Tricolour ban for Irish gymnasts

futurehope · 07-05-2009 4:22pm

Raiser said:

The current situation regarding the 6 commandeered Counties of Northern Ireland is slightly sicking to any logical right-thinking Irish individual who happens to be in possession of all of the facts...... I don't particularly care what flag you want to be seen to be waving after that..... Fly a 40 foot Nazi one if it sits well with your finely tuned sensibilities.....

Well, I'd have thought it would be Irish Republicans who would favour The Nazi flag, given the fact that they collaborated with them during WWII and have behaved like them ever since.

The only conciliatory fact is that the Unionists are regarded as stubborn, petulant, whining, squatting British Knackers by the Irish and irritating Irish Misfits by the British - NOBODY wants anything to do with them at this stage - if, for an example, a new strain of Orange Avian Flu wiped them out overnight then I'd suspect there'd be two new National Holidays created as a consequence......

[/QUOTE]

A bit like most decent people world wide celebrated the old spud famine...

Grudaire · 07-05-2009 4:28pm

futurehope wrote: »

Are you suggesting that all sporting events should be British Isles based (taken as one block)? What anthem would you suggest? I quite like Rule Brittania and The Union Jack would be more than appropriate as the flag as it includes the flag of 'St Patrick' which represents all of the island of Ireland.

:cool:

No, I'm suggesting that we take the whole of Europe as one block - we have a flag, and we can work on a multi-lingual anthem to suit.:rolleyes:

Lets cop on for a minute. You might like rule Brittania, but you should know that it really isn't a great song in Ireland given the fact that we had to fight our way out (26/32 *100)% of the ruling Brittania.

Since they're allowed to play the anthem why are they not letting the flag be flown (I mean if Unionists had something to complain about I'm sure the Anthem is more offensive then Green, White and Orange which I'm sure we all know is meant to promote peace between the two communities)

this isn't the first occasion this week that sporting organisations have been dragged into the political fray up North - By Unionists.

prinz · 07-05-2009 4:33pm

Cliste wrote: »

this isn't the first occasion this week that sporting organisations have been dragged into the political fray up North - By Unionists.

It's almost a reminder of how many GAA clubs in the North refused to play the old RUC and current PSNI GAA teams.

Grudaire · 07-05-2009 4:34pm

prinz wrote: »

It's almost a reminder of how many GAA clubs in the North refused to play the old RUC and current PSNI GAA teams.

But I'm glad they moved on!

oscarBravo · 07-05-2009 4:36pm

Cliste wrote: »

But I'm glad they moved on!

If only everybody would.

prinz · 07-05-2009 4:40pm

D-Boy wrote: »

The same dregs who fought for YOUR freedom eh?
Hypocrisy much.

The same scum who place it on the coffin of dead murderers, drug dealers, etc. Who say they can execute two young unarmed soldiers supposedly in it's name. They don't represent me, they don't reflect what this country is.

It is the flag of a Republic and should be treated as such, and not abused by terrorists.

prinz · 07-05-2009 4:40pm

Cliste wrote: »

But I'm glad they moved on!

Many northern clubs still refuse to play them.

getz · 07-05-2009 4:41pm

Cliste wrote: »

No, I'm suggesting that we take the whole of Europe as one block - we have a flag, and we can work on a multi-lingual anthem to suit.:rolleyes:

Lets cop on for a minute. You might like rule Brittania, but you should know that it really isn't a great song in Ireland given the fact that we had to fight our way out (26/32 *100)% of the ruling Brittania.

Since they're allowed to play the anthem why are they not letting the flag be flown (I mean if Unionists had something to complain about I'm sure the Anthem is more offensive then Green, White and Orange which I'm sure we all know is meant to promote peace between the two communities)

this isn't the first occasion this week that sporting organisations have been dragged into the political fray up North - By Unionists.

i am sure like minded people can come up with some sort of answer -but republic would have to change some of the provocative words in their anthem if its to be excepted by the brit/irish

Grudaire · 07-05-2009 4:45pm

oscarBravo wrote: »

If only everybody would.

Well issues need resolving. If for instance a majority in favour of a United Ireland emerged in the 6 counties would the Unioists accept the democratic view of the Northern Irish (Or would we end up with a thirty county Republic, and a two county Northern Ireland?!)

There is a fundamental difference in opinion. What's more it is an unsolvable one. Either way in the interest of peace in the area people should only focus their complaints on current problems, no point in giving out about the past. Where will we stop with that argument?

Can'tseeme · 07-05-2009 4:48pm

Cliste wrote: »

Since they're allowed to play the anthem why are they not letting the flag be flown (I mean if Unionists had something to complain about I'm sure the Anthem is more offensive then Green, White and Orange which I'm sure we all know is meant to promote peace between the two communities)

Excellent point.

oscarBravo wrote: »

If only everybody would.

Agreed. People need to grow up and show a bit more tolerance. The GFA was meant to signify a moving away from the past, to show repect and tolerance for ALL communities. Whether people like it or not, nationalists in the north see the flag as representing them.

Raiser · 07-05-2009 4:51pm

oscarBravo wrote: »

What's substantially more sickening to this particular logical right-thinking Irish individual is being described as illogical and wrong-thinking just because I'm capable of recognising that Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom.

Just because I am capable of recognising that the Taliban is part of modern day Afghanistan doesn't mean that the situation is desirable, sustainable, reasonable or, please God for all concerned, permanent.

- Although to compare like with like - I never saw the the Taliban out shouting virulent and shameful abuse at tiny schoolchildren trying to make their way to primary school.......

IIMII · 07-05-2009 4:51pm

futurehope wrote: »

although I do remember English tourists giving The Irish a good hiding at the time of The Drumcree stand off in one of those dumps;)

Such wonderful tourists to have visit your country

oscarBravo · 07-05-2009 4:52pm

Cliste wrote: »

Well issues need resolving. If for instance a majority in favour of a United Ireland emerged in the 6 counties would the Unioists accept the democratic view of the Northern Irish (Or would we end up with a thirty county Republic, and a two county Northern Ireland?!)

I'm still waiting for many Republicans to accept the democratic view expressed by the vast majority in 1998 that Northern Ireland is in the UK.

Grudaire · 07-05-2009 4:53pm

getz wrote: »

i am sure like minded people can come up with some sort of answer -but republic would have to change some of the provocative words in their anthem if its to be excepted by the brit/irish

I'm against changing the anthem, although it may be a way to go. Although I can't find any particularly offending words: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soldiers_song. The song is about fighting to gain freedom - I don't see why an Irish state which earned its freedom through liberal use of the gun would be wrong in having that as it's national anthem. (not to mention it'll straight up hyjacked by Sinn Féin, and I'm not sure which side I'd be on either...)

prinz wrote: »

Many northern clubs still refuse to play them.

I honestly don't know about that - you hardly have a link that I can read about it (Not saying that you're wrong - it really wouldn't be beyond the realms of imagination). Also I could understand why clubs wouldn't want to play them, and for reasons far less petty then the tricolour complaints

dlofnep · 07-05-2009 4:57pm

More bigotry in the occupied 6. If they identify themselves as "Irish" - then let them fly the Irish flag.

Grudaire · 07-05-2009 4:58pm

oscarBravo wrote: »

I'm still waiting for many Republicans to accept the democratic view expressed by the vast majority in 1998 that Northern Ireland is in the UK.

Aren't we all?

Still Rome wasn't built in a day, and I would hope that your views on the entire Nationalist population would not be tainted by this minority.

oscarBravo · 07-05-2009 5:03pm

Raiser wrote: »

Just because I am capable of recognising that the Taliban is part of modern day Afghanistan doesn't mean that the situation is desirable, sustainable, reasonable or, please God for all concerned, permanent.

When there's a referendum in Afghanistan where more than 90% express their support for the status quo, come back to me.

- Although to compare like with like - I never saw the the Taliban out shouting virulent and shameful abuse at tiny schoolchildren trying to make their way to primary school.......

Nope, those angelic Taliban types would never do anything that nasty.

getz · 07-05-2009 5:03pm

Cliste wrote: »

I'm against changing the anthem, although it may be a way to go. Although I can't find any particularly offending words: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soldiers_song. The song is about fighting to gain freedom - I don't see why an Irish state which earned its freedom through liberal use of the gun would be wrong in having that as it's national anthem. (not to mention it'll straight up hyjacked by Sinn Féin, and I'm not sure which side I'd be on either...)

I honestly don't know about that - you hardly have a link that I can read about it (Not saying that you're wrong - it really wouldn't be beyond the realms of imagination). Also I could understand why clubs wouldn't want to play them, and for reasons far less petty then the tricolour complaints

the only woods in it i would like to change is ;the saxon foe; and dont tell me its about the germans-remember GSTQ hasent any anti /any race words in it -its just about an old dear who represents the uk and northern ireland-not matter what the bigots claim .

oscarBravo · 07-05-2009 5:06pm

Cliste wrote: »

Still Rome wasn't built in a day, and I would hope that your views on the entire Nationalist population would not be tainted by this minority.

I respect anyone's right to aspire to Irish unification, as long as it's solely and exclusively by peaceful political means.

For the record, and on-topic, I think it's depressing that people get themselves so worked up about emblems and symbols like flags. Whether it's people complaining about an Irish team flying an Irish flag, or the hysteria that greeted the posting of a picture of a Union Jack on a Politics thread some time back, it would all be laughable if it weren't symptomatic of a deep malaise.

Grudaire · 07-05-2009 5:10pm

getz wrote: »

the only woods in it i would like to change is ;the saxon foe; and dont tell me its about the germans-remember GSTQ hasent any anti /any race words in it -its just about an old dear who represents the uk and northern ireland-not matter what the bigots claim .

I think that I can handle a word from the third verse being taken out. Ironically the Irish version uses the word 'bíoba' - ie enemy/foe (according to my dictionary here it has no Saxon conoctations)

I didn't say anywhere that it wasn't about the British, I actually meant that short of going with a totally different song the underlying theme is going to be a problem.

It most definitely is about the occupation of Ireland by the English, and I'm proud that we got them out. And I sing it proudly whenever the occasion suits.

futurehope · 07-05-2009 6:17pm

Raiser said:

Just because I am capable of recognising that the Taliban is part of modern day Afghanistan doesn't mean that the situation is desirable, sustainable, reasonable or, please God for all concerned, permanent.

Are you comparing militant Irish Republicans with The Taliban?

- Although to compare like with like - I never saw the the Taliban out shouting virulent and shameful abuse at tiny schoolchildren trying to make their way to primary school.......

They don't let them go to school (if they're girls).

O'Coonassa · 07-05-2009 6:20pm

Raiser wrote: »

Hasn't the British Empire given back almost all of the Colonies it bullied its way into?

Bullied it's way into with the help of many Irishmen lest we forget, (conveniently)

O'Coonassa · 07-05-2009 6:22pm

anonymous_joe wrote: »

The Golden Harp on green field one (no idea what it's called)

The Irish Flag.

O'Coonassa · 07-05-2009 6:32pm

Cliste wrote: »

I think that I can handle a word from the third verse being taken out. Ironically the Irish version uses the word 'bíoba' - ie enemy/foe (according to my dictionary here it has no Saxon conoctations)

But it was translated from the word Saxon and stinks of Victorian racialism. The notion of the Britons as Saxons is a funny one IMO.

Grudaire · 07-05-2009 7:01pm

O'Coonassa wrote: »

The Irish Flag.

Actually he's thinking of the Flag for Leinster - unofficially used as the flag for Ireland for a good while...

O'Coonassa wrote: »

But it was translated from the word Saxon and stinks of Victorian racialism. The notion of the Britons as Saxons is a funny one IMO.

Oh, I know that - I'm a fan of the old Gaeilge though. Apparently changing that one word (in the English version) would be enough for getz

O'Coonassa · 07-05-2009 7:17pm

Cliste wrote: »

Actually he's thinking of the Flag for Leinster - unofficially used as the flag for Ireland for a good while...

Well I'm still using it anyway I don't like the stripey one at all so I don't. If the green flag was good enough for the United Irishmen and the Fenians it's good enough for me!

Cliste wrote: »

Oh, I know that - I'm a fan of the old Gaeilge though. Apparently changing that one word (in the English version) would be enough for getz

I'd rather we had this instead tbh

Grudaire · 07-05-2009 7:20pm

O'Coonassa wrote: »

Well I'm still using it anyway I don't like the stripey one at all so I don't. If the green flag was good enough for the United Irishmen and the Fenians it's good enough for me!

I'd rather we had this instead tbh

Hey! Give Leinster their flag back - and give Africa their music back:p

IIMII · 07-05-2009 7:25pm

O'Coonassa wrote: »

But it was translated from the word Saxon and stinks of Victorian racialism. The notion of the Britons as Saxons is a funny one IMO.

No, the Britons aren't called Saxons in Gaeilge, only the English. In English though there are plenty of names for peoples and places that might seem strange or archaic to the people or those living in the places in question. You only have to consider how the native American's are called Indians though they have no more to do with India than Europeans do

el_tiddlero · 07-05-2009 7:26pm

Originally Posted by anonymous_joe
The Golden Harp on green field one (no idea what it's called)

That's the Leinster flag. The harp on a blue field is the flag for the whole island. Blue was traditionally the royal colour of Ireland. The harp was given to Ireland as it's symbol by Henry VIII. He remarked that governing the Irish was as difficult as playing the harp.

BAMN. Historified.

Terrontress · 07-05-2009 8:48pm

el_tiddlero wrote: »

That's the Leinster flag. The harp on a blue field is the flag for the whole island. Blue was traditionally the royal colour of Ireland. The harp was given to Ireland as it's symbol by Henry VIII. He remarked that governing the Irish was as difficult as playing the harp.

BAMN. Historified.

Is the Harp in relation to Ireland not to do with Brian Boru's Harp?

Tricolour ban for Irish gymnasts

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