Is it time for Arsene Wenger to go?

Frisbee

Mitch Connor wrote: »

what impact does property not selling and the move to the Emirittes have on Wenger making a profit in the transfer market? Surely it would be more likely for him to make a profit if cash is short?

I don't see how making a 15million profit is a great achievement on the back of the Highbury move stuff (it is a remarkable achievement in its own right, don't get me wrong, but i don't see how the highbury stuff makes it any better)

Sorry I should have been more clear.

The club after the move to Emirates and the apartments not selling really weren't looking good financially.

A lot of managers would have demanded transfer budgets every year and would have had to to maintain a Top 4 status and continually challenge in the latter stages of Europe.

Wenger's managed to do this, while also helping out the club, not just the team, by making a profit.

FlawedGenius

Ridicilous thread. Wengers an amazing manager.

Pepe LeFrits

jasonorr wrote: »

FYP!

I hope! :eek:

You're a fan of this youth policy then?

Frisbee

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

You're a fan of this youth policy then?

I'm a fan of not Phil Brown

orourkeda

This thread proves that anyone who contemplates a career in football management must be mad.

Because building a ultra modern stadium, winning titles, fa cups and getting to two european finals isnt enough for some people.

L'prof

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

You're a fan of this youth policy then?

We have some amazing players coming through and it does work, we just need to be adding experience at the same time and not worrying about hampering the youth development by doing so as if they are good enough, they will get their chance. We are still massively in debt, so I don't know what financial info you're talking about.

As for Brown in, Phil Brown? That has to be sarcasm?

Pepe LeFrits

It doesn't work, the lack of any trophies over the past few years show that. Every time a player comes through a more senior one gets tired of failure and leaves. Our financials show that we've loads of surplus cash and are making very healthy profits every year, so it's time to start spending it.

L'prof

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

It doesn't work, the lack of any trophies over the past few years show that. Every time a player comes through a more senior one gets tired of failure and leaves. Our financials show that we've loads of surplus cash and are making very healthy profits every year, so it's time to start spending it.

It works in that, we've qualified for the champions league every year. This is a major source of income for us. Yes we need bigger/stronger/more experienced players but, I don't really know that the money we're generating is available to Wenger, do you?

But seriously, Phil Brown???

Pepe LeFrits

Qualifying for the CL isn't success in my books.

Board members have said it is there. Financial statements show it is there. Arsene even said that the money is there, he just isn't spending it.

L'prof

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

Qualifying for the CL isn't success in my books.

Board members have said it is there. Financial statements show it is there. Arsene even said that the money is there, he just isn't spending it.

Means absolutely nothing.

Arsene agreeing with the board and saying he has money to spend should be taken with a pinch of salt too.

Pepe LeFrits

What purpose does it serve for them to lie? It only puts more pressure on Arsene.

Are the financials being falsified too?

L'prof

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

What purpose does it serve for them to lie? It only puts more pressure on Arsene.

Are the financials being falsified too?

It puts pressure on Wenger, but takes it away from them!

The financials aren't falsified but, they don't show where that money is, what it's being used for or who has access to it.

Pepe LeFrits

Actually they're pretty specific about the cash being surplus.

The board has changed considerably recently but the tune has always remained the same. If there was no cash available, the blame wouldn't lie with the likes of Gazidis.

Why Wenger would pretend that there was cash available makes no sense to me either.

L'prof

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

Actually they're pretty specific about the cash being surplus.

The board has changed considerably recently but the tune has always remained the same. If there was no cash available, the blame wouldn't lie with the likes of Gazidis.

Why Wenger would pretend that there was cash available makes no sense to me either.

Right, you just go ahead and believe the board so...I don't.

Wenger is employed by the board, it wouldn't be very wise to go against them and publicly state that they were lying to the fans.

Anyway, I think I'll end this conversation on that. One of us is obviously wrong but, neither can agree which it is

Pepe LeFrits

Ok, let's assume you're right for a second. Why would 'the board' lie? Who is 'the board', and what have they done?

Seems like a very convenient, faceless and nameless group to shift the blame onto.

L'prof

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

Ok, let's assume you're right for a second. Why would 'the board' lie? Who is 'the board', and what have they done?

Seems like a very convenient, faceless and nameless group to shift the blame onto.

I've drawn a line under this. You believe one thing, I believe another. It's pointless discussing it any further.

Pepe LeFrits

Fair enough, I won't bother engaging you in future if you won't give any reasons for whatever beliefs you hold.

L'prof

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

Fair enough, I won't bother engaging you in future if you won't give any reasons for whatever beliefs you hold.

It doesn't make any sense, we have money yet Wenger "chose" to make a £15m profit over the last 5.5 years?

Anyway, I am genuinely intrigued as to why you think Phil brown is the man for the job???

Sheepy99

clearly the answer is Nay as hes doing a great job still as he always has been. you can hardly expect him at the moment to be beating chelsea or united and the european cup is well out of their hands . anyways , no he shouldnt leave hes been bilding a great side the last few years which just need sone or two players with title winning experience to win the league i feel.

Pepe LeFrits

jasonorr wrote: »

It doesn't make any sense, we have money yet Wenger "chose" to make a £15m profit over the last 5.5 years?

He's pretty much said as much.

There are countless examples of his stubborness, his stingyness and his idealism (all at the cost of pragmatism).

The youth policy wasn't forced on him, he made a conscious decision to follow it.

Anyway, I am genuinely intrigued as to why you think Phil brown is the man for the job???

'cos he's such a ****ing ledge.

Keano

There is no doubt that Wenger is a great manager and his teams play some of the best football. He will of course be given another few years to get a settled team. If that fails, then he himself will move on I feel. You can only keep building for so long...

premierstone

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

Ok, let's assume you're right for a second. Why would 'the board' lie? Who is 'the board', and what have they done?

Seems like a very convenient, faceless and nameless group to shift the blame onto.

Isnt it pretty obvious why they would lie?? Imagine they come out and declare that there is no money there and if Arsene wants to buy any players he needs to sell first (which is clearly the case just look at the last transfer window) then every big club would be sniffing around our prize assets looking for a cut deal.

And seriously please answer the question that has been put to you know at least 3 times, Phil Brown to replace Arsene Wenger prey do tell what you are basing this on cos tbh on the face of it its one of the most redic. things I have ever ever seen suggested.

L'prof

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

'cos he's such a ****ing ledge.

Really

I have no affection for the man whatsoever! He's a decent manager, not ready for a top 4 team and I'm not sure he ever will be.

Maybe he should concentrate on a job in adult entertainment?

mink_man

the things he's done for arsenal!!

premierstone

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

The youth policy wasn't forced on him, he made a conscious decision to follow it.

lol you talk about ''youth policy'' as if its something like zonal marking or playing a diamond formation, the youth system is an integral part of any successfull club just look at Man utd and Barca and Arsene has created one of the strongest youth systems in the world, cna just imagine Phil Brown doing the same :rolleyes:

And do you realise that what you are suggesting is to get rid of the greatest manager the club has ever had and replace him with Phil fcukin Brown and as a result of which of course you will also loose our greatest player who a certain Mr.Brown falsely accused of spitting at one of he's staff last season, within 18 months we would be back to the position we were in when Arsene took over, what was it 13th or 14th ??

Pepe LeFrits

premierstone wrote: »

Isnt it pretty obvious why they would lie?? Imagine they come out and declare that there is no money there and if Arsene wants to buy any players he needs to sell first (which is clearly the case just look at the last transfer window) then every big club would be sniffing around our prize assets looking for a cut deal.

That can be very easily flipped in that it inflates the prices of players we're looking to buy. Plus, a lot of Arsene's purchases don't exactly scream 'broke!' - spending £5m on Ramsey summer before last for example. Both ways have their merits but only one puts Arsene under pressure.

And seriously please answer the question that has been put to you know at least 3 times, Phil Brown to replace Arsene Wenger prey do tell what you are basing this on cos tbh on the face of it its one of the most redic. things I have ever ever seen suggested.

The answer is in there somewhere...

Pepe LeFrits

premierstone wrote: »

lol you talk about ''youth policy'' as if its something like zonal marking or playing a diamond formation, the youth system is an integral part of any successfull club just look at Man utd and Barca and Arsene has created one of the strongest youth systems in the world, cna just imagine Phil Brown doing the same :rolleyes:

I talk about 'youth policy' because those are the words Arsene uses himself. Of course it is an integral part of any successful club but the difference is at Arsenal in recent years it has been the only policy.

Le King

The only reason anybody would want Phil Brown as manager of Arsenal would be someone who doesn't support the Arsenal.

As a Man Utd fan I think Wenger is world-class. Despite the fact he clearly has no money to spend, he has done reasonably well. No one can say he chose not to reinvest the Adebayor money in a new striker.

Also before the pre-Wenger era yous only a couple of small trophies. Cup Winners Cup in 94/95? And then 88 before that. In fairness he has been and still is a very successful manager.


You sack Wenger, you lose what Arsenal is now-a-days.

everdead.ie

Nay

We all know wenger has one of the safest jobs in the premier league and if he asks for money to buy another striker in january he will be either given the money or he can always sell a player to get the money.

He's not going anywhere untill his contract is up but hopefully he doesn't renew it;)


Also the acadamy's success took off at the same time Liam Brady took over so maybe he has a major part to play meaning even after he wenger leaves he should still be there

Son Of A Vidic

I'm another Man Utd man who has great respect for Wenger, he's had an awful run of luck at key times and now he's lost Van Persie. I think he has a lot of integrity as a manager and when he thinks he can't improve things any further, then he'll hop on a boat.

Pighead

A message for the "Wenger Out" brigade:

Spiritoftheseventies

Think Giles made a good point last night. Arsenal do well against the smaller teams but struggle against the bigger teams. But to be fair they were very unlucky against United early on in season.

L'prof

bayviewclose wrote: »

Think Giles made a good point last night. Arsenal do well against the smaller teams but struggle against the bigger teams. But to be fair they were very unlucky against United early on in season.

This is the case now, but before this season we lost far too many points to the smaller teams while we did relatively well against the bigger teams. We really should have taken more points from the games we've played and have been unlucky in some of the games against the bigger teams so, I wouldn't read too much into that just yet.

Mmcd

bayviewclose wrote: »

Think Giles made a good point last night. Arsenal do well against the smaller teams but struggle against the bigger teams. But to be fair they were very unlucky against United early on in season.

Tbh to win the league its alot more important to sweep up all the smaller teams than have a few giant killings. Utd won it last season with only 6/18 points v the big 4!

Spiritoftheseventies

Mmcd wrote: »

Tbh to win the league its alot more important to sweep up all the smaller teams than have a few giant killings. Utd won it last season with only 6/18 points v the big 4!

Yes and the same with Liverpool. We beat all the big teams but couldn't find a way against the likes of Stoke. And you cant win with that panel. We beat United and they saw we cant beat the smaller teams. The season before we couldn't beat the bigger teams

curry-muff

Anyone who has developed such an amazing young team as that, deserves the time to see it through.

Max Power1

How can any self respecting gooner fan (myself included) argue for wenger to be sacked? Quality manager with a great eye for talent, consistently over producing and managing to compete with the greater financial resources of United, Chelsea, and now City. Wenger should (and does TBH) have a job for life at Arsenal, and a seat upstairs waiting for him when he decides to retire!

Spiritoftheseventies

Max Power1 wrote: »

How can any self respecting gooner fan (myself included) argue for wenger to be sacked? Quality manager with a great eye for talent, consistently over producing and managing to compete with the greater financial resources of United, Chelsea, and now City. Wenger should (and does TBH) have a job for life at Arsenal, and a seat upstairs waiting for him when he decides to retire!

Yes Wenger has turned Arsenal from one of the most boring teams of all time into one of the most watchable teams of all time. Would be sheer lunacy to sack him

SlickRic

i can't believe this thread's still going. rafa i kind of understand still at times, but Wenger?

he should be knighted before being sacked.

Spiritoftheseventies

SlickRic wrote: »

i can't believe this thread's still going. rafa i kind of understand still at times, but Wenger?

he should be knighted before being sacked.

Can't believe the Rafa thread is still going either. But there are lot of fans jealous at the success of respective clubs. We just have to let them have their bit of fun for the time being.

bladespin

SlickRic wrote: »

i can't believe this thread's still going. rafa i kind of understand still at times, but Wenger?

he should be knighted before being sacked.

Great manager (I'm a united fan ), it's tough going rebuilding a team, no better man for the job (except Fergie maybe or maybe not).

L'prof

bladespin wrote: »

Great manager (I'm a united fan ), it's tough going rebuilding a team, no better man for the job (except Fergie maybe or maybe not).

Nah, not at Arsenal...maybe if we had money!

Spiritoftheseventies

brother an arsenal fan. Regularly goes on about their great stadium. When will it be paid for in full. Did that drain club of its finances?

L'prof

bayviewclose wrote: »

brother an arsenal fan. Regularly goes on about their great stadium. When will it be paid for in full. Did that drain club of its finances?

25 years was the last timeframe that I heard! Board are continually saying that we have money to spend on players but, I'm not so sure.

Max Power1

jasonorr wrote: »

25 years was the last timeframe that I heard! Board are continually saying that we have money to spend on players but, I'm not so sure.

Arshavin? Vermaelen? We do have money to spend - i'd wager its Wenger sticking to his youth players policy rather than board restriction tbh

Royale with Cheese

Max Power1 wrote: »

Arshavin? Vermaelen? We do have money to spend - i'd wager its Wenger sticking to his youth players policy rather than board restriction tbh

Toure? Adebayor?

£40m was generated from transfers last summer with £25m being spent between Arshavin and Vermaelen.

L'prof

Max Power1 wrote: »

Arshavin? Vermaelen? We do have money to spend - i'd wager its Wenger sticking to his youth players policy rather than board restriction tbh

So you're just going to ignore the fact that in the last 5.5 years we've made a profit of ~£15m?

Max Power1

Royale with Cheese wrote: »

Toure? Adebayor?

£40m was generated from transfers last summer with £25m being spent between Arshavin and Vermaelen.

Well to be fair Adebayor wanted out so he wasnt going to stay anyway, productively at least, and Toure probably wouldnt be first choice this season. Are you honestly saying you wouldnt have sold either?

jasonorr wrote: »

So you're just going to ignore the fact that in the last 5.5 years we've made a profit of ~£15m?

Yes. Tbh I wasnt aware of that... is that a profit around the business as a whole or the net transfer spend over 5.5 years?

L'prof

Max Power1 wrote: »

Well to be fair Adebayor wanted out so he wasnt going to stay anyway, productively at least, and Toure probably wouldnt be first choice this season. Are you honestly saying you wouldnt have sold either?


Yes. Tbh I wasnt aware of that... is that a profit around the business as a whole or the net transfer spend over 5.5 years?

Net transfer spend.

Royale with Cheese

Max Power1 wrote: »

Well to be fair Adebayor wanted out so he wasnt going to stay anyway, productively at least, and Toure probably wouldnt be first choice this season. Are you honestly saying you wouldnt have sold either?

I'm saying that although he spent £25m on players in the past 12 months, he received £40m. Doesn't do anything to prove there is money there for him to spend.