Tesco's new prices

dahamsta

Jip wrote: »

If you think that solely because they're British

I said it's a factor. Stop putting words in people's mouths, it's ignorant.

Jip

Apologies, I meant it as in the "royal you", as in people in general, not explicitly dahamsta.

dahamsta

I'm sure there are people out there that think that way, but it's still pigeonholing. People can be stupid, but it's as likely to be pure selfishness as stupidity. Not that that's a better trait...

darc

eightyfish wrote: »

You'll find a lot of chicken with the little Irish flag is northern Irish. If it has the Board Bia sticker, it's definitely southern Irish.

There aren't enough chickens produced in the republic to supply the market, however NI specialises in chicken production. Likewise, most of the beef in NI & much of Beef sold in Tesco UK is from Ireland. Same with lamb & pork.

eightyfish

darc wrote: »

Likewise, most of the beef in NI & much of Beef sold in Tesco UK is from Ireland. Same with lamb & pork.

Good point. Was in Glasgow last weekend, tonnes of Irish beef in Somerfield.

eightyfish

Jip wrote: »

with regards to over the counter (Superquinn) chicken there's about a 60/40 split with preference going to the north. Dunnes however are worse.

Jip wrote: »

eightyfish, I remember being told about it before by someone and then that guy Keohane was on Today FM and said the same thing with the reasoning being that there's a concentration of poultry farming north of the border.

Okay I've just checked this with my "anonymous contact" (feel a but like The Sun) in SQ and this is total bull. All SQ chicken, whether in ready meals, pre-packed or over the counter is from the Republic. Irish Republic, that is.

If anyone said it on Today FM they're either lying or they don't know what they're talking about.

hellboy99

eightyfish wrote: »

Okay I've just checked this with my "anonymous contact" (feel a but like The Sun) in SQ and this is total bull. All SQ chicken, whether in ready meals, pre-packed or over the counter is from the Republic. Irish Republic, that is.

This statement from SQ back in 2007:

Monday, February 05, 2007
Superquinn Poultry

Superquinn Poultry

February 2007

In light of recent concerns about avian bird flu. Superquinn would like to reassure all customers that any fresh poultry available at Superquinn, either pre-pack, over the counter or in our own-brand ready meals, is sourced in Ireland.

All fresh chicken and turkey available at Superquinn is Irish grown, fully traceable back to the farm on which it was raised, the hatchery it was born in, and the source of the egg. Our labels give information about the source of each bird to the customer.

The Carton Group is sole supplier of chicken and chicken products to Superquinn, while turkey and turkey products are supplied by Kerry Foods. Eggs are supplied to Superquinn by Greenfield Foods Ltd.

http://www.superquinn.ie/multi/default.asp?ID=131&itemId=124&multiItemId=126&topicId=&va=&section=Press+Room

Jip

eightyfish wrote: »

Okay I've just checked this with my "anonymous contact" (feel a but like The Sun) in SQ and this is total bull. All SQ chicken, whether in ready meals, pre-packed or over the counter is from the Republic. Irish Republic, that is.

If anyone said it on Today FM they're either lying or they don't know what they're talking about.

Eh, you're loosing the run of yourself by changing posts I made. Everyone can take a look back at my original post and see that I never said the following, you manipulated the quote which is a no no. There's only one person lying here and they haven't been on any radio station, or have you ?

ith regards to over the counter (Superquinn) chicken there's about a 60/40 split with preference going to the north. Dunnes however are worse.

So I expect a pretty big apology from you.

I was talking about Tesco, I never mentioned Superquinn.

eightyfish

Jip wrote: »

I was talking about Tesco, I never mentioned Superquinn.

Erm.. Sorry, I thought you were talking about Superquinn and that's why I put it in brackets when I cut the quote down. You have to admit, it does look like were talking about SQ and you did mention them. I didn't manipulate your post.

Jip wrote: »

Someone else just posted a link from back in January I think it is highlighting the fact that Superquinn are turning to northern distributors but yet I don't recall similar threads started over that move.

eightyfish wrote: »

Superquinn are the only Irish supermarket to use Irish (Republic) chicken/beef/pork in their ready meals and all their own branded products, as well as all pre-packed meats.

Jip wrote: »

Eightyfish, I'll concede the ready meals point as I assume they'd use British chicken there, however with regards to over the counter chicken there's about a 60/40 split with preference going to the north. Dunnes however are worse.

To accuse me of lying is unfair.

shellyboo

I'm kind of appalled that only two people in this thread have even glanced at the implications of this new strategy for Irish suppliers, not to mention the wider economy.

And don't be under any sort of illusion here - Tesco are not offering anybody 'value'. They are doing whatever they need to do to line their pockets. Great article from Paul Cullen this morning. Lovely demonstration of Tesco's attitude to Ireland. Pretend we're saving them money while still ripping them off.

Jip

I would hate to be a managing director of any company in the country, people haven't a clue what they want. People whinge about the sterling price differential as evident all over this website, not just this forum. A company tries do something about it and people still whinge about them. I have yet to read a post or a article from over the weekend criticising the fact that Dunnes or Superquinn haven't followed suit. If Tesco are doing it, why not the others ? They're already squeezing suppliers as it's claimed Tesco are.

Seriously shellyboo, what would you do ? You either want cheaper prices or you don't. So what if they make a higher profit margin in Ireland, they obviously do so reflecting what the market here is willing to pay.

Tell us what your plan would be to reduce prices ? Paul Cullen and the other guy from Pricewatch have been campaigning for years for such a move and when it comes, they're still not happy.

And a reminder to you again, Tesco are not a charity, it's aim is to make money so they're obviously very good at it and if I was a shareholder I'd be mighty pleased right now.

eightyfish

Interesting article.

Just as an example of two products, in Drogheda Tesco they're now selling Walls ice cream instead of HB, and they're now stocking "great british chips". I'm sure more of this will trickle in.

It seems like it was always inevitable, though, that they would take advantage of their UK sourcing to overcome Ireland's economies of scale issue, an option the Irish supermarkets don't have.

eightyfish

Jip wrote: »

I have yet to read a post or a article from over the weekend criticising the fact that Dunnes or Superquinn haven't followed suit. If Tesco are doing it, why not the others ? They're already squeezing suppliers as it's claimed Tesco are.

Tesco already have a mammoth UK supply chain there, and hundreds of buyers in the UK to source this stuff at rock bottom prices, you think that Irish companies can just arrange this overnight?

Jip

If they can or not is irrelevant for the point I'm making, what do people want to happen ? They either want cheaper prices of they don't. Is it that they want cheaper prices, but from Irish companies only ?

eightyfish

Jip wrote: »

If they can or not is irrelevant for the point I'm making, what do people want to happen ? They either want cheaper prices of they don't. Is it that they want cheaper prices, but from Irish companies only ?

Yes I want cheaper prices, but it's important to point out that the cheaper prices come at a cost to the Irish economy.

And it's not irrelevant to the point you're making. You said

I have yet to read a post or a article from over the weekend criticising the fact that Dunnes or Superquinn haven't followed suit.

and then say it's irrelevant if they can't do it? So, you want to see articles criticising the Irish supermarkets for not doing something that they (SQ and SV more than Dunnes) can't do anyway?

eightyfish

Another interesting article from Saturday's Irish Times.

Jip

It's irrelevant to the point that some people, including members of the media, have whined about high prices. An effort by Tesco to reduce them has still been met with a wall of hostility from some quarters, members of the same media previously mentioned.

So what is a company supposed to do ?

eightyfish

Jip wrote: »

It's irrelevant to the point that some people, including members of the media, have whined about high prices. An effort by Tesco to reduce them has still been met with a wall of hostility from some quarters, members of the same media previously mentioned.

The media isn't a single entity. People in the media will complain about prices being too high, and other people will complain if Tesco bypass Irish suppliers and use their might to source from the UK.

We can't all go "oh aren't these prices brilliant?" and stop talking. Not when Jim down the road may loose his job in the HB ice cream factory and Farmer Joe may loose his livelihood because he can't produce on a big enough scale to compete with the prices of mass-farmed UK chicken.

Economies of scale. We don't have the scale.

grumpytrousers

Jip wrote: »

It's irrelevant to the point that some people, including members of the media, have whined about high prices. An effort by Tesco to reduce them has still been met with a wall of hostility from some quarters, members of the same media previously mentioned.

So what is a company supposed to do ?

Actually - have a read of the article in the times...the most telling quote is this one

"Even consumer advocates who have been calling for price reductions for years are uneasy. "Reducing prices is one thing and it's welcome, but sticking it in the neck of the Irish food industry is a bit much," says one figure, who may yet go public with such misgivings."

It's not so much what a company is supposed to do, it's what consumers should do. Fact is, you can go and buy all the UK brands you want, cheaper, in Tesco, be it in Banbridge or Dundalk. That's hunky dorey, but you are *not* entitled (and i'm not pointing finger at you, per se, Jip) to ask in x years time why the frig we have loads of indiginous suppliersmanufacturers going out of business 'cos they can't afford to get their goods onto Tescos shelves.

It's fine and dandy, in the abstract sense, to say that Chivers should just 'cut their costs and be more competitive if they want to stay in business' but the fact is that their UK equivalents who can get their stuff onto Tesco shelves effortlesslsy, can do so because the economies of scale THEY enjoy, as producers to primarily the UK market, (population 60m, geographical size, 2 to 3 times that of Ireland) mean that they'll always win. It's not so easy for an Irish manufacturer to whack 20% of the price they charge as they don't have the same production levels, in that they tend to supply a smaller market.

It might fly in the face of the general thrust of the 'Consumer issues' board to actually advocate 'patriotism', so i won't do it; but the long term effects of buying cheaper imports, whilst they might leave the consumer with more brass in pocket at the end of the week, have serious knock on implications for domestic manufacturers/producers/suppliers.

Like I say, it's everybodys individual choice what to do with their disposable income, but there is a bigger picture; we shouldn't automatically scream "rip-off" just 'cos something is more expensive. It might be paying for more than you think.

dahamsta

Jip, you're obsessed with the low prices argument. How many times do you need to be told that it's not the only factor? Yes, some people bang on about them, but they're not the only people in the world.

shellyboo

Jip wrote: »

I have yet to read a post or a article from over the weekend criticising the fact that Dunnes or Superquinn haven't followed suit. If Tesco are doing it, why not the others ? They're already squeezing suppliers as it's claimed Tesco are..

They're not doing it because they can't afford to do it. As an example made above made patently clear, try going to Coca-Cola or Unilever and asking for ' he same deal as Tesco' on a product for your 20 stores, or 100 stores, when Tesco have over 2,000. It's not the same situation. You can't compare Dunnes/SQ to Tesco when you're talking about sourcing. They don't have the same buying power.

It's like comparing Football Special to Coca-Cola. Different animals. Also, Dunnes/SQ can't switch to all UK sourcing overnight because they don't have a UK network of stores.

Jip wrote: »

Seriously shellyboo, what would you do ? You either want cheaper prices or you don't.

Well, first of all, I never said whether I wanted cheaper prices or not. I merely observed that people aren't considering the impact on the economy. In fact, I don't think you'll find me whinging about prices anywhere on this forum. I'm not grumbling about how high prices are here - I know they're high, and I know why they're high. I also know that you cannot compare the UK to Ireland when you're talking about FMCG because they're not equal in any way, shape or form.

Jip wrote: »

And a reminder to you again, Tesco are not a charity, it's aim is to make money so they're obviously very good at it and if I was a shareholder I'd be mighty pleased right now.

I am fully aware of that, and I support their decision to maximise their own profits. It's a very clever business decision on their part. What I do not support is the disingenuous campaign that this is a "change for good" for anyone but them. This move will seriously damage the Irish economy - and people should be made aware of that so they can reach their own decisions about where to shop. I'm also amazed that the Irish consumer is so easily led by the likes of Tesco. We can see it in this thread, people all pleased that one of the retailers is doing something "for them" to "help them" and make things "better" - to take your own point there, Jip, Tesco aren't doing anything for the benefit of the consumer. So I wish they would stop making out like they are.

They don't give a monkey's about Ireland, Irish jobs or the Irish economy. They're turning Tesco headquarters in Dun Laoghaire into a regional office. So now Ireland will be a region of the UK operation. We'll be sold UK brands, just at slightly higher than UK prices, as we can see. They're STILL milking us, while telling us they're doing us a favour.

And that's their perogative. It's also my perogative to take my business elsewhere. I will not be shopping in Tesco anymore as a result of their decision. I'll spend the extra in Dunnes/SQ if it means I still have a job in a year's time.

Cork

shellyboo wrote: »

We'll be sold UK brands, just at slightly higher than UK prices, as we can see. They're STILL milking us, while telling us they're doing us a favour.

Irish consumers seriously need to cop themselves on.

They should consider Tescos impact on Irish jobs.

SUPERMARKET GIANT Tesco’s profit margins in the Republic are significantly higher than in the rest of the company, according to a confidential draft business plan seen by The Irish Times .

The document reveals that Tesco Ireland’s profit margin, which has long been a closely-guarded secret, was 9.3 per cent last year and is projected to rise to 9.5 per cent this year. This compares with a margin of under 6 per cent in its parent company.

Seems Tescos Oirish arm is doing pretty well.

Jip

dahamsta wrote: »

Jip, you're obsessed with the low prices argument. How many times do you need to be told that it's not the only factor? Yes, some people bang on about them, but they're not the only people in the world.

I'm not obsessed, this board and the print media have been for the last couple of years, most vociferous in the past few months.

Yet again I ask the question, what should a company do ? Is it now the case that when a company goes ahead and cuts prices, people realise what this means elsewhere in the industry and now have to really look into what they were looking for all along now that the impact of what they wanted is clear ?

Grump trousers makes good points

but the long term effects of buying cheaper imports, whilst they might leave the consumer with more brass in pocket at the end of the week, have serious knock on implications for domestic manufacturers/producers/suppliers.

Like I say, it's everybodys individual choice what to do with their disposable income, but there is a bigger picture; we shouldn't automatically scream "rip-off" just 'cos something is more expensive. It might be paying for more than you think.

The last point is what I'm getting at. People can't have it both ways, basic physics you could even say, every action has an equal and opposite reaction.

Shellyboo, fair enough, you know why prices are high but there's threads every day asking why shouldn't prices be the same here as they are in the UK without putting any thought into it.

But the simple fact is that people have to take a step back. Whinge all you want about high prices but don't start whinging when some company takes steps to lower their prices. I'm not going to stop shopping in Tescos as every supermarket chains operates the same cut throat way, only Tesco have more pull due to their size. Don't think for a minute that Dunnes or Superquinn aren't wishing they could do the same, and again their specials aren't for the good of the consumer, it's simply to make themselves more money.

Despite all the hysteria, Tesco haven't put anyone out of business due to squeezing suppliers or partners, Dunnes have done so with 2 companys, Whelans and Nevlilles Bakery. But was that seen as ok a couple of years ago because there were lots of jobs for these people to move to or just a way of doing business ?

darc

I'll judge Tesco on their actions - lower prices on imported product at the expense of Irish products is not something I'd like to see.

I live in Ireland, get paid Irish salary rate & pay lowish Irish taxes - I for one don't expect Irish food producers to suddenly pay their staff a UK wage (30% lower) just so I can have a few pence off my shopping.

What I will do is buy irish PRODUCED goods wherever possible as long as the price difference is not too wide and take advantage of the lower prices of the normal UK produced goods I buy.

BTW - Its amazing what "Irish" brands are not made in Ireland - not even Jacobs Biscuits are made here these days except for the premium ranges!

grumpytrousers

darc wrote: »

BTW - Its amazing what "Irish" brands are not made in Ireland - not even Jacobs Biscuits are made here these days except for the premium ranges!

Tsk - you should not be looking further than the Kimberlys; truly the king of biscuits. Lets see some fookin' Brit manufacturer try and make them, huh!

eightyfish

darc wrote: »

BTW - Its amazing what "Irish" brands are not made in Ireland - not even Jacobs Biscuits are made here these days except for the premium ranges!

Jacob's hasn't been an Irish company since 1990.

Aside: overheard an auld one saying to a shop assistant "I'm looking for Hennessy Brandy-The Irish one, not this new French one."

ejmaztec

grumpytrousers wrote: »

Tsk - you should not be looking further than the Kimberlys; truly the king of biscuits. Lets see some fookin' Brit manufacturer try and make them, huh!

The overall price of biscuits in Ireland really takes the biscuit. They've always cost an arm and a leg here as compared with the UK, and I'm not just talking about twenty years.

If some fooking Brit made Kimberleys, they'd be half the fooking price.:P

ejmaztec

eightyfish wrote: »

Jacob's hasn't been an Irish company since 1990.

Their website maintains that they are an "Irish" company, but what that means in this day and age is a bit of a grey area.:eek:

http://www.jacobfruitfield.com/profile/

eightyfish

grumpytrousers wrote: »

Tsk - you should not be looking further than the Kimberlys; truly the king of biscuits. Lets see some fookin' Brit manufacturer try and make them, huh!

Especially the chocolate ones.

Interesting to think what would be gone if all Irish stores were to become UK stores in an extreme way. We'd loose Kimberley's, red lemonade, salted popcorn, King crisps, proper tea...

ejmaztec

eightyfish wrote: »

Especially the chocolate ones.

Interesting to think what would be gone if all Irish stores were to become UK stores in an extreme way. We'd loose Kimberley's, red lemonade, salted popcorn, King crisps, proper tea...

Many local shops in predominantly Irish areas in the UK rob their homesick customers blind, then some, for the privilege of getting their hands on all this homegrown Irish goodness.:(