Beware Airtricity pushy door to door salesmen

TechFreak

Guys if you've been switch without permission its a serious breach of your rights. If you get no satisfaction from Airtricity you should contact the Commission for Energy Regulation.

Ive heard there hammering companies for such breaches.

wonderwoman

Hi all. I'm writing an article about this very issue for The Sunday Times this weekend (was subjected to similar sales tactics by Airtricity myself two weeks ago) and I've asked the Commission for Energy Regulation (CER) about it. They are investigating a number of complaints about Airtricity's door-t-door sales. They point out if you feel strongly that you were mislead or harrassed in any way you should approach their complaints division. Their contact details are also on the bottom of every energy bill and on www.cer.ie.

In the meantime, if you've complained about Airtricity or are about to, feel free to PM me if you would like to contribute to the article.

TechFreak

wonderwoman wrote: »

Hi all. I'm writing an article about this very issue for The Sunday Times this weekend (was subjected to similar sales tactics by Airtricity myself two weeks ago) and I've asked the Commission for Energy Regulation (CER) about it. They are investigating a number of complaints about Airtricity's door-t-door sales. They point out if you feel strongly that you were mislead or harrassed in any way you should approach their complaints division. Their contact details are also on the bottom of every energy bill and on www.cer.ie.

In the meantime, if you've complained about Airtricity or are about to, feel free to PM me if you would like to contribute to the article.

The CER appear to have another site that more consumer focused at www.energycustomers.ie . I found that pretty helpful.

Im sure your article will make interesting reading. Did the CER give a formal response in relation to these complaints ?

wonderwoman

Thanks Techfreak! I can't tell you their response here just yet but the CER says they do take these complaints seriously.

Prisoner6409

Have the ESB not also got a part to play here. Surely they should be satisfied when closing an account that they are talking to the account holder and not some random sales person. For most customer service calls I have made recently (Sky ect) I had to satisfy them I was indeed the account holder before they dealth with any query. I think the ESB should operate in a similar fashion especially if this problem has already been identified to them.

Fnergg

Prisoner6409 wrote: »

Have the ESB not also got a part to play here. Surely they should be satisfied when closing an account that they are talking to the account holder and not some random sales person. For most customer service calls I have made recently (Sky ect) I had to satisfy them I was indeed the account holder before they dealth with any query. I think the ESB should operate in a similar fashion especially if this problem has already been identified to them.

The ESB, like all other suppliers, operates according to the market rules as laid down by the CER.

When a customer opts to go to another supplier neither he/she nor the new supplier communicates directly with the ESB. Instead, the notification that a customer is switching is communciated by the new supplier to the ESB by the MRSO - the Meter Registration System Operator - an independent body which acts as a hub for all switching.

The ESB has to assume, on receipt of such a notification, that the customer has decided to switch and so his/her account is closed. IF ESB were to ask each customer if they really, really wanted to switch it would be seen, rightly, as an impediment to the operation of the market.

It should be borne in mind that in the vast majority of cases there is no problem. Cases of customers being pressurised by door to door salespeople or being switched without their consent are tiny in comparison to the total number of customers who have moved to other suppliers to date - over 300,000.

Regards,

Fnergg

TechFreak

Fnergg wrote: »

The ESB, like all other suppliers, operates according to the market rules as laid down by the CER.

When a customer opts to go to another supplier neither he/she nor the new supplier communicates directly with the ESB. Instead, the notification that a customer is switching is communciated by the new supplier to the ESB by the MRSO - the Meter Registration System Operator - an independent body which acts as a hub for all switching.

The ESB has to assume, on receipt of such a notification, that the customer has decided to switch and so his/her account is closed. IF ESB were to ask each customer if they really, really wanted to switch it would be seen, rightly, as an impediment to the operation of the market.

It should be borne in mind that in the vast majority of cases there is no problem. Cases of customers being pressurised by door to door salespeople or being switched without their consent are tiny in comparison to the total number of customers who have moved to other suppliers to date - over 300,000.

Regards,

Fnergg

Indeed , but the cases were miss-selling does occur by Airtricity are scandalous and havent been mention in the media to date

wonderwoman

I can't run the story in The Sunday Times this weekend unless I can quote someone who has been subjected to pushy sales tactics by Airtricity. Unlike the CER, the National Consumer Agency hasn't received any complaints about it and says if this is going on, they want to know about it.

If complaints are merely discussed on an internet forum, nothing is going to change.

Sponge Bob

National Consumer Agency are completely useless ***** , try complaining about missold broadband that is clearly within their remit and they come up with absolutely any excuse possible to do nothing

Fnergg

wonderwoman wrote: »

I can't run the story in The Sunday Times this weekend unless I can quote someone who has been subjected to pushy sales tactics by Airtricity. Unlike the CER, the National Consumer Agency hasn't received any complaints about it and says if this is going on, they want to know about it.

If complaints are merely discussed on an internet forum, nothing is going to change.

The NCA! Hah! An utterly useless toothless Quango heading the way of the Dodo if the Government has the testicular fortitude to implement the McCarthy Report's findings on the Agency.

The NCA is the last Agency I would think of complaining to in relation to Airtricity agents. The CER has the power to do something about it and so it is to them that complaints should be made. I would be asking them what exactly they have done in relation to the complaints and what undertakings they have received from Airtricity.

Regards,

Fnergg

wonderwoman

I've already asked the CER and they are currently investigating individual complaints to see if they break code of conduct or any laws. Unlike they receive more complaints than they already have (about 10), the CER won't be take a single big action against Airtricity.

Fnergg wrote: »

The NCA! Hah! An utterly useless toothless Quango heading the way of the Dodo if the Government has the testicular fortitude to implement the McCarthy Report's findings on the Agency.

The NCA is the last Agency I would think of complaining to in relation to Airtricity agents. The CER has the power to do something about it and so it is to them that complaints should be made. I would be asking them what exactly they have done in relation to the complaints and what undertakings they have received from Airtricity.

Regards,

Fnergg

scorpianking86

Sponge Bob wrote: »

You gave them the meter number so they made their sale and you are probably now an airtricity customer .

If you want to change back then contact www.cer.ie and complain , they will say you should follow a complaints procedure but if you are not an airtricity customer then there is no reason why you should is there ??

You cant be switched by jst a meter number, for definite! A MPRN number is needed not to mention billing contacts and payment method and signatures!!!

rolion

Hi,
i've seen the same pressure / tactics here in D15 from the sales guys...
I've told them that i'll look,to leave any leaflets or additional info to look at.
Nothing more...
Went online,read and checked all info and did the switch online,in less than five minutes.
Did the change mainly due to campaign done by the sales guys and not lastly,because of the web site / online easy & safe procedures.
rgds

Saint_Mel

I had an Airtricity guy call to the door a few months ago, I had already changed to Bord Gais but it was a cold day and he looked wrecked so I decided I'd let him get he speil in instead of slamming the door. So he went through it all and I politely said thank sfor the info but no thanks and told him I was getting a better rate from Bord Gais. He thanked me for my time and went on his way.

Next day, same fella lands to the door and starts his speil ... I interupted him at the 3rd word and told him that he'd been here the day before and I wasnt interested. He said he didnt remember and tried to start again, and then asked why wasnt I interested in helping the environment. Told him, politely, I couldnt afford to and I wasnt interested in switching. Off he went.

The day after, yep you've guessed it ... doorbell rang and there the same fella was. He didnt even get a chance to start cos I told him he was here twice and I still wasnt interested. He apologised saying he must have forgotton to mark my house off the list. So he fiddled with his clipboard and off he went.

4th day in a row ... doorbell rings and low and behold he's there again. Starts his speil and with that I told him that this was the 4th day in a row he called, it was the 4th time in a row I said I wasnt interested and that if he ever so much as set foot into my driveway again I'd be force feeding him his clipboard.

In the end pure ignorance from me done the trick and thankfully he hasnt called since.

cgarvey

I can't think of any time where it makes sense to talk to a door-to-door salesman, let alone offer up any account details.

We had them to our door for a very short period last week. 1st line was "are you happy with your electricity supplier", 2nd was "you can make massive savings if you switch to Airtricity". Then, sensing the opposition and imminent door slamming, the 3rd line was "there's no contracts and not even a Direct Debit". Gem! "Really?" "yeah, we can arrange that if you want to give use your account details". Door slam. Rude? Yes, and so it was intended.

TanG411

My mother caved in with the airtricity salesman.

Ah well, let's hope there's good savings

Thoie

Amusing coincidence - yesterday my ESB bill arrived and I thought "Feck, never got around to switching to Airtricity, must do so soon". Then, as I was reading this thread, the intercom goes (apartment building).

Airtricity young lad outside "Hi, I've been sent by the management company to ensure that everyone is capable of getting Airtricity and signed up to make sure the savings go through".

I didn't let him in, though part of me is feeling guilty - it's cold out there, and I was considering changing anyway, and it might make his life a bit easier.

granadaghia

IF a customer has arrears on their account and there is a threat of supply being cut off , i would take my chances with the ESB , the new kids in town are going to be a lot more ruthless and demand that the ESB cut you off immediately .

Fnergg

granadaghia wrote: »

IF a customer has arrears on their account and there is a threat of supply being cut off , i would take my chances with the ESB , the new kids in town are going to be a lot more ruthless and demand that the ESB cut you off immediately .

True. The ESB has, over the years, demonstrated it's willingness to help customers in financial difficulty and it works closely with organisations like the SVDP and MABS in order to avoid having to disconnect supply for non-payment of account. Don't expect such understanding from the new boys.

BGE and Airtiricty's business model is to sign up customers who will have a low cost to serve i.e. who will pay by direct debit and who will not cost the companies money in having to chase payment. Fall into arrears and you can expect a ruthless approach from them. They can also decide to terminate your contract forthwith and send you back to the ESB whether you like it or not.

The attractive discounts on offer by BGE and Airtricty therefore are aimed at those with the ability to pay on time every time (preferably by direct debit). That is why they are knocking on the doors of the middle class housing estates but they are keeping well away from those who could benefit the most from lower prices.

The latter are effectively forced to stay with ESB who in turn are forced by the CER to keep its prices higher than its competitors so that "competition" can be seen to take hold. Competition in the electricity market has failed to deliver any benefits to the poorer sections of Irish society.

Regards,

Fnergg

jfmulroy

course they are. and if they save you money on your bill then shame on them selling such a filthy idea.

channelsurfer2

had the experience of the pushy airtricity salesmen last night. its not pleasent. they bombard you with facts such as airtricity is not subject to the carbon level as its a green company....you must be mad to stay with bord gais(despite getting 14% from BG) sign up now its a once in a lifetime opportunity we wont be back in this area again and we cant guarantee the prices if you dont sign up now....he looked for the 2 bills and was actually starting to write down the mprn number as he spoke until I copped it and said no thanks please leave...poor lad that was with him looked shocked by the rubbish he was spouting...

Trampas

I had them call the other week and literally in the front door.

I just say no thanks and close the door

5uspect

I just tell them that I'm leaving the country next year.*

*may actually be true

coffeepls

They rang the intercom to my apt some months ago - yes they said about airtricity being cheaper etc, and I simply said I wasn't interested. The guy said 'but don't you want to save money?' - to which I said 'no, thanks anyway':) - and that was the end of the conversation.

Ok - I don't like door to door salesmen - but surely it's no big deal to be polite and just say no thank you? Of course I want to save money, but I prefer to check out airtricity or bord gais electricity myself, that's my choice.

Grumpypants

Had a one young lady call to the door asking if i wanted to switch i said i am all ready with Airtricity (which i am) and she ok great and just left. So that might be a good excuse.

Docnic

I must admit I read this thread with a lot of amusement. I worked as a sales agent for over a year with Bord Gais and I honestly couldn't fault them. Even though I absolutely despised the job (not a sales-y person), the company itself was quite impressive. Huge contrast to Airtricity - I came across so many airtricity customers who were blatantly lied to and changed over without permission! BGE on the other hand use very strict & controlled procedure. The wages were ridiculously good - I was earning around 50,000 a year and I wasn't even that good! They use a reputable sales firm & complaints were never an issue.

Sorry all that is off topic but I feel like I should speak up as I'm fairly disgusted at how sales agents are being portrayed here! Yes it can be fairly annoying to be interrupted by the doorbell in the middle of corrie but referring to sales ppl as "scum"?? Come on! Its normal people doing an unbelievably difficult job. (Try smiling & staying optimistic for 8/9 hours a day while dealing with such a high level of abuse!) And field sales is still very profitable - even now they are still switching 8+ people per agent every day. Considering the average persons lethargy in relation to switching once its done once they generally stay on....quite lucrative and well worth investing in a high quality field sales division.

Sorry rant over

Tim M-U

Hey guys, if you don't want to waste time just say 'Im not interested' and close the door. You don't have to avail of them and certinly don't have to listen to all this crap 'save money..' . People who do this a take such numbers from houses is dam right rude and the spanners should know this annoys people and puts a bad name on the company. Just close the door if they annoy you and say not interested. however, bare in mind these people have lives and possibly only make money if they make a sale so remember that..

Docnic

Fnergg wrote: »

True. The ESB has, over the years, demonstrated it's willingness to help customers in financial difficulty and it works closely with organisations like the SVDP and MABS in order to avoid having to disconnect supply for non-payment of account. Don't expect such understanding from the new boys.

The attractive discounts on offer by BGE and Airtricty therefore are aimed at those with the ability to pay on time every time (preferably by direct debit). That is why they are knocking on the doors of the middle class housing estates but they are keeping well away from those who could benefit the most from lower prices.

The latter are effectively forced to stay with ESB who in turn are forced by the CER to keep its prices higher than its competitors so that "competition" can be seen to take hold. Competition in the electricity market has failed to deliver any benefits to the poorer sections of Irish society.

Regards,

Fnergg

Sorry to go on but I had to add that this is hilarious! When I worked with BGE in field sales we LOVED the "poorer" areas! When we were allocated leads on the GPS we were praying for those kinds of areas - the fortnight I worked in Ballymun was like Christmas. People who 1. genuinely needed to save money and 2. who were probably the politest people I came across. In a middle class area I would switch 8 -10 people daily whereas if I was lucky enough to be with the "poorer sections of Irish society" it would be 14+. (It was like the nononsense.ie radio ad Keerrrchiing! ) Maybe the reason you only see sales agents in middle class estates is because you live in one?

discostu1

Hi DocnicFrom the Alternative electricity suppliers thread.see below Were you guys working for the same company. Also a question that I raised and no one seems to be answer. Are BGE and Airtricity happy to move you back on to the high discount after 12 months simply by chaning the name to that of your wife Partner. Seems mad if they are why not just extent the high discount.Btw with BGE and I agree they were easier to deal with than Airtricity.€50k a year is a decent figure so you were getting what €40/€50 a sale ????Big Switch in reality

---

Hi There, Some things to take into account when looking and making a big switch: I used to work on the Big switch for BGE so I have the inside track.1. The deal:Despite what you hear on your door step or in your business deals from all providers are basically the same 10% and if your a residential customer you can gain up to 14% provided you jump through a few hoops (direct debit, gas customer, payment plan etc)What does this mean to your bill at home or in your business about €35 off you 2 monthly bill.The deal with all providers last a year with Bord Gais offering an extra 5% year 2 & 3. This is not the case with Businesses where the deal only lasts till Oct 10 with all providers, due to the ESB being allowed to compete withing the comercial market (business, shope etc).Ok what does this tell you: *All deals are basicaly the same with the exception of the ESB for now.*Shop around at the end of year 1 and get the better deal for another year. 2. The companyBGE a semi state Irish company.Airtricity owned by a UK company scotish and southern.Energia ownd by a Spanish company.ESB a semi state Irish company.Both Airtricity and Bord Gais produce wind energy in Ireland but most of the power is bought on the open market due to the fact wind energy is difficult to store. (electricity is produced and used on demand, if the wind is not blowing you use electricity produced by fossil fules).3. The employeesEmployees involved in the selling of the products are employed through an agency or a broker, despite the Bord gais employees being told to tell the customer they work directly for BGE, this is not the case. Targets are set extreamly high for employees of BGE almost twice the industry standard and under performance means termination of your contract. ( this in my oppinion is a totaly unethical from a semi state company abusing its subcontracted employees ) and adding on a weekly basis to the long line of people looking for unemployemnt benifit).Targets for Airtricity employees are more reasonable and are set so employees can achieve and earn a decent living.The same goes for Energia. Who to choose:The deals are more or less the same for one year so take this into consideration. And look around after one year. Remember sales people under preasure will tell you what you want to hear and when its their job on the line they can come up with some very interesting offers. I for one am happy to have found another job because some of my friends still working with BGE are fearing loosing their jobs on a daily basis.

Max Power1

discostu1 wrote: »

Hi DocnicFrom the Alternative electricity suppliers thread.see below Were you guys working for the same company. Also a question that I raised and no one seems to be answer. Are BGE and Airtricity happy to move you back on to the high discount after 12 months simply by chaning the name to that of your wife Partner. Seems mad if they are why not just extent the high discount.Btw with BGE and I agree they were easier to deal with than Airtricity.€50k a year is a decent figure so you were getting what €40/€50 a sale ????Big Switch in reality

---

Hi There, Some things to take into account when looking and making a big switch: I used to work on the Big switch for BGE so I have the inside track.1. The deal:Despite what you hear on your door step or in your business deals from all providers are basically the same 10% and if your a residential customer you can gain up to 14% provided you jump through a few hoops (direct debit, gas customer, payment plan etc)What does this mean to your bill at home or in your business about €35 off you 2 monthly bill.The deal with all providers last a year with Bord Gais offering an extra 5% year 2 & 3. This is not the case with Businesses where the deal only lasts till Oct 10 with all providers, due to the ESB being allowed to compete withing the comercial market (business, shope etc).Ok what does this tell you: *All deals are basicaly the same with the exception of the ESB for now.*Shop around at the end of year 1 and get the better deal for another year. 2. The companyBGE a semi state Irish company.Airtricity owned by a UK company scotish and southern.Energia ownd by a Spanish company.ESB a semi state Irish company.Both Airtricity and Bord Gais produce wind energy in Ireland but most of the power is bought on the open market due to the fact wind energy is difficult to store. (electricity is produced and used on demand, if the wind is not blowing you use electricity produced by fossil fules).3. The employeesEmployees involved in the selling of the products are employed through an agency or a broker, despite the Bord gais employees being told to tell the customer they work directly for BGE, this is not the case. Targets are set extreamly high for employees of BGE almost twice the industry standard and under performance means termination of your contract. ( this in my oppinion is a totaly unethical from a semi state company abusing its subcontracted employees ) and adding on a weekly basis to the long line of people looking for unemployemnt benifit).Targets for Airtricity employees are more reasonable and are set so employees can achieve and earn a decent living.The same goes for Energia. Who to choose:The deals are more or less the same for one year so take this into consideration. And look around after one year. Remember sales people under preasure will tell you what you want to hear and when its their job on the line they can come up with some very interesting offers. I for one am happy to have found another job because some of my friends still working with BGE are fearing loosing their jobs on a daily basis.

OUCH MY EYES

Are paragraphs difficult to use?