BNP get seat...

DB10

towel401 wrote: »

Ya know the BNP actually have some fairly good ideas. Much like Geert Wilders has. They are not as racist as they let on, and besides its good to have a few racists in the government when everybody else is hell-bent on reverse discrimination. kind of balances things out you know?

I agree. They aren't as bad as the media make out.

Stevek101

DB10 wrote: »

I agree. They aren't as bad as the media make out.

Are you sure about that?

No one with links to a terrorist organisation that refuses to lay down its arms should be allowed to enter government. We would abolish state-supported segregation in education. In the long run, we wish to end the conflict in Ireland by welcoming Eire as well as Ulster as equal partners in a federation of the nations of the British Isles

One word. Disgusting.

towel401

Stevek101 wrote: »

One word. Disgusting.

Dublin is full of West Brits anyway. We copy everything they do, let them buy our supermarkets, our mobile phone networks, set up their big-box stores here. Go around complaining this country is backwards because not everyone can get broadband and because there aren't as many CCTV cameras here yet. or whatever other reason you can think of that ireland is less technologically advanced. sure they might as well own us anyway.

the irish government is doomed to be forever copying their ideas, whether or not they are good. soon you will start seeing mandatory ID cards, GPS speed limiters in cars and 100% geographic CCTV coverage just because the brits have it.

yeah, we hate the brits. we have our own country but could never finish the job properly. the government still feels the need to copy everything that is british in order to fit in for some unknown greater purpose?

MrMatisse

getz wrote: »

943,589 may sound like a lot of people to ireland but to the uk its a very small amount we have a population of over 60,000,000

When almost a million of your people vote for far right racists you have a problem.

poplulation is 60 million, high proportion of them are children, people who didnt bother to vote or people who cant vote. The proportion of people who have tacitly accepted this type of thinking is scary.

MrMatisse

towel401 wrote: »

yeah, we hate the brits. we have our own country but could never finish the job properly. the government still feels the need to copy everything that is british in order to fit in for some unknown greater purpose?

WTF?

Rowley Birkin QC

DB10 wrote: »

I agree. They aren't as bad as the media make out.

Griffin is a holocaust denier and his supporters are violent thugs.

Then again he does have some kind of superhuman ability to spot British people by looking at them, maybe he should be employed at passport control at an airport somewhere.

towel401

Really-Stressed wrote: »

When almost a million of your people vote for far right racists you have a problem.

poplulation is 60 million, high proportion of them are children, people who didnt bother to vote or people who cant vote. The proportion of people who have tacitly accepted this type of thinking is scary.

these people aren't happy with the status quo. look at the 3 main parties in england, "New Labour" are actually a right wing authoritarian party hell bent on covering england with cameras and other invasive anti-crime measures. The opposition there is worthless, doomed not to have a very strong stance on anything for political correctness reasons. The 3 main parties are far too worried about offending any minority group to get any serious work done. the BNP seem more down to earth, not afraid to say what they mean even though I might not agree with all of it. and like it or not there is such a thing as letting in *too many* immigrants. just because you want to slow the flow of immigrants doesn't mean you're a racist

MrMatisse

towel401 wrote: »

these people aren't happy with the status quo. look at the 3 main parties in england, "New Labour" are actually a right wing authoritarian party hell bent on covering england with cameras and other invasive anti-crime measures. The opposition there is worthless, doomed not to have a very strong stance on anything for political correctness reasons. The 3 main parties are far too worried about offending any minority group to get any serious work done. the BNP seem more down to earth, not afraid to say what they mean even though I might not agree with all of it. and like it or not there is such a thing as letting in *too many* immigrants. just because you want to slow the flow of immigrants doesn't mean you're a racist

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSrw9NcBtOc

This type of thing is disgusting.

People say i dont really agree with them but .........

towel401

Really-Stressed wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSrw9NcBtOc

This type of thing is disgusting.

and you can honestly say you don't judge people on how they look?

I know we're all supposed to be politically correct and all but lets face it if you see a slutbag walking down the street there's a 99% chance that she actually is a slutbag.

the race issue is only a small part of what the BNP stands for and even if they did get into government I don't think they can throw out anyone who has already got british citizenship.

MrMatisse

towel401 wrote: »

and you can honestly say you don't judge people on how they look?

I know we're all supposed to be politically correct and all but lets face it if you see a slutbag walking down the street there's a 99% chance that she actually is a slutbag.

the race issue is only a small part of what the BNP stands for and even if they did get into government I don't think they can throw out anyone who has already got british citizenship.

In the video he says he wants poles out of britain too. I wonder how he will identify them?

Numbered tatoo maybe? Yellow star?

The race issue is the main thing they stand for. Hence the racist cartoons they made aimed at five year olds.

I wouldnt design a national policy on the basis of skin colour. They tried it in South Africa. Didnt work.

towel401

Really-Stressed wrote: »

In the video he says he wants poles out of britain too. I wonder how he will identify them?

Numbered tatoo maybe? Yellow star?

The race issue is the main thing they stand for. Hence the racist cartoons they made aimed at five year olds.

I wouldnt design a national policy on the basis of skin colour. They tried it in South Africa. Didnt work.

strangely enough I can usually spot a polish person a mile off. I have nothing against them but I can spot them without the yellow star

Davidth88

I am truly shocked/disgusted that BNP would start to get a hold in British politics like this . However to be honest I am not entirely surprised

I no longer live in Britain , however I have many relatives/friends who do. Most of them would fall into the ' White Middle class protestant ' demographic.

They descibe things that I find shocking , a lot of it would be blown out of all proportion by the 'Daily Mail' type press.

But most of it links to that demographic feeling left out/dismissed by all the mainstream parties as they all go for the ' ethnic minority ' votes. One example ( all be it now out of date ) which I post here because it's pertinent , would be Ken Livingstone spending money on a St Patricks parade , Boris Johnson scrapped that and instead spent the money on a St Georges parade. They feel ( maybe for no good reason ) almost guilty for celebrating their nationality. ( mainly due I thinkto media hype )

Where I grew up it was always a ' mixed culture ' , my school would have been 20% asian and that was in the 70s, it's much greater now . There were never any obvious issues . There were the things like the Toxteth/Brixton riots, but they were one off , and certainly in the Brixton case were fuelled by poor policing procedures .

I remember clearly during the last recession the NF ( as they were then ) gaining popularity and selling their vile newspapers outside football grounds etc .

You also wonder how much the current expences row may have contributed with ' all your politicians are on the make ' being wheeled out by the BNP.

Acacia

Horrible news. I'm disgusted. I really hope this isn't the beginning of an increase in extreme rightwing nutjobs sorry, parties, in Europe.

Acacia

towel401 wrote: »

Ya know the BNP actually have some fairly good ideas. Much like Geert Wilders has. They are not as racist as they let on, and besides its good to have a few racists in the government when everybody else is hell-bent on reverse discrimination. kind of balances things out you know?

They are not as racist as they 'let on'? Surely, if they want their policies and ideas to have any credibility, it would be in their best interest to tone down their racism and appear as legitimate as possible? I've seen some of their vidoes on youtube- laughable attempts at propaganda that can easily be seen for the racist bile they are.

The fact that you think it is in anyway a positive thing to have 'a few racists in governmnt' speaks volumes , tbh.


Y'know, when I read these type of posts I'm not surprised that these clowns got their seats- too many people going about with a persecution complex about 'reverse discrimination' and imagining that the poor indigneous British man is hard done by.

tolosenc

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Comparing SF to the BNP shows a kindergarten understanding of politics.

BNP would be 3rd position, and more racist. Other than that, they both want their country out of the EU, they're both composed of a few good speakers and many violent thugs, with Sinn Féin having it's own private army/terrorist organisation for much of its existence...

Nodin wrote: »

I'd suggest reading their policies on the matter before making such statements.

Is it not clear as day that SF are the most similar party on this island to the BNP?

ShooterSF

obl wrote: »

BNP would be 3rd position, and more racist. Other than that, they both want their country out of the EU, they're both composed of a few good speakers and many violent thugs, with Sinn Féin having it's own private army/terrorist organisation for much of its existence...



Is it not clear as day that SF are the most similar party on this island to the BNP?

They are both anti-Eu (from their actions) based on being nationalists. Other than that your question is a bit like,
I have an apple in one hand and a banana in the other, which is more like an orange?

DB10

bigkev49 wrote: »

Griffin is a holocaust denier and his supporters are violent thugs.

Then again he does have some kind of superhuman ability to spot British people by looking at them, maybe he should be employed at passport control at an airport somewhere.

Well judging people by looking at them is nothing new. I think we all know an Eastern European when we see them or an Indian or African.

PopeBuckfastXVI

DB10 wrote: »

Well judging people by looking at them is nothing new. I think we all know an Eastern European when we see them or an Indian or African.

What about a British person who's 4 grandparents are African?

How can you know when you see them that they are British, and not a tourist?

markopantelic

sinn fein don't want ireland out of the eu, even if they did its hardly the worst thing ever, maby they could have an interesting alternative, norway aren't in the eu either, im pro-eu but sinn fein has some good ideas.

Rowley Birkin QC

DB10 wrote: »

Well judging people by looking at them is nothing new. I think we all know an Eastern European when we see them or an Indian or African.

BS. How about this guy? What's his nationality? By your logic you should know simply by looking at him.

Or this guy? What's his lineage? Apparently it should be simple to spot. :rolleyes:

apoch632

How about him

http://www.topnews.in/sports/files/Ryan-Giggs1.jpg

Judging people by simply looking at them is utter bull****

RDM_83

There's a difference between eire and the uk IMO in relation to the recent wave of immegration in the UK, the wages never rose the same way as they did here and so if your a lower paid worker you probably be feeling quite bitter at the minute as you never made that much money (compared to here) in the good times and now many of them are facing increased competion for employment and living on low level benefits.
Also its important to look at the levels of dissatifaction with both conservatives and labour in a country that doesn't have a history of independent candidates.

Rb

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

What about a British person who's 4 grandparents are African?

How can you know when you see them that they are British, and not a tourist?

They don't claim to be the son of the Prince of Nigeria? :pac:

On a more serious note though, I think DB10 above is showing a pretty common mentality that if someone immigrates and don't look like us, then they're never "Irish" or "English" as the case may be, no matter how long they've been there.

How the BNP can claim to know who is and isn't British by looking at them and then state that they're not talking about those who've settled and integrated yet then go on to use Bradford as an example...I don't know, it's very inconsistent.

Nodin

obl wrote: »

Is it not clear as day that SF are the most similar party on this island to the BNP?

Theres no comparison. The BNP are a right wing racist party with a whites only membership policy.

Go find me the right wing racism here.
http://www.sinnfein.ie/files/Policies_Racism.pdf

deisedude

Was anyone watching Channel 4 news. They were interviewing a newly elected BNP MEP. His excuse for not allowing black or asian people become members of the party was to protect indigenous people. Despicable racist pondlife is what they are

oscarBravo

I really shouldn't have to point it out, but this thread isn't about Sinn Féin. Let's not go there.

conchubhar1

obl wrote: »

BNP would be 3rd position, and more racist. Other than that, they both want their country out of the EU, they're both composed of a few good speakers and many violent thugs, with Sinn Féin having it's own private army/terrorist organisation for much of its existence...

Is it not clear as day that SF are the most similar party on this island to the BNP?

had an army, as did many irish parties..... (de rossa was a volunteer in the past... let it go)

more rascist - they are rascist and sf is not.

Nodin

deisedude wrote: »

Was anyone watching Channel 4 news. They were interviewing a newly elected BNP MEP. His excuse for not allowing black or asian people become members of the party was to protect indigenous people. Despicable racist pondlife is what they are

Thats the Bron fella. Ex-chairman of the National Front.

Iwasfrozen

Despicable racist pondlife is what they are

How dare they choose their own membership. Despicable. :mad:

DB10

Looks like the freedom of speech is lost on alot of people.
The fact remains Griffen had his car vandalised and eggs thrown at him while being ridiculed by all and sundry.

Those people are the idiots here. Some people act like the BNP and its voters are stupid racist thugs, yet their opposers resort to vigilante justice and verbal insults. They are just as bad as the people they oppose.

trailerparkboy

Congrats to the BNP for the 2 elected MPS, great news the people will no longer be fooled by the elites who dont care about the working class people and the effects immigration has caused to the working class.

DB10

Can I also add that if I was English, and the National Front connections were removed , I would probably have voted for the BNP as well.
And I'm sure if the NF connections were gone they would have done alot better with thousands more behind them.

And by the way I am not scum,racist or a thug.

trailerparkboy

DB10 wrote: »

Can I also add that if I was English, and the National Front connections were removed , I would probably have voted for the BNP as well.
And I'm sure if the NF connections were gone they would have done alot better with thousands more behind them.

And by the way I am not scum,racist or a thug.

Well said sir, im with you there.

Nodin

DB10 wrote: »

Can I also add that if I was English, and the National Front connections were removed , I would probably have voted for the BNP as well.
And I'm sure if the NF connections were gone they would have done alot better with thousands more behind them.

And by the way I am not scum,racist or a thug.

Well.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSrw9NcBtOc

and....

"the introduction of a system of voluntary resettlement whereby those immigrants who are legally here will be afforded the opportunity to return to their lands of ethnic origin"
http://bnp.org.uk/policies/

I'd say that in your current position, you're liable to get fleas.....

Nodin

trailerparkboy wrote: »

Congrats to the BNP for the 2 elected MPS, great news the people will no longer be fooled by the elites who dont care about the working class people and the effects immigration has caused to the working class.

*Snicker

Griffins votes actually down from the last time out. Its like winning a race because all the other runners were injured in a crash, for jaysus sake.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/8088381.stm

DB10

The only scum are the NF and the anti BNP followers who attack people physically and verbally for their political views.

trailerparkboy

The BNP are going to clean up in the next general election theres no stoping them now, British people must look after there own people first everyone else second.

Nodin

trailerparkboy wrote: »

The BNP are going to clean up in the next general election theres no stoping them now, British people must look after there own people first everyone else second.

Their vote was slightly down..As far as I understand it they only got in due to PR, which the Brits don't use in General elections.....why exactly would there be "no stopping them"?

A Dub in Glasgo

I'm glad to say that the BNP only got 2.5% of the vote in Scotland

Iwasfrozen

Their vote was slightly down..As far as I understand it they only got in due to PR, which the Brits don't use in General elections.....why exactly would there be "no stopping them"?

They've gotten more publicity now, also as they now have representation in the European parliment the BBc is going to have to recognise them as a real party and afford them more air time.

Rowley Birkin QC

I genuinely cannot understand how any right-minded people can fail to see these morons as anything but a throwback to a previous time.

It genuinely bothers me that they got so many votes in our neighboring country.

oscarBravo

DB10 wrote: »

Looks like the freedom of speech is lost on alot of people.
The fact remains Griffen had his car vandalised and eggs thrown at him while being ridiculed by all and sundry.

Those people are the idiots here. Some people act like the BNP and its voters are stupid racist thugs, yet their opposers resort to vigilante justice and verbal insults. They are just as bad as the people they oppose.

There's a problem with your analysis: not everyone who opposes the BNP resorts to vigilante justice and/or verbal insults. On the flipside, pretty much everyone who supports the BNP tacitly condones racism.

DB10 wrote: »

Can I also add that if I was English, and the National Front connections were removed , I would probably have voted for the BNP as well.
And I'm sure if the NF connections were gone they would have done alot better with thousands more behind them.

And by the way I am not scum,racist or a thug.

Scum or thug, fair enough - but it's hard to imagine a reason for voting BNP that doesn't include racism. Maybe you could enlighten me.

Affable

Acacia wrote: »

Y'know, when I read these type of posts I'm not surprised that these clowns got their seats- too many people going about with a persecution complex about 'reverse discrimination' and imagining that the poor indigneous British man is hard done by.

Yeah, except there is an element of truth in it. The white on black violent crimes covered vastly more than the black/asian on white violent crimes for example, because of media fears of fanning flames, even police have been hindered in doing what they need to do because of accusations of racism. (eg polic being more likely to search black people in London, well surprise surprise the target areas are the vey poorest and roughest, thats why people are searched more, but more black people live in these areas, what are they supposed to do?)

Check out the 'Kriss Donald' vs 'Stephen Lawrence' cases for example.

Acacia

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

How dare they choose their own membership. Despicable. :mad:

Well, it is discriminatry to only have whites as members. Pretty obvious., I would have thought.

DB10 wrote: »

Looks like the freedom of speech is lost on alot of people.
The fact remains Griffen had his car vandalised and eggs thrown at him while being ridiculed by all and sundry.

Those people are the idiots here. Some people act like the BNP and its voters are stupid racist thugs, yet their opposers resort to vigilante justice and verbal insults. They are just as bad as the people they oppose.

Oh, yes, those poor underdogs , the BNP...

Yes, their freedom of speech was so curtailed that they were allowed stand for election to the European parliament. :rolleyes:

Their supporters' freedom of speech was so curtailed that they were allowed vote for the party of their choice. :rolleyes:

trailerparkboy wrote: »

Congrats to the BNP for the 2 elected MPS, great news the people will no longer be fooled by the elites who dont care about the working class people and the effects immigration has caused to the working class.

As Nodin has pointed out, they only got in because low voting turn-outs.

And what effects does immigration have on the working-class may I ask?

DB10 wrote: »

Can I also add that if I was English, and the National Front connections were removed , I would probably have voted for the BNP as well.
And I'm sure if the NF connections were gone they would have done alot better with thousands more behind them.

And by the way I am not scum,racist or a thug.

If the National Front connections were removed there wouldn't be a whole lot left.

And why would you want to vote for a party that was in any way connected, in the past or present, with the NF?

DB10 wrote: »

The only scum are the NF and the anti BNP followers who attack people physically and verbally for their political views.

Do you have anything to offer to the debate besides bland sloganeering?

A reaction to what Nodin posted about the BNP's vile policies perhaps?

No, like the BNP themselves, it's much easier to stand behind vague slogans than to produce any convincing arguments.

trailerparkboy wrote: »

The BNP are going to clean up in the next general election theres no stoping them now, British people must look after there own people first everyone else second.

Who is everyone else? What about legally British immigrants?

Maybe they see Britain as their home- why should they be forced to leave because they don't fit into the BNP's definition of Britishness?

Yeah, except there is an element of truth in it. The white on black violent crimes covered vastly more than the black/asian on white violent crimes for example, because of media fears of fanning flames, even police have been hindered in doing what they need to do because of accusations of racism. (eg polic being more likely to search black people in London, well surprise surprise the target areas are the vey poorest and roughest, thats why people are searched more, but more black people live in these areas, what are they supposed to do?)

Check out the 'Kriss Donald' vs 'Stephen Lawrence' cases for example

I've asked this twice on the After Hours thread about this and nobody has yet answered me satisfactorily- can anyone give an example of a policy/ law which outright favored or showed preference towards immigrants over native British people in areas of housing, employment, education?

If it were a case that, like Griffin claims the white British working-class were being treated like second-class citizens, you would think there would be some sort of official policy that enforced this. But there's not.

An 'element' of truth or a few examples of extreme 'political correctness' does not national policy make. So that is why I say there is a 'persecution complex'.

In any case, why is the solution to poor coverage of black-on-white crime in the media to 'voluntarily' remove immigrants from the country?

DB10

Anacia the ignorant view that their followers are scum is what the point came across as. And I have addressed that point.

Clearly you are blind if you think I have defended the NF. They are scum as you put it and don't try to twist my words in future.

My point is that some of their policies are not as bad as the media portray and they are the only party in the UK willing to address serious immigration problems.

Acacia

DB10 wrote: »

Anacia the ignorant view that their followers are scum is what the point came across as. And I have addressed that point.

Clearly you are blind if you think I have defended the NF. They are scum as you put it and don't try to twist my words in future.

My point is that some of their policies are not as bad as the media portray and they are the only party in the UK willing to address serious immigration problems.

You were complaining about freedom of speech- which was the point I addressed- not their followers being 'scum'.


Where did I twist your words? You said the NF are scum- the BNP have NF connections- yet you would vote for them- my question is why would you vote for a party that have connections to a group that in your own words (not mine, by the way, you said it)are 'scum'? Seemes a bit bizarre to me.

I've looked at their policies and they certainly do seem to be as bad as the media portrays.

Yes, they are the only party in the UK to address immigration- maybe because immigration issues aren't as big a deal as they make out?

DB10

Acacia wrote: »

You were complaining about freedom of speech- which was the point I addressed- not their followers being 'scum'.


Where did I twist your words? You said the NF are scum- the BNP have NF connections- yet you would vote for them- my question is why would you vote for a party that have connections to a group that in your own words are 'scum'? Seemes a bit bizarre to me.

I've looked at their policies and they certainly do seem to be as bad as the media portrays.

Yes, they are the only party in the UK to address immigration- maybe because immigration issues aren't as big a deal as they make out?

I said I would vote for a party with their immigration policies yet not the BNP because of the Nazi NF connections. Get it right.

If you seriously believe immigration isn't a problem in the UK then your are deluded.

Extreme radical Muslims preaching their vile all over the country.
Floodgates open to millions of illegals who come in and work for half the minimium wage.
The country is gone overboard on political correctness so much so there is reverse discrimination.

Iwasfrozen

Acacia wrote:

Well, it is discriminatry to only have whites as members. Pretty obvious., I would have thought.

They have as much a right to discriminate as you do not to discriminate.

Acacia wrote:

Oh, yes, those poor underdogs , the BNP...

Yes, their freedom of speech was so curtailed that they were allowed stand for election to the European parliament.

Their supporters' freedom of speech was so curtailed that they were allowed vote for the party of their choice.

Becareful here, it's very easy to get lost in eyerolls and forget the real issue.
Nobody is saying that the British public as a whole curtails freedom of speech and the freedom to elect a party that the majority of people want representing them. What we are saying is that there are some people in Britain that feel they would rather not recognise the Democratic voice of the people in North West England and instead throw eggs when they don't get their way. [Ahem Lid Democrats]

As Nodin has pointed out, they only got in because low voting turn-outs.

And what effects does immigration have on the working-class may I ask?

Immigration dilutes the culture of it's host nation. For example Islam is far flung desert religion that historically has had no place in european history save the crusades.
Why should Britain or any other western nation recognise Islam as a religion ?

Acacia wrote:

Who is everyone else? What about legally British immigrants?

Maybe they see Britain as their home- why should they be forced to leave because they don't fit into the BNP's definition of Britishness?

Have you even read the BNP's policies nobody is throwing anybody out of anywhere. The BNP would offer incentives for Immigrants to leave.
It's abit to long to post here but you can find all information here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/shared/bsp/hi/pdfs/BNP_uk_manifesto.pdf

Acacia wrote:

I've asked this twice on the After Hours thread about this and nobody has yet answered me satisfactorily- can anyone give an example of a policy/ law which outright favored or showed preference towards immigrants over native British people in areas of housing, employment, education?

If it were a case that, like Griffin claims the white British working-class were being treated like second-class citizens, you would think there would be some sort of official policy that enforced this. But there's not.

An 'element' of truth or a few examples of extreme 'political correctness' does not national policy make. So that is why I say there is a 'persecution complex'.

In any case, why is the solution to poor coverage of black-on-white crime in the media to 'voluntarily' remove immigrants from the country?

The truth is we cannot give you direct examples. Thats's not to say that these atrocities do not happen, only that they are not recorded by any credible media form for fear of being labeled a racist, Such is the extent of the damage our P.C world has inflicted upon our population.
These atrocities are happening to namless people in nameless places, like Joe Bloggs and his mates being fired because some Irish Ferry service can pay an eastern european for 1/2 the price.

Nodin

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

For example Islam is far flung desert religion that historically has had no place in european history save the crusades.
Why should Britain or any other western nation recognise Islam as a religion ?.

Actually Christianity is also a far flung desert Judaeo-Greco cult which was in many instances imposed by Crusades.

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

The truth is we cannot give you direct examples. Thats's not to say that these atrocities do not happen, only that they are not recorded by any credible media form for fear of being labeled a racist, Such is the extent of the damage our P.C world has inflicted upon our population.

So it's a conspiracy, is it?

Rowley Birkin QC

We can go round and round in circles about the BNP but let me state one simple fact; the British National Party does not admit certain members of society based on the colour of their skin.

Can anyone, cognisant of that one simple fact, continue to defend these people?