Berlin Marathon

Rusty Cogs 08

Participating in Berlin marathon Sept 20th 2009
Peckham
Jrar
Mithril
Krusty_Clown
RustyCogs 2'59'59"
Daithi BC
ike
aburke
Woddle
ergo

(confirmed in bold)

ergo

Hey,

are many people who are doing Berlin also doing Dublin...? am sure this may have been discussed on some thread or other but so many threads on this forum hard to find the one

my plan was to peak for Berlin , really go for the fast time, then, depending on how that went, maintain some of that fitness, then just run Dublin for the enjoyment (it is 5 weeks after Berlin)

as it stands now, well, I lost a couple of weeks through injury, I feel Berlin may be coming a little soon for me in terms of peak performance - am still going to go for it but do you think it is possible to make further gains in training in the 5 weeks between marathons?

actually that's a ridiculous question - I'll be spending the first week or 2 recovering after Berlin then 3 weeks tapering so doesn't look like a runner

but back to the original question : are many people running Berlin and Dublin and how are they approaching that?

Woddle

I did it last year and pb'd in both, I managed to sqeeze out another 4 mins in Dublin which really surprised me and it wasn't expected and I really enjoyed it, in between the 4 weeks my training was as follows, back doing easy running that Thursday, then for the next 2 weeks I was back in the swing of things but kept my lsr to 15 and then 12 the following week before taking it dead handy in the last week, if I was doing it this year I would do the exact same. The great thing is this year you get an extra week to play with.

Aimman

ergo wrote: »

as it stands now, well, I lost a couple of weeks through injury, I feel Berlin may be coming a little soon for me in terms of peak performance - am still going to go for it but do you think it is possible to make further gains in training in the 5 weeks between marathons?

actually that's a ridiculous question - I'll be spending the first week or 2 recovering after Berlin then 3 weeks tapering so doesn't look like a runner

I did Berlin and Dublin last year and I thought Berlin would be my best time, but in fact I was 15 mins faster in Dublin. I found the Berlin race worked out as a handy last long training run for Dublin (though it wasnt my intention), and it gave me the confidence to keep a good pace up in Dublin. Hope it works out the same for you. If you look after yourself after the Berlin Marathon, you should have a speedy recovery and get back on the road to taper for for Dublin

ergo

good stuff, thanks for those replies - that's fairly encouraging

there are so many different training schedules around but not many which have 2 marathons in 5 weeks at the end of it!

less than 6 weeks to go now.....:)

aburke

Berlin or bust...Ganz oder gar nicht!

mithril

Ran the Adidas 10 mile today and disappointed with my 65:20 . I had hoped to run about a minute faster in preparation for a sub 3 hour attempt which would be the McMillan equivalent.
I ran a 23 mile long run 6 days earlier and a 13 mile hilly run in mid-week so I think there might have been some lingering tiredness in the legs.

Hopefully I have not peaked too soon. I ran 1:25 in Achill Half last month which is a better McMillan comparable time

I can't blame congestion ,the weather and while the course is hillier than I understand Berlin to be, Achill would be a tougher course.

Not sure whether I should should cut down on the mileage for a week to give the body time to recover? I am currently running about 50-60 miles which is lowish in comparison to what a lot of others are doing who are hoping to run sub 3.

Daithi BC

mithril wrote: »

I am currently running about 50-60 miles which is lowish in comparison to what a lot of others are doing who are hoping to run sub 3.

I'm running about 50 miles a week and looking for a 2:50 (having run 2:58 in Dublin last year on even less mileage). Personally, I think it's the quality of the running you're doing rather than the overall mileage, though I'm not sure that everyone would agree with that. I do 1200m intervals on a Tuesday, recovery run Wednesday, marathon paced 10k on a Thursday, hill session on a Saturday and long run (32km max) on a Sunday.

I wouldn't underestimate the possibility of tiredness after your long run on Sunday and the hilly 13 miler.

Daithi BC

Hope everyone's training is going well - last two weeks of hard stuff now and then three weeks of tapering.

My plans for a 2:50 look out the window after picking up a injury to my right shin. It looks like I'll be able to run it, but I'm going to be missing at least two weeks of training, so I'll have to decide whether to aim for 3:00, 3:10, or just to get round.

On the bright side, I shouldn't be beaten up as much by it, so I should be fit to pace 3:30 in Dublin.

Rusty Cogs 08

Yup, into my 2nd last hard P&D week, although the 3 taper weeks are not without some tough sessions, although I'm literally counting down the runs now (22).

I was looking through the literature on the race and it talks about every runner getting a sponge and there being 'basins' at the water stations to dunk the sponge in. This is a new one on me and sounds like it could be a great resource (especially if the weather is hot) to cool down rather than the usual act of throwing half a cup of water over your head. Question is, how do you carry the thing ? I'm considering investing in a small (light) belt for carb drink, gels and now this sponge. Might discard the whole lot at around the 20 mile mark if I'm feeling good.

What's everyone else planning on doing / have done in the past ?

Mickeybags

When I did IM Lanzarote a few years ago we were running in 30 degrees of heat
I put 2 sponges under each shoulder strap. The idea being that you were cooling your core temperature by cooling the blood as it passed thru the arteries in the neck.

I know in Hawaii some of the Pro's used iced gloves for the same reason

mithril

Rusty Cogs 08 wrote: »

I'm considering investing in a small (light) belt for carb drink, gels and now this sponge. Might discard the whole lot at around the 20 mile mark if I'm feeling good.
quote]

Yeo, thats what I am doing and I am trainng with it on my LSRs to get used to it. Carry 2 powergels in it (and some money and keys ) .

Weighs hardly anything but belt cuts into you a little bit and so I am planning to chuck it after I take my second gel.

From what I have read, sponging just gives you a momentarily psychological boost - like eating an ice cream - and won't lower your core temperature noticeably. I will be in real trouble if I have to run in temperatures in the upper twenties.

Woddle

Hopefully the weather will be similar to last year. There was no wind and while travelling to the start all you needed was a T-shirt over the gear you were going to run in. It really was perfect, cool, clear at 9am but come 11 it was getting warmer and that combined with 2 hours of effort was tough. They have big basins for you to wet your sponge but I just stuck my head in a few having disregarded my sponge before the off. You'll see lots of disregarded sponges in the opening miles. And on finishing just after 12:37 pm the weather was perfect, it kept you warm and made you appreciate all the fruit and cold drinks at the end. So excited, I'm so glad I've decided to this again.
I did 20 yesterday and included a few walking breaks and I think there's a few boardsies (including myself) doing 20 on Sunday morning. The following Sunday I plan on doing 22 before tapering and running shorter but faster sessions.

village runner

aburke wrote: »

Berlin or bust...Ganz oder gar nicht!

What time you hope to do ?? You finished in front of me in Ballycotton.

A good group of us are going from the home of hurling. Having been there last year it will help for preparions etc. With 4.5 weeks to go its a big nxt two weeks. High mileage and plenty of cycling. Its the diet i have to watch carefully.

aburke

village runner wrote: »

What time you hope to do ?? You finished in front of me in Ballycotton.

The target has been 2:50 for a long time.
I'd have good races and bad races all year, Ballycotton being a good one.
I took 2 weeks holidays in the middle of training, and training hasn't gone well since.

I'm not doing enough miles to be happy nor was I happy with my Streets of Galway performance.

All that said, I plan on doing a tough 'race conditions' long run soonish, and I'll see whether 2:50 is possible after that.
3 mile warmup, 15 mls at race pace, 3 miles warm down.

Jetzt geht's los!

Alan

Rusty Cogs 08

One thing I wanted to clear up. Are you allocated a pen by virtue of your previous best time or predicted time. I can't remember what the application form requested (if anything) and I'm afraid of getting stuck in the + 3'15" pen (previous best) instead of the sub 3' pen (goal). The prospect of having to battle through everyone in the 3' - 3'15" pen and try and find the sub 3' pacer concerns me.

Woddle

Hi Rusty if I remember correctly you had to proove your time from a previous race but I wouldn't worry about it, you won't believe how easily you get away and how much space you have to run in.

Woddle

On a different note, are we going to meet up that evening for a few beers, my mate is coming instead of the wife and we'll be heading to the Irish pub. Heads of to find out where that pub is, we went there last year and it was great crack, even the DJ had his medal on.

Rusty Cogs 08

Woddle wrote: »

my mate is coming instead of the wife and we'll be heading to the Irish pub.

Deft switch good sir.

I'd be very much on for that, I'll stun the OH with my powers to find common ground with 'total strangers' in a pub we (I) just happened to drop into.

Woddle

My OH last year actually loved the buzz in the pub, great night. I think the one we went to was on Kantstrabe or at least near to it, I'll find out for def.

http://www.irishpubberlin.de/index.php?id=33

shels4ever

Woddle wrote: »

My OH last year actually loved the buzz in the pub, great night. I think the one we went to was on Kantstrabe or at least near to it, I'll find out for def.

http://www.irishpubberlin.de/index.php?id=33

The buzz after a Marathon is somethign great, missed out on it last year after my shambles but will have to do one more sometime.

Woddle

shels4ever wrote: »

The buzz after a Marathon is somethign great, missed out on it last year after my shambles but will have to do one more sometime.

Nothing stopping you from hijacking the post Dublin drinks

Woddle

Just looking through an attachment that I have to bring to the expo and they have this written down
T1*** chip, 02:59:00,1979, inline skater

So I've sent them a mail to make sure it's not the skating marathon I've signed up for. Did anyone get the same

lizanne83

Hi all, I’m watching this Berlin thread banter and the exciting conversation of the marathon on the horizon now approaching the taper time.

Rusty, from experience (I won’t even go into that experience for fear of daggers again!) but you don’t need to worry about the pen allocation. I got into the Berlin sub-3 pen last year no probs despite it not being my ‘goal’… or previous PB.

Woddle, as far as I remember that Irish bar we were in (met you and wifey there) was the Irish Pub in the Europa-Center - take the U/S-Bahn Zoologischer Garten if not staying in the same hotel (Exchequer)

Rusty Cogs 08

Woddle wrote: »

Just looking through an attachment that I have to bring to the expo and they have this written down
T1*** chip, 02:59:00,1979, inline skater

So I've sent them a mail to make sure it's not the skating marathon I've signed up for. Did anyone get the same

No mention of inline skating on mine, isn't that on the Saturday ? Why not do both ?

shels4ever

Woddle wrote: »

Just looking through an attachment that I have to bring to the expo and they have this written down
T1*** chip, 02:59:00,1979, inline skater

So I've sent them a mail to make sure it's not the skating marathon I've signed up for. Did anyone get the same

I know you have changed your training plans a few time and gone from doing 800m to Marathons but to take up inline skating at this point is going a bit too far ...

Hope you didnt sign up for the wrong one.

Woddle

I've just checked and I appear to be signed up for both :rolleyes: you can search list of participants, I'm a dope, don't know how I did that and where is my mail with my proper reg. There's alot to be said with going through an operator.

shels4ever

Woddle wrote: »

I've just checked and I appear to be signed up for both :rolleyes: you can search list of participants, I'm a dope, don't know how I did that and where is my mail with my proper reg. There's alot to be said with going through an operator.

So better get a pair of skates then.

aburke

village runner wrote: »

What time you hope to do ?? You finished in front of me in Ballycotton.

And yourself? Whats the plan timewise?

jlang

shels4ever wrote: »

So better get a pair of skates then.

Or a pair of those runners the kids wear that have wheels that flip out of the heels, so you're covered either way.

Krusty_Clown

Woddle wrote: »

Just looking through an attachment that I have to bring to the expo and they have this written down
T1*** chip, 02:59:00,1979, inline skater

So I've sent them a mail to make sure it's not the skating marathon I've signed up for. Did anyone get the same

Attachment?? Did we get something that we're supposed to print and bring?
I see I'm the oldest registered Boards AC runner, so that's my first excuse lined-up.

village runner

aburke wrote: »

And yourself? Whats the plan timewise?

I will know in three weeks. Depends on my weight. I am a firm believer in this. I have improved since march so i really should break 3 hours. Ran 3,04 in Rotterdam. I might have a go at 2.55 but as i said if i behave eating wise i will go for this. hope to be a stone lighter than i was in Rotterdam so i reckon its worth 9 min. Spend alot of time on bike to burn more cals as i dont be starving after bike like i am after running. Might hook up with you over there. But i wont be going at 2.50. Thats for sure. Best of luck with you training. Whats the plan training wise fir the nxt week.

aburke

village runner wrote: »

Whats the plan training wise fir the nxt week.

Going through a bad patch mentally, struggling to get out at all.
It happens.
I'm getting in the long runs though, did 20 this morning.

I'd be happy just to get out every evening this week, give the way my motivation is.
I've planned a 'paced long run' for next Sunday - that will tell a lot.

Alan

ergo

feel like I'm running out of time in terms of sessions before Berlin - it always seemed so far away and now we're nearly tapering :eek:

finally seeing some benefits of the miles I've been putting in -

unfortunately I haven't been able to manage to get in any proper races on the past few months but I did run a 10k in training tonight in 39:21 - my fastest for 4 years

and just 1 second slower than my actual PB

But, my long slow runs have become a bit too slow, have acquired a training partner just for long runs whose pace is a quite a bit below mine - I'm not too bothered though because I like the company for the long runs

my current up-to-date goal is still sub 3:10 but if it feels right on the day will try for sub 3:05 or better.......

Woddle

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Attachment?? Did we get something that we're supposed to print and bring?
I see I'm the oldest registered Boards AC runner, so that's my first excuse lined-up.

Hi Krusty, yep you should have received alot of emails, the title starts SCC and there is lots of info in them and yep I found an old mail with my correct marathon reg but I still have not heard back from them regarding the inline skating.
On a different note, today will be 4 days of no running, my left shin started to throb after my last lsr but feels great today.

Daithi BC

Went for my first run last night since the 10 miler in the Phoenix Park. My right shin is still in bits, though I think I might be able to hobble round Berlin.

Woddle

Daithi BC wrote: »

Went for my first run last night since the 10 miler in the Phoenix Park. My right shin is still in bits, though I think I might be able to hobble round Berlin.

I had this problem last year also and I found stretching the calfs and using the foam roller on the calfs and shins very helpful. Also ice and the 3 days leading up to it I was an ibrufon junky

Daithi BC

I'll make it alright. I just might need to borrow your inline skates....

mithril

Anyone doing a final 8-10k tune-up race 2 weeks beforehand per the P&D schedule? If so where?

Krusty_Clown

mithril wrote: »

Anyone doing a final 8-10k tune-up race 2 weeks beforehand per the P&D schedule? If so where?

I couldn't find one.. Still looking.

village runner

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

I couldn't find one.. Still looking.

6 miler in kilkenny friday 4th september. Asimonov, ike myself and hopefully sosa will be there.
10km in
Portlaoise the 6th.

Krusty_Clown

village runner wrote: »

6 miler in kilkenny friday 4th september. Asimonov, ike myself and hopefully sosa will be there.
10km in
Portlaoise the 6th.

Is the Kilkenny race open to anyone? Any links for the Portlaoise race?
Thanks!

ergo

well, what's everyone doing or done this weekend?

No nearby race that I can do - am off out for a 10-12 miler

Krusty_Clown

Did a 10k time trial instead of a race yesterday, and doing 16 miles tomorrow.

Berlin have now launched their SMS service (you can register your mobile phone number against anyone's race number. Haile Gebrselassie's bib number is #1. Link here.
Here's my interpretation of the over-complicated water-stations layout!

Rusty Cogs 08

Does this mean that there's no carb/sports drink on offer ?

If it all goes wrong in the first half I think I'll just treat myself to four massages. You'd have to be pretty relaxed as 26.2 miles go.

Krusty_Clown

The 'Tea' seems to be the sports drink. Must give it a try when I get over there. Do you remember what it was like Woddle?

Also, do you have a link to your run last year on Garmin Connect? Wouldn't mind getting a look at the elevation profile, and also find a place where the OH can give me some supplies (<insert corny Asian joke here>).

Woddle

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

The 'Tea' seems to be the sports drink. Must give it a try when I get over there. Do you remember what it was like Woddle?

Also, do you have a link to your run last year on Garmin Connect? Wouldn't mind getting a look at the elevation profile, and also find a place where the OH can give me some supplies (<insert corny Asian joke here>).

Berlin marathon
I've never been able to upload this for some reason but I deleted the last lap and it finally manually uploaded although the information regarding elevation seems to be all over the place.

There is sports drinks but can't remember where they are on course but there is plenty of stands through out the course

jrar

I think I know the answer to this one myself, but just looking for advice or input from more experienced runners

Heading for Berlin on Sun. week and have done 3 x LSRs (18. 19 and 20 miles) plus a 14-miler last Monday. Have ongoing back/sciatica problems and my left hamstring is feeling a little "loose" as a result - not quite twanging like a banjo string but definitely not feeling like it's raring to go for a 26-mile run.

So do I rest up completely and trust that what I've done to date (did 5 x 40 mile weeks during late July and right up to early Sept.) will carry me through, or do I get another 4 or 5 "gentle" 5-milers in between now and Fri. week ?

I've run the last 2 DCMs so I have some idea of what it's like to run the distance, but I've never had to do it before with a dodgy hamstring.

Would welcome any and all advice - thanks.

Woddle

Hi Jrar it's a tough one, yes you have all the hard work done but 2 weeks is a long time of doing nothing, if you can get out every second day for a 5 miler do but if there's any sign of a niggle, stop. I would imagine you could still get around the course even if you did nothing for the next 2 weeks but your confidence might be knocked slightly so again another reason to get out and run and keep the confidence high. Best of luck

Rusty Cogs 08

Well my €0.013793 worth would say that the last two weeks is about maintaining whatever level of fitness you've achieved. You don't have to necessary run to do that so you might mix it up a bit with cycles and swims. If neither of those float your boat then as per Dubya, I'd go for some easy running. Soon enough your legs are going to have to cope with 26.2 miles so you might as well give them an airing over the next 10 days to see how they feel.