Traffic Corps Program on RTE

Gary ITR

TheNog wrote: »

oh right I thought VRT was charged at 20% value of the car when its bought.

There are different bands now and it's calculated on the OMSP of the particular make/model

And our lads in revenue have been sticking to the higher end of the OMSP.
I bought a mk2 Golf as a parts car for my own for less than €1000 and decided it was too good to break. When I checked out the VRT they wanted €1200. Is it any wonder these young lads in Donegal aren't VRTing their cars

Zube

TheNog wrote: »

Lets be honest about this. The car is probably worthless so the VRT.

Can you tell us how valuable a car we can get away with on a yellow reg? I'm unemployed at the moment, so I should be able to upgrade from my sh!itty Kangoo that I bought when I was a fully employed, law abiding, taxpaying citizen.

TheNog

eringobragh wrote: »

TBH Personally I don't give a **** about the VRT but thats besides the point. He shouldn't have been let drive home his car should have been left in a gap and he should have been bunged in the back of the car and taken home and told to collect the car tomorrow.

Its hard to stomach the RSAs stance on "Speedings evil" when an inexperienced 17 year old is let drive off in a 'lethal weapon' on a learner permit.

As I said before, Does someone have to be killed before common sense prevails?

very true but there is nothing in law allowing us to do that. Also there are insurance issues carrying a passenger in a patrol car who is not a prisoner.

Can ye all see now what its like out there?????

Zube

TheNog wrote: »

Can ye all see now what its like out there?????

I think a show that said "we had to let this pimply git go because the law is an ass" would be worth making.

But, of course, the Garda Síochána and RTÉ would get it in the neck for telling the truth.

Speeding on dual carriageways! That's the real problem!

TheNog

Zube wrote: »

Speeding on dual carriageways! That's the real problem!

That fella on the dual carriageway does blow the "shooting fish in a barrel" statement out of the water though doesnt it?

eringobragh

TheNog wrote: »

very true but there is nothing in law allowing us to do that. Also there are insurance issues carrying a passenger in a patrol car who is not a prisoner.

Can ye all see now what its like out there?????

I'm not having a go at you guys! I know how it is. All I'm saying you SHOULD be given the power to do that.

Its pretty daft you can take "Mary Murphys" car off her when her tax is out over a month, and a 17 year old Learner permit, car in ****e on NI plates is let on his way...Call a spade a spade , but wheres the logic in that. Only in Ireland eh...:p

I'd imagine this blip in the law must / should have been highlighted to the relevant authorities by your peers?

Gary ITR

TheNog wrote: »

That fella on the dual carriageway does blow the "shooting fish in a barrel" statement out of the water though doesnt it?

I had a Station Sergent tell me that that's his biggest pet peeve. The Guards sitting on the 3 lane N7.

I was caught there, 112 in 100 zone at 11pm. I was courteous and apologetic to the Guard, still got 2 points and my wallet 80 quid lighter.

Zube

TheNog wrote: »

That fella on the dual carriageway does blow the "shooting fish in a barrel" statement out of the water though doesnt it?

No, that's kind of what we're talking about. We get done (I must point out that I have no points, and never got a ticket, although Herself did once) we get done with a simple static check, and we get fines and points and go on the statistics. Mad c%nts like yerman in that video drive at 120 mph up the wrong side of the road, and they get free legal aid to defend themselves, and then they drive while disqualified anyhow, and get assistance again when they are caught.

I'm turning into my Dad.

TheNog

eringobragh wrote: »

I'm not having a go at you guys! I know how it is. All I'm saying you SHOULD be given the power to do that.

Its pretty daft you can take "Mary Murphys" car off her when her tax is out over a month, and a 17 year old Learner permit, car in ****e on NI plates is let on his way...Call a spade a spade , but wheres the logic in that. Only in Ireland eh...:p

I'd imagine this blip in the law must / should have been highlighted to the relevant authorities by your peers?

Hey you are preaching to the converted here!!!

Onkle wrote: »

The Guards sitting on the 3 lane N7.

I was caught there, 112 in 100 zone at 11pm. I was courteous and apologetic to the Guard, still got 2 points and my wallet 80 quid lighter.

Zube wrote: »

No, that's kind of what we're talking about. We get done (I must point out that I have no points, and never got a ticket, although Herself did once) we get done with a simple static check, and we get fines and points and go on the statistics. Mad c%nts like yerman in that video drive at 120 mph up the wrong side of the road, and they get free legal aid to defend themselves, and then they drive while disqualified anyhow, and get assistance again when they are caught.

I'm turning into my Dad.

Aye there will always be serial offenders but there are ways and means to deal with them. I cant talk for every division but in mine we all know who they are. We know who they are by passing that information on to all stations where a particular serial offender would be travelling say to work/school/visiting family etc as well word of mouth from unit to unit within a station. To put it mildly we hammer them and hammer them hard till the couts have no choice but to imprison them. Some offenders will move out of the area to get anonymity back but again the information is passed onto ther new local station to keep an eye on them. After that there is nt much more we can do.

veetwin

eringobragh wrote: »

x 2, and as for the learner permit part why do any of us even bother with the driving test if we can drive around more or less without hindrance. Will someone have to be killed before common sense prevails??

As for the above I'm referring to legislation its pretty daft that a garda can't stop a lad of 17(or any age for that ,matter) in his tracks in a car thats in bad repair and on a learner permit (which he didn't have with him).

While the rest of us risk points bringing our car back to the NCT centre for a retest.

Guys the JLO system has been there for years and applies to all under 18s for most minor offences. Its hardly the traffic cops fault that is the case. There is no public appetite there to radically change the system and criminalise 17 year olds for petty road traffic (or any) offences. Under the system under 18s are allowed a few minor indiscretions.

NewApproach

veetwin wrote: »

Guys the JLO system has been there for years and applies to all under 18s for most minor offences. Its hardly the traffic cops fault that is the case. There is no public appetite there to radically change the system and criminalise 17 year olds for petty road traffic (or any) offences. Under the system under 18s are allowed a few minor indiscretions.

A 17 yer old will do the same damage in a crash as an 18 or 80 year old, therefore they should be subject to the same consequences when out of line. End of story.

CharlieCroker

That may be a lot of peoples opinion but a Garda can only work within the law and the powers he has.
The Garda in that clip was prob just as frustrated as anyone to see him drive away.

eringobragh

veetwin wrote: »

Guys the JLO system has been there for years and applies to all under 18s for most minor offences. Its hardly the traffic cops fault that is the case. There is no public appetite there to radically change the system and criminalise 17 year olds for petty road traffic (or any) offences. Under the system under 18s are allowed a few minor indiscretions.

I've no issue with the lad and the JLO thats fair enough.... it's him being let drive home on his own thats what takes the biscuit. The law is an ass.

You think with all these new fantastic laws regarding NCTs and penaltyb points they'd surely throw something in to combat the obvious.

Someone let everyone in the 'Learning to Drive' forum know that they can drive alone and the €1000 fine seems to be a lottery at this stage. When you look back at all the scare tactics that were thrown out there when they closed the 2nd provisional driving alone law well it beggars belief

salonfire

CharlieCroker wrote: »

That may be a lot of peoples opinion but a Garda can only work within the law and the powers he has.
The Garda in that clip was prob just as frustrated as anyone to see him drive away.

I don't think that is a fair statement to make...if he wanted to, the car could be seized under the Finance Act (genuine question - because he is only 17, I assume his car can be lifted under the Finance Act - his age is irrelevant right???)

I appreciate TheNog's point on how much resources can be used to deal with the case and how it costs the taxpayer, etc - but its peoples lives we are talking about here - money or inconvenience should not be a factor - people want the roads to be as safe as possible and entrust AGS to help achieve that.

I don't think its up to an individual garda to try save taxpayers some money on a case by case basis by not seizing the car.

AGS are the only people that can get these dangerous lads off the road and had a perfect opportunity to do so that night.


While he may have been prosecuted after going through the JLO, the fact remains he was still allowed drive a dangerous car that night by the garda.

With his record and demographic profile, an attempt should have been made to at least get him off the road that night


Gardai were quite happy to try seize a car from a young mum and two kids:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/foyle_and_west/8052021.stm

A Strabane mother has complained to the Garda Ombudsman that a member of the Irish police called her a "tramp" after a three-hour stand-off in Donegal.

Triona McConnellogue said she locked herself in the car after a garda tried to impound the vehicle because it wasn't registered in the Republic.

She said she told the garda the car was legally registered to a NI business and refused to hand it over.

The Gardaí said they cannot comment on cases that referred to the Ombudsman.

Mrs McConnellogue is originally from Strabane but now lives in Letterkenny.

Many people in border counties buy cars in Northern Ireland as they are often cheaper than in the Republic.

Customs officials suspect some motorists have failed to pay a re-registration tax and are therefore driving illegally on Northern Ireland plates.

Garda and custom officers have been cracking down on tax avoidance and a number of vehicles have been seized in recent weeks.

"It was the way he looked at me, and he just said, 'you tramp', said Mrs McConnellogue.

"My children were there crying in the back of the car.

"My wee boy knows that the guard called me a tramp but he doesn't know what it means.

"There's no way on this earth I should have been treated like that.

"I wasn't a criminal, and there's no way that anybody, even a member of the police, should treat you like that," she said.

The same law should be applied to every road user, including the lad in the clapped out banger

Zube

veetwin wrote: »

Its hardly the traffic cops fault

Absofrickinlutely. I wish we had a lot more guards on dedicated traffic corps duty.

There is no public appetite there to radically change the system and criminalise 17 year olds for petty road traffic (or any) offences

Actually, I think the general public would like to see petty criminals hurt badly on RTE after the 9 o'clock news. At a minimum, seizing the spotty waster's car and crushing it before his eyes would make some good TV. Why did no-one suggest that on the doorstep?

They are so out of touch.

eringobragh

Zube wrote: »

Actually, I think the general public would like to see petty criminals hurt badly on RTE after the 9 o'clock news. At a minimum, seizing the spotty waster's car and crushing it before his eyes would make some good TV. Why did no-one suggest that on the doorstep?

They are so out of touch.

x2..

The whole arguemnet of "costing the Tax payer money" excsue that being thrown around doesn't really wash..Anyhow the state will squander the money on some other half baked project :rolleyes:

If the garda wanted to he could have siezed that car.

Guy:Incognito

CharlieCroker wrote: »

The Garda in that clip was prob just as frustrated as anyone to see him drive away.

Hardly, seeing as he could have taken the car off him because he was illegally driving a foreign registered vehicle. He chose tolet him go, and going by theNogs attitude that its financially better for the state to let him drive off illegally because the cost to impound is more than the amount of VRT recouped, it seems its common practice. So if you dont fancy taxing or havign an NCT while getting a cheaper car, it looks like all you have to do is drive a really cheap car and the gards wont be bothered with the law

Jumbo156

With regard tot he lad in Donegal being allowed to drive home after been stopped, is this not the same as going to do your test, failing miserable, and still being able to drive away from the test centre , no questions asked.
The law is an ass when it comes to provisional drivers.

Guy:Incognito

Jumbo156 wrote: »

With regard tot he lad in Donegal being allowed to drive home after been stopped, is this not the same as going to do your test, failing miserable, and still being able to drive away from the test centre , no questions asked.
The law is an ass when it comes to provisional drivers.

Is it the same as that if all thats wrong is you fail your test. That guy had plenty of things worng and never would have gotten near taking the test with any one of them. (no licence on him, no L plates, missing wing mirror, missing coolant cap, foreign reg'd car)

Jumbo156

Stekelly wrote: »

Is it the same as that if all thats wrong is you fail your test. That guy had plenty of things worng and never would have gotten near taking the test with any one of them. (no licence on him, no L plates, missing wing mirror, missing coolant cap, foreign reg'd car)

So, once a person has all of the above, he/she should be allowed on the road ?..Even if he/she doesn't know a thing about how to actually drive a car...
TO say "all thats wrong is you fail your test" is baffling beyond belief...

I do believe that he shouldn't have been allowed to drive home, but I also believe that anyone who fails their test should not be allowed to drive home either!

TheNog

salonfire wrote: »

I don't think that is a fair statement to make...if he wanted to, the car could be seized under the Finance Act (genuine question - because he is only 17, I assume his car can be lifted under the Finance Act - his age is irrelevant right???)

Yes his age is irrelevant.

I appreciate TheNog's point on how much resources can be used to deal with the case and how it costs the taxpayer, etc - but its peoples lives we are talking about here - money or inconvenience should not be a factor - people want the roads to be as safe as possible and entrust AGS to help achieve that.

Thats incorrect. You are confusing the issue of seizing the car for non payment of VRT which I pretty much outlined step by step and the costs involved with driving a defective car.

Just because the VRT is not paid does not automatically make the driver a very real threat to other peoples lives

With his record and demographic profile, an attempt should have been made to at least get him off the road that night

Thats an unfair statement to make right there. His so called record was just 138kph in a 100kph. Thats not a major speed to be going at but Im thinking that posters are thinking the car was bellowing steam that time too but tbh no one knows if it was or not.
As for demographic profile, pure waffle. If that was applied to everyone in this country then I could say all Dublin people are into stealing cars, all people from Limerick carry weapons etc etc

Stekelly wrote: »

Hardly, seeing as he could have taken the car off him because he was illegally driving a foreign registered vehicle. He chose tolet him go, and going by theNogs attitude that its financially better for the state to let him drive off illegally because the cost to impound is more than the amount of VRT recouped, it seems its common practice. So if you dont fancy taxing or havign an NCT while getting a cheaper car, it looks like all you have to do is drive a really cheap car and the gards wont be bothered with the law

I never said it was common practice nor should be taken as such. I just pointed out the difficulties in recouping VRT. All I gave on this stop is my opinion on the facts that I saw on the programme. It is obvious to me that particular stop was edited to whatever 1-2 minutes for TV. In reality it would have taken at least double that so some vital information would have been missed.

Also lets take into consideration the guard may not have any type of mechanical experience like me and so may not have known the possible outcomes of an engine seizing.

Again these are my own opinions on what I say so dont be taking the view that this standard practice across the board and to say I have an "attitude" I actually find a bit offensive. Two years ago I came onto the Motors forum not because I have an interest in Motors (well I do in some aspects) but I do come in here to inform posters about the workings of AGS in relation to traffic policing.

-Chris-

TheNog wrote: »

Two years ago I came onto the Motors forum not because I have an interest in Motors (well I do in some aspects) but I do come in here to inform posters about the workings of AGS in relation to traffic policing.

It's definitely appreciated TheNog.

B00MSTICK

Just saw it there for the 1st time.

Pretty disgusted that the Santa Fe (It was a Santa Fe right?) driver got 2 penalty points for that when I got the same for being slightly over the limit on a clear DC. I surely would have thought not indicating/changing lanes on a roundabout/sitting in the overtaking lane (don't know the road at all but I can remember the Garda pulling alongside him while he was in the furthest right lane, could easily be wrong on this though) would amount to careless driving?

With the Donegal lad, I think the Gardai should've been alot sterner with him. i.e scare the bejasus out of him instead of just calmly talking to him and explaining what a JLO is. Even hollow threats such as "your name/car/condition etc is on the system now, if we catch you again with your car in this condition it will be crushed etc. etc." would make him think twice about hooning around in it anyway.

I take the "keep her lit" comment as accelerate quite quickly when driving onto the overtaking lane as I don't want to be standing in the middle of it for too long

Thought it was watchable anyway

Hooch

B00MSTICK wrote: »

With the Donegal lad, I think the Gardai should've been alot sterner with him. i.e scare the bejasus out of him instead of just calmly talking to him and explaining what a JLO is. Even hollow threats such as "your name/car/condition etc is on the system now, if we catch you again with your car in this condition it will be crushed etc. etc." would make him think twice about hooning around in it anyway.

Gardaí must operate within the legislation thatwe have. We cannot ''scare the bejasus'' out of someone. The member explained what was about to happen in a polite manner. If he had started roaring at the kid then this forum would be in uproar. Every Garda will give advice or a caution to a motorist once in a while but not procecution also. Its one or the other. The member decided what action to take (his choice not anyone elses) and stuck by it as a JLO caution.
AGS is not in the business of issuing hollow threats or any threats for that matter.

bladebrew

im sure the guard was saying cars could be driving by at motorway speed! thats not a motorway and its approaching a roundabout,if its the road im thinking of,
on again at 8:30 tonight dont forget!!!!!!

McSpud

bladebrew wrote: »

im sure the guard was saying cars could be driving by at motorway speed! thats not a motorway and its approaching a roundabout,if its the road im thinking of,
on again at 8:30 tonight dont forget!!!!!!

Correct. That is probably 80kph or 100kph zone. Definitely not a motorway.

Got around to watching on RTE Player. The lesson seems to be better off getting caught speeding from a garda car than a fixed camera as they will be more lenient. The SUV guy only getting 2 points if anything would make me more likely to speed. That said fact the guards driving at 162kpn to catch him means nothing unless you know what speed they were doing when he passed them.

Guy in Donegal should not be on the road. He already had his warning when caught speeding. Surely another chance is not warranted.

vard

can someone upload it online / or has it already been uploaded? I'm living abroad at the moment, so won't be able to catch it.

Terrontress

The cops did not get a true speed rating on the Hyundai. They went to catch up with them but by the time they caught up, he had left the motorway and headed toward Swords. They didn't tell him what speed he had done. Only what speed they had to do to catch up. They need positive evidence to do someone for speeding. It won't do to stand up in front of a judge and estimate he must have been doing 150km/h.

As for the little waster in Donegal, I'd prefer to see Traffic Officers on the road and targeting dangerous driving instead of spending the evening filling in paperwork and calling tow-trucks over VRT. The lad has entered the system now and his day will come.

Atomic Pineapple

Terrontress wrote: »

As for the little waster in Donegal, I'd prefer to see Traffic Officers on the road and targeting dangerous driving instead of spending the evening filling in paperwork and calling tow-trucks over VRT. The lad has entered the system now and his day will come.

I think the more worrying fact is they let him drive off in a car that they said was not fit to be on the road

APM

Found on youtube

Found it on youtube