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Fine Gael's health system propsals

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    #32
    turgon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭turgon


    Flamed Diving wrote: »
    So if you take a nasty fall and split your head in a life-threatening way, the hospital should turn you away, in this case?

    Ok, I see where I erred. Never let it be said that man cannot change his outlook!


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    #33
    The_Minister
    Registered Users Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    Breezer wrote: »
    True enough, but a big part of the plan is to improve primary care in the community (and have it covered by the health insurance), thereby getting people out of hospitals altogether, allowing them to be more efficient. Therefore, we wouldn't need as many hospitals.
    Except that the number of GPs is about to plummet over the next 4-8 years, meaning that we probably will not be able to sustain even the levels of primary care that we do now.


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    #34
    The_Minister
    Registered Users Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    turgon wrote: »
    Ok, I see where I erred. Never let it be said that man cannot change his outlook!
    I'm glad to hear that, you big, dirty free rider, you:)


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    #35
    Breezer
    Registered Users Posts: 3,228 ✭✭✭Breezer


    The_Minister wrote: »
    Except that the number of GPs is about to plummet over the next 4-8 years, meaning that we probably will not be able to sustain even the levels of primary care that we do now.
    That's why such a focus is being placed on developing the sector. Primary care is about more than just GPs, although I agree they're pretty essential. Don't get me started on the "number of medical graduates looking to be GPs vs number of GP training places vs number of GPs needed" situation...

    I'd like to see more info on exactly what's going to be done for primary care too. Don't forget that this is a roadmap though, and more detailed documents are to follow. *Waits for someone to complain that policies take time to develop*


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    #36
    irish_bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,271 ✭✭✭irish_bob


    Pride Fighter wrote: »
    Saw this on the week in politics. Absolutely disgusting. For profit companies providing health care, nothing but PD type neo liberal nonsense. The PD's FG are incorporating are getting to work quickly.

    your the kind of left wing idealogue who would be happier with a public health service hamstringed by obtuse unions and leaking millions while all the while failing to deliver care to the patient - citizen than (a perish the thought )private orientated health care system being a vast improovement

    personally i trust the for profit business model every time


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    #37
    Vorsprung
    Registered Users Posts: 2,815 ✭✭✭Vorsprung


    The_Minister wrote: »
    Except that the number of GPs is about to plummet over the next 4-8 years, meaning that we probably will not be able to sustain even the levels of primary care that we do now.

    Add to that the fact that GP training places are being cut.

    @ Breezer - My point was in relation to that game FG have on the front page of its site.


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    #38
    The_Minister
    Registered Users Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    bigjimthefirst wrote: »
    Add to that the fact that GP training places are being cut.
    Thats odd. :confused:
    Harney was trying to get them to train more doctors about a year ago, and was negotiating with the representatives of the Doctor's Guilds unions, and was getting education to increase the number of medical places in colleges.

    Was this a cost cutting measure, or a policy change?


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    #39
    jank
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭jank


    Pride Fighter wrote: »
    Saw this on the week in politics. Absolutely disgusting. For profit companies providing health care, nothing but PD type neo liberal nonsense. The PD's FG are incorporating are getting to work quickly.

    You mean neo-conservative nonesense?:rolleyes:

    By the way, whats the singapore model?


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    #40
    Breezer
    Registered Users Posts: 3,228 ✭✭✭Breezer


    The_Minister wrote: »
    Harney was trying to get them to train more doctors about a year ago, and was negotiating with the representatives of the Doctor's Guilds unions, and was getting education to increase the number of medical places in colleges.?
    Was that not undergraduate places? GP training is postgrad.
    bigjimthefirst wrote:
    @ Breezer - My point was in relation to that game FG have on the front page of its site.
    Note to self: don't take everything so seriously :o


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    #41
    turgon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭turgon


    I may be wrong here, but it seems that FG want to force all the insurance companies to offer the same price and same terms. Surely this is distortion of competition?


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    #42
    Vorsprung
    Registered Users Posts: 2,815 ✭✭✭Vorsprung


    Breezer wrote: »
    Was that not undergraduate places? GP training is postgrad.

    Bingo.
    Breezer wrote: »
    Note to self: don't take everything so seriously :o

    :)

    I just have a problem with MRSA being thrown around as a problem when a lot of people don't actually know much about it.


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    #43
    Breezer
    Registered Users Posts: 3,228 ✭✭✭Breezer


    turgon wrote: »
    I may be wrong here, but it seems that FG want to force all the insurance companies to offer the same price and same terms. Surely this is distortion of competition?
    No, not quite. They would all have to offer the same basic package covering essential services, and each individual company would have to charge all its customers the same price for this. But companies would be free to offer the package at a lower price than other companies if that's part of their business model. They could also offer supplemental cover for non-essential services, such as cosmetic treatments, and charge what they liked for that. The companies would also negotiate their own deals with the healthcare providers. So there's plenty of room there for competition.
    bigjimthefirst wrote:
    I just have a problem with MRSA being thrown around as a problem when a lot of people don't actually know much about it.
    It's an incurable virus that causes flesh-eating bacteria. Everyone knows that :p


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    #44
    Amnesiac_ie
    Registered Users Posts: 510 ✭✭✭Amnesiac_ie


    A universal health insurance system, where "money follows the patient" is always a system I've been interested in and it does look like Fine Gael have put real effort into looking abroad for new ideas and coming up with the beginnings of a plan to implement such a solution in Ireland. But is now really a good time to sell a market driven approach to health care to the Irish voting public? Has the Labour party made any formal response to this? Could Eamon Gilmore form a government that had this plan as the cornerstone of its legislative agenda.

    As someone who works at the frontline in the mess that is the HSE (and a formal Labour party member and usual Labour voter) I hope the answer to the above questions is "Yes." I'm totally frustrated with both the top level autocrats in the HSE and the protectionist health sector unions.

    And does this mean I could vote for Enda Kenny? Hmm, maybe I AM running a fever...


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    #45
    ccosgrave
    Closed Accounts Posts: 370 ✭✭ccosgrave


    To be quite honest, this is probably the one issue that could possibly cause me to vote FG.


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