licence conditions

brieny1000

hi all
my friend bought a trg 308 and has had serious problems with licence. he will be granted the licence on certain conditions.he can only use the gun on 1 of his permissions in co clare(he is living in west cork) and not on the others as the inspector does not think it is safe to use on these farms and mountain areas as they are 100 to150 acres and this in his opinion is not big enough for a .308.!!!he has land himself but he cant use it here. he has to have the gun unassembled at all times other than when on the permission in clare ie (has to take off sights!!). he can only zero gun on this land when he is going shooting. he plans to do the hcap but must inform inspector before hand and will get permission for that day.. if he wants to go to an approved shooting range he must also inform inspector.he had 2 .243`s which he has gotten rid of to get the trg. he cant use the gun for vermin control also as it is too big for fox!!!!he has never had a problem with the law.the inspector has more or less suggested going to court to get it sorted.(more wasted tax payers money)did any of ye have similar problems/stupid conditions? or any suggestions. he is with countryside alliance but they dont seem too interested.

Bobby_1

sounds a bit over the top to me. a friend of mine who i go out shooting with has a .308 had no trouble getting it or had no conditions like the above mentioned. the thing that is wrong with the licencing laws in this country is that they are at the discretion of people! no proper regulations as to who is allowed what and for what reason! if he lived some where else with the same permissions there might be no trouble getting the license to shoot the lands he has permission for, or he might be refused permission for the .308 altogether. just another arseways setup in this backwards country in my opinion.

bunny shooter

And I thought my Super was OTT

Shame on Countryside Alliance first off. They are on the FCP and therfore have access to the Firearms Policy Unit

Apart from court this would be his best option.

I am in CA as a group member from a certain establishment, however, I am a NARGC member too. I had a firearms licence issue recently and approached Des Crofton and he got it sorted within 24 hours for me

Personally I would not let CA off the hook. Your friend had paid his membership. He is entitled to their help when he needs it.

Jonty

OP, when you say "inspectors", do you mean Gardai firearms officers or NPWS rangers?? The only reason I ask is that I've never heard of the gardai telling somebody that 100 acres was too small to be shooting on.

I presume your friend is using the TRG for deer stalking. He must be a big chap. I mean whether its 20 acres or 2000 acres it shoudn't make a difference what size the permission is. Stalking is all about getting close to target, not knocking deer on one side of a 200 yd permission while you're on the other side.

It wasn't me!

I'd give the firearms policy unit a ring personally. They really seem to want to hear from people, which is fantastic. A chat with them will leave everything a lot clearer, and he'll know best one way or the other.

jwshooter

thats total crap ,firstly i would get your friend to get the super to put all there conditions on to paper and stamp and sign it .

giving reasons why he has restricted the man in question to his silly whims and also i would ask him for his practical experience in the use of sed firearm .

none i would think.

if these conditions are not printed onto the firearms licence,which i doubt very much i would seek legal advice on it .
this more of it give these guys a inch and the will try take a mile

personally i would not except this from them .

i would give des a ring he might help or know a man that can .

they reckon some one in templemore is stealing there brain as they sleep ,
must have a good few by now .

brieny1000

thanks to all who have replied.
the inspector is gardai.
yes it is for deer stalking, he has been stalking with years with the 243's but wants the 308 for the the extra umph!! he explained to the cop that his shots would be up to 100 odd yrds with a back stop but he does'nt have a clue. he kept refering to it as the BIG gun , he also called the 308 a sniper pistol!!! he is a big man alright:D:Dsorry pat.
thanks lads

rrpc

brieny1000 wrote: »

he cant use the gun for vermin control also as it is too big for fox!!!!

Was he intending to use a .308 to shoot vermin and fox?


IWM:
NGB's are the sole point of contact with the FPU.

chem

It wasn't me! wrote: »

I'd give the firearms policy unit a ring personally. They really seem to want to hear from people, which is fantastic. A chat with them will leave everything a lot clearer, and he'll know best one way or the other.

Can you post there number?

like to hunt

have to agree with jw he is right.. we may stand up...
i have a
.300 w.m
.223
.22 pistol
12 g
410 g
the super says get rid of some and she mite give me .17

i have tryed for .17 14 months now
had to get crime officer out again.....
give writgen reason whey i wanted it.....
paper work was lost.. back to gun shop....

rrpc

chem wrote: »

Can you post there number?

Your representative association is the point of contact. Individuals should contact their association with full details of the problem they're having and they can then take it to the FPU.

Grizzly 45

What do us lot do who are not in any organisations as
[1] There are none that repersent our intrests in disiplines we want to persue? Only one I was intrested in was disbanded here.
[2] Have tried to contact others to find out how to join clubs or form ones in ones area and have never recived even the courtsey of a phone call or reply from head offices on this.[NARGC take note on this].

A "sniper pistol":eek::eek: Whatever next???

ILTH,I had the same nonsense to get a .243.Swop out two for one seems to be the newest BS trick going on around this great little country.:rolleyes:

rrpc

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

What do us lot do who are not in any organisations as
[1] There are none that repersent our intrests in disiplines we want to persue? Only one I was intrested in was disbanded here.

Well apart from the NARGC which you can join as an individual and will represent you, there's also Countryside Alliance Ireland who will do the same (notwithstanding the comment above).

[2] Have tried to contact others to find out how to join clubs or form ones in ones area and have never recived even the courtsey of a phone call or reply from head offices on this.[NARGC take note on this].

Depends what you wanted the club to do. Anyone can form a club you don't need the say so of an association, but it helps to belong to one as it will bring you competitions and advertising which in turn will bring you members.

A "sniper pistol":eek::eek: Whatever next???

I'd take that with a pinch of salt. The OP was a little incoherent: He surely couldn't mean that his friend wanted to shoot foxes with a .308 :eek:. If he did, then I might start to understand why he was given those conditions.

ILTH,I had the same nonsense to get a .243.Swop out two for one seems to be the newest BS trick going on around this great little country.:rolleyes:

The OP didn't say that he was asked to give them up, merely that he did give them up to get the TRG. It seemed to me that it was a financial decision rather than an enforced one.

chem

rrpc wrote: »

Well apart from the NARGC which you can join as an individual

I was told by the NARGC, that they dont take individuals, for membership.

jwshooter

chem wrote: »

I was told by the NARGC, that they dont take individuals, for membership.

your right there you have to be in a club recognized in the county ,if your starting a club at least two adjoining clubs have to give there consent.
boundaries have to be agreed etc

Sparks

CAI will recognise you as a member though. And Grizzly, don't the NASRPC shoot fullbore pistol (I know it's not IPSC, but any port in a storm)?

Vegeta

rrpc wrote: »

I'd take that with a pinch of salt. The OP was a little incoherent: He surely couldn't mean that his friend wanted to shoot foxes with a .308 :eek:. If he did, then I might start to understand why he was given those conditions.

I cant really understand it if he was allowed use a .243 for it

.243 (necked down .308) case with a 55 grain bullet has about 2000 ft/lbs

.308 with a 150 grain bullet has about 2600 ft/lbs

The .243 is very common for fox in the UK and used here, even a 55 grain round will pass through a fox, does the extra 600 ft/lbs make the .308 unsuitable or any less safe.

Both are powerful rounds, I cant think of any situation with the two above where if you changed the calibre it suddenly makes a shot safe. Any shot I wouldn't take with a .308 I wouldn't take with a .243 either

OP:
Get the conditions in writing
Did the Gardai inspect the land?
Make your case to a body (who your friend is a member of) with access to the Firearms Policy Unit. (Not something half arsed mind, a good well presented case)

finnmacool

brieny1000 wrote: »

hi all
my friend bought a trg 308 and has had serious problems with licence. he will be granted the licence on certain conditions.he can only use the gun on 1 of his permissions in co clare(he is living in west cork) and not on the others as the inspector does not think it is safe to use on these farms and mountain areas as they are 100 to150 acres and this in his opinion is not big enough for a .308.!!!he has land himself but he cant use it here. he has to have the gun unassembled at all times other than when on the permission in clare ie (has to take off sights!!). he can only zero gun on this land when he is going shooting. he plans to do the hcap but must inform inspector before hand and will get permission for that day.. if he wants to go to an approved shooting range he must also inform inspector.he had 2 .243`s which he has gotten rid of to get the trg. he cant use the gun for vermin control also as it is too big for fox!!!!he has never had a problem with the law.the inspector has more or less suggested going to court to get it sorted.(more wasted tax payers money)did any of ye have similar problems/stupid conditions? or any suggestions. he is with countryside alliance but they dont seem too interested.

I have been dealing with your friend on this and I am very interested to know who told you we were not interested

rrpc

Vegeta wrote: »

I cant really understand it if he was allowed use a .243 for it

.243 (necked down .308) case with a 55 grain bullet has about 2000 ft/lbs

.308 with a 150 grain bullet has about 2600 ft/lbs

The .243 is very common for fox in the UK and used here, even a 55 grain round will pass through a fox, does the extra 600 ft/lbs make the .308 unsuitable or any less safe.

Not arguing whether it's suitable or not Vegeta, but if you continue that course of logic then you could be shooting foxes with a 338 Lapua Magnum (on the basis that it's only x joules more powerful than the 308).

I've become wary of giving people advice on licensing issues on the basis of posts on boards by friends of the individual. Generally you find that some salient detail is left out when you investigate further and a completely different slant is evident.

Not saying that's the case here, but the OP is at best vague and obviously going by the post from finn maccool is untrue in one respect already.

Vegeta

rrpc wrote: »

Not arguing whether it's suitable or not Vegeta, but if you continue that course of logic then you could be shooting foxes with a 338 Lapua Magnum (on the basis that it's only x joules more powerful than the 308).

Just judging this on a case by case basis rrpc, I think if land is safe to shoot a .243 it would be safe to shoot a .308

I am not saying that if its safe to shoot a .308 then its safe to shoot a .338 Lapua Mag. I feel the difference in power there is vastly greater than the difference between the .243 and .308

I've become wary of giving people advice on licensing issues on the basis of posts on boards by friends of the individual. Generally you find that some salient detail is left out when you investigate further and a completely different slant is evident.

Not saying that's the case here, but the OP is at best vague and obviously going by the post from finn maccool is untrue in one respect already.

I'd agree with your wariness.

bunny shooter

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

What do us lot do who are not in any organisations...

Join one. Otherwise how do you expect to get representation on any shooting matter? What do you do for insurance?

CAI or IFA Countryside are cheap and take individuals

Grizzly 45

bunny shooter wrote: »

Join one. Otherwise how do you expect to get representation on any shooting matter? What do you do for insurance?

CAI or IFA Countryside are cheap and take individuals

Yeah as I said BS,finding one that repersents my intrests is the main one.
As I said about NARGC stands.I cant find out who is in charge of any local club in my area, the regional rep,and if the HQ doesnt answer emails or the phone on such quieries..... Do I or anyone want to give money to such an organisation or organisations?Not picking on paticulary the NARGC,but this is the one I am having no luck with.
Insurance.I shoot mostly on our own land for which we are coverd by public indemnity and public liability.

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Insurance.I shoot mostly on our own land

And the rest of the time?

jwshooter

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Yeah as I said BS,finding one that repersents my intrests is the main one.
As I said about NARGC stands.I cant find out who is in charge of any local club in my area, the regional rep,and if the HQ doesnt answer emails or the phone on such quieries..... Do I or anyone want to give money to such an organisation or organisations?Not picking on paticulary the NARGC,but this is the one I am having no luck with.
Insurance.I shoot mostly on our own land for which we are coverd by public indemnity and public liability.

so you dont have insurance other than stated .,MOSTLY WTF .

[MOD SNIP]

do you shoot deer on your own land do the people that let you shoot on there lands know you are not covered .

[MOD SNIP]

bunny shooter

Fair enough while you are on your own land

BUT .

You state your not always on your own land. To shoot on someone elses land or in a club/s without adequate insurance is indefencable :mad:

For the sake of €60ish you can get adequate cover with either CAI or IFA Countryside :mad: And as for "your interests" and your reference to the disbanded assocation, [MOD SNIP]. Did practical assocation even offer insurance? CAI and IFA Countryside support ALL legal shooting and country sports. [MOD SNIP].

[MOD SNIP].

jwshooter

bunny shooter wrote: »

Fair enough while you are on your own land

BUT .

You state your not always on your own land. To shoot on someone elses land or in a club/s without adequate insurance is indefencable :mad:

For the sake of €60ish you can get adequate cover with either CAI or IFA Countryside :mad: And as for "your interests" and your reference to the disbanded assocation, [MOD SNIP]. Did practical assocation even offer insurance? CAI and IFA Countryside support ALL legal shooting and country sports. [MOD SNIP].

[MOD SNIP]

also if you own and keep a pistol and are not in any club you should hand it in [MOD SNIP] ,

[MOD SNIP] .

bunny shooter

jwshooter wrote: »

also if you own and keep a pistol and are not in any club you should hand it in [MOD SNIP] ,

[MOD SNIP] .

Few lads in my area actually got pistols soley on the strength of being members of the practical association. Reckon they will have to join clubs now though or else their licences will be revoked? And some people wonder why DOJ are taking the approach they are?

Sparks

Okay, I think that's far enough into the 'play the man' end of things to close the thread down.

Rovi

This thread has degenerated beyond the point of no return and will not be re-opened, but in the interests of fairness and clarity, it should be noted that Grizzly 45 has contacted the moderators to explain that the word "mostly" in his post above refers to the fact that besides shooting on his own lands here in Ireland, he also shoots in the U.S.A. and Germany where such insurance cover as is required is provided for.


Some posts above have been pruned.