Frequently asked questions about suitable electric showers!

Joey the lips

There are many types of shower on the market today. Many buyers are traditional in there methods of buying and usually relie on price rather than model. This is a mistake as different functions of showers call for different prices.

Pumped Electric Showers
This the most common type of shower on the market that is electric powered supply.The water is pumped and heated at the same time. This provides instant hot water which is useful if you fail to set the immersion however it is a little louder than all the other showers. This uses cold water from the attic storage tank. This must not be connected to a mains water .This is available in many power sizes ie 8.5 / 9.5 /10.8 however becuase of the irish system of electric only arriving at 220volts you will generally only get 8.5 kw no matter what model you go for. Its life span varies but usually suffers from over use becuase its the most convienent shower. Eg Triton T90/ Mira Elite 2 / Redring pumped electric shower.

Power Shower
This is probably the second most popular model of shower. What this does is take cold water from the attic storage tank and hot water from the hot press cylinder. This generally tends to be slightly quiter than the pumped electric but the disadvantage is that it relies on a store of hot water. People usually install this as a second shower because they dont need the second one to be instant hot and You cannot fit a second pumped electric shower without fitting a special switch which only allows one shower work at a time and this usually proves expensive.

You do not need to do this with a powershower and pumped electric shower fit together but ask your electrician for advice on your own grid. Because the power shower only pumps the water it generally pumps at a higher pressure giving an exhilarating and invigorating shower. However the downside is if you forget to set the boiler for hot water you will be having a cold shower. Becuase the hot water in the tank can be at different temperatures power showers can be bought with or without thermostats Eg: Aqualisa power shower. Redring 520 Expressions Triton AS2000

Electric Showers
Electric showers take cold water direct from the mains and heat it as it passes through the shower. This gives instant hot water so no need to have stored hot water. These relie on good mains pressure and will not work well if mains is bad. Better to have a plumber check your mains pressure. These come in many different wattages and the higher the wattage the better the heater.These are sometimes used in attic conversions because the shower is above the tank. Eg: Triton T80/Redring Selectronic Thermostatic shower.

Mixer Showers
Lastly there is mixer showers. These are generally not electric. They do the exact same thing as the power shower except they do not have a pump. Ie They take hot water from the cylinder and cold water from the attic tank.They usually rely on gravity and a stored cylinder of hot water. However where attic conversions are done a booster pump is usually fitted to these because the dropping of the tank causes a drop of pressure. These come in thermostatic and manual. In the last number of years builders have in general fitted the cheaper manual shower with fixed head however the most prefered one by far is a thermostatic one with a riser rail kit. Eg: Most of the brass bodied chrome showers abailable on the market with or without riser rail kits.[/SIZE][/FONT]

Special note: This information is solely for information purposes only. Please varify all this in the shop you are buying the shower to ensure there has been no change in specification that renders the showers mentioned above unsuitable for your application.

oh and happy showering!

2011

A well written and informative post Joey. Just a little point or 2

This is available in many power sizes ie 8.5 / 9.5 /10.8 however becuase of the irish system of electric only arriving at 220volts you will generally only get 8.5 kw no matter what model you go for

With the Irish system we get 230 volts. Most domestic connections are 12kVA and there is also a larger 16kVA supply available for the last few years. The standard 12kVA domestic connection is considerably larger connection capacity than many countries in the EU. In France for example you are not permitted to have a single load as large as 8.5kW in a domestic installation.

I know several homes in Ireland with a 9.5 kW Trition T90 showers.

BTW the Triton T80 (8.5kW) is designed to be fed from the mains water supply instead of the tank in the attic (unlike the T90).

danjo

Joey the lips wrote: »

Electric Showers
Electric showers take cold water direct from the mains and heat it as it passes through the shower. This gives instant hot water so no need to have stored hot water. These relie on good mains pressure and will not work well if mains is bad. Better to have a plumber check your mains pressure. These come in many different wattages and the higher the wattage the better the heater.These are sometimes used in attic conversions because the shower is above the tank. Eg: Triton T80/Redring Selectronic Thermostatic shower.

Great information Joey. One question relating to the Electric shower...is it possible to connect this to the immersion tank instead of the mains? Reason being to use hot water when available in the tank.

Davy

danjo wrote: »

Great information Joey. One question relating to the Electric shower...is it possible to connect this to the immersion tank instead of the mains? Reason being to use hot water when available in the tank.

That would be a mixer shower and not an electric shower.

davelerave

2011 wrote: »

A well written and informative post Joey. Just a little point or 2



With the Irish system we get 230 volts. Most domestic connections are 12kVA and there is also a larger 16kVA supply available for the last few years. The standard 12kVA domestic connection is considerably larger connection capacity than many countries in the EU. In France for example you are not permitted to have a single load as large as 8.5kW in a domestic installation.

I know several homes in Ireland with a 9.5 kW Trition T90 showers.

BTW the Triton T80 (8.5kW) is designed to be fed from the mains water supply instead of the tank in the attic (unlike the T90).

there's also 21kva and 29kva in single phase subject to availability.

Joey the lips

Davy wrote: »

That would be a mixer shower and not an electric shower.

correct, it would also be a power shower

Joey the lips

Thanks guys for the electrical guidence. I am not perfect and knowledge shareing works by me. Thanks

Joey the lips

2011 wrote: »

A well written and informative post Joey. Just a little point or 2



With the Irish system we get 230 volts. Most domestic connections are 12kVA and there is also a larger 16kVA supply available for the last few years. The standard 12kVA domestic connection is considerably larger connection capacity than many countries in the EU. In France for example you are not permitted to have a single load as large as 8.5kW in a domestic installation.

I know several homes in Ireland with a 9.5 kW Trition T90 showers.

BTW the Triton T80 (8.5kW) is designed to be fed from the mains water supply instead of the tank in the attic (unlike the T90).

I said the T80 is a mains shower but is normally used in attic conversions becase the T90 cant

2011

there's also 21kva and 29kva in single phase subject to availability.

Are you sure? I have never heard of this.

The application form for new domestic connections (and increase of existing connection) describes the 16kVA as "maximum".

http://www.esb.ie/esbnetworks/downloads/domestic_new_connection.pdf

I said the T80 is a mains shower

Sorry, my bad.
Like I said, a very good post.

davelerave

2011 wrote: »

Are you sure? I have never heard of this.

The application form for new domestic connections (and increase of existing connection) describes the 16kVA as "maximum".

http://www.esb.ie/esbnetworks/downloads/domestic_new_connection.pdf



Sorry, my bad.
Like I said, a very good post.

they're ct metered single-phase .they cost a few thousand for the mv network.have only seen for commercial but have been implemented for domestic.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055472293&page=2

2011

they're ct metered single-phase .they cost a few thousand for the mv network.have only seen for commercial but have been implemented for domestic.

Thanks for that. You are correct. Very interesting!!

I cant see why someone would want this though. If a 16kVA single phase supply is not large enough the best thing to do would be to a get 3 phase supply IMHO. Then you can have all of the advantages of 3 phase (there are many) and have as large a supply as you want.

The only advantage would be that perhaps the expense of getting 3 phase installed in some cases would be far more that getting one of these large single phase supplies.

davelerave

2011 wrote: »

Thanks for that. You are correct. Very interesting!!

I cant see why someone would want this though. If a 16kVA single phase supply is not large enough the best thing to do would be to a get 3 phase supply IMHO. Then you can have all of the advantages of 3 phase (there are many) and have as large a supply as you want.

The only advantage would be that perhaps the expense of getting 3 phase installed in some cases would be far more that getting one of these large single phase supplies.

i think the esb favour the higher-capacity SP supplies for commercial and technical reasons( for some domestic).depends on the size of sp loads and what's available nearby.a single phase mv supply is sometimes the only available in rural areas.the 16kva and larger are suited to large inductive SP loads because of connection to mv network via transformer.

2011

a single phase mv supply is sometimes the only available in rural areas

This is what I was thinking.

16kva and larger are suited to large inductive SP loads because of connection to mv network via transformer.

What do you mean?

All 1ph loads (inductive or otherwise) are connected to the network through an ESB transformer at some point.

davelerave

voltage drop .enhanced supplies and larger SP supplies are connected direct to transformer (mv is brought to edge of site for rural).whereas 12kva and standard 3-phase may be connected to 230v LV some distance from nearest trafo.ie:supply capacity and quality.voltage tolerance i 5% i think but heat pumps are a different story

Davy

Three phase may not even be available in the city. A lot of dublin city still has old concentirc cables which aren't 3 phases.

enmac

danjo wrote: »

Great information Joey. One question relating to the Electric shower...is it possible to connect this to the immersion tank instead of the mains? Reason being to use hot water when available in the tank.

the way i'm interpreting this question is that you are thinking that you won't use as much electricty if the water is somewhat warm already /

the main problem is that you only have a single supply to the shower and the water from the cylinder could be far too hot to have a shower

Joey the lips

enmac wrote: »

the way i'm interpreting this question is that you are thinking that you won't use as much electricty if the water is somewhat warm already /

the main problem is that you only have a single supply to the shower and the water from the cylinder could be far too hot to have a shower

You cant ever have a single supply to a shower unless its a T90 and it would not be coming from a cylinder it comes from the attic so I dont think you are inter it correctly! Sorry!

danjo

enmac wrote: »

the way i'm interpreting this question is that you are thinking that you won't use as much electricty if the water is somewhat warm already /

the main problem is that you only have a single supply to the shower and the water from the cylinder could be far too hot to have a shower

Yes, that was what I was thinking alright. I now see that it could not work, as you say, the water could be far too hot.
Thanks,

danjo

Joey the lips

danjo wrote: »

Yes, that was what I was thinking alright. I now see that it could not work, as you say, the water could be far too hot.
Thanks,

danjo

The two of you need to be a little careful, you cannot plumb one supply to any shower except the T80( Must only be mains cold) and the T90(must only be tank cold) and while in reality this is possible to plumb one hot supply to the T80 and the T90, The T80 wont work cause the pressure wont be high enough and if by some act of god it did work you would have no way to cool the water. In the case of the T90 the same

In a nut shell(and forgive me) if this is being contemplated considered or done you have not a clue how showers operate so be very careful if not for your sakes for those using. Thanks

danjo

No need for forgiveness Joey. It was merely a question which has been answered.

Thanks,

danjo

enmac

Joey the lips wrote: »

You cant ever have a single supply to a shower unless its a T90 and it would not be coming from a cylinder it comes from the attic so I dont think you are inter it correctly! Sorry!

Joey,

It looks like i was interpreting the question correctly after all !
No need for any apologies mate

Joey the lips

enmac wrote: »

Joey,

It looks like i was interpreting the question correctly after all !
No need for any apologies mate

I see that I was amazed you both could be mistaken in that way so yes I apologise for assuming but at least you both understand now

its all shareing of info which is good

enmac

Joey the lips wrote: »

I see that I was amazed you both could be mistaken in that way so yes I apologise for assuming but at least you both understand now

its all shareing of info which is good

Joey,

I don't mean to go on about this but in your posts you have basically stated that I don't know how various electric showers work - you've used the words, mistaken, little careful, not a clue..

I have clearly answered the question posed by Danjo and He has acknowledged it.

You obviously have an indepth knowledge of showers and I'm not questioning that, but I fail to see how you can criticise my posts

Please point out where I was wrong

Joey the lips

enmac wrote: »

Joey,

I don't mean to go on about this but in your posts you have basically stated that I don't know how various electric showers work - you've used the words, mistaken, little careful, not a clue..

I have clearly answered the question posed by Danjo and He has acknowledged it.

You obviously have an indepth knowledge of showers and I'm not questioning that, but I fail to see how you can criticise my posts

Please point out where I was wrong

We are just crossing incorrectly and you are thinking the worst, dont. its just a misunderstanding. My understanding is you both thought you could connect a shower to the hot only. You cant i thought thats what you figured if you did not and I am misunderstanding fine. The only reason I added the comment is it was me how corrected you first for which I am sorry

Kiniska

Hi Joey,

Not to confuse this any more, but can you have an electric mixer shower. That uses both hot and cold water lines and heats the water if the hot isn't hot enough?

Joey the lips

Kiniska wrote: »

Hi Joey,

Not to confuse this any more, but can you have an electric mixer shower. That uses both hot and cold water lines and heats the water if the hot isn't hot enough?

No not as such but some comes are doing a new shower that heats small qtys of water in a box behind the shower say in a hot press. The closest you come is

Power shower 2 feeds stored hot water

Pumped electric shower 1 feed- cold water

I welcome any new knowledge if known always. Its about shareing nreally

Stoner

Jebus lads, start a new thread!!!

Unless someone wants an MV shower cabled in speaker wire

mahoney.john

Joey the lips wrote: »

Mixer Showers
Lastly there is mixer showers. These are generally not electric. They do the exact same thing as the power shower except they do not have a pump. Ie They take hot water from the cylinder and cold water from the attic tank.They usually rely on gravity and a stored cylinder of hot water. However where attic conversions are done a booster pump is usually fitted to these because the dropping of the tank causes a drop of pressure. These come in thermostatic and manual. In the last number of years builders have in general fitted the cheaper manual shower with fixed head however the most prefered one by far is a thermostatic one with a riser rail kit. Eg: Most of the brass bodied chrome showers abailable on the market with or without riser rail kits.[/size][/font]

Special note: This information is solely for information purposes only. Please varify all this in the shop you are buying the shower to ensure there has been no change in specification that renders the showers mentioned above unsuitable for your application.

oh and happy showering!

hi,
the info you provided is really very useful

Joey the lips

mahoney.john wrote: »

hi,
the info you provided is really very useful

Thank you. If you need any further help just ask. I also do public speaking on the subject if you would like me to give a talk. I am reasonably priced. I will PM you my managers no if you want. :D:D:D:D

Joey the lips

Information on electric showers as requested

Scorpio Girl

i have a power shower that i need to heat the water for. every morning the immersion comes on for an hour, i have a shower, maybe 7 minutes long and that's about all the hot water i get from having the immersion on for an hour. is this right or do i need to get something checked out?