Man Utd v Arsenal Champions League

starbelgrade

ShooterSF wrote: »

That doesn't prove he's "over-rated" though. Actually it proves the opposite.

I don't think it's possible to prove it one way or another. That's why football is full of opinions, I presume?

Liam O

Carrick wasn't terrible, his passing was a bit off but I thought that his runs into the box were good and he made a few good tackles. Got the assist (with a little help from Silly) so not all bad.

ShooterSF

starbelgrade wrote: »

I don't think it's possible to prove it one way or another. That's why football is full of opinions, I presume?

Apologies for the use of the word proof. It's evidence that he's under-rated. Cause he's better than sh*t.

GuanYin

nuxxx wrote: »

What team doesnt want possesion? The only true team like this are barcelona left in the CL.

You're just being obtuse now. Look how arsenal usually play vs how they play with the awful formation. It doesn't take a genius to see the problem.

The defence didnt no anything special lol, the problem was UTD overran arsenals midfield because of the lack of selection position wise from wengers selection

They didn't have to. They had an isolated striker incapable of keeping the ball long enough for support by himself. It changed completely when they had two forwards.

diaby never ever got forward, ever. the three man midfield wasnt one. Fabregas was meant was a AM behind ADE but was drawn back to play all the time because hes a CM , and a excellent one at that

But Fabregas didn't in three games, because he isn't comfortable and is wasted in that role. As for Diaby not getting forward? Go watch the three games vs. Chelsea, Liverpool and United tonight. Overall he is the player of the three who is furthest forward (he's also the one who usually loses possession).

Brentner had about 3 runs, 2 of which went back to either fab or nasri and the other loosing possession, everyone nos brentner is championship quality

:rolleyes: Bendtner's contribution isn't about runs. He provides an option for creating space and keeping possession as Arsenal probe an opening, which they do when they play 4-4-2. He has scored some important goals for Arsenal, but he isn't a first choice striker.

Is he a better option than the system tonight? Yes. Definitely.

Van persie was missed as was in my first post, which you claimed 1 player didnt matter to the system. of course it does. Look at utd without ferdinard or vidic, or liverpool without gerrard, or any team without a key key player. Anyway i wont reply to you anymore because i dont think you know what your talking about and dont wanter a 156th infraction because i meantioned a certion word about a certion player

Of course the team is weaker, but Arsenal could have coped if they played the style of play they normally play and the players are comfortable with rather than a system that has three (count them) three times failed to cope with the opposition.

If you can't argue and defend your point with getting petty then don't argue or post.

GuanYin

Does anyone else besides nuux think that Arsenal looked better as a 4-3-2-1 than a 4-4-2 against United and Liverpool?

herbieflowers

GuanYin wrote: »

Does anyone else besides nuux think that Arsenal looked better as a 4-3-2-1 than a 4-4-2 against United and Liverpool?

Was it really 4-4-2 though? Bendtner still seemed to be out wide as opposed to on the shoulder of the centre-backs.

tony1kenobi

To be honest I really don't know why we didn't throw in Vela from the start. We knew he was cleared from quarantine but if we had put the word out that he might have swine flu then dodgy bollix and the hun (Ferdy/Vidic) wouldn't have gone near him....

.....imagine winning the tie using topical disease as a tactic..........

GuanYin

herbieflowers wrote: »

Was it really 4-4-2 though? Bendtner still seemed to be out wide as opposed to on the shoulder of the centre-backs.

Fair point, it's more a 4-4-1-1 that they play... ... still better than the abomination.

herbieflowers

GuanYin wrote: »

Fair point, it's more a 4-4-1-1 that they play... ... still better than the abomination.

Well, it can be problematic playing against a team that defends the way United defended this evening. Back four on the edge of the box, and the midfield not too far ahead. It meant that United were able to keep Arsenal away from the goal, literally, and hindered their characteristic intricate passing game. Thus Adebayour was always going to be somewhat isolated. That said, they could definitely have sneaked one.

jebuz

GuanYin wrote: »

You're just being obtuse now.

What did you just say?

ShooterSF

tony1kenobi wrote: »

To be honest I really don't know why we didn't throw in Vela from the start. We knew he was cleared from quarantine but if we had put the word out that he might have swine flu then dodgy bollix and the hun (Ferdy/Vidic) wouldn't have gone near him....

.....imagine winning the tie using topical disease as a tactic..........

My old man (City fan) said the exact same thing, only he didn't know if he was cleared at the time

Dave!

Cracking performance by United tonight

Happy with pretty much everybody tbh

Lots of lovely passing play, determined runs, and even Berbatov tracking back in a moment of sheer madness

Could really have been more than 1-0, but Fergie said he'd be happy with that, so happy days. No away goals conceded either.

Fletcher was a beast also

tony1kenobi

ShooterSF wrote: »

My old man (City fan) said the exact same thing, only he didn't know if he was cleared at the time

It would've worked....A couple of sneezes when Arsenal had a corner......Ronaldo probably would have rolled around clutching his throat.....:pac:

GuanYin

herbieflowers wrote: »

Well, it can be problematic playing against a team that defends the way United defended this evening. Back four on the edge of the box, and the midfield not too far ahead. It meant that United were able to keep Arsenal away from the goal, literally, and hindered their characteristic intricate passing game. Thus Adebayour was always going to be somewhat isolated. That said, they could definitely have sneaked one.

I think they coped well before. Usually they try and use pace to get in behind United's defense.

The sad thing about these teams is that we're not seeing the the best players playing.

JerryHandbag

I would have taken anything-nil before hand so pretty pleased....roll on 2nd leg, still plenty life left in tie though. And a well taken goal by the white Pele:D

ShooterSF

tony1kenobi wrote: »

It would've worked....A couple of sneezes when Arsenal had a corner......Ronaldo probably would have rolled around clutching his throat.....:pac:

United all playing in long sleeves, face masks and surgical gloves.

herbieflowers

GuanYin wrote: »

I think they coped well before. Usually they try and use pace to get in behind United's defense.

The sad thing about these teams is that we're not seeing the the best players playing.

What's the story with van Persie, Clichy and Gallas? I thought Silvestre had a decent game, though Arsenal were very porous. Ferdinand may be out of the return leg, which would be a boost for Arsenal.

tony1kenobi

ShooterSF wrote: »

United all playing in long sleeves, face masks and surgical gloves.

Berbatov would still be getting kitted out if that were the case.....

JIZZLORD

only seen the 2nd half, but at no stage did i feel that united where threatened. it could have been a high scoring match but in the end the result stands. Also i can't wait to find the youtube footage of ronaldos tantrum. I had just started giving out about him to my friend and he rose to the challenge

itsjaybud

Im not sure everyone here was watching the same match tonight??

Gibbs had an outstanding game considering he was up against Ronaldo and on current form one of the best players in the world Rooney.

Arsenal will have to make do with that result and hopefully we can on top of utd early on in next weeks game. (easier said than done though )

MOTM : The ref great game made ronaldo look such a tool why does such a talented footballer act like that?

Anyway its still very much up in the air on who will reach rome on the 27th!

Mr.Nice Guy

Very good performance from United. They were clearly the better side but unfortunately didn't translate that into goals. Arsenal are very much alive in this tie. With that being said I can't see Arsenal's defence keeping United out at the Emirates. I fancy United to progress.

Random

It was an alright game. Very frustrating from the neutral point of view, hoping someone would score. I felt Utd could have knocked a few in .. Arsenal seemed to have settled for the 1-0 loss in the last 20 mins or so.

Ronaldo is a waste of space (still). The rare moment he appears doesn't justify his existence in the squad IMO.

Headshot

Random wrote: »

It was an alright game. Very frustrating from the neutral point of view, hoping someone would score. I felt Utd could have knocked a few in .. Arsenal seemed to have settled for the 1-0 loss in the last 20 mins or so.

Ronaldo is a waste of space (still). The rare moment he appears doesn't justify his existence in the squad IMO.

lolz about that statement on ronaldo.do yourself a favour and look up his stats before you comment anymore on his existence in the squad

Random

Headshot wrote: »

lolz about that statement on ronaldo.do yourself a favour and look up his stats before you comment anymore on his existence in the squad

Everyone says that to me, but I just don't like him as a player. I'm not a Utd fan so maybe ths is why?

I don't know what it is. To me football is about entertainment and not stats and Ronaldo really doesn't provide the entertainment to me overall. He comes across as a spoilt player where everything is too much hassle for him.

Just my thoughts on it though.

Dave!

Lol..... you're funny

Random

Dave! wrote: »

Lol..... you're funny

Thanks very much.

_blank_

Xavi6

nuxxx wrote: »

Anyway i wont reply to you anymore because i dont think you know what your talking about and dont wanter a 156th infraction because i meantioned a certion word about a certion player

If you wish to debate football then do so without resorting to petty comments about moderation.

The two are seperate to each other so keep that in mind when posting in future.

Cheers

eirebhoy

Very impressed with Darren Fletcher last night. Scotland could do with lending us a central midfielder. Fletcher and Brown is a brilliant partnership.

Mitch Connor

eirebhoy wrote: »

Very impressed with Darren Fletcher last night. Scotland could do with lending us a central midfielder. Fletcher and Brown is a brilliant partnership.

Fletcher has been quality most of this season to be fair to him, one of our more consistent players this year, even through our blip. reckon it should be the same midfield in the away leg, the energy himself and Anderson bring to the midfield is vital for these types of games. I would actually consider swapping Carrick out for either Scholes or Giggs, with Scholes being my choice, cause Carrick is woefully out of form right now.

Boggles

Jaysus was I watching the same game, I thought Carrick was decent, some good passing and good tackles. Anderson had a good first half, he coasted past players effortlessly, final ball and decision making still needs work though.

I said last week Fletcher has to play every game until the end, if I were on that committee the guy would be a certainy for a drug test the way he has been playing the past few games.

Thought Ferdinand was excellent last night, hopefully he hasn't busted a rib. O'Shea, what can you say, told ye he was better than Torres.

United should have put the semi final to bed last night, realistically 3-4 nil would not have flattered the champions.

That said winning at home without conceeding is massive, United will score at the Emirates, danger is The Arse are more than capable of getting 3 especially with the seniors back.

Headshot

jebus boggles I taught carrick was poor and ando was immense one of our best players last night

Theresalwaysone

I will never utter (publically) a bad word about O'Shea again. Unless of course we need a goal in an important match.

Enjoyed the game. Thought we were in full control for nearly all of the match. Can't ask for much more.

Tevez was all energy again but still not clinical enough.

ROCKMAN

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

I will never utter (publically) a bad word about O'Shea again. Unless of course we need a goal in an important match.

Enjoyed the game. Thought we were in full control for nearly all of the match. Can't ask for much more.

Tevez was all energy again but still not clinical enough.

Maybe the finishing was not clinical enough but Almunia did have one of does games (c**t:D).
But we are back tripping teams apart and creating chances . Hopefully the goals will come.

Boggles

Anyone agree with me now that Walcott in these big games is a far better weapon coming off in the bench in the 60th?

Headshot wrote: »

jebus boggles I taught carrick was poor and ando was immense one of our best players last night

Thought Ando was decent, gave the ball away just as much as Carrick though and was non exist for the 15-20 minutes he played in the second half.

Final ball is woefull woefull!!

Mitch Connor

ROCKMAN wrote: »

Maybe the finishing was not clinical enough but Almunia did have one of does games (c**t:D).
But we are back tripping teams apart and creating chances . Hopefully the goals will come.

he did ok, he did what he had to do - i don't think he had one of those game though.

the save from Tevez's shot - it was straight at him. The save from Ronaldo's header, straight at him again. Both were poor misses imo, as opposed to great saves. The one on one save vs Tevez was in his favour to imo - Tevez touch put the ball way too far ahead of him.

Headshot

Boggles wrote: »

Anyone agree with me now that Walcott in these big games is a far better weapon coming off in the bench in the 60th?



Thought Ando was decent, gave the ball away just as much as Carrick though and was non exist for the 15-20 minutes he played in the second half.

Final ball is woefull woefull!!

just have to agree to disagree about carrick and ando then. i cant believe it thou

_blank_

Carrick's passing was very poor by his standards.

But how many times did Evra give the ball away :eek:

New left back please Mr Ferguson.

Theresalwaysone

I was in the UCD student bar last night watching this. Enjoyable atmosphere and whatnot.

BUT the amount of Berba hating United fans was unreal. Everytime he touched the ball he was "****e, lazy, kack" everytime he passed it, it was the wrong decision, everytime he got on the ball it was "run berbatov run". Jesus fúcking christ United fans tilt me.

When he does something right...deathly silent.

One person even blamed Berbatov for GIGGS being offside when he scored... and was deadly serious.

I can understand people believing (falsley) that he is lazy. It is being beaten into them by the media, by the excuses for pundits on RTE and by all and sundry. Its ridiculous. Its come to the stage now where Berbatov could be in the shítter and people will be screaming at him for not squeezing harder.

Mitch Connor

Des wrote: »

Carrick's passing was very poor by his standards.

But how many times did Evra give the ball away :eek:

New left back please Mr Ferguson.

Rumours suggest Evra may be off to Barcelona in the summer.

His passing was very poor last night, but i personally would not be giving up on him yet, he has been fantastic for United for the most part, i would certainly give him time to get himself right again (maybe he is in love, or has swine flu, as RTE say! )

_blank_

I wouldn't pay much attention to the type of fella who watches football in the UCD Student Bar, sure they'd have more interest in Rugger anyway.

Nalz

Manchester United
Van Der Saar 6

Evra 7
Rio 8.5
Vidic 7.5
O Shea 8.5

Ronaldo 7.5
Rooney 7.5
Fletcher 8
Anderson 8
Carrick 7

Tevez 7.5

Giggs 6.5, Berbatov 6.5, Evans 6

ROCKMAN

On Berbs
There has been game this season where he has come across as lazy, some will say it his style of play and some will say its laziness .
For me earlier in the season his level of commitment for the team was just not good enough.
However in the last few games he seems to have upped his work-rate a bit and he has been good in the role as lone striker and especially his first time ball retention and hold up play.

Taught he did fairly well when he came on last night.

Headshot

berba did a grand job when he came on alright but mg he's a slow bastard
no pace what so ever

Mitch Connor

Headshot wrote: »

berba did a grand job when he came on alright but mg he's a slow bastard
no pace what so ever

Yep - wish he had more pace; if that through ball had been to Ronaldo, toure would not have got to the ball first. loved that ball juggling bit on the edge of the box though. his ability to keep possession of the ball is unreal!

ROCKMAN

Headshot wrote: »

berba did a grand job when he came on alright but mg he's a slow bastard
no pace what so ever

AH no he is a bit like me ,

" Lightning quick over 2 yards "

Headshot

ROCKMAN wrote: »

AH no his is a bit like me ,

" Lightning quick over 2 yards "

he's a good power walker alright

Dave!

deisedevil

Boggles wrote: »

Jaysus was I watching the same game, I thought Carrick was decent, some good passing and good tackles. Anderson had a good first half, he coasted past players effortlessly, final ball and decision making still needs work though.

I think you were watching a diff game alright, Carrick was poor and no doubt.

After seeing two or three long passes go way off target I said it to a few friends who agreed he'd wanna sharpen up, after this we watched pass after pass go astray and were very disapointed with him as especially in the long passing area of his game as he's usually spot on. Not anywhere near playing his best last night and it's been a while now since I was impressed with him after a game, he was doing really well earlier in the season, just seems to me that he's caught whatever Evra caught.

PHB

Great performance, good result. If we kept a clean sheet I was happy, so winning by 1 with no away goal for Arsenal is a darn good result.

The way I see it now is that if we score once at the Emirates, which I believe we will, we're through. Can't see Arsenal putting 3 past us.

O'Shea was excellent, not just for his goal. He made fantastic runs down the right wing and really exploited the inexperience of Gibbs.

Carrick was average, didn't really get into the game enough, but kept it ticking. Fletcher was a man possessed, really got stuck in and kept Fabregas quiet. I just wish he'd drive forward a bit more with the ball ala Anderson, because he can, he's got good feet.
Anderson was very very good, great drive from midfield. Hard work and determinatin to get stuck in. Played a huge part in keeping Arsenal quiet, but also provided an outlet.

Ronaldo was outstanding I thought, really at the core of all of our good work in terms of drawing players away and then playing the right pass at the right time. I was shocked that he didn't score that header though, really woulda put the game to bed. Almunia didn't make an amazing save, the ball was straight at him and any premiership goalie woulda saved that.

Tevez I thought had a better game than normal, but that was an absolute guilt edged chance from O'Shea's cross, and Almunia didn't make an amazing save, Tevez made a **** shot. Beyond that he lost the ball a bit too much for my liking. He did however pressurise the defence excellently which was at the core of the game plan for stopping Arsenal play.

Ferdinand was outstanding, at his best, along with Vidic who was top notch. Evra was poor, once again, he really needs to get his game back, a summers break will do that hopefully, because at this stage, O'Shea is pushing him for the LB position, and I'm sure Fabio will aswell soon.

All in all, I'm happy. Can't complain