Unofficial Bus Strike...

meanmachine3

Dublin Bus services across 19 routes could face severe disruption tomorrow as a result of an unofficial work stoppage by drivers at the company's Harristown depot.

The action began this morning when drivers stopped work in sympathy with another driver on the 128 route, who was suspended for refusing to work a new schedule.

Unions had accepted Labour Court recommendations on the company's €31m cost cutting measures that included reducing the fleet by 120 buses.

AdvertisementThe drivers are unhappy at new schedules which the Labour Court had recommended should come into effect today.

It is believed the dispute stemmed from unhappiness among drivers with the new schedule on the 128 route.

The routes that will have no service are the 4 and 4A, 13 and 13A, 17A, 33B, all 40 services, 102, 128, 140, 142, 237, 238, 239 and 270.

There will also be disruption to ten routes partly serviced by drivers and buses from the Harristown depot.

These are the 37 and 37 X, the 38 and 38C, the 39 and 39X, the 41 and 41X, the 43 and the 70.


Workers at the depot refused to give interviews on the matter this afternoon.

However, it is understood they stopped work in solidarity with the suspended driver.

They claim that while the broad proposals had been accepted by unions over a week ago, the working arrangements for drivers on each of the routes affected by the cuts had to be worked out locally before today's deadline for implementation of the cuts.

They said agreement had been reached on all but one of the routes due to be cut from today.

And when the first driver turned up to work that 128 route this morning, he refused to operate the new schedule and was suspended, prompting the action by the other drivers at the depot.

Dublin Bus says the Labour Court agreement included an arrangement, where if agreement hadn't been reached on how drivers on each route were to be affected before today's deadline, the cut was to go ahead anyway, and the arrangements negotiated later.

However, the workers claim today's deadline for the commencement of the cuts was set in one of the earlier sets of proposals that was subsequently rejected.

As a result, they said, the deadline for implementing all the cuts from today was unrealistic.

They said they had asked management to delay the cuts on the 128 route until the 10 May, but this was rejected. They say they also offered to continue talks on the 128 route through this weekend, but claim this offer was also rejected by management.

They also claim they remain available for talks.

sillymoo

meanmachine3 wrote: »

The routes that will have no service are the 4 and 4A, 13 and 13A, 17A, 33B, all 40 services, 102, 128, 140, 142, 237, 238, 239 and 270.

There will also be disruption to ten routes partly serviced by drivers and buses from the Harristown depot.

These are the 37 and 37 X, the 38 and 38C, the 39 and 39X, the 41 and 41X, the 43 and the 70.

Does anyone know what the story is with the 27b? The dublin bus website says there will be no service on that route but RTE has no mention. This is so bloody confusing.

Dyr

As a result, they said, the deadline for implementing all the cuts from today was unrealistic.

suprise suprise.

dub_commuter

You should be able to trust the DB website, but considering the fact the service numbers it lists have no service, do not even have the correct start and end points listed next to them, shows that you would not be able to trust them.

What specific timetabled services are cut, on the curtailed routes I could not tell you. Dublin Bus know this information but have elected to share it not with their customers, because that would be far too sensible to do.

mikemac

Oh man, this is pretty much what happened last time, though for different reasons and it was a different issue

Driver shows up, instructions aren't followed so they get suspended and then the drivers comrades go on unofficial strike.

Have both sides learned nothing from last time?
I'm not laying the blame at either side, it just seems to be history repeating itself from what I see

meanmachine3

by the looks of the companies web site both sides could be in it for the long haul. strangely enough the 27B is not metioned at all. they have a list with no services and a list with curtailed services

dub_commuter

I've Included the correct routes in brackets as DB do not seem to know where their own routes go, so heaven help them. Apologies for the brackets but had to correct DB's mistakes

The following routes will have No Service
4/4a Ballymun to Blackrock/Stradbrook (Harristown - Blackrock/Stradbrook)
13/13a Ballymun to Merrion Square (Harristown - Merrion Square
17a Finglas to Kilbarrack
27b Eden Quay to Harristown via Beaumont Hospital
40a/b/c/d Finglas to City Centre (40B Toberburr to City Centre, 40D Tyrrelstown to City Centre)
33b Portrane/Donabate to Swords (Only Selected serivces serve Donabate)
102.Sutton Station to Airport via Swords
128 Baldoyle to Rathmines (Clongriffin - Rathmines)
83 Finglas to Kimmage (Harristown - Kimmage)
237 Blanchardstown to Castleknock (Blanchardstown Circular via Auburn Ave)
238 Blanchardstown to Tyrellstown (Does not go anywhere near Tyrrelstown, Circular route via Ladyswell/Ballycoolin)
270 Blanchardstown to Dunboyne
140 Finglas to Leeson Street (St Margreats Road/Hampton Wood - Lesson Street)

The following routes will have a Curtailed Service
27x Clare Hall to UCD Belfield
37 Hawkins Street to Carpenterstown
37x Carpenterstown to UCD Belfield
38/a Hawkins Street to Damastown
38b/c Hawkins Street to Tyrrelstown
39 Hawkins Street to Ongar
39x Ongar to UCD Belfield
41 Lower Abbey Street to Swords Manor
41x Swords to UCD Belfield
43 Lower Abbey Street to Swords Business Park
70/a Hawkins Street to Dunboyne

The Following Routes also operate from Harristown, and will not have services but DB do not list them.
239 Liffey Valley to Blanchardstown Shopping Centre
142 Portmarnock to Rathmines

sillymoo

meanmachine3 wrote: »

by the looks of the companies web site both sides could be in it for the long haul. strangely enough the 27B is not metioned at all. they have a list with no services and a list with curtailed services

Its on this page http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/News-Centre/Travel-News/Service-Disruption/

The amount elderly people who take this bus everyday is more than I have seen on any other route.

meanmachine3

i'll repost this for anyone that hasn't read it

meanmachine3 wrote: »

the following was posted in another thread by one of our colleagues
"In this letter Mr Maguire confirmed that the company would be utilising the current agreed Schedules Negotation procedures Up to and Including the Schedules Tribunal.
So thefore realistically the company is in no position to impliment any more than a few minor withdrawals next Sunday.
The largest problems appear to exist at locations where some Senior Managers have decided to "Get stuck In" by insisting that the new bills are starting in toto on the 26th."

now you make up your mind. the 128 problem is basically a new schedule being introduced

January

It's the same with the 40 bus service. An awful lot of elderly people take this bus from Plunkett/Barry/Casement Areas of Finglas to the church on Cardiffsbridfe Road or to the village.

ecom

regardless of who is in the right or wrong here, if this was an official strike then fair enough, however as it is an unofficial strike by people simply refusing to work (no matter what way you look at it) then they should be suspended without pay or fired. This may yet happen.

In my industry if I decided one day I dont fancy working then I would be reprimanded. And rightly so.

[EDIT] I just want to add to this that I dont wish for anyone to lose their jobs, especially in these times of rising unemployment. What would be preferable is if these drivers went down the proper route to highlight their concerns. The fact that they haven't and are holding a city to ransom, to me calls for the need for strong leadership in dealing with the actions of these people.[/EDIT]

Ste.phen

Looks like i'm walking to work, so!
The Bus? Are you getting it yet?
No, cos the damn thing is parked in the garage!

sidneykidney

I hear that clontarf bus garage is now affected,anyone know this for sure?

jlang

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/News-Centre/Travel-News/Service-Disruption/

Service Disruption

Monday, April 27, 2009

Dublin Bus wishes to apologise to customers for the disruption to a number of its services. This disruption is due to unofficial Industrial action by drivers at Clontarf and Harristown depots following the introduction of service changes which were agreed and accepted following a Labour Court Recommendation.

The following routes will have No Service
4/4a Harristown to Blackrock/Stradbrook
13/13a Merrion Square to Harristown
17a Finglas to Kilbarrack
27 Talbot Street to Clare Hall
27b Eden Quay to Harristown via Beaumont Hospital
27x Clare Hall to UCD Belfield
29a Eden Quay to Newgrove Cross
31 Eden Quay to Howth Summit
31b Eden Quay to Howth Summit
32a Eden Quay to Malahide
32/b Eden Quay to Portmarnock
32x Malahide to UCD Belfield
33b Portrane/Donabate to Swords
40/a/b/c/d Finglas to City Centre
42 Lower Abbey Street to Sands Hotel (Portmarnock) / Coast Road (Malahide)
42a/b Lower Abbey Street to Blunden Drive / Beaumont Hospital (42a)
43 Lower Abbey Street to Swords Business Park
53 Eden Quay to East Wall Road
53a Eden Quay to North Wall (Alexandra Road)
83 Harristown to Kimmage
102 Sutton Station to Airport via Swords
103 Clontarf Dart Station to OMNI Shopping Centre
104 Clontarf Dart Station to Cappagh Hospital
128 Clongriffin to Rathmines (Palmerston Park)
130 Lower Abbey Street to Castle Avenue
140 Finglas to Leeson Street
142 Portmarnock to Rathmines (Palmerston Park)
237 Blanchardstown to Castleknock
238 Blanchardstown to Tyrellstown
239 Blanchardstown Shopping Centre to Liffey Valley Shopping Centre
270 Blanchardstown Shopping Centre to Dunboyne
The following routes will have a Curtailed Service
37 Hawkins Street to Carpenterstown
37x Carpenterstown to UCD Belfield
38/a Hawkins Street to Damastown
38b/c Hawkins Street to Tyrrelstown
39 Hawkins Street to Ongar
39x Ongar to UCD Belfield
41 Lower Abbey Street to Swords Manor
41x Swords to UCD Belfield
70/a Hawkins Street to Dunboyne
This page was last updated at 07:50hrs.

A-Train

Clontarf and Harristown out of action today, coming into work there were loads of people at bus stops that were not aware this was taking place and there was about 15 people at each stop and on the flip side taxis will make there money today!

Once again all the trade union dinosaurs that were sent out to Harristown when it opened are calling the shots regardless of official action or not. Not good enough!

líreacán

Killester DART station has queues round the block due to the buses not running.

BC

meanmachine3 wrote: »

the 128 problem is basically a new schedule being introduced

What exactly is the issue with this?
As far as I can see (as a 128 bus user) there is very little change in the timetable, so what exactly is the drivers issue?

dub_commuter

BC wrote: »

What exactly is the issue with this?
As far as I can see (as a 128 bus user) there is very little change in the timetable, so what exactly is the drivers issue?

Reduced journey time from one terminus to another, the timetable is practically the same, but will be operated with one less bus, so if there is a delay on a service, it makes it very likely that the rest of the services operated by that driver for the day will get progressively later as their shift continues, which could result in "Extraordinary Late Running", where a bus is canceled in order to get things running to timetable again, so they have one service which may not run, in order to make the rest on time rather than having every service the bus operates running late.

At the moment on the 128 route, the journey is estimated as taking a set time, and normally there will be a little bit of time inbetween when it is expected to arrive, and it's next departure for another service, this has been cut so now if a bus is late, it is much more likely to be late on the next journey, and it goes on and on and gets later and later.

shltter

ecom wrote: »

regardless of who is in the right or wrong here, if this was an official strike then fair enough, however as it is an unofficial strike by people simply refusing to work (no matter what way you look at it) then they should be suspended without pay or fired. This may yet happen.

In my industry if I decided one day I dont fancy working then I would be reprimanded. And rightly so.

[EDIT] I just want to add

to this that I dont wish for anyone to lose their jobs, especially in these times of rising unemployment. What would be preferable is if these drivers went down the proper route to highlight their concerns. The fact that they haven't and are holding a city to ransom, to me calls for the need for strong leadership in dealing with the actions of these people.[/EDIT]

The reason it is unofficial is the labour law in this country that means you have to ballot and give seven days notice. Obviously it's not possible to do that in this case. The company have tried to force in a bill without following agreed procedures which they promised to do before the LRC vote.

They were warned that if they tried to bypass procedures it would lead to disputes. Now if you go put and work that bill you have de facto accepted it and the agreed procedures are worthless as the company can by pass anytime they like. Once a driver is suspended it escalates the dispute as drivers will not continue working and leave fellow drivers out of work where the company have not followed agreed procedures.

I warned this would happen last week.

az2wp0sye65487

Heard on RTE news this morning that the Gardaí have advised that all inbound bus lanes are suspended until 10am today to alleviate congestion due to extra traffic...

shltter

BC wrote: »

What exactly is the issue with this?
As far as I can see (as a 128 bus user) there is very little change in the timetable, so what exactly is the drivers issue?

The timetable is not the same as the bill. Afaik the issues relate to running times as well as duty start finish and break times.

A bill can be laid out in various ways without affecting the timetable.

However the other issue of running times is the company masking cutbacks by reducing running time.

MiniD

dub_commuter wrote: »

At the moment on the 128 route, the journey is estimated as taking a set time, and normally there will be a little bit of time inbetween when it is expected to arrive, and it's next departure for another service, this has been cut so now if a bus is late, it is much more likely to be late on the next journey, and it goes on and on and gets later and later.

Some would argue the running time for the 128 was a bit too generous. Perhaps reduced running time makes sense and one less bus is required. Traffic in Dublin has got a lot lighter in the last year, another poster described of having to wait up to 15 minutes for a driver changeover.

Does anybody know why Clontarf depot is now on strike?

dub_commuter

MiniD wrote: »

Some would argue the running time for the 128 was a bit too generous. Perhaps reduced running time makes sense and one less bus is required. Traffic in Dublin has got a lot lighter in the last year, another poster described of having to wait up to 15 minutes for a driver changeover.

Does anybody know why Clontarf depot is now on strike?

That would all be very well, there are some outside peak services like ths - this is not the argument The duty in question being withdrawn is a PEAK duty vehicle, when there are not these 15 minute gaps and it will create issues. Off-peak I totally agree with you that there can be reductions in journey times for the reasons you state, and this is not being disputed, the peak, is however.

Jonathan

MiniD wrote: »

Does anybody know why Clontarf depot is now on strike?

In support of the suspended driver. :rolleyes:

John Mason

Sebastian Swift Meteor wrote: »

Heard on RTE news this morning that the Gardaí have advised that all inbound bus lanes are suspended until 10am today to alleviate congestion due to extra traffic...

well, i can tell you at 8.15am this morning on the N2, there were two gardai pulling all cars driving in the bus lanes - the bastards

KC61

dub_commuter wrote: »

Reduced journey time from one terminus to another, the timetable is practically the same, but will be operated with one less bus, so if there is a delay on a service, it makes it very likely that the rest of the services operated by that driver for the day will get progressively later as their shift continues, which could result in "Extraordinary Late Running", where a bus is canceled in order to get things running to timetable again, so they have one service which may not run, in order to make the rest on time rather than having every service the bus operates running late.

At the moment on the 128 route, the journey is estimated as taking a set time, and normally there will be a little bit of time inbetween when it is expected to arrive, and it's next departure for another service, this has been cut so now if a bus is late, it is much more likely to be late on the next journey, and it goes on and on and gets later and later.

Indeed...but it would appear that the 128 is a route where the running time could in fact be cut back - if judging from my own observations of the time buses spent parked between journeys at the southern terminus is anything to go by.

It's all very well to say that delays "might happen". However, how likely is there to be an excessive delay? Delays can happen to any route, but there has to be a balance struck in coming up with a schedule that will deliver the most reliable service while maximising driving time. If buses are waiting for significant periods of time at a terminus between journeys (such as the 48A which frequently in the off-peak has over 30 minutes waiting!!!), then there is scope for change.

At the end of the day, the service needs to be operated in the most efficient manner possible, while delivering a reliable service.

Resolving this dispute needs to be the focus now and descending into a blame game on either side is not going to do that.

angel01

Just been on the dublin bus site, most of the time it doesn't load or I can't seem to look for the bus route timetable that I need, dreadfully designed site.

They should be putting up what time buses are cancelled :rolleyes:

MiniD

dub_commuter wrote: »

That would all be very well, there are some outside peak services like ths - this is not the argument The duty in question being withdrawn is a PEAK duty vehicle, when there are not these 15 minute gaps and it will create issues. Off-peak I totally agree with you that there can be reductions in journey times for the reasons you state, and this is not being disputed, the peak, is however.

Whats is a Peak duty vehicle?

Surely if the timetable is tightened up with reduced running time then it should be spread out across the day. Where is the big gap on the timetable at peak time?

dub_commuter

KC61 wrote: »

Indeed...but it would appear that the 128 is a route where the running time could in fact be cut back - if judging from my own observations of the time buses spent parked between journeys at the southern terminus is anything to go by.

It's all very well to say that delays "might happen". However, how likely is there to be an excessive delay? Delays can happen to any route, but there has to be a balance struck in coming up with a schedule that will deliver the most reliable service while maximising driving time. If buses are waiting for significant periods of time at a terminus between journeys (such as the 48A which frequently in the off-peak has over 30 minutes waiting!!!), then there is scope for change.

At the end of the day, the service needs to be operated in the most efficient manner possible, while delivering a reliable service.

Resolving this dispute needs to be the focus now and descending into a blame game on either side is not going to do that.

I agree, the 128 running time should, and is being cut back outside peak. At the moment there is too much running time during the quietest times for traffic on the 128. This has been cut and I am told there was no objection to this, as it would not have any effect on customers. As your observations quite rightly say, there are buses sitting at the Southern terminus for a decent length of time, I've seen this a lot off-peak.

From what I have heard, they have about 5 or occasionally 10 minutes sitting there during peak, however from what I have heard, they want to cut the running time by up to 10 minutes during peak. Judging by on average the bus has less than this to spare before going out, you can see where the problem lies.

dub_commuter

angel01 wrote: »

Just been on the dublin bus site, most of the time it doesn't load or I can't seem to look for the bus route timetable that I need, dreadfully designed site.

They should be putting up what time buses are cancelled :rolleyes:

The official answer from Customer service for the Euro duties that are effected, is that they do not wish to post this information up at the moment.