IMPORTANT INFO RE SWINE FLU

marco_polo

samson09 wrote: »

Baxter scientists patented the “swine flu” vaccine two years before outbreak of “novel swine flu” virus * Austrian Baxter scientist involved in H1N1 vaccine patent also advises WHO

By birdflu666

Otfried Kistner, the head of virology at Baxter’s Austrian subsidiary in Orth an der Donau, which contaminated 72 kilos of vaccine material with the live bird flu virus and sent it to 16 labs this February, was part of the Austrian-based Baxter team that applied for a provisional patent for the “swine flu” H1N1 vaccine in August 2007, almost two years before the first “swine flu” outbreak in Mexico City in April2009 in a location about 50 kilometers from a Baxter facility.

Baxter’s Vaccine Patent Application US 2009/0060950 A1 gives “Kistner et al” as the applicant for the patent for the H1N1 vaccine that was provisionally filed on August 28, 2007.

http://www.theoneclickgroup.co.uk/documents/vaccines/Baxter%20Vaccine%20Patent%20Application.pdf

Also Kistner is an advisor to WHO and took part in the WHO meeting in Geneva 2005 on the Evaluation and Development of Influenza Pandemic Vaccines.

http://209.85.129.132/search?q=cache:VwWbwsW7dc4J:www.who.int/vaccine_research/diseases/influenza/Kistner.pdf+ottfried+kistner&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk

It was WHO which supplied Baxter with the live bird flu virus that Baxter used to contaminate 72 kilos of vaccine material, sending it to 16 labs in four countries, neary sparking a pandemic in Febuary.

Source for story: http://birdflu666.wordpress.com/2009/07/17/baxter-team-patents-the-swine-flu-vaccine-two-years-before-swine-flu-outbreak-austrian-baxter-scientist-involved-in-h1n1-vaccine-patent-also-advises-who/

Nice hyberbole however the reality is a little disappointing when you read the document. I appears to be a method of general viral vaccine production, this is not the same thing as 'patenting h1n1 vaccine' which is interestingly not mentioned in the document at all.

samson09

marco_polo wrote: »

Nice hyberbole however the reality is a little disappointing when you read the document. I appears to be a method of general viral vaccine production, this is not the same thing as 'patenting h1n1 vaccine' which is interestingly not mentioned in the document at all.

Yes it does. Read it again.

marco_polo

samson09 wrote: »

Yes it does. Read it again.

Ok I see it now in a list of all known flu subtypes. Still it is not a patent of a swine flu vaccine, just a patent on a refined viral vaccine production process. So the decription accompanying the document link is a flat out lie. Not suprising given the find the average Conspiracy theorist is about as honest as a creationist.

samson09

marco_polo wrote: »

Ok I see it now in a list of all known flu subtypes. Still it is not a patent of a swine flu vaccine, just a patent on a refined viral vaccine production process. So the decription accompanying the document link is a flat out lie. Not suprising given the find the average Conspiracy theorist is about as honest as a creationist.

You need to read it again. It's an application for a patent. No need to be nasty marco.

marco_polo

samson09 wrote: »

You need to read it again. It's an application for a patent. No need to be nasty marco.

Headline = "Baxter scientists patented the “swine flu” vaccine two years before outbreak of “novel swine flu” virus". :eek:

Actual document = bog standard, run of the mill, viral vaccine production process patent application.

Have I have missed something?

samson09

marco_polo wrote: »

Headline = "Baxter scientists patented the “swine flu” vaccine two years before outbreak of “novel swine flu” virus". :eek:

Actual document = bog standard, run of the mill, viral vaccine production process patent application.

Have I have missed something?

Maybe we should ask an independent observer (such as a mod?) to chip in here, no point going around in circles, we're only creating needless conflict.

Anywho, lets see where we stand at the moment. The latest news is that Germany is preparing itself for a mass vaccination programme to commence in September,while over in Belgium new legislation has been passed that allows the health minister to use the police in the event of forced vaccinations. Brilliant.

Following WHO’s “swine flu” instructions, Germany prepares for mass vaccination in September * WHO assumes control of Belgium police force

Germany’s Health Minister Ulla Schmidt has said that a mass campaign for vaccination against the “swine” flu is to begin in September with “chronically ill patients, health care workers, police officers, fire fighters, public workers and pregnant women” to receive the injections first in response to WHO’s instructions to its 194 member countries to vaccinate their entire populations.

Baxter — one of the very companies that are set to profit from this order — sits on WHO’s advisory vaccine board as an “observer”.
Baxter’s Austrian subsidiary also sent out 72 kilos of live bird flu supplied by WHO this February in an act that can only be explained by assuming criminal intent given the high security standards surrounding biosafety level 3 facilities in which live bird flu virus must be supplied.

Is the German Health Minister — as the Austrian Health Minister appears to be — misusing her office to further the agenda of the pharma companies and in reckless disregard for the lives and health of the German population? Are there financial or other links between Ulla Schmidt and pharma industry?

Although the German government maintains the injection will be voluntary, the laws that are in place to make it mandatory can be activated any time.

Belgium recently announced that it had passed a law allowing the health minister to make use of the police for forced vaccinations. See report on

http://www.rtlinfo.be/rtl/news/article/258062/grippe-ah1n1-loi-d-exception-et-campagne-de-vaccination/

The health ministers of all countries will answer to WHO in the event of a pandemic emergency under pandemic plans passed in each country in 2005 and under the International Health Regulations of 2005. That means that WHO has obtained the ultimate authority over the Belgium police.
—–
Deutsche Welle
July 19, 2009
The German health ministry announced on Friday that an estimated quarter of Germany’s population will be eligible to receive the flu shots. This confirms reports earlier this week that the government had plans to order 50 million vaccine units against swine flu. The vaccines will be available from September, to coincide with an expected surge in flu cases.
Health state ministers late on Thursday agreed that chronically ill patients, health care workers, police officers, fire fighters, public workers and pregnant women can receive the injections first. Two shots are needed for the vaccination to be effective against the (A)H1N1 virus.
“The vaccinations are a precautionary measure,” said health ministry spokesman, Klaus Vater. “No one can tell how the new virus will develop in the coming weeks.”
Despite the priority immunization list, Federal Health Minister Ulla Schmidt insists that everyone who wants to be vaccinated against swine flu, will be able to do so. Protecting the entire population is expected to cost health insurers an estimated two billion euros"

http://birdflu666.wordpress.com/2009/07/20/following-whos-instructions-germany-prepares-for-mass-vaccination-in-september-who-assumes-control-of-belgium-police-force/

For anyone that doubts that an agreement between 194 countries and the WHO exists, which may lead to a "take-over" of the WHO in the event of a pandemic emergency, take a look at this.

http://www.who.int/ihr/9789241596664/en/index.html

The possibilty of mandatory vaccinations is very real folks, whether you believe the vaccine is safe or not. **This does not mean you will be forcibly injected against your will (although this isnt out of the question either), but if you dont have the vaccine you may find life becoming very difficult (you may end up being summoned to court, you might not be allowed to board an aircraft to another country, etc)**- Note, just my opinion here.

Oh yeah, I have ditched the idea of filing criminal charges, now it seems that the best thing to do is to file an injunction in the circuit court. If there are any solicitors/lawyers/barristers who want to help, please pm me!

samson09

APPENDIX 1

STATES PARTIES TO THE INTERNATIONAL HEALTH
REGULATIONS (2005)
1

Except as otherwise indicated, the International Health Regulations (2005) entered into force on 15 June 2007 for the following States:

Afghanistan, Albania, Algeria, Andorra, Angola, Antigua and Barbuda, Argentina, Armenia,
Australia, Austria, Azerbaijan, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belarus, Belgium, Belize,
Benin, Bhutan, Bolivia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Botswana, Brazil, Brunei Darussalam, Bulgaria,
Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cambodia, Cameroon, Canada, Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Chad,
Chile, China2, Colombia, Comoros, Congo, Cook Islands, Costa Rica, Côte d’Ivoire, Croatia, Cuba,
Cyprus, Czech Republic, Democratic People’s Republic of Korea, Democratic Republic of the Congo,
Denmark, Djibouti, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Egypt, El Salvador, Equatorial Guinea,
Eritrea, Estonia, Ethiopia, Fiji, Finland, France, Gabon, Gambia, Georgia, Germany, Ghana, Greece2,
Grenada, Guatemala, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Guyana, Haiti, Holy See, Honduras, Hungary, Iceland,
India (8 August 2007)2, Indonesia, Iran (Islamic Republic of)2, Iraq, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Jamaica,
Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Kenya, Kiribati, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Lao People’s Democratic Republic,
Latvia, Lebanon, Lesotho, Liberia, Libyan Arab Jamahiriya, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Madagascar,
Malawi, Malaysia, Maldives, Mali, Malta, Marshall Islands, Mauritania, Mauritius, Mexico,
Micronesia (Federated States of), Moldova, Monaco, Mongolia, Montenegro (5 February 2008),
Morocco, Mozambique, Myanmar, Namibia, Nauru, Nepal, Netherlands, New Zealand, Nicaragua,
Niger, Nigeria, Niue, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Palau, Panama, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay, Peru,
Philippines, Poland, Portugal2, Qatar, Republic of Korea, Romania, Russian Federation, Rwanda, Saint
Kitts and Nevis, Saint Lucia, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines, Samoa, San Marino, Sao Tome and
Principe, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Serbia, Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovakia, Slovenia,
Solomon Islands, Somalia, South Africa, Spain, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Suriname, Swaziland, Sweden,
Switzerland, Syrian Arab Republic, Tajikistan, Thailand, The former Yugoslav Republic of
Macedonia, Timor-Leste, Togo, Tonga2, Trinidad and Tobago, Tunisia, Turkey2, Turkmenistan,
Tuvalu, Uganda, Ukraine, United Arab Emirates, United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern
Ireland, United Republic of Tanzania, United States of America (18 July 2007) 2, Uruguay,

Uzbekistan, Vanuatu, Venezuela (Bolivarian Republic of), Viet Nam, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe.

There we are, along with the other 193 countries who may soon find themselves answering to the WHO.

marco_polo

May I ask the circumstances under which 194 countries would willingly hand over Sovereignty to the WHO en bloc?

samson09

This will happen in the event of a "pandemic emergency", this will probably be announced sometime in Autumn as we have been told to expect a surge in the number of cases at this time. Countries around the world are already getting ready for this. Most countries have either bought or ordered enough vaccines to vaccinate every single citizen at least twice, and an increasing number of governments are passing legislation that will allow the police to be used in the event of a mandatory vaccination.

Here's the latest news:

CLG UPDATES – China puts in place efficient flu monitoring system while WHO abandons all monitoring requirements * UK government looks set to keep schools open against expert advice and to force vaccinate children in autumn * “Swine flu pandemic” will “tip” UK economy over the brink in worst decline in 90 years

http://birdflu666.wordpress.com/2009/07/21/china-puts-in-place-efficient-monitoring-system-to-check-spread-of-swine-flu-uk-government-looks-set-to-insist-on-keeping-schools-open-against-expert-advice-swine-flu-pandemic-will-ti/

King Mob

samson09 wrote: »

and an increasing number of governments are passing legislation that will allow the police to be used in the event of a mandatory vaccination.

Can you provide a single example of this?

humanji

Maybe you shouldn't rely on an anonymous blog for all your information?

samson09

humanji wrote: »

Maybe you shouldn't rely on an anonymous blog for all your information?

The blog is written by Jane Burgermeister, the journalist who has filed charges in Austria. She has an MA Honours degree from Edinburgh University, Scotland, she has written for Nature, the British Medical Journal, The Scientist, Reuters Health, and The Guardian among other publications. She was also European Correspondent for the website of Renewable Energy World. If you take the time to read it, you will find she references most of what she reports. It is a convenient place to source information as she just tells it like it is and is a great deal less sensationalistic than many others who are covering the "story".

Humanji, I suggest that next time you make a comment on this thread you put a little bit more effort into any questions you send my way. Do you have anything to say about the content of my posts, do you actually have an opinion on this? Or are you just another person who refuses to look at the big picture and is happy to focus on irrelevant trivialities that do not matter. This will affect you, your family, your friends and your children. At the very minimum, these vaccines contain an adjuvant that will cause auto immune disorders in a unknown percentage of people. The WHO itself acknowledged that these adjuvants have relatively no effect on the effectiveness of vaccines.

King Mob: Just in case you are responding to me, you are still on my ignore list. This is all I ever see:

This user is on your Ignore List.

or

This message is hidden because King Mob is on your ignore list.

meglome

samson09 wrote: »

King Mob: Just in case you are responding to me, you are still on my ignore list. This is all I ever see:

This user is on your Ignore List.

or

This message is hidden because King Mob is on your ignore list.

Nothing worse than people who ask difficult questions, ones that might not fit with a preconceived world view.

marco_polo

Yes but I am not understanding is WHY they would accept WHO control?

Also why would anyone need 72 Kgs of a virus, when viruses are such efficient replicators, a couple of grams would be more than enough to generate all the viral matter they would need. What is her source for this claim?

samson09

meglome wrote: »

Nothing worse than people who ask difficult questions, ones that might not fit with a preconceived world view.

If you feel the question is important ask it yourself.

samson09

marco_polo wrote: »

Yes but I am not understanding is WHY they would accept WHO control?

Also why would anyone need 72 Kgs of a virus, when viruses are such efficient replicators, a couple of grams would be more than enough to generate all the viral matter they would need. What is her source for this claim?

They would accept it because they are legally obliged to and also because we have been led to believe that such an action would be in our own best interests.

The 72 kgs was 72 kgs of vaccine material (not just virus) contaminated with live bird flu virus.

"Baxter AG, headquartered in Vienna, and the Austrian subsidiary of the pharmaceutical company Baxter International, headquartered in Deerfield, IL, USA, sent vaccine material contaminated with deadly live H5N1 bird flu virus to 16 laboratories in four countries in winter 2009 before a technician caught the mistake.
The deadly mixture of live bird flu virus and human flu virus were mixed in a biosecurity level 3 facility, where basic protocol and procedures would make it impossible to ever mix a live virus bioweapon with vaccine material by accident"

If you click on the following link and go to pages 31-36 you will find more information (with accompanying sources) under the heading "VII. Evidence as to the role of Baxter and WHO in producing and releasing pandemic virus material in Austria":

http://wakenews.net/Evidence_of_the_use_of_pandemic_flu_to_depopulate_USA.pdf

samson09

For anyone who's interested there's a show on tonight at 1 pm – 3 pm CST (which I think is 7 o clock GMT, it may be 6) where Jane Burgermeister, JoAnne Cremer, Elizabeth Book, Rebecca Campbell and either Dr Carley or Patrick Jordan will be discussing the vaccine story with Bill Ryan.

Follow link on homepage here:

http://www.projectcamelot.org/

marco_polo

samson09 wrote: »

They would accept it because they are legally obliged to and also because we have been led to believe that such an action would be in our own best interests.

The 72 kgs was 72 kgs of vaccine material (not just virus) contaminated with live bird flu virus.

"Baxter AG, headquartered in Vienna, and the Austrian subsidiary of the pharmaceutical company Baxter International, headquartered in Deerfield, IL, USA, sent vaccine material contaminated with deadly live H5N1 bird flu virus to 16 laboratories in four countries in winter 2009 before a technician caught the mistake.
The deadly mixture of live bird flu virus and human flu virus were mixed in a biosecurity level 3 facility, where basic protocol and procedures would make it impossible to ever mix a live virus bioweapon with vaccine material by accident"

If you click on the following link and go to pages 31-36 you will find more information (with accompanying sources) under the heading "VII. Evidence as to the role of Baxter and WHO in producing and releasing pandemic virus material in Austria":

http://wakenews.net/Evidence_of_the_use_of_pandemic_flu_to_depopulate_USA.pdf

Apologies I indeed rember the incident in question now. I assure you I am no lover of large pharmacuticals, and I hope that they get severly punished for it if found guilty, but to suggest that they deliberately set out to kill people is a big of a stretch to put it mildly.

bonkey

samson09 wrote: »

Maybe we should ask an independent observer (such as a mod?) to chip in here, no point going around in circles, we're only creating needless conflict.

You've provided a link to a pdf copy of the patent application. I assume you've looked through this application yourself. Can you point out where you see something which leads you to believe that it is what the headline claimed it to be?

I've had a look through it, but not read it all in detail. From my brief perusal, it is exactly what it claims to be on the very front page - a patent application for a "Method for Producing viral vaccines" (numbered item 54).

samson09 wrote:

Novartis recalled its “swine flu” HIN1 vaccine in February of this year, two months before the outbreak of the allegedly new and unseeen “swine flu” H1N1 outbreak in Mexico City occurred in April.

The current outbreak caused by a strain of H1N1.
H1N1 itself isn't a new subtype.
You seem to be suggesting that the current pandemic-causing strain isn't new because its a strain of a previously-known subtype.

watty

The WHO calls it a Novel H1N1. i.e. a new strain.

samson09

Ah yes, I see what you are saying and I think you are right. Thanks for clearing that up

NewFrockTuesday

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2009/07/23/glaxosmithkline-in-swine-flu-vaccine-profits-row-115875-21541093/

I just saw this in Google news. Just for the stir in

samson09

CLG UPDATES – GSK to earn 1 billion from forced jab classified as bioweapon by EU and US reglators * Protests of no compensation plans for H1N1 jab in the USA

"Swine flu is going to be positive for the performance [of the company].’ Glaxo unmasked: drug firm to make £1bn from swine flu 23 Jul 2009 Britain’s largest pharmaceuticals company could make up to £1bn from sales of its swine flu vaccine by the end of the year, industry analysts said yesterday as the first trials of the drug began in Australia. GlaxoSmithKline is to sell the vaccine for up to £6 a dose in Western countries, and the first supplies are due to arrive in Britain in September. Andrew Witty, GSK’s chief executive, refused to apologise for the boost in earnings, pointing out that GSK had invested more than $2.5bn (£1.5bn) in its vaccine [pandemic] development programme over the past few years.
Swine vaccine will need compensation rules: Expert –No plans here to aid those injured from the immunization 21 Jul 2009 A leading public health expert is calling on Canada to create a no-fault compensation program for people who may be harmed by a swine flu vaccine that millions of Canadians will be urged by the government to get this fall. Kumanan Wilson, Canada research chair in public health at the University of Ottawa, said in an interview with Canwest News Service that children and adults could be exposed to an incompletely tested vaccine and that a compensation scheme is needed to encourage the public to buy into any mass immunization program. [We are not 'buying into' Baxter's pandemic propaganda promoting their WMDs. --LRP]"

http://birdflu666.wordpress.com/2009/07/23/clg-updates-gsk-to-earn-1-billion-from-jab-classified-as-bioweapon-by-eu-reglators-protests-of-no-compensation-plans-for-h1n1-jab-in-the-usa/

meglome

samson09 wrote: »

CLG UPDATES – GSK to earn 1 billion from forced jab classified as bioweapon by EU and US reglators * Protests of no compensation plans for H1N1 jab in the USA

"Swine flu is going to be positive for the performance [of the company].’ Glaxo unmasked: drug firm to make £1bn from swine flu 23 Jul 2009 Britain’s largest pharmaceuticals company could make up to £1bn from sales of its swine flu vaccine by the end of the year, industry analysts said yesterday as the first trials of the drug began in Australia. GlaxoSmithKline is to sell the vaccine for up to £6 a dose in Western countries, and the first supplies are due to arrive in Britain in September. Andrew Witty, GSK’s chief executive, refused to apologise for the boost in earnings, pointing out that GSK had invested more than $2.5bn (£1.5bn) in its vaccine [pandemic] development programme over the past few years.
Swine vaccine will need compensation rules: Expert –No plans here to aid those injured from the immunization 21 Jul 2009 A leading public health expert is calling on Canada to create a no-fault compensation program for people who may be harmed by a swine flu vaccine that millions of Canadians will be urged by the government to get this fall. Kumanan Wilson, Canada research chair in public health at the University of Ottawa, said in an interview with Canwest News Service that children and adults could be exposed to an incompletely tested vaccine and that a compensation scheme is needed to encourage the public to buy into any mass immunization program. [We are not 'buying into' Baxter's pandemic propaganda promoting their WMDs. --LRP]"

http://birdflu666.wordpress.com/2009/07/23/clg-updates-gsk-to-earn-1-billion-from-jab-classified-as-bioweapon-by-eu-reglators-protests-of-no-compensation-plans-for-h1n1-jab-in-the-usa/

I for one am horrified now I know that businesses want to earn as much profit as possible. Shocking revelation.

samson09

meglome wrote: »

I for one am horrified now I know that businesses want to earn as much profit as possible. Shocking revelation.

From a previous post:

"Nothing worse than people who ask difficult questions, ones that might not fit with a preconceived world view.
If you feel the question is important ask it yourself."

Decided the difficult question wasnt worth asking meglome?

Nice to see you back, your insightful contributions have been missed.

bonkey

meglome wrote: »

I for one am horrified now I know that businesses want to earn as much profit as possible. Shocking revelation.

I'm more horrified to find out that the EU and US regulators both have classified this particular vaccine as a bioweapon.

I do note, however, that its an article from the same source who apparently couldn't read a patent application correctly, so I'm wondering if its another case of fact/headline divergence.

bonkey

Samson09 and meglome both...

You guys have been taking pot-shots at each other.

Time to stop.

King Mob

bonkey wrote: »

I'm more horrified to find out that the EU and US regulators both have classified this particular vaccine as a bioweapon.

I do note, however, that its an article from the same source who apparently couldn't read a patent application correctly, so I'm wondering if its another case of fact/headline divergence.

From what I've gathered the reasoning for that is this:
The US restricts the import of certain vaccines (for some flus and smallpox and stuff) into certain countries like North Korea.
The reason for this is that such vaccines could possibly be used in the development of bio-weapons.

Therefore this means that vaccines are a bio-weapon apparently.
But given the website this level of logic isn't surprising.

The truth is that no vaccine is classed a bio-weapon.

samson09

bonkey wrote: »

Samson09 and meglome both...

You guys have been taking pot-shots at each other.

Time to stop.

Hold on a second now, I started this thread intending it to be used as a means for posting and discussing the latest updates on the swine flu, the type of information that you wont get from Anne Doyle or Sharon Ní Bheoláin! Meglome hasnt contributed anything meaningful at all, and continues to post short, cynical and sarcastic comments such as:

"Nothing worse than people who ask difficult questions, ones that might not fit with a preconceived world view"

"I for one am horrified now I know that businesses want to earn as much profit as possible. Shocking revelation".

I'm open to constructive criticism and questioning asI know the topic is relatively "far out" but I shouldnt be expected to put up with the bs. And I shouldnt be warned for defending myself either.

As far as I'm aware, what meglome is doing shouldnt be allowed on the forum

"• Respect other posters
Snide remarks and bitching will not be tolerated"

I would have no need to respond to aforementioned bitching if the bitching wasn't there in the first place. Btw, this is not an attack against you, I hope you see where I'm coming from

bonkey

Samson09 infracted for arguing with mod in-thread

samson09

bonkey wrote: »

Samson09 infracted for arguing with mod in-thread

Ridiculous.

Please delete/close my account.

Adios.

Four-Too

We should ALL press charges against Baxter, the UN and WHO, for attempted genocide and for trying to profit from it. Go to your local-authoritys or Gardai and press charges. If they refuse tell them they are complicit in genocide, show them evidence which is on this website:
http://www.thecrowhouse.com/janeburg.html
The Irish government might be complicit in genocide, they have ordered millions of vaccinations. Perhaps this should be in AH so more people can see it.

King Mob

Four-Too wrote: »

We should ALL press charges against Baxter, the UN and WHO, for attempted genocide and for trying to profit from it. Go to your local-authoritys or Gardai and press charges. If they refuse tell them they are complicit in genocide, show them evidence which is on this website:
http://www.thecrowhouse.com/janeburg.html
The Irish government might be complicit in genocide, they have ordered millions of vaccinations. Perhaps this should be in AH so more people can see it.

You realise that Irish Gardai have no jurisdiction on a foreign company right?
And them refusing to do something they can't actually do doesn't make them complicit.
It's a bit dishonest to say something like that.

MeatProduct

The pharma compaines are in business to make money, no mystery there. That they put money before human welfare is just business. It does amuse me that people actually think big pharma has our health as their main interest. That there is no pressure put on governments by big pharma is profoundly naive.

Anyone who's been around the block for a while has the opportunity to see that the valuing of human life is low. The pharma companies would be out of business if they produced drugs that cured illness rather than the symptoms of illness. It's simple business sense, I would probably do the same in their position. Why remove your market if you don't need to?

Big pharma has an interest in expanding their market, more sick people = more profits. There's no big conspiracy here, just humans doing what they do best, ****ing eachother over.

Nick

nyarlothothep

MeatProduct wrote: »

The pharma compaines are in business to make money, no mystery there. That they put money before human welfare is just business. It does amuse me that people actually think big pharma has our health as their main interest. That there is no pressure put on governments by big pharma is profoundly naive.

Anyone who's been around the block for a while has the opportunity to see that the valuing of human life is low. The pharma companies would be out of business if they produced drugs that cured illness rather than the symptoms of illness. It's simple business sense, I would probably do the same in their position. Why remove your market if you don't need to?

Big pharma has an interest in expanding their market, more sick people = more profits. There's no big conspiracy here, just humans doing what they do best, ****ing eachother over.

Nick

why would you feel the need to fck people over? Beyond the convenience of profit and the market have you questioned the validity of the system and your own ideas regarding what it means to be human?

MeatProduct

nyarlothothep wrote: »

why would you feel the need to fck people over? Beyond the convenience of profit and the market have you questioned the validity of the system and your own ideas regarding what it means to be human?

Being human covers all expressions, what we see at the moment is a particular skill at putting profit before people. Putting sickness before health. This results in ****ing people over. All part of being human, there are nice people and there are a**holes. Not so sure I would behave any differently if I owned a large pharma company.

As to why I feel people need to **** others over, there are many reasons for that but it generally comes down to an emotional/psychlogical lack. A perfectly stable person does not seek to impose anything on another.

Nick

eman66

This smells.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1202389/Government-virus-expert-paid-116k-swine-flu-vaccine-manufacturers.html;jsessionid=F4F04A95F36D15D7D4C703EB8705037A

Four-Too

MeatProduct wrote: »

Being human covers all expressions, what we see at the moment is a particular skill at putting profit before people. Putting sickness before health. This results in ****ing people over. All part of being human, there are nice people and there are a**holes. Not so sure I would behave any differently if I owned a large pharma company.

As to why I feel people need to **** others over, there are many reasons for that but it generally comes down to an emotional/psychlogical lack. A perfectly stable person does not seek to impose anything on another.

Nick

That is the mentality of the people we are trying to fight against!
I gather that you ENTIRELY accept what they are doing right now to the people on this planet...hitting them with swine flu, then a FORCED vaccination which will be even more deadly.....and a more intensified chemtrail spraying effort. Do you value your own life? Your loved ones?? You may, of course, write posts in humour. But I write in all seriousness. It's time we stood up for our rights!!

derry

eman66 wrote: »

This smells.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1202389/Government-virus-expert-paid-116k-swine-flu-vaccine-manufacturers.html;jsessionid=F4F04A95F36D15D7D4C703EB8705037A

A bit of info might help to explain why it stinks and join in the spirt of the thread point out the essential info

Something like top UK advisor for the Swine flu is also on board for Gllaxo the company that supplies the swine flu vacccine.The conflict is clear the advisor want his sponsored vaccine clearing safety hurdles without any safety testing and getting sold to the UK government heath authority preferably without any liabilty to the Glaxo company :eek:

or

dailymail wrote:

A scientist who advises the Government on swine flu is a paid director of a drugs firm making hundreds of millions of pounds from the pandemic.

Professor Sir Roy Anderson sits on the Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (Sage), a 20-strong task force drawing up the action plan for the virus.

Yet he also holds a £116,000-a-year post on the board of GlaxoSmithKline, the company selling swine flu vaccines and anti-virals to the NHS.

A google search under whales and Professor Sir Roy Anderson shows this guy has a history of weird mathamatics that can adapt to suit the government s requirements or the requirements he want the maths to suit

MeatProduct

Four-Too wrote: »

That is the mentality of the people we are trying to fight against!
I gather that you ENTIRELY accept what they are doing right now to the people on this planet...hitting them with swine flu, then a FORCED vaccination which will be even more deadly.....and a more intensified chemtrail spraying effort. Do you value your own life? Your loved ones?? You may, of course, write posts in humour. But I write in all seriousness. It's time we stood up for our rights!!

We all have the mentality of the people we wish to fight against, at some level. Putting blame on others for the "wrong" they are doing is a simple escape and avoidance of personal responsibility.

No where have I stated that I approve personally of forced vaccination. I am very familiar with the exploits of the pharma companies as well as what accounts for proper nuitrition. We wouldn't need pharma companies if everyone ate properly and reduced the toxicity of their environments but that requires personal responsibility. It is us that have created the pharma companies and then we rail against them when they get too powerful.

The best way to "fight" them is to get well, to not be sick. No one makes money off you then, so simple yet so very effective. It's no way near as exciting as getting out and protesting and fighting for our rights but it works.

Nick

derry

MeatProduct wrote: »

We all have the mentality of the people we wish to fight against, at some level. Putting blame on others for the "wrong" they are doing is a simple escape and avoidance of personal responsibility.

No where have I stated that I approve personally of forced vaccination. I am very familiar with the exploits of the pharma companies as well as what accounts for proper nuitrition. We wouldn't need pharma companies if everyone ate properly and reduced the toxicity of their environments but that requires personal responsibility. It is us that have created the pharma companies and then we rail against them when they get too powerful.

The best way to "fight" them is to get well, to not be sick. No one makes money off you then, so simple yet so very effective. It's no way near as exciting as getting out and protesting and fighting for our rights but it works.

Nick

Its not so easy today to eat the so called nutrition diet.

The most the food is grown in factory farm set ups which make the soil defient in Zinc iron magnesium and other important metals. Taking these metals directly often doesnt work as the body needs these metals to be part of a protien molicule that is a plant or animal that has stored these types of metals in a protien form .The large Pharma sell us mostly metal suplements which the body cant use as it is not part of a protien molicule the body can use .The fast factory sytems for eggs and meat production often means low omega 3 levels which also is difficult to get in the correct form from the large Pharma the body can use .

For real supplemts to make up for the bad diet intake from the mass produced food we often need to go to specialist herbal shops or go online to get these products .
Now Big phama wants other sources of real suplements banned so they can sell us junk supplements instead.

You take two outfits at random for example Lidl and Boots both who sell vitamin C tablets.On certian brands the vitiman C has aspertane (nutrasweet ) as the sweetner .If you look up how cancer causing and [
RUMSFEILD'S DISEASE this product is and yet the EU and the FDA licence it you would never take anything with aspertane in it. Diet cola drinks have this aspertane in it and the Venezuela governemt banned the diet cola drinks ,because they say it is poision to humans .Lots of non sugar items in shops like chewing gum also has aspertane in it
I call the into both these places Lidl customer complaints or directly to Boots shop and complain and yet the products are always for sale because it is LEGAL poision to sell as per EU directive .There does exist other sweetner products which have no issies but the big outfits want asperatane to be inside products as it kills us better than other also less lethal artifical sweetners

Then you take water nearly all water in ROI has floride put in it .Most countries in Europe banned its use in drinkling water .Floride is a toxic poision and yet they put it in all drinking water here.The cows and the farm animals all drink the same water that is killing us as it is a cummulitive poision .We eat the animals so even we drink spring water which is pure water (most are municipal florided water anyway ) we still get exposed to this toxic poison .Then Floride is in tooth pase so every day you use tooth paste you injest more poision and worse many force thier kids to consume this poision with teeth cleaning .

Me I am an old codjer so really I dont care for me too much about getting more poision in me as the feckers have already poisioned me over many years but for the younger generation I fight these SOB that poision us in ROI daily.

Most Plastic containers that have water milk orange juice whatever in them are a type that leeches a chemical that is similar to female hormones and can lead to men having a lower testrone levels and cause brewers droop.The cure is extra supplemnts of Pharma testestorone or Viagra so needing the new chemicals to cure the problem they create and so wrecking your health makes big pharma big profits

Basically if you went out of your way to try to make a cocktail that would poision the people of ROI and many other countries then its clear the idea is simple kill the feckers in the world slowly and milk them with expensive medicine as they die out so that they can poision us even more to bump up profits.Poision the water the foods and the enviorment and then poision the medicines as well

The super rich are not interested to supply us good food.They want to supply us bad food preferably toxic with nasty GM in it and any other toxic stuff they can add in as well.Then use big pharma with nasty medicine and vaccines to add to this soup and kill us of even faster and charge us money for the privilage

Now you know who is killing why they killing you and how they killing you you got some chance to stay alive and avoid the toxic soup they dish out to us .

And for Feeck sake think twice before you take the jab to stop this swine flu they invented in a bio weapon lab .Me I ant taking that jab no way

Derry

Four-Too

MeatProduct wrote: »

We all have the mentality of the people we wish to fight against, at some level. Putting blame on others for the "wrong" they are doing is a simple escape and avoidance of personal responsibility.

No where have I stated that I approve personally of forced vaccination. I am very familiar with the exploits of the pharma companies as well as what accounts for proper nuitrition. We wouldn't need pharma companies if everyone ate properly and reduced the toxicity of their environments but that requires personal responsibility. It is us that have created the pharma companies and then we rail against them when they get too powerful.

The best way to "fight" them is to get well, to not be sick. No one makes money off you then, so simple yet so very effective. It's no way near as exciting as getting out and protesting and fighting for our rights but it works.

Nick

I agree that violent protest is not the best way, but we are going to face the sort of difficulties that will make it very tempting for people to turn to violence in the near future. I can see all school children being targeted for vaccination in the autumn, and if I was a parent I would seriously consider keeping my child out of school. Nobody knows, from Brian Cowen down, what is in the vaccine, nor will government officials care.

thecommander

derry wrote: »

Me I ant taking that jab no way

Derry

Are they not supplied as tablets, rather than an injection?

MeatProduct

derry wrote: »

Its not so easy today to eat the so called nutrition diet.

Agreed. It is certainly more difficult to reduce the toxicity in one's environment but the average person can make massive reductions.

Animal products themselves kill more people in the world than any other disease. Heart disease is the biggest killer, the primary cause is cholesterol of which the primary dietary source is animal produce. We don't need it, we produce our own cholesterol. There's pleanty more about animal products that are toxic to the human physiology. Stopping eating animals produce vastly improves your health. The largest nutritional study ever conducted, the China Study, clearly proves this.

Here are some figures from the American Heart Association. In 2005 1,372,000 died from cardio-vascular diseases (a small proportion of these were congeintal). Staggering. Why are we not looking at the cause of this rather than the treatment of it? Simply because treatment makes considerably more money than the cure would.

Now diet is clearly killing more people than the swine flu. An estimated 80 million Americans have some form of heart disease, this means they are not healthy. Not enough oxygen is getting to the organs, including the brain. So how can we expect to tackle all the worlds issues if we can even think properly.

Conspiracy theories are fun and everything, there's an excitment about them. Our problem here is that we project them outside of ourselves and refuse to accept we are complicit. What are any of us eating? We are part of the problem here. Eat meat and you are statistically proven to make more money for the pharma companies. This is the biggest elephant in the living room, let's tackle this one first so we are all alive and more healthy to see to the less important issues.

It makes business sense for the pharma companies to be involved in suggesting what is a healthy diet, that's why meat and dairy is a part of it.

The problem with many people who do not eat meat is that they are uneducated about what constitutes a healthy diet. Many vegans/vegetarians are unhealthy. Coming off animal products requires a good deal of research.

Regarding toxicity there are many more means of reducing environmental toxicity down to levels that the body can deal with without falling sick. This is a massive area and notentirely suited to this discussion.

I agree with you that the quality of food and supplements are a lot to be desired. Vaccinations are highly questionable and I myself will certainly not be queuing up for it. To all my friends and familiy I am recommending the same.

Once I see the pharma/medical industries dealing with the causes rather than symptoms then I will give it a second look. However this is unlikely to happen as it is not in their interests to be having healthy people roaming the planet.

In conclusion, let's fix what is immediately in our power to fix, what we are putting into our bodies on a daily basis.

MeatProduct

Four-Too wrote: »

I agree that violent protest is not the best way, but we are going to face the sort of difficulties that will make it very tempting for people to turn to violence in the near future. I can see all school children being targeted for vaccination in the autumn, and if I was a parent I would seriously consider keeping my child out of school. Nobody knows, from Brian Cowen down, what is in the vaccine, nor will government officials care.

This is of serious concern. I was fortunate enough to have parents that didn't allow me to have vaccinations in school, I'm not sure that will be allowed now. I assume there will be some sort of mandatory vaccination policy for schools.

I'm not sure it's a matter of them not caring, maybe it is, but I think there is another motivation for them to do so. Likely it's some sort of financial or political pressure being put on them. In 2008 the top 50 pharma companies made $637,289,000,000 in profits. That's a lot of reasons to apply pressure to governments.

However, Four-Too, if we were all healthier our bodies could deal with the vaccines more efficiently. All our immune systems are hammered from the crap we ingest and environmental toxicity.

Nick

rameire

i now believe the swine flu was produced and released to Kill all Conspiracy Theorists.
the great beings that run this world released the swine flu knowing that the conspiract theorists would not take the vacine.
thus meaning that most if not all conspiracy theorists would die from the swine flu.
thus leaving the world open to attack without question.

derry

MeatProduct wrote: »

<SNIP>

Regarding toxicity there are many more means of reducing environmental toxicity down to levels that the body can deal with without falling sick. This is a massive area and notentirely suited to this discussion.

<SNIP>

OK lets say we put peopl,e on your diet suggestions and we also feed them lethal doses of arsinic and lets see if your diet will save them from the Arsinic poisioning

Clearly no diet is gonna to work in the face of of serious poisioning.
This link to floride poisioning gives you some idea of the poisioning that virtualy every Irish person or non Irish is subjected to in the ROI.

That means to stop this poision entering you you must drink always non floride water.This means no coffe or tea in public cafe as that uses florided water .No drinks of beer in the pub as that uses florided water.No milk as that uses florided water.You need to to filter out the floride from your bath water so that when you shower you dont get exposed to the floride

Then for the other toxins like aspertane which is in thousands of products including some asprins and medicines thats a similar story as removing yourself from the toxisity of florided water.

Then other things cause issues like the plastic bottle that store water so all bottles that store drinks need to be glass or non plastic.

Dont forget also to use natural soaps made from natural oils to wash with as most soaps are made from toxic products left over from oil refineries operations that are sold off and bagged as soap .That is done rather than pay for the toxic stuff to be disposed of properly.

Then note there is insectiside all over food supplies and that stuff has only one purpose to kill living things and we humans are living things also

Then in the streets of cities or even the interior of cars we are often sujected to fumes from the petrol or deisel fuels .Apart from the cancers these often cause often far worse than smoking cigeratess hazards they cuase serious influx of chemicals that play havoc with the human bodies systems including some chemicals get stored in the bodies fat or bone structures .This chemical soup varies from Ozone exposure a nasty form of Oxegene at low levels on the earth which damages DNA.Then there is benzene from petrol fuels that are really toxic .Then there is toulene and similar chemicals to paint strippers used in petrol fuels to control its octane that are really bad for the human body.In fact bad as deisel is with its soot issues and its Nitros oxide issues it is often less toxic than petrol burning cars.
The cathalistic reator in cars captures a lot of these toxic gasses when the cathalistic reactor is hot after some 5 minutes of engine running .Hower if we assume that most engines in most cars are run for one hour to work and one hour to go home that 10 minutes or more than 5% of the fuel is a toxic poision as it spews out .In dublin city that a lot of toxic soup every day in the city and the dark green smog low over dublin on calm days as seen from Donnybrook shows this clearly .

The solution is if all cars were to burn E85 or 85% alcohol fuel the emmsions would be reduced a tremdous lot and most unburnt fuel would be harmless alcohol which nature soaks up easily.E85 also produces subtansially less Nitric oxides and less toulene or benzene .

Equaly bio deisel is similar in its lesser toxic qualties both to the air and to the land especialy if there is spills as the bio fuel would be soaked up easily by nature .Some soot issues still exist but the use of scrubbers could reduce these issues .The bio deisel doesnt have the same high level of cancer causing issues .

This isnt all the toxic assult on the body every day but gives some ideas on some ways that can reduce the toxic issues .

Then after you remove most all the toxins from the air and water and food the issue of diet can be interesting.

Some new research shows that the big bad cholesterol is yet another invention that the medical feild invented to try to fool us .Then they give us Stattan drugs which are lethal in the short andd long term to many people who take the stattans and the damage is often not reverserable .

Butter is better for you than margerine when you research it so now I do Butter

The concept that eating animals is bad for you is often based on tests where the animals are fed from toxic food supplies so eating toxic animals leads to eting toxic materials that leads to bad health issues.Meat eating natives in darkest Africa and south aamerica dont suffer these issues that you speak of.
Eskomeos in the north pole were 100% meat eaters and often were very healthy .
Studies that are based on city dwellers in third world countries where the like of the local lead battery company pumps large amounts of lead into the air and allows toxins into the local water supply will screw the figures so that it can show eating meat is bad for you .

Meat eating is like anything else eating meat seven days a week isnt probably good for you .However eating meat from factory farms that exist in china or Brazil where toxins can be in the food supply or they use chemicals and harmones to make the animals grow faster will mean eating that meat every day will be sure as hell bad for you .

So for me it Toxin reduction first diet second in the order of heathy living with exersise a important third requirement after these first two are completed .


Lucky in nature there exists natural toxins and so the human has over time gained some abilty to flush out toxins but the human body was never meant to cope with this level of toxity .So we need to plan a program to reduce the levels of ingestion of the toxins so as to reduce the risks .


Vaccines can short circuit the filters our digestive sytem and our protecting skin and make our immune sytem go haywire if the product injected is a oil or mercury or similar product that the body cant cope with .Then many vaccines grow in culture like a pigs kidney and so many other virus grow alongside the desired virus the vaccine wants to produce and the those other virus can gain entry through a vaccine .this can trigger unwanted virus illness effects .

Big pharma and thier scientists knows this but dosent tell us these risks

But then not so long ago thousands of good reputable scientists could garentee us that smoking cigerates was not harmful for us and in fact was good for us .
it was called the big ciggerate company consparsy that the big tobacco companies were knowly killing us to gain profits and the media assured us it was only a consparcy theory that smoking was bad for you .Sure smoking is good for you and the smoking advertizing revenue was sure good for the media and anyway the media is owned by the filty rich who want you all dead ASAP :eek:

derryn

derry

rameire wrote: »

i now believe the swine flu was produced and released to Kill all Conspiracy Theorists.
the great beings that run this world released the swine flu knowing that the conspiract theorists would not take the vacine.
thus meaning that most if not all conspiracy theorists would die from the swine flu.
thus leaving the world open to attack without question.

Why dont you go toddle of and smoke a ciggerate or something usefull to speed up your desire to die ASAP

Derry

bonkey

Rameire and Derry both infracted.

meglome

US Secretary of Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius on CBS news about the seriousness of the H1N1 virus and the vaccine.

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5199389n&tag=related;photovideo

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5199449n&tag=mg;eveningnews

Full testing will be done, voluntary vaccination, etc. Seems to be opposite to what many CT'ers are claiming.