Religion is not a private matter?

Sam Vimes

dvpower wrote: »

I can't see how religion can be kept private.

Christians believe that those of us who don't accept Jesus Christ are doomed to an eternity in hell (or something). Imagine knowing that and keeping it to yourself? For some it must be like seeing an out of control car careering towards a pedestrian and not shouting out.

Religion should be treated like any other set of beliefs; like your politics or choice of football team, but its a free country; people can hold and express views no matter how strange they are. But there is an appropriate time and place and I think that was the (ignored / misunderstood) point of that other thread.

I don't mind religious people telling me about their beliefs, everyone has the right to free speech, but I object to the hypocrisy of thanking the above post while simultaneously saying "I'm just tired of OTT secularism trying to tell us how we should live our lives.". Just because you might think you have the one true path doesn't mean you should be encouraged to tell everyone about your beliefs and others should be silent, lest they "tell us how we should live our lives".

If you want to "say a small prayer before a game" you have that right but if I don't want to be included in it I also have that right. It is hypocritical to encourage someone who wants to include non-religious people in religious rituals and to call someone an extremist for saying they don't want to be included. The only person forcing anything on others in that case is the religious person, the secular person is simply trying to stop him.

Hrududu

Jaysus, where did this happen? What a muppet! IMO religion doesnt make that guy oppresive, his muppet personality does.

Twas on the Dublin>Sligo train about a week ago. It was the fact that he kept telling her that she was wrong and that her religion wasn't the right one that bugged me. He was just so obnoxious. But of course he said it all with a smile on his face so he probably thinks he wasn't being rude at all.

BrotherBoniface

--amadeus-- wrote: »

I'm not sure what it is exactly about the attitude above that I find hair raising but it is so totally alien to my own (lack of) beliefs that it really did take me by surprise. In fact if I didn't know the back story to the two posters involved I would have suspected a wind up.

I find teh idea of a coach - in a non-religious community team - insisting on saying a prayer with the team before the game to be totally hair brained. And while it might not bother a lot of people and I wouldn't be offended by it I certainly wouldn't want a nurse offering to pray for me (apart from anything I'd be worried about what she knew about my condition that I didn't :pac:). And I would have thought that most people - religious or not - would see that. They would have considered faith and religion to be a private matter, between each person and thier clergyman or god. But it seems thats not universally true. In fact some religious feel that they have the right to pull religion into every aspect of thier lives.

I'm not talking here about religion cropping up in conversation and someone defending or discussing thier viewpoint ("ohhh you've bought a CD, what is it?" "Oh it's an audio bible to play in the car..." type stuff). It's that some religious feel a need to trumpet thier faith even in inapropriate settings and totally out of context.

And then it dawned on me. When I lived in London I knew a few gay people and some of them had the same flamboyant attitude. Out and proud and they would let everyone know within minutes of meeting them that they were gay. Which was fine but if you'd just asked what they wanted from teh bar it was a bit out of place. Others though you would never know. It wasn't that they hid it or were ashamed it just wasn't *that* big a deal to them. If you asked about thier homelife they might mention say "oh I live with my boyfriend" or whatever but it was a part of them, not what defined them. The louder ones though (gross generalisation and amateur psychoanalysis) were often newer "out" or were younger and they seemed to be making a deal out of it more for themsleves than whoever they were talking to, it always came across as a bit insecure and needy. It seems quite common in minorities - the aggressive taking of the trait that sets them apart and glamourising of it. "Queer" and "queen" were once huge insults to gay men, now they are names for trendy clubs and have lost a lot of teh power to sting. You can't get a rap album without hearing the "N" word and Travellers here are fiercely proud of thier culture.

So - long winded (sorry) - but my point is could we see the attitudes above as being a sign that we are culturally transitioning from a situation where religion and teh religious are in an overwhelming majority and culturally set teh tone to a stage where it is now a minority practice? Or am I offbeam altogether, is there nothing wrong with this public declaration of faith, after all some on here are vocally anti-theist.

Mods - i would have put this in Christianity as thats the host forum for teh quotes above but in light of teh charter change I thought it might come across as Christian bashing, please move if its better suite to there, thanks

Interesting post and well written. I totally see where you are coming from, religion is such a private thing and so is sexuality. How did you find people's attitude to your sexuality in London as opposed to here?( I take it you live in Ireland now?) I mean is London more accepting to homosexuality than Ireland? Did the fact of coming out in London turn you away from christianity and turning to atheism is easier with dealing with your sexuality? I feel is it so sad that the gay fraternity in Ireland find solace away from religion(atheism) and not seek help from it. Remember, God is forgiving and will always welcome back his lost sheep, no matter what colour, white black or pink. I hope this helps