[BPB] Boards.ie Photography Yearbook 2009 - Planning stage - [!! POLL ADDED !!]

CabanSail

Rather than leave until later in the year, when it all becomes a rush to get deliveries before Christmas and get the money to Santa Strike Force, we should probably get things moving now.

To start things off lets have a look at the way the last book was organised & see how we can improve things for this year. I am not saying anything was wrong last year but it was a totally new project that sort of evolved as it went along. Knowing what we do now, what would we change?

Do those who did specific roles last year want to repeat the fine job they did?

Any other suggestions are welcome.

I will sticky this until we have worked out where we are going then replace it with another thread for the implementation.

whyulittle

I may be submitting an image.

Good, I was going to bring this up the other day, but thought I'd be shot for doing it so early.

I don't imagine I will be available to do it this year, so somebody is going to have to step forward to put it together. It's easy do, honest!

EDIT: We sold 210 copies of the 2008 volume at the last check.

ThOnda

I may be submitting an image.

Well, I am back on-line, so you can expect in few days time what I remember about the last year project. And I am open to be involved, if there are no objections.
I have to warn that I cannot help with graphic design and promoting of the book. However I would like to get more involved in communication with all participants.

One thing is clear - we need one test print before we make the book available for sale.

CabanSail

I may be submitting an image.

whyulittle wrote: »

Good, I was going to bring this up the other day, but thought I'd be shot for doing it so early.

Seems early but really it's not. We should be looking at a delivery date & working back from that. I would suggest that the delivery date should be about the early/middle of November. This would mean having it ready for ordering in the middle of October. This would mean that submission of images would be in late August.

Cabaal

I may be submitting an image.

Instead of having people go through threads for the info why not setup a section on the boards photobook website (if its still running?) outlining the requirments etc, make it one stop shop for info and leave the threads for discussions only.

If some info changes the site can easily be changed accordingly so we don't have conflicting info in threads anymore

If the domain is still active and needs hosting I'm happy to provide some to whoever wants to manage it for what its worth
[EDIT] If the domain has lapsed I'm sure its worth reging a new one that could be used each year, again I'd be happy help out with this too as I did feck all work last year cause I was busy as hell

trishw78

I may be submitting an image.

Seriously 'great minds...' and all that I was thinking about this as we were taking down the exhibition.

I'd love to involved this year.

CabanSail

I may be submitting an image.

One thing I have been thinking about is that we should have a much bigger launch this year to get some more media coverage.

ThOnda

I may be submitting an image.

Well, we have results from last year and that definitely helps to attract more attention.

sineadw

I may be submitting an image.

One think I'd say is to maybe get a small print run done rather than Blurb. If we could get 300 I'm sure we'd do that no problem? Its just - when I was doing the gallery stint for the boards exhibition we shifted quite a few books and DeVore (or was it Simon or Danny) pointed out that we could be shifting yearbooks instead. They could be available to buy at all Boards socials.. And the print quality would be better.

Just throwing that in there

Anyway, I'm more than wiling to help in any capacity I can

Mycroft H

I may be submitting an image.

By the late summer i'll be on holidays and in the autumn i'll be dossing in first year college so i'll be willing to put the shoulder to the wheel and help this time round.....

What was the format for submitting images last year?

challengemaster

I may be submitting an image.

I'll help too, even if it's just by submitting a photo again

Buzz Lightyear

I may be submitting an image.

I missed out on last years as I felt I had nothing ready, but would be more than happy to help out in what ever way I can with this years book.

While I agree with sineads proposal that we should have some stock to sell at various boards events, this also requires cash. Even if we looked at stock of 100 books, at a cost of say 15 euro each, this would require us to get 'savings' of one and a half grand ! As with any venture we would be bound to get more promises of purchases than actual purchases from those who submit images. I would therefore propose that images be submitted with a donation towards the costs of printing this stock, this would help to ensure that nobody is out of pocket to the tune of the stock. I say donation, to reflect the circumstances of some people. If say an image entry's suggested donation was €10, an allowance could be made in this figure to allow for a couple of people whose private circumstances wouldn't permit this sum. Anything left over in this allowance could go straight into the fund.


I assume the proceeds would be going towards the great cause of Santa's Strike Force again.

Pigwidgeon

I may be submitting an image.

Like landyman I'll be in first year of college, possibly even doing photography, so I'll have more time to help out with this one. Although I'm not the most computer literate person, I would be willing to do what I could, even just putting up flyers anywhere and everywhere, every little bit helps!

Have to say, knowing the deadline(ish) well in advance, it'll give me that push I need to get out with my camera a lot during the summer!

rahtkennades

I may be submitting an image.

I agree with the idea of getting a 'stock' of books for further sale, and I like Buzz's idea of having a portion of the price to go for purchasing 'stock'.

Does anybody know anybody in the printing business that could look at a previous book and give a quote for a minimum order? I'm sure a charitable donation of services would be welcomed by everybody involved, even if this meant a partial reduction in printing costs.

A difficulty with doing it as a single print run is that it reduces the ability of people to purchase more than one copy, and makes distribution much more difficult. One advantage of online publishing last year was that people could order the books themselves and not worry about having to meet somebody to collect etc. They could also easily order extra copies afterwards, or tell their friends and family who could also order.

Perhaps if it was published online again, and as Buzz suggests, a portion of the cost went to purchasing a batch of books for further sale at exhibitions/meets/the launch night, this would be a compromise?

Thoie

I may be submitting an image.

I'm happy to help with/do spreadsheets again this year if required, but won't insist if anyone else wants to do it. Due to a change in my circumstances I'm not at the delivery spot very often these days, but I'm sure if needed stuff could be delivered there again and I can pick it up in advance of a launch. Again, if someone else has something more suitable, I'm good with that

dakar

I may be submitting an image.

I really enjoyed the whole process last year and will happily contribute any way I can this time around. I'll have a think about how the experience could be improved cos this thread has caught me on the hop a bit!

melekalikimaka

I may be submitting an image.

more than happy to lend a hand this time round

Cabaal

I may be submitting an image.

So we can perhaps get a start on things ahead of time can somebody tell me who owns boardsyearbook.com which was reged last November by somebody here, I did a whois and found their personal site which is http://cooligmartin.net/ but I still have no idea who owns it here

ThOnda

I may be submitting an image.

Brilliant, I am glad that so many people are interested. I cannot wait to see another book.

Thoie

I may be submitting an image.

Cabaal wrote: »

So we can perhaps get a start on things ahead of time can somebody tell me who owns boardsyearbook.com

cooligphoto was the name of the user who said (s)he'd done it.

CabanSail

I may be submitting an image.

I did look into getting a book published locally. IIRC the minimum print run required was 3000 books, which is a huge leap from what we sold last year.

The IPF publish a yearbook too (submissions close June 30) which sells for €15 a copy. the quality is good but it's mainly B&W. Quite a few of the colour submissions are printed in Mono. Last year I had 2 images accepted, one was B&W the other Colour but both were printed in B&W.

PixelTrawler

Count me in...

Main problem last year was the book was not a "quality product".

I mean speaking objectively, if I bought that book without being involved id be disappointed the quite a few of the photos came out poorly.

Agreed with an earlier posted blurb may not be the way to go again

Morrisseeee

I may be submitting an image.

Really liked being involved last year & more than happy to help out again this year. (Can't believe Santa is just around the corner, nooooooooo!! ).

quite a few of the photos came out poorly.

....that might be because some of us (incl. me) were NEW to photography, and this was our 1st 'publishing' !!, or they mightn't have chosen their best photo (ie. landscape orientation of the book).
I must add that I didn't think the printing of the book & the whole package last year was that bad. The prints were only 10*8, so I can't see much improvement there (quality wise), I think the problem was darkness/brightness of the prints.

artyeva

I may be submitting an image.

apart from trying to get one of my own images in the book i'd be happy to help out - but as i live on the complete other side of the country to dublin i'm not sure exactly how much help i can be :rolleyes:

what about trying to find another venue somewhere down here for the exhibition once it's finished in dublin?? just an idea. not sure bout the logistics but i've loads of spare time on my hands at the moment and wouldn't mind spending some time on it. there's a few places in galway, sligo and mayo that i'm sure would be suitable and might get some extra awareness/sales/interest going.

.Longshanks.

I may be submitting an image.

I wasn't around these sections last year, but i love the idea and be happy to help out if i can....

CabanSail

I may be submitting an image.

artyeva wrote: »

what about trying to find another venue somewhere down here for the exhibition once it's finished in dublin?? just an idea. not sure bout the logistics but i've loads of spare time on my hands at the moment and wouldn't mind spending some time on it. there's a few places in galway, sligo and mayo that i'm sure would be suitable and might get some extra awareness/sales/interest going.

This thread is about the Yearbook. The Exhibition was a separate project, which has now finished & the prints have all gone their own ways.

melekalikimaka

I may be submitting an image.

this is gonna grow...

will it stil be a free for all... or a voting system to get in?

artyeva

I may be submitting an image.

CabanSail wrote: »

This thread is about the Yearbook. The Exhibition was a separate project, which has now finished & the prints have all gone their own ways.

ok - ha ha whoops - don't hurt me, i'm new!? don't know where i got the idea that the exhibition was a tie-in with the book makes sense to me though. people come see the stuff and get the chance to buy them in book form :rolleyes:

offer of help still stands

rahtkennades

I may be submitting an image.

melekalikimaka wrote: »

this is gonna grow...

will it stil be a free for all... or a voting system to get in?

The free for all seemed to work out okay in the end last year I thought?

melekalikimaka

I may be submitting an image.

aye but it was big at the end... and will only grow. also if we want to push it further... the standard may need to be pushed up. i dunno, i just dont wanna book with 200 pics from every punter off boards who passes this thread

ThOnda

I may be submitting an image.

I thought that we are making the book because we want to, because we want to see our picture printed in book and to appreciate synergy here on Boards.ie. Not to mention the SSF donations.
I have already begun to summarise last year's time-line, so we can have something to begin with. Just keep your offers and ideas coming, we can only make it better this year!

CabanSail

I may be submitting an image.

Having just been through the process of selecting images for the DCC Annual Exhibition, it is a really hard thing to do. It was necessary there as we only have room to hang about 250(ish) photos & there were almost 700 submitted. Sure there were a few images that had glaring technical errors that went early, but after that it was hard. I was only assisting & so did not have to make the call. There was a similar process taken to select the Boards Exhibition, on a smaller scale.

My feeling is that this book should reflect the photography of the regular contributors to this forum. It should be up to those people what they want to put forward to fill their page. Last year the idea started as being a group of us put together a book so we can see one of our images in print & have copies of others work as well. The only restriction was that if you put in a photo then you committed to buying a book. It then went on to adding a small donation to a charity & SSF was picked. That donation moved the project out for general sales more & it became a bigger project than it was originally. This follow up book will be bigger again, but I would like it to retain as much of the ideals from the first book as possible.

rahtkennades

I may be submitting an image.

I think we had this same debate last year! I can't remember exactly, but I think the consensus was that the final contributors would be kind of self-selecting given the investment they would end up making in the book. (correct me if that's just my bad memory!)

With the success of the book last year, I hope there would be more interest in entries this year. This might mean more entries, but I would still think there would be a natural cap on numbers, since the cost rises with the number of images.

I pretty much agree with Th0nda that for me anyway, the purpose was as much to put a picture in a book and be able to say "Look what I made!", I think that was the same for a lot of people.

But maybe a compromise would be to guage the level of interest by looking for numbers, then make the decision. If 300 people put their names forward, there would have to be some whittling. But if the numbers are similar to last year, maybe there would be no need to.

Just a thought (though maybe that's just deferring the problem!)

trooney

I may be submitting an image.

I totally let this slide by me last year, but would certainly like to be involved this year...

AnCatDubh

I may be submitting an image.

One of the genuine beauties of this forum is that it is welcoming of photographers of any ability from one post wonders to people who take up residency and squatters rights on this piece of virtual real estate. Our most successful and longest active thread, the Random photo thread, is the most excellent example of the welcoming nature of the forum.

Thinking about the book - I would really dislike an idea which would see the forum's welcoming ethos diluted. The qualification criteria of "You must buy a book" thereby effecting a charitable donation in my opinion is strong enough rationale.

I have read the opinion of those who have indicated their dissatisfaction with the quality of last years efforts. I wholeheartedly disagree given its purpose and remit. It was a self publishing initiative. It was random. There was a multitude of brands and models of cameras used. There was a multitude of people of varying photographic abilities. There was little consistent about it. It was in my opinion truly great.

Most of us who partake in the forum, regular or occasional, will rarely if ever be in a position to be published so if this gives such an opportunity to a fellow photographer and friend of the forum then I would be of the opinion that we should be facilitating and welcoming. In the run up to last years publication there was a significant number of people who came back to the forum for advice selection. This seemed to be a way familiar to the forum users in terms of assisted selection and I think worked reasonably well.

City-Exile

I'll help if I can.
Was very impressed with it last year.

sNarah

Wasnt involved in the process last year so have no idea HOW it all actaully works Nonetheless, I'd be happy to help out with it!

City-Exile

Solyad wrote: »

Count me in...

Main problem last year was the book was not a "quality product".

I mean speaking objectively, if I bought that book without being involved id be disappointed the quite a few of the photos came out poorly.

Agreed with an earlier posted blurb may not be the way to go again

This annoys me!
The whole forum is about encouraging people to experess themselves through photography and to enjoy it. The book wasn't produced for profit and the varying quality reflected the amateur status of the majority. This is what made it more personal and more meaningful.

If we're out to reject people because you don't think they don't contribute to a "quality product", then we have lost the spirit of the project.

Cabaal

I may be submitting an image.

I've sent off a e-mail to the owner of the boardsyearbook.com domain see if I can get the ball rolling regarding getting it up and running.

On the subject of "quality product", I'd have to fully agree with City-Exile, the book is about community and a showcase of the communitys work.

Sure everyone should work towards showing their very best work but its not some professional photographers book we're making here, its a showcase.

We start taking people out of the book and its no longer about the community which I'd hate to see happen.

Hearvee

I may be submitting an image.

City-Exile wrote: »

If we're out to reject people because you don't think they don't contribute to a "quality product", then we have lost the spirit of the project.

I took the original quote about "quality product" as referring to the printing
of the photos in the book, not the photos themselves!
A few of the photos in last years book were printed a lot darker than the
owners themselves expected, thus hiding the details in them.

Once we're all aware of that issue, I thought the Blurb book last year was
excellent quality.

There was a suggestion earlier that at least one proof copy has to be printed
so that this can spotted earlier, and corrections made before the final
version. There wasn't time to do this last year, but it would've improved an
already great book by a notch or two.

Pigwidgeon

I may be submitting an image.

I think the way we did it last year worked well, ie if you want a photo in the book, just buy one and you can have one.

I agree with the previous posts about the community of boards and letting members of the forum have a photo. Even if they are just lurkers, this might encourage people to become more involved within the forum itself.

I don't think it would really be a true reflection of the forum if only photos above a certain standard were allowed in, because after the great thing about boards is it's diversity, there's people of different ages, different skill levels, from different locations and if we are to call it a boards yearbook then I think all this should be shown in the book, not just images from one section of the forum.

Cabaal

I may be submitting an image.

You got to wounder is the book better off having work from people that are actually active or somewhat active in the forum rather then people just passing through who have perhaps never posted in this forum?

trishw78

I may be submitting an image.

I think people you'll have alot of people putting there names forward to putting pictures in the book, but when it actually come to submitting the shots the numbers will fall off you just have to look at last years book or the exhibition.

If the time comes and we have shots submitted by 'lurkers' hopefully they will have become more involved in the forum by then.

As I was just reminded at lunch time Christmas Day is only 7 months away.

Cabaal

I may be submitting an image.

trishw78 wrote: »

I think people you'll have alot of people putting there names forward to putting pictures in the book, but when it actually come to submitting the shots the numbers will fall off you just have to look at last years book or the exhibition.

If the time comes and we have shots submitted by 'lurkers' hopefully they will have become more involved in the forum by then.

As I was just reminded at lunch time Christmas Day is only 7 months away.

I'd have to agree with this, we'd want to get started, perhaps start setting rough dates for one the first round of photos should be submitted

This will give us plenty of time to do proofs and ensure quality control is better then last year (though I thought last year was fine )

DeVore

I may be submitting an image.

I thought last year the pictures were breathtaking, however the print quality was darker then expected as pointed out above. This can be remedied by a quality check in advance.

I agree that we should allow all-comers, we can put an upper limit on that though if we want to control it, on a first-come-first-in basis. This neatly encourages people to get off their asses and submit in time too
(yes, I'm talking about me specifically... I think I probably had the last photo in, last year!)

DeV.

sineadw

I may be submitting an image.

An upper limit might *have* to be imposed, purely because people not involved in the book directly are not going to pay a crap load of money for a huge book based on a charitable donation of a fiver. I think we can cross that bridge when we come to it though? We had a first come first served policy last year...

And my mention of quality was directed at Blurb! Not photos. I'd HATE to see a selection process - the democracy of last year's project was it's main asset I thought. I thought some of the photos were printed a bit on the dark side too, and the quality of the cover was a bit low (I got the matt black one, and within two seconds of opening it it was stained with fingerprints). I'm looking at mine here, and the pages have a guillotined look? I suggest looking at alternatives and if we can't find anything better then yep - Blurb again It *was* very handy having them in a virtual shop like that. I'd have absolutely no objection with going with them again if its found there's no better option.

My other half is a writer, and has self published books on proper (small scale) print runs in France. I'll ask him to just have a poke about and see what run/money we could get. No harm finding out...

CabanSail

I may be submitting an image.

The limit is the number of pages & the price per book with Blurb

The page numbers go up in groups of 40. Each jump costs from €2 to €5 per book extra (mainly €4 jumps) The Maximum number of pages is 440

Pages Softcover Hardcover Hardcover - Image wrap
161-200 €22,95 €33,95 €36,95
201-240 €27,95 €37,95 €41,95

401-440 €48,95 €52,95 €56,95

Remember we have to add the SSF donation plus postage.

If we could find a printer that would handle a small run then it would be worth looking at.

TelePaul

I'd like to be involved in this somehow. Even if it's just submitting a photo. Misse dout on last eyars and am raging!

bernard0368

I may be submitting an image.

I would love to get involved again this year. If there are more people involved all the better surely the more people commited to buy a book the lower the cost of printing.
I totally disagree with the idea of setting a limit on the amount of pages and selecting images to be incorporated in the book. This I feel would damage the forum. It is after all a site for novice and professional alike to meet and learn.

What better way to encourage a novice by letting them showcase there works.

rahtkennades

I may be submitting an image.

Can I suggest that the first two things we can do are:

1. Begin to gather a list of people who wish to submit an image? Me First! Me First!

2. Gather options for publishing the book. Sineadw is finding out about doing a small private print run, Cabansail has posted the cost of using Blurb again.

I'd suggest as part of the publishing options that we get opinions on past experiences for publishing, eg:

a) Blurb
Price: X for 40, Y for 80, Z for 120.
Type: Online Self-publisher
Opinions: Some prints a bit dark.

b) Lulu
Price: ???
Type: Online Self-publisher
Opinions: ???

c) Paddy's Printing Ltd
Price: ??? per 100 units for 80 pages....?
Type: Small Private Printer
Opinions: Good quality, distribution issues


... or some such?

Pigwidgeon

I may be submitting an image.

The way we did it last year for numbers was polls... lots and lots of polls, I suppose for the first general number we could set up a poll and then decide where to go from there. If a mod or the OP can add a poll to the thread for people who are intereseted?