiocy on display in this thread is absolutely unreal.
It's a conspiracy bla bla bla
Ref's favour 'big four clubs'
lol lol

So wrong. The more you attack, the more chances you create, the more chances opposition teams take in defence. Hence, the more penalties/free kicks you win. Some may be wrong, but in general attacking play is rewarded. Mistakes happen. You make your own luck and get what you deserve.
Sure sometimes the result of a game is influenced by a bad decision, but taking today as an example, anyone watching the game would have seen how utd finished the 1st half very strongly and started the second even better. It was only a matter of time before we scored.

Another thing, whilst utd have been lucky to get some good decisions in our favour over the years, lets not forget we have been robbed as much as any team too. CL v porto when scholes scored and the ref decided to disallow it for no reason. Ferdinand banning. Last week v everton to name just a few.

IT DOES EVEN OUT.

good points Reggie. I have always tried convincing people that the reason that in particular UTD get more penalties is because we attack more and not due to any bull****ty referee favourtism.

its an easy argument for the 'smaller' clubs to use as a we got screwed over by the big boys.

Nalz

in the hotel

hammered

just f'ucking savage lad

tony1kenobi

Dave! wrote: »

Never been to one of those

You have....It's just that impotence overcomes (or fails to come over) them regularly.

eagle eye

cardshark202 wrote: »

Just reading through this now. The amount of idiocy on display in this thread is absolutely unreal.
It's a conspiracy bla bla bla
Ref's favour 'big four clubs'
lol lol

So wrong. The more you attack, the more chances you create, the more chances opposition teams take in defence. Hence, the more penalties/free kicks you win. Some may be wrong, but in general attacking play is rewarded. Mistakes happen. You make your own luck and get what you deserve.
Sure sometimes the result of a game is influenced by a bad decision, but taking today as an example, anyone watching the game would have seen how utd finished the 1st half very strongly and started the second even better. It was only a matter of time before we scored.

Another thing, whilst utd have been lucky to get some good decisions in our favour over the years, lets not forget we have been robbed as much as any team too. CL v porto when scholes scored and the ref decided to disallow it for no reason. Ferdinand banning. Last week v everton to name just a few.

IT DOES EVEN OUT.

Ok so you believe all that but please address these issues I raised regarding the referee in charge of today's game.

Ronaldo kicks out at a player and he does not get a yellow card?
Pedersen is clearly fouled by Rafael and he does not get a penalty?
Messi is clearly fouled against Bayern and does not get a penalty?

Whats very clear is its not normal for this referee to give penalties very easily based upon two recent matches he was in charge of. The fact that he gave it here is someting that has to be seriously looked at. Was he under pressure due to Ferguson's rant after the Everton game? That shoudl not be the case.
You expect a referee to be consistent and in this case he did not act in a similar manner to other recent games he was in charge of.

Unearthly

p_larkin99 wrote: »

good points Reggie. I have always tried convincing people that the reason that in particular UTD get more penalties is because we attack more and not due to any bull****ty referee favourtism.

its an easy argument for the 'smaller' clubs to use as a we got screwed over by the big boys.

Yep. I said that in the refs are biased to Man Utd topic to but it seems to of fallen on deaf ears.

SlickRic

eagle eye wrote: »

Ok so you believe all that but please address these issues I raised regarding the referee in charge of today's game.

Ronaldo kicks out at a player and he does not get a yellow card?
Pedersen is clearly fouled by Rafael and he does not get a penalty?
Messi is clearly fouled against Bayern and does not get a penalty?

Whats very clear is its not normal for this referee to give penalties very easily based upon two recent matches he was in charge of. The fact that he gave it here is someting that has to be seriously looked at. Was he under pressure due to Ferguson's rant after the Everton game? That shoudl not be the case.
You expect a referee to be consistent and in this case he did not act in a similar manner to other recent games he was in charge of recent.

or maybe he just f'ucked up.

Morzadec

Pro. F wrote: »

What a performance in the second half today by United.

The penalty was a bad decision. Maybe the Refs angle was hard to judge it from, I don't know, but Gomez sent the ball away at such an angle I don't know how it could be thought he didn't get contact on it.

Who knows what would have happened if United hadn't got the penalty - but I don't care!
The team took full advantage of the good fortune. In world class style.

Rooney, Berbatov and Ronaldo were on fire. They tore into Spurs. Tevez did well too but it was more Rooney sorting out our left wing that was important.

I didn't think that Nani did too bad in the first half. He put in some decent crosses but we needed more cover for Evra - Rooney did that and his link up play was better.

On the down side our defence still looks dodgy. I know too many crosses came into the box today but Ferdinand hardly covered himself in glory and Rafael is still learning.

You are a United fan. I am a Liverpool fan. Therefore we should hate each other and not agree. But I have to say good post.

I'm sick of these United ref conspiracies, and I'm also sick of United fans claiming it was the right decision. Seriously just admit it was wrong like this United fan has. And then focus on the rest of your comeback which was superb but which was seemingly based on the foundation of a bad decision. Which we'll never know if it influenced the game or not. United fans will certainly argue it didn't and they would have plenty of ground to argue that on. But for god sake admit it was wrong. It is embarrassing not to. It's ridiculous that you can't look past your fan allegiance to look and look at it from a footballing perspective and accept that the penalty decision was wrong.

And also any United fan defending it as a right decision would make me believe that they don't believe they would have come back without it

Paul Tergat

eagle eye wrote: »

Ok so you believe all that but please address these issues I raised regarding the referee in charge of today's game.

Ronaldo kicks out at a player and he does not get a yellow card?
Pedersen is clearly fouled by Rafael and he does not get a penalty?
Messi is clearly fouled against Bayern and does not get a penalty?

Whats very clear is its not normal for this referee to give penalties very easily based upon two recent matches he was in charge of. The fact that he gave it here is someting that has to be seriously looked at. Was he under pressure due to Ferguson's rant after the Everton game? That shoudl not be the case.
You expect a referee to be consistent and in this case he did not act in a similar manner to other recent games he was in charge of.

do you no think palacios should have been sent off for his 'tackle attempt' on ronaldo? or is this a case of referees favouriting the top 4...oh wait.

referees are human, they dont get every call correct.

was it a penalty, no,

should palacios have gone, yes.

2 things missed by the ref, very important things albeit. one for each team.

and the highlighted bit, he's human not a robot. its almost impossible to remove feelings such as pressure from such situations. do you believe that moyes words before the semi final had an effect on us not getting a peno...or is this a case of referees favouriting the top 4...oh wait

SuprSi

Ok, I'm a Spurs fan and I think I've calmed down enough to post. Firstly, let me congradulate Man U on coming back from 2 goals and scoring 5 in the second half. It truly was the mark of champions and I fully expect them to go on and win the league, which they fully deserve over the course of the season.

Now to todays game. Spurs deserved their lead in the first half. Perhaps not by 2 goals but they took their chances and did what they had to do. Nobody would have expected Utd to play the same way in the second half, and I figured that if Spurs could keep the score the same for the first 20 minutes of the second half that things would get interesting. Unfortunately, 12 minutes in the ref played a part. A good (or better) referring performance is one where the referee goes unnoticed and the game flows with interruptions only where they are warranted. Unfortunately Howard Webb interrupted this flow and gave Utd a decision that was not warranted, was completely incorrect, and regardless of his position, was one that, at home, could do nothing but motivate Utd. Like it or not, this decision was the turning point of the game.

Regardless of whether Utd were robbed the week before, this decision was based (or should only be based) on this game and it was wrong and very harsh on a very well performing Spurs side. A team away from home, performing well but perhaps on a knife-edge because they can't believe the position they're in, can take very little to knock them off their perch. A fortunate goal, a great goal, or a really crappy referring decision - all situations that can cause the away team to fold. The problem is when the away team have honestly beaten the home team 2 - 0 for 57 minutes, to lose a goal so dishonestly is gut-wrenching and, with the exception of Chelsea, Arsenal, or Liverpool, will more or less mean the end of the contest. Who knows whether a normal goal would have come so soon into the half or whether it would have had the same effect? Unfortunately Mr. Webb took this potential scenario out of the equation.

I believe most people on here would be critising Spurs for folding if the first goal had been a normal/proper goal rather than a poxy one, but instead they're blaming the ref because Spurs were up for it and he took that away from them. I can't say I was confident of keeping the scoreline the same starting the second half, after all it's Utd at home, but I hoped we could keep the momentum and I believe we could have been in with a very good chance if the ref hadn't had more to say on the result than he did. Even with the decision we should have been able to keep our cool but the wind was well and truly taken out of our sails. That's a sign of a team that doesn't have the required heart to deal with this sort of injustice.

So in summation, and I'm sorry for the rant, fair play to Utd but curse you Howard Webb. My estimation of Frank Lampard went way up this week after his articulate and politically correct phone in but you sir, despite my previously lofty estimation of your skills, have gone way down in mine after your shambolic decision today.

Paul Tergat

Unearthly wrote: »

Yep. I said that in the refs are biased to Man Utd topic to but it seems to of fallen on deaf ears.

haven't seen them posts mate...we can only try!

SlickRic

Morzadec wrote: »

I'm also sick of United fans claiming it was the right decision.

if they're saying it's the right decision, they're winding you up to get a reaction. it's easier to just ignore it.

because no matter how they try to justify it, they'll end up looking foolish. so let them. if they can't enjoy a comeback and win like that without trying to wind some Pool fans up by talking sh*t, then that's their problem not yours.