Anybody else doing Eireman?

kruger73

As one of the (40? 43? 50? 60?) people who ran the incorrect shorter course, there seem to me to be two options.

(1) Disqualify us. How do you establish who the first person was to defy the marshall and take the correct route home? Did the organisers record the number of this person once they realised what was happening? (Of course at this point why did they not send everyone home the same course in the interests of consistency) Did that person or anyone else do the extra loop up to the cone before entering the forest? It all has to be taken on trust in the absence of timing mats to record who did what loops.
(2) Adjust our times upwards by a certain factor to account for the extra distance + fatigue. Arbitrary in the extreme I realise, but of course this is the option I would prefer as one of the early finishers.

Either way, a mess. Wonder how long before we know?

Rubycube

I posted this question earlier ? anyone any thoughts ?

What is the TI rule on not completing the full course ?

i.e if top 100 did 16km instead of the 21km required does the TI rules say it HAS to be 100 DQ's

and hence, by default the 101 place person (assuming the ran the 21km) is the winnner....

My question is about the rules really.... I am unsure myself ?

This question also applies to the OL distance.

Thanks

jollybean

Eoin could award 1st,2nd 3rd etc to those who did the HIM with a 16k run (ie those who did not turn left and back to the forest) (which will be obvious from run splits)

AND 1st 2nd 3rd etc to those who did the full HIM run distance.

We have two Middle distance races with two different run distances. You can't penalise people who were sent the wrong way and similarly you can't penalise people who were sent the right way on the run (because they actually did the full distance!)

Seems fair to me - split the prise money between the two events.

(BTW i did the full distance, but i don't want to see anyone who didn't DQed, even tho it would obviously see me promoted to a higher position)

hunnymonster

Rubycube wrote: »

I posted this question earlier ? anyone any thoughts ?

What is the TI rule on not completing the full course ?


Thanks

I guess 3.8.c would apply in this case
"The competitor is also responsible for pre race preparation, which includes attendance at the briefing, knowing and adhering to TI competition rules, knowing and following the prescribed course. "

The ambiguity could come in other parts of the manual of guidance where there is a repsonnsibility on the organiser to mark the course. I wasn't there so can't give an opinion on how well the course was marked.

I had some friends DQ'ed from IMCH this year because a marshall send them the wrong way. In that race, like most others, the responsibility is on the competitor to know the route.

Izoard

garydee wrote: »

Anyway rant over - sorry again for the length don't scream at me....
But its an official Ironman event for me I think next year - Switzerland here I come... And will give Ireman a go sometime as well I think

Hey Garydee,

Good summary...pretty much reflected my experience as well.
Coincidentally, I'm hovering over the commit button for IM CH as well.

copacetic

but can't you be DQ'd for not following a marshalls directions also? You are in a prickly spot if you think its one way and the marshall insists it defintiely isn't.

Rubycube

Honeymonster & Tunney..... you know your stuff.

I also really like the two options of 1,2,3 fro each of teh HIM races.

I still will be out the back so just interested in how the rules are applied and who makes the decision (i.e TI or the Race Director ???)

tunney

Rubycube wrote: »

I also really like the two options of 1,2,3 fro each of teh HIM races.

I still will be out the back so just interested in how the rules are applied and who makes the decision (i.e TI or the Race Director ???)

Application of rules in a TI sanctioned event is the race referee. If the penalties board did not show the DQs after the race then they cannot be DQ'ed at this stage.

The suggesion of "1,2,3 to each of the HIM races" would be a gesture of good will on behalf of the race organiser. By the book there can be only one winner.

garydee

Izoard wrote: »

Hey Garydee,

Good summary...pretty much reflected my experience as well.
Coincidentally, I'm hovering over the commit button for IM CH as well.

Do it do it do it!! not many places left with over 2000 already in - I'm booked in and paid up, accom sorted and flights are getting booked this weekend - expensive... ouch. But I plan it as a once off - do it and be happy to have done it. Thats what a couple of the guys I spoke to had planned at Eireman at the weekend - now with no swim they can't say they 'officially' did the distance - shame.

---

As for what to do for the athletes sent the wrong way I can't see how the are gonna even see where the competitors started going the right way (i.e. split up the wrong way runners and the right way runners) unless theres a big obvious difference in the times as no timing mats were at the cones to keep everything exactly right.

Eoin - good luck fella - you're getting it tough from all ends

jollybean

The suggesion of "1,2,3 to each of the HIM races" would be a gesture of good will on behalf of the race organiser. By the book there can be only one winner.[/quote]

....that's the spirit it is suggested in - goodwill. Not by the book exactly and not a perfect resolution (there isn't one) but a compromise which might leave all concerned slightly appeased?

hunnymonster

OT, but I thought IMCH was really badly organised. I've done quite a few IM (branded and challenge events) races and it's the first one I could say that about.

Rubycube

tunney wrote: »

Application of rules in a TI sanctioned event is the race referee. If the penalties board did not show the DQs after the race then they cannot be DQ'ed at this stage.

Penaltities Board.... Race Referee......

NOWHERE to be seen / heard (along with the Race Organiser) at the end.

PS: If you are the race ref, I'm not aware of where you were and that you had a penaltities board meeting ......

and based on chipchamp... the Race Director has the results and will sort this out. I only hope he has a penaltities board meeting and involves TI and some of the race winners...

If he make his own decision..... is that allowed ?

Tunney - You are a Legend

mloc123

tunney wrote: »

If the penalties board did not show the DQs after the race then they cannot be DQ'ed at this stage.

Providing there was a penalties board that is... was no mention of its location in the sprint briefing.

tunney

Rubycube wrote: »

Penaltities Board.... Race Referee......

NOWHERE to be seen / heard (along with the Race Organiser) at the end.

PS: If you are the race ref, I'm not aware of where you were and that you had a penaltities board meeting ......

No I'm not the race ref
I can only imagine that once the race was over the race referee didn't make himself too obvious as race refs often get endless amounts of abuse for the failings of race directors.

There is no penalties board meeting. The penalty board is stuck up in the race HQ, and people can appeal non judgement calls.

Rubycube wrote: »

and based on chipchamp... the Race Director has the results and will sort this out. I only hope he has a penaltities board meeting and involves TI and some of the race winners...

If he make his own decision..... is that allowed ?

To DQ? No the race director cannot.

garydee

hunnymonster wrote: »

OT, but I thought IMCH was really badly organised. I've done quite a few IM (branded and challenge events) races and it's the first one I could say that about.

ah f$%k don't say that..... but enough about IMCH - this thread is about Eireman and I don't want to take it in a different direction....

Hard Worker

tunney wrote: »

What happens when TI pull sanctioning of an event?

My post was purely a suggestion. However, if every Tri club or athletic club who staged an event had a qualified race director, there would be no need to pull sanctioning of an event. My point is that if you wish to stage an event, you should have some qualification to do so.

Rubycube

Is anyone else reading this and thinking

OMG.....WOW.... (and some cursing)

How could one race cause this much hassle ?

Anyone remember the hassle that a certain duathlon race caused earlier in the year. It now seems like chicken feed compare to this....

Dowee

I'm 99% sure I was the last person to be sent the wrong way. Two friends were running close behind me (not close enough to see me going the wrong way) and they were very likely the first ones to go the right route. There was a 20 minute difference in our finish times. I was at the line for those 20 minutes and am fairly sure no half ironman competitors crossed the line in that 20 minutes so it should be fairly obvious where the split is between the long route runners and the short route ones.

Eoin has been informed of this by email.

I knew we were supposed to turn at some point (to go back towards the woods) but to be honest there had been so many changes to the race that when I was assured by the marshall that I was to run straight I took his word for it, I figured another change had been made.

Of course there is the additional problem of people that didn't do the last loop around the cone, good luck sorting that one out!!

milligank

Of course there is the additional problem of people that didn't do the last loop around the cone, good luck sorting that one out!![/quote]

Dowee.... I know who you are.....

I would have caught you. When I saw you, you were walking, hopping and praying that I'd catch you and "carry" you home.

You are lucky that you cuct the course short as I'd say another 5km and you would have been goosed.......

And as for the cone comment.... I ran around the fecking thing four times just to make sure I beat you fair and square...

I was dissapointed that you didn't buy me a pint to congratulate me....

Sure as I was telling you for many weeks before the HIM.... I'LL SEE YOU ON THE RUN. I wasn't counting on you cutting 5km off the run.

EMMMMM , I get you next year.

the2nd007babe

I just want to see my splits... I don't really care who wins. It was a big achievement for me to finish it and I don't have a medal to show for it or a t-shirt that says I finished a HIM (sprint people got the same t-shirt) but I would settle for knowing my times and moving on with my life!!:D

asimonov

Does anyone know how the OP (irontractorboy) did? I passed someone (in runnersworld pirate gear) still out on the road at around 8.45pm that evening as we were driving home. I think he's a pacer for the DCM so its important he survived!

Izoard

hunnymonster wrote: »

OT, but I thought IMCH was really badly organised. I've done quite a few IM (branded and challenge events) races and it's the first one I could say that about.

Yep..you've flagged that before, but I'm kind of stuck on August, so it looks like CH or UK (which seems to get ever poorer reviews...)

Noel123

Done the HIM and agree with both good and bad points raised on this event. There are many bad points but there were also some good points on the event.
I think the top bad point for all half and full distance was the finish line. Having put in so much training myself and crossing the finishing line been such an anti climax ( I cant imagine how the full people felt)
I read Eoin used this foum to promote the event, so I would ask where are you? We are all waiting on results and even an acknowledgement that the event organisers are working on this would be something.
Take the constructive critisism and use it to make this a better event next year - i.e. stand up, say we got things wrong and will work to improve these issues highlighted on this forum.

Towel

Hi all,

As someone who completed the whole course i have to say that there were many great things about the race and as we know, some issues. I sympathise with the people who had a bad deal and did not get the race they wanted but sometimes these things happen. The way to deal with it is to email the RO directly with some concerns and perhaps some suggestions. Slagging off on a public forum will lose certainly get word around that no one should support triathlon in ireland, which is such a great place for triathlon.

Get behind the race, suggest the improvements for next year, and offer your club support. Lets look at the potential for a great race rather than spend your time being negative.

Yes, i had issues too, but being experienced around the world you see some of the same things at some of the supposed best races in the world.

This race could be a great one, but you should not kill it just yet.

Towel

Izoard wrote: »

Yep..you've flagged that before, but I'm kind of stuck on August, so it looks like CH or UK (which seems to get ever poorer reviews...)

The Outlaw in Nottingham may be an alternative too.

dinnycollins

1rst post here.. done the full distance an enjoyed it despite the weather and other problems..
Just reading some comments on the famous cone after the forest and just to give yous a laugh when I was comming back from Gorey on my 2nd lap at around 6pm the 'cone' was gone! and as I ran towards the marshall looking confused he pointed at a 'leaf' on the ground where the cone had been so round the leaf I ran ha I just thought how Irish is this.

It was a hard day for everybody but a big thank you to all the volunteers and supporters who stood out in the dreadfull weather..

Been away for a few years so not sure what else is on offer but it would be great to have a well organised long distance event for next year the demand will be there with all the HIM entrants this year..

lazyboypops

I know its off topic but I have started an Eireman lost and found thread here
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055662254&referrerid=205586

Iron Enthusiast

Looks like povisional 'timing chip' results are now available on the Eireman home page!

911sc

Thanks...and a half marathon new world record was set at 58:08:)

hunnymonster

asimonov wrote: »

Does anyone know how the OP (irontractorboy) did? I passed someone (in runnersworld pirate gear) still out on the road at around 8.45pm that evening as we were driving home. I think he's a pacer for the DCM so its important he survived!

He did survive. I've "seen" him on facebook but last I heard was still driving home.