Romanians Victims of Racist Attacks

oscarBravo · 23-06-2009 11:32am

Tha Gopher wrote: »

Right I accept it. As I did in my opening post if you bothered getting off your PC horse.

"I'm not condoning these attacks, but..."

23-06-2009 1:41pm

johnathan woss wrote: »

So when are djpbarry, oscarbravo and conor74 giving one of their rooms to a fine upstanding roma family ?

johnathan woss wrote: »

So djpbarry, oscarbravo and conor74, when are the Roma moving into your houses ?

Was this a serious point? You must have thought so, and indeed thought it so good you made it twice. Remarkable.

Johnathon, I hate child abusers, but that doesn't mean I have to give abuse victims a room in my house to prove it to you.

I don't want others living in my house. But if I had to make a choice, I'd sooner have Romas packing out the place before I'd have one Irish racist around for tea anyway.

joseph brand · 23-06-2009 2:11pm

this is surely a massive blow to the NI economy. These were hard working people, professionals, only too willing to add to society.

The Roma are team players if ever I seen any. Hunting in packs on the streets, working together to relieve people of their heavy wallets/ purses, loose change AND notes.

I wanna speak up for all the unfortunates who may not be mugged this week or next, now that the Roma have gone. Shame on those thugs. For expressing their views.

Hole-in-the-wall machines won't hold the same excitement that it once did when there was a chance there was a Roma nearby ready to pounce.

Roll on the PC brigade. . . . .

joseph brand · 23-06-2009 2:21pm

wes wrote: »

There are entire Italian cities basically run by the mafia and I don't see the same irrational hatred of Italians.

So what if the Roma are disproprtionally involved in crime. Its hardly fair to blame the whole lot of them, now is it? Do you think the irrational hatred of the Roma will help the situation? It is stupid in this day and age to hate an ethnic group. They are Human like the rest of us. If there are problems, irrational hatred will not solve them.

Also, statistics on Irish traveller are meaningless, when it comes to the Roma.

You 'have' to be joking. So what indeed.

So what if those who chase them from the North are involved in crime, . .so what!

It's interesting to see that do-gooders accept the Roma being heavily involved in crime. Its just accepted, lets get on with things. :P

What age are you?

Nodin · 23-06-2009 2:30pm

joseph brand wrote: »

this is surely(....)nearby ready to pounce.

. . . . .

Don't suppose you've a source for any of that, specifically relating to those driven out their homes....?

wes · 23-06-2009 2:32pm

joseph brand wrote: »

this is surely a massive blow to the NI economy. These were hard working people, professionals, only too willing to add to society.

The Roma are team players if ever I seen any. Hunting in packs on the streets, working together to relieve people of their heavy wallets/ purses, loose change AND notes.

I wanna speak up for all the unfortunates who may not be mugged this week or next, now that the Roma have gone. Shame on those thugs. For expressing their views.

Hole-in-the-wall machines won't hold the same excitement that it once did when there was a chance there was a Roma nearby ready to pounce.

Roll on the PC brigade. . . . .

So I take it you have a shred of evidence to back up your accusation against the people who had to flee there homes, due to attacks by a pack of small minded backwards racist thugs? Oh and asking for proof is not PC, its just common sense. Seriously care to provide one ounce of evidence that the people who had to flee there homes, were involved in the activities you describe above?

Banging on about PC this and PC that, is no substitute for actual proof, because as it stands you are clearly talking bloody nonsense.

wes · 23-06-2009 2:36pm

joseph brand wrote: »

You 'have' to be joking. So what indeed.

So what if those who chase them from the North are involved in crime, . .so what!

I fail to see what your getting at. The people who had to flee there homes commited no crime. There ethnic group commiting crimes in other countries, has feck all to do with them. Just seems like someone trying to make excuses for irrational hatred of a small pack of racists.

Also, the people who attacked them, were clearly engaged in criminal assault.

joseph brand wrote: »

It's interesting to see that do-gooders accept the Roma being heavily involved in crime. Its just accepted, lets get on with things. :P

So, the entire Roma people should be held responsible for criminality of some member of there community? Collective punishment is pretty pointless and will solve nothing and is quite frankly racism, that belongs in the Middle Ages.

Here is an idea, how about we arrest the criminals and not judge an entire ethnic group, due to the actions of some criminal who belong to it. One, woudl think that such a position would be common sense in this day and age.

joseph brand wrote: »

What age are you?

What year is it?

Rb · 23-06-2009 2:50pm

wes wrote: »

Don't think this has been posted here yet:

So the racists have won and gotten rid of these poor people and they even in all probablity attacked the church that offered them sanctuary. I can't say I blame the Roma for leaving, especially in light of some of the attitudes seen in this thread towards them.

It's disappointing to see the BBC calling the Roma "Romanians", something which will no doubt annoy actual Romanians.

Anyway, good riddance to them, let's hope they stay out.

oscarBravo · 23-06-2009 3:01pm

Rb wrote: »

It's disappointing to see the BBC calling the Roma "Romanians", something which will no doubt annoy actual Romanians.

They are Romanians.

wes · 23-06-2009 3:07pm

Rb wrote: »

It's disappointing to see the BBC calling the Roma "Romanians", something which will no doubt annoy actual Romanians.

Well, seeing as there from there, I fail to see the problem.

Rb wrote: »

Anyway, good riddance to them, let's hope they stay out.

Why? What did they do to you, to deserve such ire?

23-06-2009 3:29pm

joseph brand wrote: »

You 'have' to be joking. So what indeed.

So what if those who chase them from the North are involved in crime, . .so what!

Yeah.

I note you're based in Dublin. Which has a far greater crime rate than where I live, South Kerry. Why don't they tax you criminal types higher? Why aren't you people subjected to curfews? Why is unemployment so high in parts of Dublin, are you people naturally lazier than my neighbours? Just please don't bring your broke thieving criminal types down destroying my neighbourhood every time Brendan Grace has a show in Killarney...

opo · 23-06-2009 5:36pm

wes wrote: »

Don't think this has been posted here yet:

So the racists have won and gotten rid of these poor people and they even in all probablity attacked the church that offered them sanctuary. I can't say I blame the Roma for leaving, especially in light of some of the attitudes seen in this thread towards them.

On this we agree.

The racists have indeed been the winners. Thanks, in part, to the media frenzy that gave global attention to a type of activity that is far from unknown to joyriders and drug dealers in NI.

That and the perception that unqualified racists (bizzarely) acted spontaneously and unilaterally.

Add in the latest PC twist of trying to downplay that the fact the evictees were Roma as irrelevant, I'd say it is a very happy result for some.

solice · 23-06-2009 5:39pm

opo wrote: »

That and the perception that unqualified racists (bizzarely) acted spontaneously and unilaterally.

Apart from giving general statistics on the Roma people as a whole can you give any specific details as to what the Roma/Romanians that were attacked did that caused the local youths in the area to feel they had to act in the way they did?

That is a very long winded question...basically, what did these specific people do to deserve this treatment in your opinion?

wes · 23-06-2009 5:42pm

opo wrote: »

The racists have indeed been the winners. Thanks, in part, to the media frenzy that gave global attention to a type of activity that is far from unknown to joyriders and drug dealers in NI.

Raising awareness of the racism problem, is actually a good thing. More people being aware of the consequences of irrational hatred, will mean more will tackle it when they come accross it.

opo wrote: »

That and the perception that unqualified racists (bizzarely) acted spontaneously and unilaterally.

The KKK for example just hated black people. They needed no other reason. So its not like there isn't precedent, for a group soley motivated by a irrational hatred to start attacking people.

opo wrote: »

Add in the latest PC twist of trying to downplay that the fact the evictees were Roma as irrelevant, I'd say it is a very happy result for some.

Why should them being Roma matter? All that lead to was people accusing the people who were attacked of being criminals and all other sorts of crap.

solice · 23-06-2009 5:50pm

wes wrote: »

The KKK for example just hated black people. They needed no other reason. So its not like there isn't precedent, for a group soley motivated by a irrational hatred to start attacking people.

Thats not actually true, the KKK didnt JUST hate black people, they also hated jews, homosexuals and people of different races and cultures to their own. They didnt so much as hate them, more they considered themselves to be superior.

But you are right, there are people out there that act on irrational mindsets, who carry out crimes for no logical reason other than they want to do it and I imagine this is one of them...

opo · 23-06-2009 5:50pm

solice wrote: »

Apart from giving general statistics on the Roma people as a whole can you give any specific details as to what the Roma/Romanians that were attacked did that caused the local youths in the area to feel they had to act in the way they did?

That is a very long winded question...basically, what did these specific people do to deserve this treatment in your opinion?

I honestly do not know. I have been flayed here for asking the same question.

I have already stated that I suspect that they were crammed into the houses they lived in - perhaps 20 or 30 to a home. That on its own is not a good sign. After that there is little else to go on as the media appear not to have asked the question and/or reported the answer - preferring the sensationalism aspect - much to the perpetrators advantage it would appear.

I will go further and say that the media have not being saying that they were model neighbours and industrious contributors to their community which would compound an outrage. They have said nothing at all.

solice · 23-06-2009 5:57pm

opo wrote: »

I honestly do not know. I have been flayed here for asking the same question.

I have already stated that I suspect that they were crammed into the houses they lived in - perhaps 20 or 30 to a home. That on its own is not a good sign. After that there is little else to go on as the media appear not to have asked the question and/or reported the answer - preferring the sensationalism aspect - much to the perpetrators advantage it would appear.

I will go further and say that the media have not being saying that they were model neighbours and industrious contributors to their community which would compound an outrage. They have said nothing at all.

I admire you for asking and I ask the same question...Did these people do something to deserve they way they were treated?

But I think its a stretch of the imagination to link a suspicion of something without proof, even if it was true, to actual criminality.

And I also think its unfair to blame the press for not covering the Romas criminal behaviour for fear of being un-pc. Maybe the press is not covering their illicit behaviour because there is no illicit behaviour to cover? Its not like some of the tabloids are worried whether they are pc or not...

wes · 23-06-2009 5:57pm

opo wrote: »

I will go further and say that the media have not being saying that they were model neighbours and industrious contributors to their community which would compound an outrage. They have said nothing at all.

There were plenty of people in the local community who helped them. Several locals went to protect them from the attackers. The local church took them in. There is nothing to suggest that these people were hated by the majority of the community. In fact the reaction from the community would suggest otherwise imho.

It seem clear to me, there attackers were a small irrational group of racist thugs.

23-06-2009 5:59pm

opo wrote: »

That and the perception that unqualified racists (bizzarely) acted spontaneously and unilaterally.

I presume they planned it, and there was nothing spontaneous at all.

Not sure what is meant by 'they acted unilaterally'. I don't think they got the agreement of the Roma people, no, so to that extent it was 'unilateral'.

And, being racists, I'm not sure we should bother looking for logic or reason in their actions, when they were spawned by prejudice and irrationality.

opo · 23-06-2009 6:00pm

wes wrote: »

There were plenty of people in the local community who helped them. Several locals went to protect them from the attackers. The local church took them in. There is nothing to suggest that these people were hated by the majority of the community. In fact the reaction from the community would suggest otherwise imho.

It seem clear to me, there attackers were a small irrational group of racist thugs.

In my attempt to find (google) the answers, I did come across this today:

http://skinflicks.blogspot.com/2009/06/pogrom-that-wasnt.html

The chap may be right or wrong, but he is from there and I suspect has a better handle on the situation than anything I have seen in the media.

opo · 23-06-2009 6:06pm

solice wrote: »

I admire you for asking and I ask the same question...Did these people do something to deserve they way they were treated?

But I think its a stretch of the imagination to link a suspicion of something without proof, even if it was true, to actual criminality.

And I also think its unfair to blame the press for not covering the Romas criminal behaviour for fear of being un-pc. Maybe the press is not covering their illicit behaviour because there is no illicit behaviour to cover? Its not like some of the tabloids are worried whether they are pc or not...

Roma behaviour is old hat, even to the tabloids.

I suspect race riots are a better seller for any paper.

23-06-2009 6:12pm

opo wrote: »

he is from there and I suspect has a better handle on the situation than anything I have seen in the media.

Ah the internet. The soapbox for every nut who wants the air of publicity.

Not sure if he has a better handle and all the media are wrong across the board and he's right. There's a whole other conspiracy in that. You think a couple of youngsters in Belfast have some influence in the upper echelons of Sky, RTE, BBC etc.? or we can't trust the media but should trust Mr. JC Skinner?

djpbarry · 23-06-2009 6:15pm

opo wrote: »

In my attempt to find (google) the answers, I did come across this today:

http://skinflicks.blogspot.com/2009/06/pogrom-that-wasnt.html

The chap may be right or wrong, but he is from there and I suspect has a better handle on the situation than anything I have seen in the media

He may be right or wrong, but he claims to know what he's talking about, therefore he's obviously more reliable than the horribly biased media, who won't tell me what I want to here.

Nodin · 23-06-2009 6:59pm

opo wrote: »

On (....)for some.

Still sliming out that stuff eh? Get a source for your claims of provocation or withdraw it. And no, the blog isn't one.

23-06-2009 7:06pm

Why is everyone arguing about Roma when all the headlines + articles are about Romanians?

Did I miss something?

opo · 23-06-2009 7:16pm

Nodin wrote: »

Still sliming out that stuff eh? Get a source for your claims of provocation or withdraw it. And no, the blog isn't one.

Were you trying to figure out the quote button or something?

Oh, I don't dance to your tune so less of the imperious prig.

opo · 23-06-2009 7:21pm

bluewolf wrote: »

Why is everyone arguing about Roma when all the headlines + articles are about Romanians?
Did I miss something?

Maybe this?

http://tinyurl.com/m4z428

23-06-2009 7:23pm

opo wrote: »

Maybe this?

http://tinyurl.com/m4z428

Cheers, all the newspapers I've read on it have been saying romanian

I'm starting to wonder if they themselves know the difference

djpbarry · 23-06-2009 7:24pm

bluewolf wrote: »

Cheers, all the newspapers I've read on it have been saying romanian
I'm starting to wonder if they themselves know the difference

It is possible to be both.

opo · 23-06-2009 7:30pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah the internet. The soapbox for every nut who wants the air of publicity.

Not sure if he has a better handle and all the media are wrong across the board and he's right. There's a whole other conspiracy in that. You think a couple of youngsters in Belfast have some influence in the upper echelons of Sky, RTE, BBC etc.? or we can't trust the media but should trust Mr. JC Skinner?

Were you ever burned out of your home In Belfast as his family were? Isn't he a victim too or does he have to prove that to you as well? Why is he the "nut" whilst your a voice of sanity?

Romanians Victims of Racist Attacks

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