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Where do political parties get your address from ?

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  • 25-05-2009 4:33pm
    #1
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭


    Something happened last week that has me wondering where political parties get their addresses from for their junk mail.

    Basically, I've recently moved back to a former address of mine, but in the interim I wasn't registered at the old address, and so I had to fill out the form to change registration details last week to my new [old] address (and got the polling card today).

    But before that change of registration, Labour managed to send me a junk mail card, addressed directly to me!

    How could they do this ?

    Plus, a neighbour of mine who moved to this area last year (and who is still registered at her old address) ALSO received a directly-addressed junk mail card!

    While my one might be explained by me being "back" at my old address - maybe the address for European stuff wasn't changed in the meantime - my neighbour has NEVER been registered at her new address!

    So what source could these people be using ? And does it mean that someone, somewhere, is breaching some part of the Data Protection Act ?


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    #2
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,978 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Post office lists? TV licence list? Tax office?


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    #3
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,804 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    Curious about that. We've both received election literature from a number of parties addressed to an incorrect address (but close enough that the postman got it to us anyway - Her Indoors has an unusual name). We've checked the register, and the address is (almost) correct there - certainly it's not the address on the election literature. I've been wondering what the source is.


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    #4
    ionix5891
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭ionix5891


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    Curious about that. We've both received election literature from a number of parties addressed to an incorrect address (but close enough that the postman got it to us anyway - Her Indoors has an unusual name). We've checked the register, and the address is (almost) correct there - certainly it's not the address on the election literature. I've been wondering what the source is.

    can this information be requested under freedom of information or whatever acts?


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    #5
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    mike65 wrote: »
    Post office lists? TV licence list? Tax office?

    Maybe - don't know....

    But if so, is it in breach of the Data Protection Act ?


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    #6
    ionix5891
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭ionix5891


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    Maybe - don't know....

    But if so, is it in breach of the Data Protection Act ?

    Considering alot of people have no issues putting very private details on the likes of Bebo and Facebook and Myspace shouldn't come as surprise that alot of data about us is sloshing around


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    #7
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    ionix5891 wrote: »
    Considering alot of people have no issues putting very private details on the likes of Bebo and Facebook and Myspace shouldn't come as surprise that alot of data about us is sloshing around

    No address of mine on those.


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    #8
    ionix5891
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭ionix5891


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    No address of mine on those.

    hmm i don't know, i didn't get any letters addressed to me, but my girlfriend has dozens

    Dont the gardai have the right to keep very detailed records on us?


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    #9
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    ionix5891 wrote: »
    Dont the gardai have the right to keep very detailed records on us?

    They might have (and fair enough) but they surely don't have the right to pass it on to third parties ?


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    #10
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    similar occurence to the above - the OH has been getting electoral rubbish from multiple parties. the address is the same on all parties leaflets - but different to whats on the register.


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    #11
    InFront
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,698 ✭✭✭InFront


    Maybe the parties are on those Junk Mail sign-up lists? Like the people who used to offer me a credit card but whose correspondence has stopped of late. Must write.


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    #12
    bcirl03
    Registered Users Posts: 484 ✭✭bcirl03


    I've only got one so far, I expect more.

    Whilst I dont know where they come from I consider them junk mail and as such RETURN TO SENDER.


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    #13
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,804 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    What's strange is that those addressed to us have the right house number, but the wrong housing estate - it's the next estate up, and the name is completely different to the one we live in. It's a brand-new estate, whereas the one we live in is quite established, and there's certainly nothing we've ever done that would associate our names with that address.

    It's a strange one.


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    #14
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Yep, I've gotten it too, despite not being on the edited register. Would be very curious to know how/where the information gets into their hands.

    It only seems to be EU elections material in my case - could that be significant?


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    #15
    SeanW
    Registered Users Posts: 8,843 ✭✭✭SeanW


    Yeah, I've got a small mountain of those 1/4 page wide leaflets over the last week or so. Just got more from the Shinners today.

    I'm on the electors register, but not the edited register, which is the one that marketers and political parties are supposed to use as an "opt in to all crap" list.

    Do you think the politicians are (illegally?) using the main electors register?


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    #16
    ionix5891
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭ionix5891


    seamus wrote: »
    Yep, I've gotten it too, despite being on the edited register. Would be very curious to know how/where the information gets into their hands.

    It only seems to be EU elections material in my case - could that be significant?

    That should be a good question to as 'em when they come canvasing to the door, if they cant give a straight answer about an issue like that why would the party be trusted with power?

    on further taught maybe there some sort of companies out there with up to date databases, and they sell this info on, i always found it disturbing how the tv license people always got my latest apartment even tho there was no tv in house as i moved around for work :pac:


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    #17
    Stabshauptmann
    Registered Users Posts: 4,885 ✭✭✭Stabshauptmann


    Political parties or candidates for election in the context of an election have certain exemptions under the DPA.

    For one they are not required to obtain your explicit consent for the processing of "sensitive personal data".

    Also direct mailing carried out in the course of political activities [...] is outside the definition of direct marketing under the DPA - you do not have an opt out.

    Theres a couple of exemptions to receiving consent before obtaining your informations, and I *think* political parties fall into these.

    The above info is taken from one of my course texts, if anyone wants to find the exact place in legislation I would suggest checkin not only the 88 act, but the 2003 act and more importantly, the regulations under both acts.

    So this explains how election material is sent to my second address, but Ive no idea how I became registered there

    [edit]I do now. This is a strange legal one imo.
    It is the councils duty under law to maintain the register. They have wide ranging powers as to how they can do this, I think originally it was by going door to door or through direct mailing. I think in my case it was census data as I cant think of any other way they could know about my second address - I had no bills in my name.

    It is however my obligation under law to alert the Register of Electors that my information is incorrect. Great, someone added me to the register incorrectly and without consulting me, and its my fault :rolleyes:


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    #18
    Stabshauptmann
    Registered Users Posts: 4,885 ✭✭✭Stabshauptmann


    ionix5891 wrote: »
    That should be a good question to as 'em when they come canvasing to the door, if they cant give a straight answer about an issue like that why would the party be trusted with power?

    on further taught maybe there some sort of companies out there with up to date databases, and they sell this info on, i always found it disturbing how the tv license people always got my latest apartment even tho there was no tv in house as i moved around for work :pac:
    the TV license is specifical proscribed for in law. Crappy text book is only an introductory, cant give you the exact reference


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    #19
    Stabshauptmann
    Registered Users Posts: 4,885 ✭✭✭Stabshauptmann


    seamus wrote: »
    Yep, I've gotten it too, despite not being on the edited register. Would be very curious to know how/where the information gets into their hands.

    It only seems to be EU elections material in my case - could that be significant?
    The edited register contains the names and addresses of persons who have indicated that their details can be used for a purpose other than electoral or other statutory use, e.g. for direct marketing use by a commercial or other organisation.

    you cannot opt out of polical direct mailing.

    The EU thing is strange. If you only got local info Id know why. Check the register, even if you were type E (non Irish, resident EU national) you should still get local election info.

    Maybe nobody wants your vote :p


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    #20
    thebman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,012 ✭✭✭✭thebman


    Wrong ones get sent to my house and none addressed to me.

    I guess the man hasn't found me :P

    Oh and I have a TV license in my name for this address.


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    #21
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    Something happened last week that has me wondering where political parties get their addresses from for their junk mail.

    Basically, I've recently moved back to a former address of mine, but in the interim I wasn't registered at the old address, and so I had to fill out the form to change registration details last week to my new [old] address (and got the polling card today).

    But before that change of registration, Labour managed to send me a junk mail card, addressed directly to me!

    How could they do this ?

    Plus, a neighbour of mine who moved to this area last year (and who is still registered at her old address) ALSO received a directly-addressed junk mail card!

    While my one might be explained by me being "back" at my old address - maybe the address for European stuff wasn't changed in the meantime - my neighbour has NEVER been registered at her new address!

    So what source could these people be using ? And does it mean that someone, somewhere, is breaching some part of the Data Protection Act ?
    Are you known personally by a councillor/senator/TD?

    Within days of moving house 8 years ago, I went to change my address on the electoral register but it was already done. A Labour Councillor, who I knew personally, took the liberty.

    (He made a slight mistake with the address and it's easy to spot any mail using this database as they all arrive with the same mistake).


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    #22
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    The Electrol register! Its also the thing they mark off the day you go to vote. You see they know that you vote, they just dont know who....

    So next time you tell a politician "Ah yes I voted!" just remember its easy to check. :D


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    #23
    LostinBlanch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,908 ✭✭✭LostinBlanch


    When I registered at a previous address I got a junkmail card from Gerry Adams saying "LIB a chara please vote for us etc." It happened within a couple of weeks of me going on the register so that's where I think it comes from.


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    #24
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    LostinBlanch wrote: »
    When I registered at a previous address I got a junkmail card from Gerry Adams saying "LIB a chara please vote for us etc." It happened within a couple of weeks of me going on the register so that's where I think it comes from.


    Your lucky you could have got it from Bertie! :D


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    #25
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    The Electrol register!
    LostinBlanch wrote: »
    It happened within a couple of weeks of me going on the register so that's where I think it comes from.
    The OP is aware that the mail comes from the electoral register but is simply wondering how it arrived at his new address when he hasn't changed it yet.


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    #26
    The Raven.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,008 ✭✭✭The Raven.


    The first one I got was from Libertas :eek::eek::eek:!!!


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    #27
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    Wishbone Ash wrote: »
    The OP is aware that the mail comes from the electoral register but is simply wondering how it arrived at his new address when he hasn't changed it yet.

    Oh my apologies I ment to say the supplimentary register but then that still leaves the question, how did it get there! :confused::confused::confused:


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    #28
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    The Electrol register! Its also the thing they mark off the day you go to vote.

    Did you even read the original post, Joey ? I only got the name transferred last Friday week, so no, it wasn't the "Electrol" register, or even the electoral one.

    Maybe they have access to the post office's internal lists or something - I dunno.

    But I can't see why they'd deserve an exemption from the marketing restrictions; they basically "selling" themselves (and as I've said before if any local politician or TD did worthwhile stuff then we'd know about them and wouldn't need to be bombarded with stupid posters and junk mail.
    Wishbone Ash wrote: »
    The OP is aware that the mail comes from the electoral register but is simply wondering how it arrived at his new address when he hasn't changed it yet.

    It's changed now....wasn't gonna miss teaching a few people a few long-overdue lessons on Friday week! But yeah - the issue is that the flyer arrived BEFORE that change request went in, and also arrived to a neighbour who has left her voting registration at her old family-home address.


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    #29
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    If they didn't get it by the register Liam, I've no idea. Did anyone canvass you? Canvassers might have got your address if you showed a sense of support towards them.

    Although - generally, if you're not on the register; they normally wouldn't. At least, that's my understanding of it.


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    #30
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    Did you even read the original post, Joey ? I only got the name transferred last Friday week, so no, it wasn't the "Electrol" register, or even the electoral one.
    .


    I am not the only one that does not read correctly Liam, I answered that earlier and as stated I thought it might be the supl register!


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    #31
    lostexpectation
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,082 ✭✭✭lostexpectation


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    The Electrol register! Its also the thing they mark off the day you go to vote. You see they know that you vote, they just dont know who....

    So next time you tell a politician "Ah yes I voted!" just remember its easy to check. :D

    surely they throw away the paper list they use on the day


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