AFTER HOURS DOUBLE STANDARDS

handsomecake

Ponster wrote: »

Yes. That is exactly it.

as in non conformists with the decided mood that rabies or whoever decides to pick.


i also notice that you never see one after hours mods punning,and another one pulling him up on it. they are kind of guilty by association and back each other up regardless for fear of having a mind of their own.

rabies and terry(in another thread) acknowledge that they handled the air france thread badly but where were java boy and dr bollocko. how come they didnt tell them to cop on..........oh thats right,because its one rule for you and rule for the rest of us.that air france thread pissed me right off.........more so then the girl who got to watch the poxy film before she died.but because the boys from after hours decided it upset them then we all had to geniflect and weep with them.

another boards.ie poster came on ,declared she was related to a member of the deceased on the plane and ye all carried on.nobody here knows /or is related to that girl in america.
but it touched the mods so despite the incredibly obvious hypocrisy we had to sing of your hymn sheet. well that completely stinks if you ask me and my banning is complete and utter nonsense. especially seen as its permanent.if you apply the same criteria to everyone else like you did to my banning then after hours would be a ghost town. but you dont because you have too many 3000 plus post count buddys who meet you for beers etc and who you know face to face and hence have get out of jail free cards

handsomecake

also tell me why this guy is waiting so long on an answer.its not just me who thinks i got shafted http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055598331

handsomecake

and what about this:Second that, you can't just pick on someone on one thread and then have a free for all on another, it really is petty.

Handsomecake to be re-instated i feel.



I'm actually with handsomecake on this one, you can't allow people to take the piss out of, for example - a serial rapist where 10 rape victims are involved and allow comments like this :


Quote:
whats the crime? a beautiful woman having sex with all these men..call the FBI
and similar with taking the piss out of a down syndrome boy, and allow a comment like this


Quote:
why doesn't she ride him...... I mean they're not related.

or this in a thread about suicide


Quote:
i secretly admire people who kill themselves.
and then ban people for similar comments on this thread? If you allow it elsewhere, how are people supposed to know what is allowed and what is not?

handsomecake

or these:


^ to be honest I see his point. It's totally hypocritical to forbid anyone to make light of a ten year old girl dying yet allow jokes about Jade Goody and the Air France tragedy.

Either everything should be sacred, or nothing should be. Very sad story. Fair play to Pixer

handsomecake has a fair point, I read a few pages of the Air France thread and just left it

__________________

Ponster

handsomecake wrote: »

If you allow it elsewhere, how are people supposed to know what is allowed and what is not?

Amazingly enough 99% of people who post in AH manage on a daily basis to know where the line is.

True, sometimes it's a little hard to spot and generally mods will make allowance in these cases. But as you know it all comes down to post #7. Had that not been there then any off-topic posts would have been replied to with just an on-thread warning.


I have this feeling though that should that have been the case, the same people would have ended up posting the way they did, the same people would have been banned and this thread would still have been started.

I'm just surprised that no one has mentioned nazis or freedom of speech yet.

Rabies

As I already said. Its all about how the thread starts.

I think I'm going around in circles here.

Screw it, I'm going home. Time for pizza and bed.

javaboy

handsomecake wrote: »

rabies and terry(in another thread) acknowledge that they handled the air france thread badly but where were java boy and dr bollocko. how come they didnt tell them to cop on..........oh thats right,because its one rule for you and rule for the rest of us.that air france thread pissed me right off.

I'm not going to explain myself to you. It suffices to say that I wasn't in a position to wade in on a large controversial thread at that time.

another boards.ie poster came on ,declared she was related to a member of the deceased on the plane and ye all carried on.nobody here knows /or is related to that girl in america.

Subsequent threads taking the piss on the Air France tragedy were deleted/locked precisely because members of Boards were related or knew some of the deceased directly.

You don't seem to be able to let the Air France thing go. The mods have held up their hands and said they didn't do a good job. Now when we try to put that right for the next controversial thread, you complain.

Seriously I have to wonder if you're more interested in getting digs in than in actually seeing an improvement in moderation.

if you apply the same criteria to everyone else like you did to my banning then after hours would be a ghost town. but you dont because you have too many 3000 plus post count buddys who meet you for beers etc and who you know face to face and hence have get out of jail free cards

I'm the mod who permanently banned you. I have met about 4 people who have posted in After Hours. Between them they probably have about 30 posts in the forum in total. I haven't been to a Boards beers. I have banned several 3000 plus post count users. I have banned people I would consider myself friendly with online.

Did you ever think maybe that it's just you?

Rabies

handsomecake

javaboy wrote: »

I'm not going to explain myself to you. It suffices to say that I wasn't in a position to wade in on a large controversial thread at that time.



Subsequent threads taking the piss on the Air France tragedy were deleted/locked precisely because members of Boards were related or knew some of the deceased directly.

You don't seem to be able to let the Air France thing go. The mods have held up their hands and said they didn't do a good job. Now when we try to put that right for the next controversial thread, you complain.

Seriously I have to wonder if you're more interested in getting digs in than in actually seeing an improvement in moderation.



I'm the mod who permanently banned you. I have met about 4 people who have posted in After Hours. Between them they probably have about 30 posts in the forum in total. I haven't been to a Boards beers. I have banned several 3000 plus post count users. I have banned people I would consider myself friendly with online.

Did you ever think maybe that it's just you?

my opinion may be subjective but no i dont think its just me.some of my posts were thanked. there is another thread in help desk from a guy unknown to me who thinks i was shafted.i got a pm from another guy who thinks i got rode. i dont think im alone in my thoughts on this

The Sweeper

Handsomecake

You can continue to talk about this until you're blue in the face, but it stands as follows: if the AH forum moderators had simply started banning users from the Pixar thread with no warning, then I would accept any user complaint that this was against the usual flow of After Hours.

But on the first page of the thread, the forum moderators set a tone.

They're allowed to do that.

And users need to pay attention to it. If you don't like the tone, then you can open a Feedback thread stating you think the subject matter should be exposed to a level of ridicule that you're comfortable with, before you manage to get yourself banned.

As it stands, this boils down to one very simple, site-wide concept: you never, ever go against the forum moderator on-thread.

Piste

johnny_knoxvile wrote: »

I was banned from After Hours for allegedly "Trolling", merely because I made a cynical comment about corporate America in the following thread:

Pixar does decent by a dying 10yr old girl

My posts are there for everyone to see.

I made a valid point, I was at no time offensive or insensitive, I merely expressed a point of view.

The Moderator that banned me, in a thread about the Air France crash, made the following comment:

'My first thought was to mail people the link saying "May contain lost spoilers."
Now they all think I'm a callous bastard'.

When another Boards user (Fink Goddie) stood up for me and pointed out the hypocracy of the banning she too was banned and had her posts removed.

I've seen a lot worse said than what either of us said on a daily basis in AH and it is not banned. Suddenly people get over emotional over a certain subject matter and a little close knit group on AH close ranks and start deciding to ban anyone who's opinion differs.

Fair play to "stevie cakes" and "handsomecake" for also pointing out the double standards at the risk of getting banned. And to the moderator "Piste" who seemed to be the only moderator with an objective view.

Thank you for your reading.

Mr. Knoxvile

Can I just point out, I don't mod AH. Thea Leaving Cert, Junior Cert and Clearasil and Hormones forums are nothing to do with AH. When I post in AH I do so as a regular poster with no more powers or immunity to punishment than you.

Knife-WREEENCH wrote: »

johnny_knoxville, you can't complain about your ban because you did ignore Rabies' warning in Post #7. Personally, I didn't particularly agree with that warning (or the modding of that thread in general) but nonetheless it was there and you continued to ignore it.
I think both yourself and handsomecake had valid points, but you didn;t put them across the right way.

I agree with him, (this is not a mod conspiracy just because Knife-WREEENCH is a mod!) I believe you should have been banned as you straight away broke the rule of the thread, but I don't believe that warning should have been there inthe first place. As I already said in that thread, either everything is sacred or nothing is.

handsomecake

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

Handsomecake

You can continue to talk about this until you're blue in the face, but it stands as follows: if the AH forum moderators had simply started banning users from the Pixar thread with no warning, then I would accept any user complaint that this was against the usual flow of After Hours.

But on the first page of the thread, the forum moderators set a tone.

They're allowed to do that.

i didnt realise it was an automatic ban. i have been watching people post in similar fashions for months now. maybe my conduct would have been different had i have known of the ramifications(which i still disagree with)

The Sweeper

Everything is sacred, or nothing is.

I don't agree that this needs to be applied to After Hours. After Hours was never designed to be the definitive pisstake forum of boards.ie. If the forum moderators want to set a tone on a thread, they can. It's up to them. If it's clear, e.g. on the front page or in the thread title, then it's up to users to pay attention to the threads they're posting in. Caveat poster, if you like.

Making everything or nothing sacred sets a rule that's unsustainable depending on the subject matter. In real life, something are sacred, and some things are not. It's not as simple as black and white.

For instance, sometimes boardsies die. And sometimes their friends and family, who know they use boards.ie, will post a thread announcing that their loved one has died. That thread often goes into After Hours because it's the 'central gathering place' of boards.ie. That's not the sort of thread where we would allow people to take the piss. That doesn't mean the AH mods are going to start cracking down on everything on every thread. Why should they?

As Ponster pointed out above, thousands of users manage to not get banned from After Hours every week. However, none of them start Feedback threads about the week where they didn't get banned.

The Sweeper

handsomecake wrote: »

i didnt realise it was an automatic ban.

This was the post by Rabies:

Good work by Pixar.

If anyone throws in typical AH comments in to this thread I'll ban their ass. Try to have serious thread for once.

I fail to see how it could have been made any more clear.

javaboy

Piste wrote: »

As I already said in that thread, either everything is sacred or nothing is.

Have you thought about all the ramifications of having such a policy?

Anyway that is not the policy on After Hours and never was.

handsomecake

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

That thread often goes into After Hours because it's the 'central gathering place' of boards.ie.

i was told in another help desk thread that this is the atitude you want to deter. that after hours ISNT the central gathering place of boards and that the sub forums should be used appropriately.another mod orestes( in the autistic help desk thread) is of the opinion that after hours IS WITHOUT DOUBT the piss taking forum on boards regardless of thread content.

The Sweeper

No, the attitude we want to deter is people posting questions that are suitable for other forums in After Hours because they're either too lazy to find the correct forum, or they believe they'll get more responses to their post in After Hours.

There is no other forum on boards.ie that would be particularly "suitable" for the Pixar thread. It could fit, in some way, in a lot of other forums, because it's a general topic, but it also fits in AH, because it's a general topic.

As for what Orestes thinks of After Hours, one mod's opinion doesn't make the policy of an entire bulletin board.

brianthebard

Alan Rouge wrote: »

I'd like to talk about the absurdity of this story gaining such coverage but which forum is appropriate ?

There's the secret funny forum where there's some comments might fit in , fair enough.
Humanities isn't much more than a sort of dumpin' ground for stray threads that no one wants.
After Hours has put the fut down (and I'm not complaining btw)
Politics won't want to broach such a thorny issue I don't think.


I think it is ridiculous that some dying 10 yr old gets shown a DVD and then it's worldwide news and there's a kid dying every three seconds according to Bonio and they don't get DVDs.

Alan Rouge wrote: »

I'd agree with this but I don't know if there's much point in putting any points that aren't "oh my god I'm crying this is so sad and heart warming".

It's grand that natives and mods there want to keep things away from "ah let the bitch rot" but there's a decent discussion to be had I think.

Agree completely. The amount of rape jokes, misogyny, sexism, racism, xenophobia and minority bashing that is considered normal AH content, but god forbid anyone would question the motives of a multibillion dollar corporation showing a girl a fecking dvd. That sort of thing is clearly sacrosanct.

Nick_oliveri

Good work by Pixar.

If anyone throws in typical AH comments in to this thread I'll ban their ass. Try to have serious thread for once.

Typical AH comments in AH shocker!
Come on guys. The thread and the warning IMHO should not have been.

When the thread was started and the warning was issued. We all knew what was gonna happen. The controversy. Now theres two threads in this forum and two in helpdesk. Both threads on helpdesk make valid points along with this one (for and against).

The same ****ing controversy happened with the other dead people, in AH!

Rabies wrote:

Screw it, I'm going home. Time for pizza and bed.

Pizza and bed at 9.30 in the morning? :pac: Im sure a lot of people have a sore head today..

KnifeWRENCH

handsomecake wrote: »

i got banned permanently.absolutely outrageous.im reading a margaret thatcher thread here and even the op wants her dead!! banned? no not at all and thread still open. i said i wanted the little girl dead( to prove a point)and i get banned. i have campaigned for more serious posting in after hours and was laughed out of help desk.

In fairness, that was an extremely stupid trollish thing to say, regardless of what point you were trying to prove. You definitely deserved to be banned for it, although I do think a permanent ban is too extreme.

that guys finding chemo pun was genius( although tasteless)

I thought it was funny too, and I've seen many posts equally or more tasteless than that being allowed.

it appears to me that after hours is a bit of a clique with the same people thanking each other and entering into pun contests the whole time.non conformists get banned

If that's your attitude, you're not going to get very far here. There is no mod cilque and there isn't any prejudice against newer users. You're just searching for things to complain about now.

brianthebard wrote: »

Agree completely. The amount of rape jokes, misogyny, sexism, racism, xenophobia and minority bashing that is considered normal AH content, but god forbid anyone would question the motives of a multibillion dollar corporation showing a girl a fecking dvd. That sort of thing is clearly sacrosanct.

I was gonna thank that post but have only now realised that there's no thanks button in Feedback. anymore. How long has that been the case?!

EDIT: 5,000th post! I really should have picked a better forum to have it...

Ponster

Knife-WREEENCH wrote: »

How long has that been the case?!

not long

Gummy Panda

Nick_oliveri wrote: »

Pizza and bed at 9.30 in the morning? :pac: Im sure a lot of people have a sore head today..

he lives in New Zealand

Nick_oliveri

Gummy Panda wrote: »

he lives in New Zealand

Ahh! I still maintain it would be somewhat awesome to do such a thing on a Sunday morning!

javaboy

Knife-WREEENCH wrote: »

You definitely deserved to be banned for it, although I do think a permanent ban is too extreme.

The ban was permanent because of the user's record: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/modutils.php?username=handsomecake&action=history [mods only]

It was not too extreme.

KnifeWRENCH

javaboy wrote: »

The ban was permanent because of the user's record: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/modutils.php?username=handsomecake&action=history [mods only]

It was not too extreme.

Apologies, I assumed the permaban was solely for his comments on that thread. Didn't realise he had been banned from AH so many times before.

Rabies

Nick_oliveri wrote: »

Pizza and bed at 9.30 in the morning? :pac: Im sure a lot of people have a sore head today..

No. Its 3:10am and I went drinking instead of going home. We're not all based in Ireland
i Need sleep and water.

orestes

handsomecake wrote: »

i was told in another help desk thread that this is the atitude you want to deter. that after hours ISNT the central gathering place of boards and that the sub forums should be used appropriately.another mod orestes( in the autistic help desk thread) is of the opinion that after hours IS WITHOUT DOUBT the piss taking forum on boards regardless of thread content.

I don't mod After Hours, the moderation of that forum is nothing to do with me and my personal opinions on the nature of humour are completely irrelevant in this discussion.

Terry

Nick_oliveri wrote: »

I think having that thread there was asking for trouble, at the stage the thread was at the posters were probably just skimming over a lot of the posts or reading the OP and replying.

People really do not need to make a joke out of everything.

Im not saying thats any excuse but when it comes to the venue FFS Rabies what did you expect? A life is a life and I really cant see the difference in the much compared Air France thread. Actually I do see the difference, it was a much larger tragedy, obviously not on you guises heartstrings though.

And it was good in the runup to this, the jokes were original or well executed in other threads and yes, they remained somewhat offensive or downright outrageous for random things. A lot of posters is take the piss out of the subject on random threads.

But really, sort out a bleeding heart forum. Weve had Jade, that Irish model that nobody cared about till she died and now oh look theres controversy over some other dead person in AH of all places. Heartbreaking story and all but FFS, wrong forum.

Theres obviously demand for something like a Bleeding Heart Forum. Remember teh Jade Goody thread that was created to serve the one purpose of the users paying their respects? This is a similar thread... on AH, the banter place, the random place where the funnehs are created. It doesnt come across as the pay your respects to this random poor kid or GTFO places. But what do I know, **** changes right?

IMHO the thread did not belong there. Anyone who couldn't see the lulz brigade coming in to "lighten the mood" needs to wake up. Im not saying it was right, but it was coming.

Don't read the thread.
It's really that simple.

Piste wrote: »

I agree with him, (this is not a mod conspiracy just because Knife-WREEENCH is a mod!) I believe you should have been banned as you straight away broke the rule of the thread, but I don't believe that warning should have been there inthe first place. As I already said in that thread, either everything is sacred or nothing is.

I believe I well and truly disproved that and earned myself a permanent ban from C&H in doing so.

brianthebard wrote: »

Agree completely. The amount of rape jokes, misogyny, sexism, racism, xenophobia and minority bashing that is considered normal AH content, but god forbid anyone would question the motives of a multibillion dollar corporation showing a girl a fecking dvd. That sort of thing is clearly sacrosanct.

Report the posts.

Red Sleeping Beauty

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

No, the attitude we want to deter is people posting questions that are suitable for other forums in After Hours because they're either too lazy to find the correct forum, or they believe they'll get more responses to their post in After Hours.

There is no other forum on boards.ie that would be particularly "suitable" for the Pixar thread. It could fit, in some way, in a lot of other forums, because it's a general topic, but it also fits in AH, because it's a general topic.

As for what Orestes thinks of After Hours, one mod's opinion doesn't make the policy of an entire bulletin board.

brianthebard wrote: »

Agree completely. The amount of rape jokes, misogyny, sexism, racism, xenophobia and minority bashing that is considered normal AH content, but god forbid anyone would question the motives of a multibillion dollar corporation showing a girl a fecking dvd. That sort of thing is clearly sacrosanct.

Is it worth considering that "serious alternative" to AH then ?

Terry wrote: »

Report the posts.

The point is on that thread it's dodgy ground if you want to question the motives or absurdity of what Pixar did. The strict moderation meant that anything other than "omg I'm in tears" wasn't welcome.

Gordon

Alan Rouge wrote: »

Is it worth considering that "serious alternative" to AH then ?

There is a discussion on this already.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055581763