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Can they do that?

2»

Comments

  • #52
    4Xcut
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,248 ✭✭✭4Xcut


    Absolutely disgraceful. They have no legal entitlement at all to take anyone's passport.

    She should persue a civil case for as much as she can.

    While I completely agree that fares must be paid and that the company can enact reasonable measures to ensure such, this was far and away taking advantage of someone who was unaware of the situation.

    Also stated above that they intended to sell it on. They may very well have intended such. If they knew that they had no entitlement to take it, they would have only taken it for this purpose. The only other explanation is that they were either grossly untrainded on how to do their job or on a power trip.

    None of which are acceptable.


  • #53
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    Did they actually take the passport off this woman and refuse to give it back or were they just holding it and getting her details off it?

    When I passed by it was clear that the woman did not have any English (or was at least faking pretty well that she didn't) - one of the inspectors was miming going to sleep to try and get across the idea that they were asking for her address.


  • #54
    Dord
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,817 ✭✭✭✭Dord


    AnonoBoy wrote: »
    Did they actually take the passport off this woman and refuse to give it back or were they just holding it and getting her details off it?

    When I passed by it was clear that the woman did not have any English (or was at least faking pretty well that she didn't) - one of the inspectors was miming going to sleep to try and get across the idea that they were asking for her address.

    But wouldn't that just look like he wanted to sleep with her and thats the only way she could get her passport back... :confused:


  • #55
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Dave! wrote: »
    Yeah I'm also wondering about that

    Any legal eagles know the situation with that? I don't imagine an inspector is allowed to restrain you, nor do I think they're allowed to refuse to open the door if you say you wanna leave, as they would probably be false imprisonment. I would have thought all they can do is call the Gardai.

    Anybody confirm?

    Bye-laws, which include the payment of fines and on-the-spot fines, must be approved by a Minister responsible for that area to be enforceable. Once they are they take on legal status and those persons legally charged with enforcing them also enjoy a legal status and they can, if you refuse to pay the fine, temporarily detain you so that the Gardai can be called.

    Imagine if you met a burgular in your house and you managed to restrain him and call the Gardai. You won't be charged with false imprisonment.

    Since people who refuse to pay on the spot fines are, in fact, criminals (as are those who use the Luas without paying) they can and should be treated as such.
    bladespin wrote: »
    Her passport belongs to whatever her home country is technically, taking it without the permission of the minister for foreign affairs would be considered theft (possibly even treason technically) so No.

    It would not be treason, that is quite preposterous. However, a passport is officially the property of the State which issues it and, as such, refusal to relinquish a persons passport is not just theft (though it is theft) but also a criminal offence against a foreign nation.


  • #56
    Victor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,648 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Nevore wrote: »
    I figure all the times the theiving drivers keep the change on DubBus or the crappy service on Luas, I'm entitled to a few free rides every now and then.
    They might have a problem when they're asked to account for their ticket books though.
    David Nutty Softball wrote: »
    Something I've often wondered about fare-dodging and 'On-The-Spot' fines etc...

    Not that I've ever done the whole fare dodging thing, but if a bus or Luas inspector was to stop me and I didn't have a valid ticket, there's no way they'd be getting any ID or address details from me. You could easily just make up and address; or a simple 'fcuk that, I aint tellin you' and then leggit!
    And they can have you arrested.


  • #57
    memo_to_all
    Closed Accounts Posts: 70 ✭✭memo_to_all


    AnonoBoy wrote: »
    Did they actually take the passport off this woman and refuse to give it back or were they just holding it and getting her details off it?

    When I passed by it was clear that the woman did not have any English (or was at least faking pretty well that she didn't) - one of the inspectors was miming going to sleep to try and get across the idea that they were asking for her address.

    I was standing right beside the woman and the inspectors fixing my sons jacket...I could see she was Vietnamese (from PassPort). I could clearly hear the taller guy telling her she could "have it back when she paid". The girl looked very confused by the whole affair and was standing there.

    I beleive she should have paid the fare...but a foriegn national..little or no english...jeeze a bit of common sense.


  • #58
    Epic Tissue
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭Epic Tissue


    memo_to_all wrote: »
    I felt very sorry for her...but typical Irish just walked away.

    Damn, if you were Brazilian you would have saved the day! Might have rescued a kitten from a tall tree too :(


  • #59
    dunnomede?
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭dunnomede?


    Epic Tissue wrote: »
    Damn, if you were Brazilian you would have saved the day! Might have rescued a kitten from a tall tree too :(

    or get riddled with bullets by the met police....


  • #60
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,729 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Victor wrote: »
    And they can have you arrested.
    They can file a report, they are not allowed to do anything themselves.

    Walmart is my favorite example here. unbelievable shyte inside.

    http://consumerist.com/5152730/walmart-steals-your-cart-because-you-wont-let-them-check-your-receipt


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  • #61
    Coriolanus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,879 ✭✭✭Coriolanus


    Victor wrote: »
    They might have a problem when they're asked to account for their ticket books though.And they can have you arrested.
    Anecdotal only, but apparently what they used to do was not give change, print off a change receipt periodically and send one of the kids in to get the cash. *shrug*


  • #62
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    Overheal wrote: »
    They can file a report, they are not allowed to do anything themselves.

    Walmart is my favorite example here. unbelievable shyte inside.

    http://consumerist.com/5152730/walmart-steals-your-cart-because-you-wont-let-them-check-your-receipt

    American example for an Irish issue. Same laws might not apply.


  • #63
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 2,001 ✭ [Deleted User]


    bladespin wrote: »
    Her passport belongs to whatever her home country is technically, taking it without the permission of the minister for foreign affairs would be considered theft (possibly even treason technically) so No.

    Thats what came to my mind, a passport is property of whatever government issued it.


  • #64
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,729 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    cisk wrote: »
    Thats what came to my mind, a passport is property of whatever government issued it.
    The issue of detaining her may be another story,

    However, it doesnt matter if it was her possession or her country's posession. It could have been her watch or her purse - they had no fcuking right to confiscate her personal belongings. The same way in the example I provided above Walmart had no right to confiscate items the customer had bought and paid for - even on suspicion of theft.


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