Are humans naturally good or bad?

philip100

If human beings are nuturally good natured then why does society need to govern there acts and impose laws and punishments to stop them committing evil acts.

5uspect

Evolutionary game theory is all about why it is advantageous to be social and good.
If a cheater enters the game/society he may destabilise it sometimes leading to extinctions. It is proposed that methods to discourage cheaters will therefore need to evolve. That is, good people who are also paranoid will survive better than gullible good people who let the cheater take them for a ride.

We're naturally good natured in general. When we know we won't get caught we may also be quite selfish depending on the strength of our conscious, another evolved system to help keep the peaceful status quo.

Neil3030

Because in any population where a general rule holds to be true, there are exceptions and abberations. In the case of humans being good, this is a general rule, imo, and contingencies such as locks on your door, police, alarms etc etc. are implemented in the face of the small portion of society that are not good. However, this small portion can have a great deal of impact obviously, in many respects giving the impression they exist in greater numbers than they actually do.

In terms of evolution, I believe we have evolved to obey rules in order to avoid the inevitable chaos that would exist otherwise. We also survived as a species and ascended to the top of the food chain in part by learning to work together and form organised societies. As individuals, most animals would have kicked our ass!

seanybiker

humans are the most destructive animal to ever inhabit this earth. Out of all animals we just happen to be the most evolved but we are the worse ever. What animal is messing up this earth. I know i sound a bit mad but seriously. Think about it.

amacachi

Woah, now that you say "Think about it." it's like totally mindblowing.

seanybiker

amacachi wrote: »

Woah, now that you say "Think about it." it's like totally mindblowing.

Ha your funny. Did ya make that one up yourself or ya hear it somewhere. Jesus I am so owned now I dont know what to say.

philip100

Neil3030 wrote: »

Because in any population where a general rule holds to be true, there are exceptions and abberations. In the case of humans being good, this is a general rule, imo, and contingencies such as locks on your door, police, alarms etc etc. are implemented in the face of the small portion of society that are not good.

Hi Neil, this is exactly the point I am trying to make. you say we have locks and alarms to stop the small portion of bad but if these laws and actions were not in place and people were free to act as nature planned would this small number of society be the majority and dominent force. Lets face it we are hunters by nature and since the days of the cave men we have been murdering, raping and stealing. Because of our actions society has had to implement laws and punishments to control our actions.

b12mearse

philip100 wrote: »

Hi Neil, this is exactly the point I am trying to make. you say we have locks and alarms to stop the small portion of bad but if these laws and actions were not in place and people were free to act as nature planned would this small number of society be the majority and dominent force. Lets face it we are hunters by nature and since the days of the cave men we have been murdering, raping and stealing. Because of our actions society has had to implement laws and punishments to control our actions.

Come on..locks and alarms? I can think of alot worse.
I think the majority of people are bad. A small minority are good. But some people when it comes down to the crunch would save themselves before sacrificing themselves for the survival of someone else.
And I don't think someone has to be a criminal to be bad..there are alot of people out there who just get off on the suffering of others

5uspect

seanybiker wrote: »

humans are the most destructive animal to ever inhabit this earth. Out of all animals we just happen to be the most evolved but we are the worse ever. What animal is messing up this earth. I know i sound a bit mad but seriously. Think about it.

We are no more evolved that the simplest virus. All organisms struggle with their environments and either succeed or die.

Neil3030

philip100 wrote: »

Hi Neil, this is exactly the point I am trying to make. you say we have locks and alarms to stop the small portion of bad but if these laws and actions were not in place and people were free to act as nature planned would this small number of society be the majority and dominent force. Lets face it we are hunters by nature and since the days of the cave men we have been murdering, raping and stealing. Because of our actions society has had to implement laws and punishments to control our actions.

I see what you're saying but I don't see society as being independent to the people who comprise it. I.e, laws and rules are not imposed on people, they develop as a function of the nature of people. We have rules about not killing, stealing etc. because inherently we, as a species, do not wish for these behaviours to be commonplace. Like I said, we evolved as a pack species and the pack requires order and mutual respect for one another. Laws developed out of this ethos.

b12mearse wrote: »

Come on..locks and alarms? I can think of alot worse.
I think the majority of people are bad. A small minority are good. But some people when it comes down to the crunch would save themselves before sacrificing themselves for the survival of someone else.

I think you're using a very unfair definition of the word "bad" here. Just because somebody prioritises their wellbeing ahead of others doesn't make them bad, provided they are not interfering with anybody else. Someone getting up, going to work and earning money to pay their mortgage and feed their family is essentially putting themselves before others, but it'd be a bit unfair to call this behaviour "bad". Yes, we are a self-interested, self-serving species, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing.

And I don't think someone has to be a criminal to be bad..there are alot of people out there who just get off on the suffering of others

Not to mention the masochists who get off on the suffering of themselves. Does that balance it out for you?

Zombrex

seanybiker wrote: »

humans are the most destructive animal to ever inhabit this earth. Out of all animals we just happen to be the most evolved but we are the worse ever. What animal is messing up this earth. I know i sound a bit mad but seriously. Think about it.

No we aren't.

About 3 billion years ago micro-bacteria completely changed the Earth's atmosphere, killing the vast majority of life.

That was by far the most "destructive" thing to happen to life on Earth caused by life itself.

Humans have a while to go. The odd nuclear war might top that but we haven't got there yet.

Zombrex

philip100 wrote: »

Hi Neil, this is exactly the point I am trying to make. you say we have locks and alarms to stop the small portion of bad but if these laws and actions were not in place and people were free to act as nature planned would this small number of society be the majority and dominent force. Lets face it we are hunters by nature and since the days of the cave men we have been murdering, raping and stealing. Because of our actions society has had to implement laws and punishments to control our actions.

What do you mean "as nature planned"?

Are we not doing that now? With our locks and alarms and our laws?

It is pointless to say what would humans be like if we removed our intelligence, our society, our cultural laws. That is what humans are. We are society.