[US/IRL] 5X16/17 - "The Incident" - 2 Hour Season Finale [** SPOILERS WITHIN **]

Sad Professor

- WARNING: THIS THREAD WILL CONTAIN SPOILERS FOR THOSE WHO HAVE NOT YET SEEN "THE INCIDENT" -

Episode Title: "The Incident"
Airdate: May 13th 2009

Synopsis (from TV.Com):

Jack's decision to put a plan in action in order to set things right on the island is met with some strong resistance by those close to him, and Locke assigns Ben a difficult task

Next New Episode: 6x01 - February 2010

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SPOILER WARNING:

From now on, this thread shall reveal details of the episode mentioned above. If you have not yet seen this episode, please do not move any further down the thread.

This episode shall air on:

ABC (US) - May 13th 2009
RTÉ (IRL) - May 17th 2009

If you are sure you have seen the episode as mentioned above (on the channels on those original airdates), you can move down further in order to discuss the episode.

Otherwise, YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED - there shall be major plot details of the episode revealed and discussed below with no spoiler tags used!

Sad Professor

9

Okay it's a bit early but I can't wait!

They've kept a pretty good lid on the spoilers this season. Apart from some vague rumours no one really knows what to expect. Hopefully it lives up to previous season finales.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

9

Can't wait. Only a few hours to go. And for the first time for a finale I have no idea what's going to happen...

waltersobchak

5

this is gonna be seriously bittersweet because at the end of these 2 hours we'll have nine months of withdrawl symthoms, speculative rumours and conspiracy theories to look forward too!!

Jazzy

8

was pretty ok. thought different stuff would happen though.

Sad Professor

9

I CAN'T F**KING BELIEVE THEY DID THAT!

I'm getting on a plane to Los Angeles and I'm gonna kill the writers!

8 months... I think I'm gonna cry.

tracert

2

That second hour was really, really bad.

Sea Sharp

3

terrible ending.

As per usual, more questions than answers.
Very dissapointing.

Bounty Hunter

7

so...

We find out who Jacob is, Jacob gets killed by Ben cos Lock tells him to even though he is in the crate still dead so presumably this is Smokey trying to stop Jacobs plan to Save the Island presumably from Smokey himself who found a loophole with Locke and was able to see Jacob.

Juliet...Kaboom..Incident... but maybe not destroy everything and everyone normal nuke incident? sure they must still be on the island with a full season to go.

sleep time methinks then itl all make sense or not

whirlwind

6

Well after 5 seasons we finally met Jacob, interesting. But i must say that was kinda meh, was it just be or did it never take off? Don't get me wrong i enjoyed it, i just expected something more. Maybe it was those bleeding ads, i thought sky was bad and the ending now thats a cliff hanger

Sea Sharp

3

My instinct was that Charles Widmore was Locke, but smokey makes more sense.

Absolute crap. They're running out of episodes to wrap up the story. This time next year hopefully I won't be as pissed off

Jazzy

8

yes... ads ruined that for me.
note to self - next season, just wait till thursday and watch them like a normal human being

tracert

2

Jazzy wrote: »

yes... ads ruined that for me.
note to self - next season, just wait till thursday and watch them like a normal human being

Definitely. Couldn't get into it with the ads.

waltersobchak

5

wow cant believe how predicable,and boring that was, such an
anti-climax...

i think the grey haired man at the start of the episode and not the smoke monster is now the fake locke

V9

9

I thought it was brilliant!


I'm thinking, the fella we saw at the start with the beard, is he smokey? Is this fella and Jacob the meaning of the black and white stones fround in S1?

What happened in the ep was pretty much expected from my perspective, its not the final ep ever, I a few more questions going into the final season was bound to happen.

Now the -- what 9 months? -- wait begins til the end ;_;

Also Starring LeVar Burton

9

I don't care how many new questions were raised, that was absolutely epic - for the ending alone if nothing else. That's what I call a proper cliffhanger.
I'll probably have to watch it again after some sleep to comment on the episode properly, but I thought it was very well done. Have no idea where it's gonna go from here.

Nothingcompares

i feel a little frustrated to tell the truth

tok9

9

I thought it was brilliant....
Very S1 ending. Not sure what to make of jacob either.... He revived john to the looks of it after he fell out of the building! Maybe that was the loop hole..
No time to dwell on it though... have to go study!

ZondaChai

9

It's probably nothing, but my mind was drawn back to the season 1 episode walkabout, the first Locke episode. There was a scene where Locke was cornered by the off screen monster and we never saw what happened, mabey that was when Locke was "possessed" and everything up to now was just Jacobs enemy manipualating events through Locke so he could kill Jacob.

oleras

I dont know if it is too easy an answer, but looking at the clues, it is God V Satan on the garden of eden. The conversation at the start, jacob in white and his enemy in black, jacob wanting the ship, i assume the Black Rock to land because progress is good...Too simplistic ?

Handsome Bob

7

I'll take a stab in the dark and say the guy at the start is LOST's version of Esau.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esau


It seems what separates Esau and Jacob is that one uses manipulation, while the other uses honesty. John (Esau) manipulated Sun, Richard and Ben in order to make his plans come to fruition. Whereas Jacob is of the belief that people always have a choice. This is why Jacob chose not to manipulate Ben and simply asked "what about you?" He didn't want to manipulate Ben and wanted Ben to have a choice (even though he knew that the odds were stacked against him).

I thought the first half was excellent however I feel the second half lacked an urgency. The cliffhanger was perhaps the most underwhelming cliffhanger of all 5 seasons but I'm okay with that. I prefer to have no idea about what's going on rather than be given a taster and then told to wait 8 months!

Oh and kudos to Mark Pellegrino, I thought he was absolutely excellent in his potrayal of Jacob. I just hope we get to see more of him.

Steoob

So does anyone speak spanish? What lies in the shadow of the statue?

EDIT: Ok just looked it up. Apparantly its in latin and means "He who will save us all"

Penn

Steoob wrote: »

So does anyone speak spanish? What lies in the shadow of the statue?

It was Latin. Lostpedia says it means something similar to "He who will protect/save us all"

_JOE_

9

As soon as i saw Jacob and the other man on the beach, i knew he was Locke...i'm assuming this loophole are rules which they have to live by also? They also said that the others are coming at the end? Will this person be punished?

Requiem4adream

7

Most people reviewing this episode will have watched it through a prism of high expectations. This seasons Finale was so brilliantly setup, perhaps even more so than any other season, that anything short of awesome would be a slight let-down.

Just to start with a couple of personal disappointments in terms of who was missing: 1. No Claire. 2. No Widmore/Eloise. Claire, in particular, i thought would have made an appearance. Her story arc is becoming more frustrating as time passes, it's beginning to feel like they shelved her character without a real plan.

On the episode itself, where to even start. Probably with Locke. On face value, we can probably assume the following: Locke is, in fact, dead. He wasn't resurrected and was used as a pawn in an age-old struggle between Jacob and ...... Well and who? Smokey perhaps? The scene on the beach when the Black Rock is heading to the island seems full of symbolism. Jacob wearing white robes and perhaps Smokey manifesting itself dressed in black. Suggesting an age old duel for control of the island between them, restricted by certain rules.

So Smokey manifests itself as Locke, whilst otherwise telling Ben to follow every word he says. Locke then gets an audience with Jacob, the loophole he's been looking for to circumvent some "rules" preventing him from killing Jacob.

Where does that leave Locke now? Or Jacob? It's a quandary. Although where does the final shot of the episode leave anyone? I find it difficult, almost impossible, to believe the writers will almost cast aside 5 full seasons and have them land in LAX as strangers. It just can't happen for so many reasons. Then again, where do they go from here? The story arc in the 70's is surely at or nearing the end; they have to contrive some reason for them all to be in the present again. Clutching at straws, they all land at LAX go on their merry way only for them all to end up on the island again as fated. Really cant see it happening, obviously, but the alternatives are equally perplexing.

It appears as though Illana and her team are, in fact, the good guys; although that's based on an assumption that Jacob is 1 of the good guys. I actually saw the twist about Locke coming, just had a feeling it would be a body as opposed to weapons/a bomb.

I'm not convinced at the reasons they all let Jack try proceed. Ok, Sayid was shot and possibly dying, Jin wants to see Sun again, Juliette is hurt when Sawyer looked to Kate not her at the beach, Kate seemingly abandons her instincts to trust Jack. Sawyer kinda just says to hell with it. Maybe they all had enough in some respects but it was far from convincing and felt a bit oddly paced. Miles seemed to be the only one thinking logically.

I think the most interesting aspect for me was Jacob appearing to all of the main characters in their pasts. Further enhancing the idea that there is something special about this group of people.

Plenty of positives in the episode, of course, uniformly brilliant acting, got to see Jacob and a lot of him, we learned Locke's true fate, Illanas reason for being on the island.

The cliffhanger ending was the most disappointing part, simply because it left it way too open. I probably speak for most of us when i say i hoped that by the end of the Finale, the shape of season 6 would appear somewhat clearer and give us all something to look forward to. Going into the final season not knowing anything really is a little difficult to swallow.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

that was retarded

Macker1

8

Just watched it and it was not bad at all. The ending I felt could have been done a bit better maybe with a few more answers. The actor playing the role of Jacob was quite good and it was interesting to see his interaction with the Losties during the past. It will now be a long slog waiting for the final season to start and no doubt I will be counting down the Months,Days, Hours and minutes till its return.

abelard

8

As with all of the double episodes, there's so much to mention it's hard to get it all out coherently.

Not sure what to make of the whole Jacob arc. I figured out relatively late the connexion between Jacob's "enemy" and Locke. I thought Jacob might spill the beans to Ben though and we'd get some sort of situation where Ben had to choose between light and dark. Hard to know if Jacob's actually dead too, it would seem very much an anti-climax if he were. I wonder too if the "enemy" could be a Hanso. And while Ilana seems more a "good" character now, we still don't have a clue where her allegiances are.

I was very glad when Miles made his "don't you think this could actually cause the incident speech - I was wondering how they were all so blind as to not think of that considering all that's gone on. As to whether he's right or not, we'll have to wait and see.

I am honestly very gutted for Juliet. When the bomb fell down the hole and didn't go off, i figured they'd have to send someone down after it (though I hoped it might be set off by the collapsing scaffolding), and when that chain hit her I knew it was game over I've been a fan of the character since she appeared, and at least she went out with a good bang of emotional impact, but even so, it was very sad.

There's loads more to say probably, I'm just blanking a bit right now.

doonothing

9

I thought it was brilliant! Like, it wasn't meant to be a series finale, they couldn't really make it that satisfying, but as a season finale, it was ****ing class! 10/10

homerun_homer

9

Well it didn't play out like I imagined and it's just as good for it because who doesn't love surprises. With this show I'd rather be proved wrong than proved right.
It looked like Jack was screwing things up and causing the incident. Everything started getting magnetised towards the source after he threw the bomb in and I thought "Oh no, he did cause it", but I was glad that it turned out that he was right for once.

I believe smokey must be Jacob's foe from the beach. After all Smokey manifests itself as people to influence others. Ghostly Christian Sheppard "speaks on Jacobs behalf" so of course he could be trusted, eh.. Then he tells Locke to bring everyone back, all part of his doing. My confusion which will last until answered in the show is where did he figure out the Loophole to start off this big mad plan. It isn't half complicated, but then again we're dealing with seemingly immortal people on a magic island.

As for next season, Chang survives minus an arm so it's safe to assume all the Losties are ok. Sayid is the wildcard, will he/won't he die. Will this incident transport them to the time they need to be in, or will they remain and grow 30 years older - or die as per Ricardo's inferrance.
8 months, I can't wait.

Sad Professor

9

The cliff-hanger was just evil on the part of the writers and like the season 1 finale will probably end up colouring a lot of people's reactions, but overall the episode was fantastic. I need to watch it again but at this point I'm tempted to declare it the best season finale.

There was so much going on but the focus stayed very strong on the characters. Dramatically it was epic and had some great revelations. And despite what the nay-sayers say, we learned loads.

I'm waiting for confirmation from the writers or Mitchell before I write Juliet's obituary. What happened to her is remarkably similar to what happened to Desmond in season 2. So perhaps she'll wake up in the jungle naked next season. Here's hoping.

kingpin55

Jacob was still alive when Fake Locke kicked him into the fire, maybe because of this he wont actually die because locke did actually break the rules in his haste to see who were coming for him.

Patricide

5

Am I the only one who thought that episode was terrible....one of the worst episodes all season in my opinion.

I dont really know where to start, but it seemes like 2 hours of travelling, with odd cuts in between story arcs. There was also no Claire and juliets reaction seemed totally illogical.

Also would be sad to see juliet going, Fcuk you kate!!

kingpin55

Why did locke(fake one) need directions to jacob at the statue? would he not already know where jacob was residing?

tony1kenobi

Sad Professor wrote: »

I'm waiting for confirmation from the writers or Mitchell before I write Juliet's obituary. What happened to her is remarkably similar to what happened to Desmond in season 2. So perhaps she'll wake up in the jungle naked next season. Here's hoping.

I thought that too. Wasn't the white flash and "Lost" at the end a time flash?

Unearthly

9

tony1kenobi wrote: »

I thought that too. Wasn't the white flash and "Lost" at the end a time flash?

I got the impression it was more symbolism. Dark is now in the foreground and light is in the background.

Bounty Hunter

7

Sad Professor wrote: »

I'm waiting for confirmation from the writers or Mitchell before I write Juliet's obituary. What happened to her is remarkably similar to what happened to Desmond in season 2. So perhaps she'll wake up in the jungle naked next season. Here's hoping.

I wouldent be surprised if when the white flash stops the losties arent all back in present time, they had caused the incident and things happened as before with the remaining Dharma folk likes Miles dad building the hatch etc. As regards Juliet id imagine in the first 1 or 2 episodes Juliet wont appear like Jin when he was presumed dead, I would imagine we will see her again though even if its just as Smokie trying to get Sawyer to do something maybe.

The Gnome

8

tony1kenobi wrote: »

I thought that too. Wasn't the white flash and "Lost" at the end a time flash?

Perhaps, might just be the nuke going off. Is this the first time we've seen a cut to white at the end of a series? Just thinking about the whole black/white angle, maybe a cut to black symbolises a win for smokey and this cut to white was a win for Jacob ie finally something that was of benfit to the Island... or I'm just crazy.

Enjoyed the episode for the most part, sad to see Juliet go even if her bitchfit over Kate was a bit stupid. Was hoping Jack would get his face shot off but maybe the radiation from carrying the bomb will kill him nice and slowly instead.:D

tony1kenobi

Unearthly wrote: »

I got the impression it was more symbolism. Dark is now in the foreground and light is in the background.

Probably right...I just took it that Jacobs "they're coming" meant the 1977 gang and that the flash was them jumping back to the present.

PirateShampoo

9

You should also notice Jacobs and the others mans shirts on the beach. Jacob was in white and the other was in Black.

And im even more sure now that Rose and Bernard where the remains found in 2004

abelard

8

PirateShampoo wrote: »

And im even more sure now that Rose and Bernard where the remains found in 2004

Yeah that same exact thought struck me.

Soby

9

tony1kenobi wrote: »

Probably right...I just took it that Jacobs "they're coming" meant the 1977 gang and that the flash was them jumping back to the present.

How do i not get into this kinda thinking..When i heard that i was like...Oh richard and all must be coming into Ben and Locke..silly me

Btw 36 Weeks or 253 odd days to wait people...:(:(:(..gonna be a long one

Unearthly

9

tony1kenobi wrote: »

Probably right...I just took it that Jacobs "they're coming" meant the 1977 gang and that the flash was them jumping back to the present.

We are probably both right tbh

Sad Professor

9

A few weeks ago I asked if we could trust Christian when he said he spoke for Jacob. I guess now we have our answer.

It appears that who we thought was Jacob in the cabin in season 3 wasn't actually Jacob at all. I think it was Jacob's enemy, the guy in black, let's just call him Esau for now. The same guy who was masquerading as Locke this season.

So Christian was lying and actually has nothing to do with Jacob. Esau is using Christian and Claire. This means everything that happened, turning the wheel, the O6, Locke dying, was all part of Esau's plan to usurp Jacob.

Jacob probably trapped Esau in the cabin years ago using the circle of ash but now he's on the loose. Who set him free? I don't think Esau is Smokey but he probably has some connection to him, since Smokey told Ben to do what Fake-Locke said.

tony1kenobi

Sad Professor wrote: »

Jacob probably trapped Esau in the cabin years ago using the circle of ash but now he's on the loose. Who set him free? I don't think Esau is Smokey but he probably has some connection to him, since Smokey told Ben to do what Fake-Locke said.

Didn't Hurley disturb the circle of ash when he stumbled upon the cabin?

Chardee MacDennis

tony1kenobi wrote: »

Didn't Hurley disturb the circle of ash when he stumbled upon the cabin?

that rings a bell alright...

Resi12

7

I knew it was coming, I knew Juliette was going to die.
But it still didn't prepare me for it ..

I hope to god that the flash of white was them being transported to the right time but I dunno if the blast would have killed Juliette or what...

I hope not, She was/is a really great character. She is like the cast from S1 when the drama and all this good vs evil talk was non existent.

My head has been confused the whole episode however, Who to trust Locke or Jacob. Why would Jacob revive John when he fell out the window?
I don't know who to trust but I really think Allanah(Not sure if spelt right) and her team are the real good guys...

Which makes me think Jacob is evil as he was getting them back to the Island however where Farraday's mother and Widmore are in all of this just totally confuses me...

kingpin55

When locke jumped out the window, jacob said sorry for what has happened to you...maybe referring to the window, possesion also, what was goin to happen to him?

Chardee MacDennis

Resi12 wrote: »

Which makes me think Jacob is evil as he was getting them back to the Island however where Farraday's mother and Widmore are in all of this just totally confuses me...

i dont think there is any way Jacob could be evil, he could have easily talked ben out of killing him, plus the whole white v black thing as mentioned by a few others earlier...

kingpin55 wrote: »

When locke jumped out the window, jacob said sorry for what has happened to you...maybe referring to the window, possesion also, what was goin to happen to him?

Locke was pushed wasnt he?

anotherlostie

9

Wow, I thought it was an epic, awesome 2hr romp through everything I love about Lost (we even got new flashbacks:)). OK so there was no Claire (or Desmond, who's had a really easy time of it this year), but it didn't make much sense bringing Claire into things while they were out of time. If the incident does throw them back to 2008 on island (an unpredictable event?), then it will be ridiculous if she's not back.

We got to see Jacob, we had guns, fights, death and a huge reveal about Locke, who I also presume is the guy who refused the fish from Jacob at the start. And Bernard and Rose were back (probably for the last time...) to satisfactorily answer all those giving out about where they went to. And in the flashbacks, Jacob appeared in all except Juliet's, and I wonder was that a pointer to her not being important in the grand scheme of things (of course what that says about Myles and Ben is open for debate).

Sad Professor

9

tony1kenobi wrote: »

Didn't Hurley disturb the circle of ash when he stumbled upon the cabin?

I forgot about this. It's possible but afaik we didn't actually see him disturb it. I mean the cabin was already moving around at this point. When Locke arrived at it later he found the circle of ash and no cabin. So I think someone else was responsible for freeing Esau.

An even bigger question is why the hell the Ben thought the cabin was Jacob's in the first place?