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Dunlop goes down for two years.

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    #32
    juuge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 792 ✭✭✭juuge


    smccarrick wrote: »
    ........Until such time as pork barrel politics are abondoned in favour of a list system, and politicians represent the Irish people- rather than Jack and Anne from Bog na Boille, we have no chance at all.......
    Well said! and guess what the cute-hoors will still be voted back, and one wonders why the Irish are percieved as being 'thick' is it any wonder.


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    #33
    Rebelheart
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,077 ✭✭✭Rebelheart


    I'm pleasantly surprised at the amount of people who are seeing this as I and everybody around me are seeing it: it will be a travesty if Frank alone is the only one to be sent to prison. It is wrong on so many levels. He deserves to be in prison, but not to be the scapegoat. This is the problem I have.

    As I said last week on another board here, I've known Frank all my life and I wasn't expecting this. There were so many mitigating circumstances, chiefly that he co-operated fully with the legal authorities of this state. He, and his notebook, indicted an awful lot of powerful people in this society. His evidence indicted himself, and he is going to prison for a comparatively long time. Given his co-operation and all the information he has given to the state it is beyond belief that it is he who is behind bars tonight, while these politicians are seemingly beyond reach.

    I agree entirely with Paddyboy23: Frank should hang them all. But the irony is that his evidence is substantial enough to date to hang an awful lot of them.

    There is something fundamentally wrong that he, and he alone, has been imprisoned while all these corrupt public representatives - people who were elected and expected to protect our interests (an obligation which Frank Dunlop never had, as very wrong as he obviously was).

    These people betrayed us and our trust. And we, Irish society, reward them by jailing the very man who has told us all about it. This is wrong, wrong and wrong.


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    #34
    Rebelheart
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,077 ✭✭✭Rebelheart


    legalbird12 wrote: »
    Sorry if this is the wrong forum.

    Where is Frank Dunlop most likely to serve his 18 months?


    Frank is, surprisingly, being held in Arbour Hill prison tonight. The Irish Times wrongly assumed (here:http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/0526/breaking4.html?via=mr) that he was being taken to Mountjoy.

    I don't know why they chose Arbour Hill though, which if I'm not mistaken is for sex offenders. Very odd. My heart goes out to his family, who are salt of the earth people.


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    #35
    randylonghorn
    Registered Users Posts: 29,509 ✭✭✭✭randylonghorn


    smccarrick wrote: »
    This is why Jackie Healy Rae is a folk hero in Kerry- and despised everywhere else.
    Ah, here ... there's a hell of a lot of Kerry people despise him as well!


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    #36
    bmaxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,859 ✭✭✭bmaxi


    Rebelheart wrote: »
    I agree entirely with Paddyboy23: Frank should hang them all. But the irony is that his evidence is substantial enough to date to hang an awful lot of them.

    There is something fundamentally wrong that he, and he alone, has been imprisoned while all these corrupt public representatives - people who were elected and expected to protect our interests (an obligation which Frank Dunlop never had, as very wrong as he obviously was).

    These people betrayed us and our trust. And we, Irish society, reward them by jailing the very man who has told us all about it. This is wrong, wrong and wrong.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, I thought I heard that files were being prepared for the DPP in a number of other cases.
    I don't have any sympathy for Dunlop, he did what he did for one reason only, greed. He should have been thinking of the possible consequences for his family at the time but he thought his powerful buddies would protect him.
    I would dearly love to see more of these criminals follow him through the prison gates but I won't subscribe to the idea that he was an innocent abroad.


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    #37
    jonsnow
    Registered Users Posts: 724 ✭✭✭jonsnow


    the politicians should go down too .But they wont-it would be actually very hard to prove.One of the main reasons is because they sold their votes so cheaply- a few meals, a few pints,for the really greedy ones a few grand.There wont be much of a trail.Its the developers who made the real killing from this not the politicos.They made millions out of a few thousand in backhanders.But they wont be caught either.


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    #38
    scargill
    Registered Users Posts: 1,679 ✭✭✭scargill


    Rebelheart wrote: »
    Frank is, surprisingly, being held in Arbour Hill prison tonight. The Irish Times wrongly assumed (here:http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/0526/breaking4.html?via=mr) that he was being taken to Mountjoy.

    I don't know why they chose Arbour Hill though, which if I'm not mistaken is for sex offenders. Very odd. My heart goes out to his family, who are salt of the earth people.

    Ray Burke spent 6 months there too. They must have a Fianna Fail wing.


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    #39
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    bmaxi wrote: »
    Correct me if I'm wrong, I thought I heard that files were being prepared for the DPP in a number of other cases.
    I don't have any sympathy for Dunlop, he did what he did for one reason only, greed. He should have been thinking of the possible consequences for his family at the time but he thought his powerful buddies would protect him.
    I would dearly love to see more of these criminals follow him through the prison gates but I won't subscribe to the idea that he was an innocent abroad.

    How convenient for those bribed that the DPP is to review their files. I wonder how long they will serve? How can you know that Mr. Dunlop "thought" his powerful friends would protect him? You're speculating.
    Mr. Dunlop was told by the Tribunal after he confessed that if he cooperated with proceedings that this would be taken into account further inquiries. However this was not considered by Justice Frank O'Donnell is his sentence. This was not the case. I recently visited Dunboyne, Co. Meath and Mr. Dunlop IS a complete pariah in that community - in my opinion this man has suffered enough and he is being hung out to dry by those politicians. He is in Arbour Hill? Paedophiles from the Christian Brother order should be in there. Not Frank Dunlop. So do not say Mr. Dunlop was motivated by greed. What greed motivated him to admit his wrongdoing? No family deserves to be torn apart by a prison sentence no matter what the crime. I read today (Irish Independent) that Dunlop lost his first son (aged 16) to a serious illness - god bless his wife and give her strength.

    Now the Mr. Colm Allen has cleared his name and Mr. Frank O'Donnell will more than likely be promoted to The High Court, I wonder if people actually believe that yes, this has put closure on corruption in Ireland? I think not. This is only the beginning and Mr. Dunlop is the fall guy.

    How you can be exhilarated by Mr. Dunlop's sentence is an appalling thought. Has anyone even taken into account how much the Liffey Valley Shopping Centre has done for the area?

    But like most interests Irish I suppose it was Frank Dunlop yesterday and clerical abuse today. Ireland will move on from issue to issue, release a report, write a letter to the Irish Times and move on. Yes this is an end to Dunlop's corruption but Ireland's is only being revealed.


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    #40
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,804 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    P. Breathnach wrote: »
    It means that when the money left his possession, it was a bribe; when it arrived in the politician's possession, it was a political donation.
    Accepting that that was a somewhat flippant remark: if Dunlop has been convicted of corruption, does that not establish as a matter of fact in law that corrupt payments were made by him to specific individuals?

    How, exactly, can the recipients of payments that have been established in law to be corrupt not be found guilty of corruption?


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    #41
    Flyboy!!!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 47 ✭Flyboy!!!


    Nodin wrote: »
    CJ Haughey wasn't charged at all, as it was judged prejudicial comments had been made by Harney.

    It was said the reason Haughey wouldn't stand trail was because there wasn't a court in the land where CJ could get a fair trial. This is a lie. We have the special criminal court for such cases, no jury, just three judges. If it was good enough for trying suspected IRA members then it ought to be more then adequate for corrupt politicians.


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    #42
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    Bond-007 wrote: »
    Proper order. Shows the courts are not afraid of jailing FF lackeys.

    Rubbish. You sound like today's Irish Times Editorial.

    The courts weren't to brave with Bertie. Or FF's inside puppeteers such as PJ Mara.


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    #43
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    bmaxi wrote: »
    Two years out of a possible maximum seven. Not enough.

    I encourage you to visit Arbour Hill. Look at the evidence presented in court and the record of Mr. Dunlop's trial. You see if he deserves seven.


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    #44
    BoardsRanger
    Registered Users Posts: 706 ✭✭✭BoardsRanger


    HobokenXVI wrote: »
    I recently visited Dunboyne, Co. Meath and Mr. Dunlop IS a complete pariah in that community

    Thats fairly sad to hear- i hope this isnt true. I was in college with frank, and it must be said, he was some character! I once sat beside him for an exam when at the start, the invigilator asked if anyone in the room had any material wrote on notes or on themselfs- to which frank put up his hand, pointed at my leg and said he thought i had something wrote on my leg. Much to his amusement, i started to sweat with embarrassment (obviously i didnt have anything wrote there at all).
    I really hope frank names and shames all the politicians who recieved bribes.


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    #45
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    BoardsRanger wrote: »
    Thats fairly sad to hear- i hope this isnt true. I was in college with frank, and it must be said, he was some character! I once sat beside him for an exam when at the start, the invigilator asked if anyone in the room had any material wrote on notes or on themselfs- to which frank put up his hand, pointed at my leg and said he thought i had something wrote on my leg. Much to his amusement, i started to sweat with embarrassment (obviously i didnt have anything wrote there at all).
    I really hope frank names and shames all the politicians who recieved bribes.

    It shocked me to the core. To think that "Ireland of the welcomes" could be so horrifically unkind towards mention of him. So much for community. I believe he was a gentleman and an extremely funny one at that!


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    #46
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    HobokenXVI wrote: »
    No family deserves to be torn apart by a prison sentence no matter what the crime.

    Open the doors so!


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    #47
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    dresden8 wrote: »
    Open the doors so!

    My mistake! Meant to say "this family doesn't deserve etc."

    Only if prison contained all those who should be there....
    Don't think the Dail doors are that easily opened!!!


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    #48
    bmaxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,859 ✭✭✭bmaxi


    HobokenXVI wrote: »
    How convenient for those bribed that the DPP is to review their files. I wonder how long they will serve? How can you know that Mr. Dunlop "thought" his powerful friends would protect him? You're speculating.
    Mr. Dunlop was told by the Tribunal after he confessed that if he cooperated with proceedings that this would be taken into account further inquiries. However this was not considered by Justice Frank O'Donnell is his sentence. This was not the case. I recently visited Dunboyne, Co. Meath and Mr. Dunlop IS a complete pariah in that community - in my opinion this man has suffered enough and he is being hung out to dry by those politicians. He is in Arbour Hill? Paedophiles from the Christian Brother order should be in there. Not Frank Dunlop. So do not say Mr. Dunlop was motivated by greed. What greed motivated him to admit his wrongdoing? No family deserves to be torn apart by a prison sentence no matter what the crime. I read today (Irish Independent) that Dunlop lost his first son (aged 16) to a serious illness - god bless his wife and give her strength.

    Now the Mr. Colm Allen has cleared his name and Mr. Frank O'Donnell will more than likely be promoted to The High Court, I wonder if people actually believe that yes, this has put closure on corruption in Ireland? I think not. This is only the beginning and Mr. Dunlop is the fall guy.

    How you can be exhilarated by Mr. Dunlop's sentence is an appalling thought. Has anyone even taken into account how much the Liffey Valley Shopping Centre has done for the area?

    But like most interests Irish I suppose it was Frank Dunlop yesterday and clerical abuse today. Ireland will move on from issue to issue, release a report, write a letter to the Irish Times and move on. Yes this is an end to Dunlop's corruption but Ireland's is only being revealed.

    I take it all back, Frank Dunlop is a true altruist and champion of the little man. :rolleyes:
    Give me a break.


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    #49
    Our man in Havana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    HobokenXVI wrote: »
    I encourage you to visit Arbour Hill. Look at the evidence presented in court and the record of Mr. Dunlop's trial. You see if he deserves seven.
    Why are you an FF apologist?


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    #50
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    bmaxi wrote: »
    I take it all back, Frank Dunlop is a true altruist and champion of the little man. :rolleyes:
    Give me a break.

    Nice to see you've come to your senses.


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    #51
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    Bond-007 wrote: »
    Why are you an FF apologist?

    Where in my argument did I offer defence on behalf or FF? Perhaps you misread something.


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    #52
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    HobokenXVI wrote: »
    My mistake! Meant to say "this family doesn't deserve etc."

    Only if prison contained all those who should be there....
    Don't think the Dail doors are that easily opened!!!

    Why doesn't "this family"?

    What's so special about them?

    Anto's a crim, he goes to prison, never mind little Jade and Kylie. Frank's a crim too, he goes to prison as well, no matter which well to do school his kids went to.


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    #53
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    dresden8 wrote: »
    Why doesn't "this family"?

    What's so special about them?

    Anto's a crim, he goes to prison, never mind little Jade and Kylie. Frank's a crim too, he goes to prison as well, no matter which well to do school his kids went to.

    He admitted his wrongdoing. He pleaded guilty. They had to stick by him for all the years.

    You're speculating where his kids went to school. What does that have to do with anything? You're involving an unnecessary presumption on your part. Am I supposed to presume that "Jade and Kylie" didn't go to a well to do school?


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    #54
    FTA69
    Registered Users Posts: 9,252 ✭✭✭FTA69


    HobokenXVI wrote: »
    I encourage you to visit Arbour Hill. Look at the evidence presented in court and the record of Mr. Dunlop's trial. You see if he deserves seven.

    Arbour Hill? Boo hoo. He should be thanking his lucky stars that he wasn't shoved into a damp, two-man cell in Mountjoy with three smackheads and a pot to sh*t in. That's what would have happened if he was an ordinary criminal anyway.
    No family deserves to be torn apart by a prison sentence no matter what the crime. I read today (Irish Independent) that Dunlop lost his first son (aged 16) to a serious illness - god bless his wife and give her strength.

    You can be sure many if not most of those in the Irish prison system would have had a much harder and traumatic life than bloody Frank Dunlop.


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    #55
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    HobokenXVI wrote: »
    He admitted his wrongdoing. He pleaded guilty. They had to stick by him for all the years.

    He admitted his wrongdoing after the tribunal put a gun to his head and told him he was caught. Lots of criminals ask for other offences to be taken into account. Doesn't keep them out of jail.

    No matter how much their families stand by them.


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    #56
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    dresden8 wrote: »
    He admitted his wrongdoing after the tribunal put a gun to his head and told him he was caught.

    I think being stopped by the Criminal Assets Bureau in Dublin airport with a suitcase full of cash, about to board a flight to Douglas (Isle of Man), might have sufficed.....
    dresden8 wrote: »
    Lots of criminals ask for other offences to be taken into account. Doesn't keep them out of jail.

    No matter how much their families stand by them.

    I hope he rots. I was talking to a Boardsie earlier whose brother-in-law is in the planning department of SDCC. He is both embarassed and also scared to admit where he works in public- because of people like this thief.


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    #57
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    FTA69 wrote: »
    Arbour Hill? Boo hoo. He should be thanking his lucky stars that he wasn't shoved into a damp, two-man cell in Mountjoy with three smackheads and a pot to sh*t in. That's what would have happened if he was an ordinary criminal anyway.

    Eh, he was transferred to Arbour Hill from Mountjoy. I'm sure you can explain what an ordinary criminal is.

    You can be sure many if not most of those in the Irish prison system would have had a much harder and traumatic life than bloody Frank Dunlop.

    Sorry, I can't be sure. I wrote what I did quoting what I saw in a newspaper (as per my original statement). I don't think you can be sure of their lives or his either.


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    #58
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    dresden8 wrote: »
    He admitted his wrongdoing after the tribunal put a gun to his head and told him he was caught. Lots of criminals ask for other offences to be taken into account. Doesn't keep them out of jail.

    No matter how much their families stand by them.

    But Dunlop was an exception you see. Again your facts on this case are either untrue or invented. e.g. "the tribunal put a gun to his head"... He was asked to rethink overnight.


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    #59
    HobokenXVI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11 ✭HobokenXVI


    smccarrick wrote: »
    I think being stopped by the Criminal Assets Bureau in Dublin airport with a suitcase full of cash, about to board a flight to Douglas (Isle of Man), might have sufficed.....



    I hope he rots. I was talking to a Boardsie earlier whose brother-in-law is in the planning department of SDCC. He is both embarassed and also scared to admit where he works in public- because of people like this thief.

    Well the Planners in SDCC have made an arse of South Dublin. Look at the jobs brought by The Liffey Valley Shopping Centre (bribed by Frank Dunlop)? Or what about the traffic jams worsened by the stagnant SDCC?
    Oh embarassed and scared? He should be! Just wait until corruption with SDCC is revealed.


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    #60
    SeanW
    Registered Users Posts: 8,843 ✭✭✭SeanW


    I'd like to think so but I don't think any of the developers who bribed County Councillors have gone to jail (and I doubt any of the developers that guaranteed loans from 5 or 6 different banks against the same asset will go to jail either) so this whole thing smacks of jailing the easy fall guy.

    When we see some FF Dublin councillors sharing a cell in the 'joy with some dodgy developers, I will be satisfied that justice has been done.

    But in this case ... well lets just say I remain to be convinced.


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    #61
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    HobokenXVI wrote: »
    But Dunlop was an exception you see. Again your facts on this case are either untrue or invented. e.g. "the tribunal put a gun to his head"... He was asked to rethink overnight.

    Yes, they told him they had him, and only then did he come clean. As an apologist you're piss poor.


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