Sinn Fein...the future?

Nelson Muntz · 10-06-2009 3:20pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

you're kinda on the money dude.

although i would be middle class and well i was a FF voter for years until recent elcetions. what changed my vote was actually speaking to their candidates and listening to their policies on change. Instead of voting on a parties policy that i was born into or a smile on a poster.

That said i think the current climate is unique and well who'd vote for a party with no real economic policy at a time like this. which is why we saw such a massive shift from FF to FG with Labour picking up the scraps.

lets be honest they're going no where and will always be in politics. They can only grow in popularity they didn't see any massive drop in votes like the Greens did.

I think the greens got caned because most / all people that voted green in the last GE didn't want a FF govt & thanks to the greens that is what they got.

As for SF, whatever about their origins, the troubles, etc, now at this point in 2009 with the current problems facing Irish voters, SF need to make a choice. Do they want to take the hard road of developing a full set of policies & trying to grow into a real party that middle class voters in the republic would trust in power or do they want to take the easy road and wallow in the past, sit on the edge of politics, take easy pot shots at the mainstream parties & be content to have a few local council seats & the odd MEP.

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 3:23pm

Trotter wrote: »

I think they completely underestimate the fact that their future does link heavily to their past, far more than FF/FG Civil war etc.

Before I would even look into their policies, I would have to know that the basics are covered. i.e. condemnation of murders and non sale of T-Shirts commemorating the organisation that killed so many as I grew up. Yes there were two sides to the conflict, but its SF that are looking for me to vote for them, so thats why I focus on that here.

It will be for SF to figure out a way to unlink their future from the past. However the glossy opinions I've often heard that mask a belief of justification for robbery and murder for 'cause' just turn me away. In any conversation I'd like to think I can get a sense of the underlying belief someone may be verbally skirting around. I just get the sense that many in SF, but not all I presume, still feel that some awful things were justified, yet they wont say that.

It boils down to a divergence of beliefs I suppose. Im an Irish Catholic, so as was mentioned before, I'd assume SF would welcome my vote.

I can't stand to see someone like Toiresa Ferris not condemning a murder. Its a pity really. A refusal like that, or an avoidance of doing so shines a light on a shady area if that makes sense. Enough for me not to want to vote in that direction.

Top bloke top answer and a fair opinion to have

I would've been the exact same as you dude but i grew tired of being duped by FF. With all the scandals they were linked with, with the property boom, with the miss handling of the banks etc Made me look elsewhere to my out my vote. I heard FG, they were much the same as FF but far more right wing, Labour just had a smiley face on a poster and never once made contact even though my local counsellor is a neighbour. SF in my area were very proactive in the local community in building sports halls, fighting bin charges and well I decided to put the past behind and gave them a shot. i haven't been dissapointed at all to date.

However i respect your opinion as you're not basing it on typical rhetoric others have chosen to spout today.

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 3:27pm

Nelson Muntz wrote: »

I think the greens got caned because most / all people that voted green in the last GE didn't want a FF govt & thanks to the greens that is what they got.

As for SF, whatever about their origins, the troubles, etc, now at this point in 2009 with the current problems facing Irish voters, SF need to make a choice. Do they want to take the hard road of developing a full set of policies & trying to grow into a real party that middle class voters in the republic would trust in power or do they want to take the easy road and wallow in the past, sit on the edge of politics, take easy pot shots at the mainstream parties & be content to have a few local council seats & the odd MEP.

I bet 1 billion dollars they're going for the former. How many new young faces have you seen in this local election? Eventually they will rise to governement and well fingers crossed they can get rid of the shackels of the past and change some of the opinions vented here today.

LordSutch · 10-06-2009 3:28pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

Top bloke top answer and a fair opinion to have

SF in my area were very proactive in the local community in building sports halls, fighting bin charges and well I decided to put the past behind and gave them a shot. i haven't been dissapointed at all to date.

However i respect your opinion as you're not basing it on typical rhetoric others have chosen to spout today.

Are you marking us all out of ten Dude? You seem to be taking the upper ground & then pontificating as to which answers you approve of, & which should be disgarded :cool:

Dude.

marco murphy · 10-06-2009 3:32pm

Trotter wrote: »

Agreed, they do. But they drive away voters.

I'd go along with that pretty much.

I wonder does it

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 3:35pm

Camelot wrote: »

Are you marking us all out of ten Dude? You seem to be taking the upper ground & then pontificating as to which answers you approve of, & which should be disgarded :cool:

Dude.

No marks no just agree with someone who has based their opinion on facts instead of conjecture and rehtoric from the past.

Nelson Muntz · 10-06-2009 3:39pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

I bet 1 billion dollars they're going for the former. How many new young faces have you seen in this local election? Eventually they will rise to governement and well fingers crossed they can get rid of the shackels of the past and change some of the opinions vented here today.

The problem for a lot of people is that they still carry a lot of the old faces as well.

10-06-2009 3:43pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

lets be honest the IRA wrote the book on gorrila warfare

Was the gorilla book written by the same apes they sent round canvassing to my door?

I'll say one thing from the last few counts. The Shinners have a monoply on young attactive types in neat suits. I presume the owld ugly ones are hidden behind balaclavas.

Can'tseeme · 10-06-2009 3:44pm

Camelot wrote: »

Because the 'movement' has promised to stop killing people?

The movement stopped years ago. Maybe they recognise they're a legitimate party, that has been instrumental in the peace process and helped to build a better society in the 6 counties.

Maybe the parties of the south and their supporters don't want this, as they are competing for their vote and therefore bad mouth SF at every opportunity?

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 3:52pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Was the gorilla book written by the same apes they sent round canvassing to my door?

I'll say one thing from the last few counts. The Shinners have a monoply on young attactive types in neat suits. I presume the owld ugly ones are hidden behind balaclavas.

wow you're amazing lol

LordSutch · 10-06-2009 3:53pm

All I know for sure is that, SF had the perfect opportunity to make ground this Local/ Euro elections > and they failed miserably, and whats their percentage of the national vote? (7% > 10%) Max? so its not just people like me with unionist leanings that don't vote Sinn Fein, its the vast majority of the Southern Electorate who don't, and won't vote for Sinn Fein ..........

With Fianna Fail hemorrhaging all over the place this month surely SF should have made inroads?

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 3:54pm

Can'tseeme wrote: »

The movement stopped years ago. Maybe they recognise they're a legitimate party, that has been instrumental in the peace process and helped to build a better society in the 6 counties.

Maybe the parties of the south and their supporters don't want this, as they are competing for their vote and therefore bad mouth SF at every opportunity?

Yup thats it exactly mate... Also lets not forget the media down South is biast toward SF and well continually paint them in the old light of ballot box in one hand and armalite in the other.

They're afraid for the lives that SF will show them up down south like they've done to the Unionists up north.

Based on people opinions here it seems the media shepard is doing its job on its flock quite well

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 3:56pm

Camelot wrote: »

All I know for sure is that, SF had the perfect opportunity to make ground this Local/ Euro elections > and they failed miserably, and whats their percentage of the national vote? (7% > 10%) Max? so its not just people like me with a unionist leanings that don't vote for SF, it the vast majority of the Southern Electorate who don't, and won't vote Sinn Fein ..........

With Fianna Fail hemorrhaging all over the place this month surely SF should have made inroads, (if they were wanted by the electorate) but they're not.

I've already answered that post previously keep up will ya.

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 4:01pm

they have 7.4% of the electorate nationally and 11.21 in Europe. Which is pretty good considering all the turmoil thats going on in the economy. again slight drop but nothing major.

now bring on the general election!

10-06-2009 4:01pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

wow you're amazing lol

Not sure this is a thread about me at all.

It's a thread about Shinners and terrorist fellow travellers afaik.

10-06-2009 4:06pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

They're afraid for the lives that SF will show them up down south like they've done to the Unionists up north.

You mean they'll get out their private army again, to start killing us?

It wasn't just Unionists they 'showed up'. Their sidekicks in terorism also managed to do things like beat Robert McCartney to death and cut his throat along with that of his friend, and afaik he was no Unionist.

g5fd6ow0hseima · 10-06-2009 4:08pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

they have 7.4% of the electorate nationally and 11.21 in Europe. Which is pretty good considering all the turmoil thats going on in the economy. again slight drop but nothing major.

now bring on the general election!

Its common enough for me to hear SF still being referred to being 'a shower of bank robbers', 'bunch of criminals' etc, so it might take a few more years before the bitterness dissipates....

Socialism too - they should get with the times.

Can'tseeme · 10-06-2009 4:11pm

Camelot wrote: »

All I know for sure is that, SF had the perfect opportunity to make ground this Local/ Euro elections > and they failed miserably, and whats their percentage of the national vote? (7% > 10%) Max? so its not just people like me with unionist leanings that don't vote Sinn Fein, its the vast majority of the Southern Electorate who don't, and won't vote for Sinn Fein ..........

With Fianna Fail hemorrhaging all over the place this month surely SF should have made inroads?

Yep, they have a lot of work to be done. They've a lot of arguments to win over. But they're starting from a low level vote, the only way is up and they've definitely got the potential to increase their vote.

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 4:13pm

Deleted User wrote: »

You mean they'll get out their private army again, to start killing us?

It wasn't just Unionists they 'showed up'. Their sidekicks in terorism also managed to do things like beat Robert McCartney to death and cut his throat along with that of his friend, and afaik he was no Unionist.

Not at all Conor I duno where you're getting that information from its surely not based on the facts. Again media hype and conjecture.

10-06-2009 4:20pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

Not at all Conor I duno where you're getting that information from its surely not based on the facts.

The facts are that Shinners first of all blamed the PSNI for trying to stir up anger in the community. That was Alex Maskey, he is a Shinner, check it out.

The Shinner's private army then said it had nothing to do with them or their members. They then admitted it had and offered to shoot those responsible.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/mar/08/northernireland

Not sure where you were when all this was happening. Or maybe it was all made up by the Guardian. Sheesh, maybe the IRA doesn't exist at all and it's all a ruse.

g5fd6ow0hseima · 10-06-2009 4:20pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

Not at all Conor I duno where you're getting that information from its surely not based on the facts. Again media hype and conjecture.

Who done it so?

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 4:25pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The facts are that Shinners first of all blamed the PSNI for trying to stir up anger in the community. That was Alex Maskey, he is a Shinner, check it out.

The Shinner's private army then said it had nothing to do with them or their members. They then admitted it had and offered to shoot those responsible.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/mar/08/northernireland

Not sure where you were when all this was happening. Or maybe it was all made up by the Guardian. Sheesh, maybe the IRA doesn't exist at all and it's all a ruse.

maybe they're all sitting around drinking potien with the easter bunny and santa too?

Personal army lol come off it man thats not how it is and you know it lol.

what about the poor sod can't remember who it was last week who got kicked and beaten to death by a bunch of loyalists. they knocked the rollox out of his wife and pregnant neighbour. did you see that family getting as much publicity as the mccartney sisters? no. why? It didn't serve the means of the media propeghanda machine did it. which is my point i am fully aware of what happend, what transpired between the RA and SF but again SF are the party people go to with the IRA are the topic of conversation. Invariably linking the two yet both are divided by vast differences in their policies (back in the day). But now SF reigned the RA in and we now have peace on our Island. yet you still berrate SF?

That makes perfect sense doesn't it?

marco murphy · 10-06-2009 4:31pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

maybe they're all sitting around drinking potien with the easter bunny and santa too?

Personal army lol come off it man thats not how it is and you know it lol.

what about the poor sod can't remember who it was last week who got kicked and beaten to death by a bunch of loyalists. they knocked the rollox out of his wife and pregnant neighbour. did you see that family getting as much publicity as the mccartney sisters? no. why? It didn't serve the means of the media propeghanda machine did it. which is my point i am fully aware of what happend, what transpired between the RA and SF but again SF are the party people go to with the IRA are the topic of conversation. Invariably linking the two yet both are divided by vast differences in their policies (back in the day). But now SF reigned the RA in and we now have peace on our Island. yet you still berrate SF?

That makes perfect sense doesn't it?

Just like the evening herald with their 'SF election opponent car vandalised'' and all of this media crap. Most of the papers mentioned SF in the headline.

LordSutch · 10-06-2009 4:38pm

Anyone any thoughts on Mary Lou's abysmal SF Euro performance & her Vice Presidency position :rolleyes:

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 4:41pm

Perestroika wrote: »

Just like the evening herald with their 'SF election opponent car vandalised'' and all of this media crap. Most of the papers mentioned SF in the headline.

Ah Sir Anthony O'Reilly's papers lol what service did he do to the crown to be awarded a night hood?

Simple he allowed the spin to be put on SF for the past 30-40 years and is it any surprise that he owns 60-70% of the Irish media?

Come on Ireland open your eyes to the propeghanda machine that has been feeding you tripe all these years! Im not just using that word loosely btw its real and its here on a daily basis.

marco murphy · 10-06-2009 4:41pm

Camelot wrote: »

Anyone any thoughts on Mary Lou's abysmal SF Euro performance & her Vice Presidency position :rolleyes:

Abysmal? Hardly. The constituency went from 4 to 3 seats and was always gonna be a tough fight. And what opinions would one have on her vice presidency. Stop trying to troll.

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 4:43pm

Camelot wrote: »

Anyone any thoughts on Mary Lou's abysmal SF Euro performance & her Vice Presidency position :rolleyes:

i wouldn't call it abysmal it wasn't a success sure but she was 1 of the last 3 in the running for the seat. Of course you'd call it abysmal given your stance on SF (detest with every fibre of your body i think you said).

She passed on her votes to the socialist part giving them the seat. Sure she got knocked down but if you knew the woman you'd know she wont give up and you'll see her running for a seat in the Dail at the next GE

NOGMaxpower · 10-06-2009 4:45pm

it is with deep regret that i have to leave this debate today its been great arguing with you all.

take care and remember question everything the media/government tells you. If you dont you're nothing but a lamb to the slaughter.

finally we're all entitled to our opinions but dont go killing eachother over them that's what has gotten the world into the Sh*te its in today.

marco murphy · 10-06-2009 4:48pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

it is with deep regret that i have to leave this debate today its been great arguing with you all.

take care and remember question everything the media/government tells you. If you dont you're nothing but a lamb to the slaughter.

finally we're all entitled to our opinions but dont go killing eachother over them that's what has gotten the world into the Sh*te its in today.

Tomorrows Evening Herald;

SINN FEIN IN WEB WAR DRAMA

Liam Byrne · 10-06-2009 5:05pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

take care and remember question everything the media/government tells you.

.... [subtext] but don't question ANYTHING Toireasa Ferris, Mary-Lou & Gerry Adams say......

Sinn Fein...the future?

Comments