Gold

TechnoPool

Dont want any gold sites linked or info if you have bought some


just wondering whats the general price people are paying for say 1k-5k gold?

Claypigeon

Not sure anymore tbh, can't even remember what I spent before I've only ever bought like 5k once there at WOTLK opening.

It isn't worth the real life cash - one hour aoe grinding on my tankadin per day makes like up on 1k if you do all the right things with drops

Falcon.ie

1k+100g was going for 9.87 on Azjol-Nerub there awhile ago when someone was spam advertising in Trade awhile ago

So basically 11.50 euro a grand, hardly worth selling if you've got say 16k..

TechnoPool

welll i got someone to move 3 chars for me for 12.5k so ha


think i did well :pac:

elexes

20k for about 158 euros or so.

what i find weird is that the sites selling gold always seem to have the same phone number but different prices.

Nehaxak

Take up alchemy/herbalism on your character, or take up some other profession at least that can make you good amounts of gold - you should never have any need to buy gold from those muppet spammers/hackers/retards

AaronFitz

Why would you want to know anyway? Buying gold is just plain and simple bad for the in game economey this is not a statment by me, its a well knowen fact. Either way you can just earn it through dailies, professions etc

I'm no moderator, but if a forum is willing to open a section dedicated to as such the Irish users of the game, it should be moderated as such and agree with what the makers of the game stand for and as far as I know Blizzard is totally against buying/ selling gold and ban's are handed out for doing so. Now I'm expecting a "If you have a problem with how the forum is moderated post here" sort of response but I think alot of people will agree with obeying the TOC put in place by Blizzard.

Claypigeon

AaronFitz wrote: »

Why would you want to know anyway? Buying gold is just plain and simple bad for the in game economey this is not a statment by me, its a well knowen fact. Either way you can just earn it through dailies, professions etc

I'm no moderator, but if a forum is willing to open a section dedicated to as such the Irish users of the game, it should be moderated as such and agree with what the makers of the game stand for and as far as I know Blizzard is totally against buying/ selling gold and ban's are handed out for doing so. Now I'm expecting a "If you have a problem with how the forum is moderated post here" sort of response but I think alot of people will agree with obeying the TOC put in place by Blizzard.

Most people only buy gold for one big NPC-based purchase such as Epic Flying which does not affect the economy as its money going into a black hole that affects noone, and the only other reason I've heard of is powerlevelling professions which benefits the economy a little more than damaging it as it keeps the market for lower level materials active.

Dustaz

I saw this thread and was immediatly suprised it hadnt been locked. Then i read Aaronfitz's "wont someone think of the children" post and laughed my frickin head off as right there under the post were 3 google ads for wow gold. (€8 for 1000g apparently).


I always hear the argument that goldsellers increase mudflation and im sure it does indeed have a negative effect on the economy. I think blizzard have done a pretty good job in ensuring that gold is prety readily available to people though, even if you have to do a little bit of work for it.

At the end of the day, you cant stop it. Theres a pretty huge demand for it and untill that goes away the gold sellers are here to stay.

TechnoPool

well my original question dosent warrant a locking of the thread.

Drakar

In EQ2 Sony introduced some servers as station exchange servers (I think thats what they were called), where you could basically buy and sell goods (wood, herbs etc), gold, and characters for real money on an auction type site run *by the game*. Only certain new servers had it enabled (so as a user, if you didnt want the game seller to be promoting real money transactions, you could roll your character on a different server). I like it as a concept, as if you dont like it, just roll on a regular server and operate in the same wow like system, or if you did like it, it seemed to offer many advantages (safe transactions, players are going to be buying gold anyway whatever server/game you play, at least this way its out in the open etc).

I always wondered how that worked out, did players see far less gold selling adverts etc on servers that were exchange enabled? I wonder were there disadvantages (people can openly sell their character, gold etc, so when you see a guy walking around with cool stuff, maybe you have less respect for them as you dont know if they did it legitimately - but maybe one shouldnt care). Cant see much on the outcome on wikipedia...

AaronFitz

My post is by no means a wont someone think of the children post my friend, it's more so about that if this very post was placed on the Blizzard forum it would be deleted in about 10 mins accompanied by prob a forum ban, if this forum section is opened up to as i said before represent a place where the Irish users of the game can meet up then it should be moderated as such and support what the game stands for. Buying gold = bad in Blizzard's eyes, so it should be here too imo.

As for the argument its for once off purchases, I agree alot of the time it is, but do you know who your funding? The people you are funding/ buying gold off are most of the time the very people who hack your friends accounts or even your own account, do you think it's so great to buy gold now? Go to www.wow.com (was previously wowinsider.com) and just take a look about 4-5 pages back for the scammer post who claimed to sell spectral tigers, this scammer who took accounts also sells gold etc. Now do you see my point?

Kiith

AaronFitz wrote: »

Buying gold = bad in Blizzard's eyes, so it should be here too imo.

It is bad here. You will get banned for selling gold, linking gold sites, or (intentionally) doing anything that violates the EULA.

So dont.

dlofnep

For the casual player, grinding 7K to get epic winter flying from scratch just isn't feasible - so naturally there is a market there for gold. Same for people who have just hit 80 - they could buy the mats for 4 epics for about 2k gold, which allows them to have decent enough gear to start running heroics to build up the rest of their gear for raids.

Some people don't want to spend hours grinding gold. But at the same respect, some people don't want to pay real money for gold. I've played WoW since Beta - and I still don't have an epic flying mount for any of my characters. I just was never bothered.

][cEMAN**

dlofnep wrote: »

For the casual player, grinding 7K to get epic winter flying from scratch just isn't feasible

Heard the same argument about Epic flying, but it's not true. If you do quests to get you to 70, you have enough for flying, and nearly at epic. If you reach 77, you should have the rest through the quest rewards.

....but if you spend all day in the AH looking at the latest greens that LOOK better on your toon, than the ones you bought 1 level before, you'll have no gold by the time you hit 80, and will be QQing at people who seem to have everything.

Ivan

Renamed thread to something easier on the eyes.

And heya Iceman, long time

Drakar

I've never bought any game currency but I wouldnt have a problem with players who do *in games that allow it* (like EvE indirectly).

Basically from a players perspective they can either buy 1000 gold for €8, or farm for say 5hrs (class dependant of course) to get the same amount. That's an equivalent pay rate of €1.60 an hour, and depending on how foolish they are (possibly pretty foolish if they're buying), it may be a rather boring grind.

So I can see why people do it, though again I dont agree with it when its against the rules of the game. Its fine if its an option thats available to everyone (not just people who dont mind breaking the rules). Obviously in games that dont allow real money transactions, this ignores the rather murky area of where the gold came from.

BadCharlie

I do not agree with buying gold in wow because.... lots of people have their accounts hacked everything they own, stolen sold or moved to another toon. Also the GB can be sacked also. Then to top it off they normally delete all your toons.

Dustaz

You're confusing buying gold with powerlevelling badcharlie.

When you buy gold, you dont give people details of your account. You just say "hi mr china, gief 1kg" and they give it to you in game.

When you get a toon powerlevelled however, you obviously have to give them the account details for the toon and they level it up. If your that much of an idiot to not transfer the toon to another account or at least change the password afterwords, then you porobably deserve to be hacked.

AaronFitz

I still stand by the fact that if you buy gold your funding fraudster's its like buying a gate for example from a traveller, they will simply use the money (Alot of the time) to buy a stanly blade and go kill some poor sod who looked at them wrong. Is this related to the topic? No. Is it fair on the traveller community? No. (but Tommy Tiernan can do it) {not that I'm a fan}

So what does my above point prove, buying gold is bad, it hurts the community of WoW by funding people / companies that hack people's accounts, if your comfortable with buying gold after you know this, buy away, the day you get hacked will be quite an ironic moment though dont you think? I'm done with trying to make my point in this post, you either get it or you dont.

End point, Buying from a crook will up crime, this is common knowledge. Trying to argue a gold seller aint a crook is also bull shiz, they steal accounts (as I stated earlier look it up on www.wow.com about 8-10 pages back at this stage) they even interviewd a gold seller who got their gold from hacking accounts....

Drakar

<devilsadvocate>
This is highly hypethetical... I know as a purchaser, you have no control over it, but what about gold that's farmed? There's no way to know how "your" gold was purchased, so this is just a question as a matter of interest (you have to assume some of it was hacked, I dont think there's any way to guesstimate how much).
</devilsadvocate>

I never got the whole gold *farming* (as opposed to hacking), is "ruining" the economy. My opinion has always been that gold farming is great for the economy. Prices of static goods (eg charges for repairing, reagents, desirable items like the 8k teleportation ring, or mechnohog) stay pretty much the same regardless of how much money people have so (as I mention below the affect of gold circulating in the economy makes everyone "richer") the relative cost of static stuff reduces.

What changes when there is alot of gold farming is basically two things:

1) Farmed mats become cheaper (herbs, metals, cloths, enchanting mats etc) as the supply increases beyond what us lazy westerners are willing to farm. This is bad if your primary profession is gathering. However this also means that these primary inputs into the 2ndary professions are now cheap, so you can sell secondary stuff cheaper than you could have before (as mats were too expensive), which actually makes you more money if the demand increases (see below).

2) The trickle down effect means "people" have more money. As the gold the people bought is circulated around the economy when they buy your flasks/potions, or enchants or glyphs, gems etc, you in turn use it to buy other people's stuff that you otherwise wouldnt have been able to, and they do the same etc.

As a seller of goods in the economy, I'm far better off when people have money than when there's a wow credit squeeze :P I would imagine in the long run it generally balances out. Sure you can't make money as easilly off farming professions (that work has now been offshored!), but its become so much cheaper to kit out your char for raiding/pvp etc as the 2ndary goods are now cheaper. And it's easier to sell your 2ndary stuff as the market is bigger (people are happy to buy good enchants for their alts etc as they have the money).

Gold farming definately changes the economy (much like offshoring in RL), but I can't see how it "ruins" it.

TheDoc

I bought gold back in the day to help fund a mount when really reaching the amount required was becoming stressful for me.

Since then me and my friend have been dealing with this company that sells gold. although its unethical and probably wrong, they are a very professional company, you do not ever have to hand over any details, its a paypal payment and gold gets mailed to you its a very stress free process.

I understand its against rules for blizzard, but sometimes I don't have hours to spend grinding gold, I usually have 3-4 sessions a week and that get sspent levelling, I canot afford to slack of doing professions or buying gold. So I do not see the problem really.

I always laugh, because at a blizzard press conference I was at, when WoW was first being talked about to the media, one of Blizzards company directors said how world of warcraft would be different in that every player both casual and hardcore would get the same benefits in the game, different rates for mounts etc. That obviously never came to fruitition...

And the way I look at it is literally it costs me **** all money to grab some quick gold, and it is **** all to me, an hours real life work saves me a few hours wow work, because grinding is a ****ing chore.

I would, as gay as it stands, ask if your considering buying gold, to have a look into what company you are buying from. Those stories of kids being made swet in shops grinding gold are partially true, so I always make sure to buy from companies that employee individual staff on fair wages. You'll notice that 4 in 10 gold selling companies, are the same just under names. But a little bit of research and atleast you wont be exploition some poor sod.

And on a completely different note, wotlk questing from 70-80 should really give you the money you need for mounts, quest rewards and instance loot is more then sufficent for levelling so dont be wasting gold on items. Then when you hit 80 it should be too much stress to get your remaining gold for epic or cold winter flying.

][cEMAN**

There's more to the economy than just gold buyers/sellers though. The AH is only as good as the people who use it. Outside of the AH, you're either dealing directly (not effecting the larger population directly), or buying/selling to and from vendors.

So the AH is where people get hit hard - or at least the first place. However, you only have to look at the prices for mats on the AH to see that people damage the server economy every day. They undercut people to get a quick sale. This forces other people to undercut for their quick sales, and the trend continues till the prices drop to an unreasonable low. If this happens, it can cause people not to bother gathering mats and thus causing a shortage on the server. This in turn hinders other people leveling up crafting professions, and can cause a shortage of crafters (especially when people get ****ed off and leave the game after getting every recipe in dungeons and raids). Shortages in crafters (or even just mats even if you have the crafter) means that progression in raiding can slow down due to people not being able to gear up as easily, or shortage of readily available pots, enchants, etc etc.

It's a domino effect that isn't just caused by gold selling.

The other way it can go is that people power leveling whilst buying gold will buy items at rediculous prices. This can cause certain items to go up in price on the AH - but this only feeds the gatherers. If they're getting paid, they'll keep putting it up. Usually when gold floods in, it evens itself out after a while. If prices spike, they'll come down again after a few days, but low prices tend to stay low permenantly.

Also, there are BoE items going up on the AH all the time with huge price tags. They're way outside of the price range of a lot of people in the game, and will either get bought up by people who buy gold, farm gold for themselves (and generally spend their days grinding ie. no life), or nobody will buy it, and eventually the price will come down to one that is rediculously low for the level of the item.

I'm not happy Blizzard put in so many BoE items and crafting items that are best in slot - it makes it too easy for bad players to get to places they shouldn't be (as a lot of guilds look at gear before actually testing out players). However, that's the way it is - they want it to be easy for people to hit 80 and get straight to the top of the gear list. So be it...but it's a huge money sink for the gold buyers, so I think it evens out in the end.

Oh, and hey Ivan sorry got caught up in the rant there, forgot to reply.

Dustaz

AaronFitz wrote: »

So what does my above point prove, buying gold is bad, it hurts the community of WoW by funding people / companies that hack people's accounts,

What type of drugs are they on down in cork?

Do you REALLY believe that the gold that is sold to players on servers comes from hacked accounts?

The VAST VAST majority of it is farmed.

Stop reading this. Go to wintergrasp, or HFP or Nagrand. See those hunters? The ones that are everywhere? Yeh, theyre farming and they are doing it on every server that is up and they are generating a T O N of money for the secondary market.

I dont doubt that some companies that sell gold are involved in account hacking, but there is no way that hacking could sustain the amount of gold were talking about.

Drakar

(Re Iceman)
Thats exactly the kind of argument people make.

I dont get it, it's either "zomg the economy is being ruined by stuff being too cheap on the AH", or "zomg people are buying gold and paying crazy prices for everything on the AH". It cant be both! Definately people who buy gold are pushing up prices of BOE items, but thats far from ruining the economy. For one, it means you can craft BOE items or just find drops and make easy moolah.

In the first example you discuss, if sellers are undercutting each other, thats *perfect* for crafters. I regularly nip in and buy just about all the mats I can find for some stuff and churn out the 2ndary goods (so all the frostweave, differing enchant mats, eternal fire/life etc). Lower prices end up with a far healthier market. This is directly good for 2ndary professions and end users. A healthy market is good for gathers too (as their stuff sells, though to be fair at lower prices).

The reason sellers undercut each other, is because supply in their market is greater than demand. If it's *too* easy to make money with a certain profession, you can be sure that there are a load of alts levelling that profession in the works. This tends to rebalance things. For example, if an hour of herbing is far more productive and enjoyable than an hour of blacksmithing, I thinking we're going to see more people gathering herbs, this in turn increases the supply which pushes down prices so it moves to a position where it's more comparable with other profs, then the focus switches to some other profession, etc.

The second part you discuss is that some rich players (not only gold purchasers) when levelling (or levelling alts) will nip in and pay stupid prices for goods. They are doing this because it makes sense (If Im level 20 without a mount why should I waste 20 minutes flying to barrens, hunting around for some ore spots, mining and running not riding between spots, then flying back, when I could just pay 10g and be sorted. 10g is alot of money to a lvl 20, but if you have an 80 alt, its nothing). So, sometimes these players will buy up a load of cheap mats. Guess what, the winners here are the gatherers who didn't do so well above.

The point is, if the market is healthy enough (server is well populated and enough people participate in all aspects of the market), it doesnt really matter if prices are high or low. If they are low it means stuff costs less so you dont need as much money to buy the stuff you need anyway so you can sell for less yourself. If the prices are high, you are earning lots from the stuff you sell so you can afford to pay high prices for stuff you need.

The reality is if your market is healthy, sometimes a set of users will be coming along levelling blacksmithing, but provided your gatherers are regularly listing stuff, the market will respond and once they move through the levels, it should return to an equilibrium point. Similarly for all other good types. I play on a pretty busy server, and every day there will be something that will be hugely in demand. Selling is all about finding out what those in demand goods are, and buying is about trying to nip in in times of good supply.

People participating actively in the market, buying, selling or even just listing, is whats most important. There's nothing more annoying than needing something for a profession and finding that no one is bothering to list it, and similarly when you list stuff, no one is interested in buying. The key is to be flexible, dont expect that you can just keep churning out a particular good for ever and it will always make good money. To succeed in the economy aspect of wow, you have to know your market and switch to supplying whatever the demand gaps are.

Dustaz

' wrote:

[cEMAN**;60641609']
Also, there are BoE items going up on the AH all the time with huge price tags. They're way outside of the price range of a lot of people in the game, and will either get bought up by people who buy gold, farm gold for themselves (and generally spend their days grinding ie. no life), or nobody will buy it, and eventually the price will come down to one that is rediculously low for the level of the item.

I just sold a Nax 25 BoE epic ( Gloves of token respect) for like 450g. Thats hardly huge. Lrn2populated server

][cEMAN**

Drakar I think you missed my point. I was saying that gold buying/selling wasn't ruining the market/economy, because it's a money sink now with the huge price tags on items such as mounts, BoEs, etc.

But i'll give an example to show how undercutting can mess things up. I've been playing a bit on Wildhammer with some guys I know on there, and checking out the AH prices of ore - The prices are barely higher than vendor prices. In some cases people are stupid enough to post it even lower than vendor prices (which i'm not complaining about cause it's free gold for me). Thing is, the supply of these mats are seriously low. And i'm not surprised. If you know you're going to get more from the vendor (because of the 5% sales fee off the AH), you'll just vendor it.

Right now i'm making money from it buying up ore and crafting items to sell to the vendor. That's how rediculous the prices have gone there. You can't tell me that's healthy?

So undercutting is perfect for crafters initially - because they get everything cheap for a time....till the supply runs out. Then it's not about supply and demand because you don't have the supply. It's not often people will think "Y'know what, it's time I mined a lot because there aren't many mats in the AH for our crafters to buy off me at scandalously low prices - but i'll do it for the good of the people". It's also not just about supply and demand....it's about getting a quick payout.

I've put items on the AH enough times higher than the lowest sellers, and still had it sell - because the demand was high. Though when people undercut and undercut just to be the first to sell, rather than having a reasonable price for everyone to be happy with (crafters aren't paying too much, and gatherers are earning enough to make it worthwhile spending hours flying about), things get out of hand.

Basically i'm just saying that gold buying/selling doesn't really make that much of a difference like it used to. There's already a large gap in the money market between the rich and the poor. When the expansion came out people had a few months to make money. If they didn't, then the most realistic way to make garaunteed money these days is through questing. I'm not saying gold buying/selling is a good thing, but i'm not saying it's "OHE NOES T3H END OF T3H SERVER!" if people are doing it.

And Dustaz, did you pick that up on your alt-alt-alt, because the need for Naxx 25 BoE's isn't that high these days. How much do you think you'd be charging for Northern Barrier? 450g?

AaronFitz

Dustaz wrote: »

What type of drugs are they on down in cork?

Do you REALLY believe that the gold that is sold to players on servers comes from hacked accounts?

The VAST VAST majority of it is farmed.

Stop reading this. Go to wintergrasp, or HFP or Nagrand. See those hunters? The ones that are everywhere? Yeh, theyre farming and they are doing it on every server that is up and they are generating a T O N of money for the secondary market.

I dont doubt that some companies that sell gold are involved in account hacking, but there is no way that hacking could sustain the amount of gold were talking about.

TLDR at end

I dont believe all of it is, I know a % of it is though I have given a link to prove this over 3 times now so you could look for yourselves as proof. This is compleatly off topic though, my main point here is the following: This forum is as such the major gathering point of Irish users of the game (arguabley) yes? Thus it is representing the Irish user's of the game and as such representing Blizzards game in Ireland, it should be moderated as such if you ask me, if your so for gold farming, let it stay on some other gold farming site forum, dont post it here promoting gold buying / selling. I would like to assume people of the Irish community would treat this fourm identically to the ww.wow-europe.com fourm as this is as such what it is but for the Irish users, thats what I'd like to think what it is anyway.

Also have some respect for newcomers to the forum, ALOT of people may get forwarded to this site upon looking up in google " WoW irish forums" true? So alot of new commers may come to this site see this page and guess what, never come back again. Why? cause a huge amount of people are put off by "breaking" Blizzards rules and this is one of them. I know we'r only discussing it but alot of people would'nt even consider comming back to a forum after seeing such a discussion as alot of people think its just shunned upon. So as such your un-intentionally hurting the irish community forum from increasing/ expanding and i dont know about you but I want it to expand (hello meeting up with 50-100+ WoW people for a night out somewhere in the contry every now an then), I know this post seems like QQ whine, think of t he children etc but thats how things work mate. I know for a fact some people see a link with gold selling written on it and instantly run malware checks, I know its sad, but a huge amount of people are like this.

Am I making any sense at all or am I wasting my time?

1) Not all gold sellers hack but a % of them do, a large %, look it up on WoW.com as I sugested so many times in previous posts.
2) This forum is the Irish hub of the game treat it as such and make it more approchable for the Irish user's of the game. This is just common courtesy and benifits all of us in the long run, the more people we get on this forum the better for the the irish community of WoW in the long run true? So make it as approchable as possible. (Read long post to find out how it promotes Irish user's to join our forum)

Thanks for reading.

AaronFitz

On a side note Blizz is addressing stupidly large money sinks in the form of mounts (the up grade from apprentice flying to epic is no longer as extream) source = www.mmo-champion.com, you can now learn land mount at 20, epic at 40 flying at 60 and flying at 60 is now 150% instead of 60%.

All prices for training them has dropped across the board.

Falcon.ie

There's roughly 10-15 of us posting on here every few days, I severely doubt you'll get a massive community of Irish players on here, no mind the 50-60 your talking about. This is a NOT a dedicated WoW Irish, just a sub forum. If you wanted that you should have tried harder to keep wow-ireland.com(or w/e it was) up...

If fairness not 1 person has provided a link to a gold selling site, nor will they probably. Gold farming/Selling is something most groups talk about, its stupid not to as its clearly happening all around us. Avoiding the topic is just plain stupid and those that avoid are even more so IMO...

To say its harming the community is also wrong, the majority of the gold that is bought as was previously said is going down a big black hole as its mostly spent on Epic mounts.

AaronFitz

AaronFitz wrote: »

TLDR at end

I dont believe all of it is, I know a % of it is though I have given a link to prove this over 3 times now so you could look for yourselves as proof. This is compleatly off topic though, my main point here is the following: This forum is as such the major gathering point of Irish users of the game (arguabley) yes? Thus it is representing the Irish user's of the game and as such representing Blizzards game in Ireland, it should be moderated as such if you ask me, if your so for gold farming, let it stay on some other gold farming site forum, dont post it here promoting gold buying / selling. I would like to assume people of the Irish community would treat this fourm identically to the ww.wow-europe.com fourm as this is as such what it is but for the Irish users, thats what I'd like to think what it is anyway.

Also have some respect for newcomers to the forum, ALOT of people may get forwarded to this site upon looking up in google " WoW irish forums" true? So alot of new commers may come to this site see this page and guess what, never come back again. Why? cause a huge amount of people are put off by "breaking" Blizzards rules and this is one of them. I know we'r only discussing it but alot of people would'nt even consider comming back to a forum after seeing such a discussion as alot of people think its just shunned upon. So as such your un-intentionally hurting the irish community forum from increasing/ expanding and i dont know about you but I want it to expand (hello meeting up with 50-100+ WoW people for a night out somewhere in the contry every now an then), I know this post seems like QQ whine, think of t he children etc but thats how things work mate. I know for a fact some people see a link with gold selling written on it and instantly run malware checks, I know its sad, but a huge amount of people are like this.

Am I making any sense at all or am I wasting my time?

1) Not all gold sellers hack but a % of them do, a large %, look it up on WoW.com as I sugested so many times in previous posts.
2) This forum is the Irish hub of the game treat it as such and make it more approchable for the Irish user's of the game. This is just common courtesy and benifits all of us in the long run, the more people we get on this forum the better for the the irish community of WoW in the long run true? So make it as approchable as possible. (Read long post to find out how it promotes Irish user's to join our forum)

Thanks for reading.

Spot the narc!