Community Saddened as Carlow Forum Declines

stick-dan

Hi all,

As requested by the powers that be i have moved this post that will air my opinion and indeed worries here to feedback. Just for a little background info this thread is about the decline of the community in the carlow forum and the subsequent withdrawal of what used to be regular posters from it. I used to be the mod of the carlow forum until i stepped down for my own personal reasons.

What i am about to say and the post i will quote from what i said on the carlow forum thread are made by me on the behalf of myself and a number of other carlow boardies plus a few who have yet to openly air their disappointment. In the past week i have received private messages from a number of carlow boards members who have aired their disappointment at the way the forum is being moderated and the direction that it is taking. Each of them has said in some way shape or form and i quote :

"i just don't feel comfortable posting there anymore".

Now the reason i seem to be the one spear-heading all this is because i used to mod this forum and i have seen it grow from an unactive forum to a proper community of regular posters who all enjoyed helping/conversing and debating on the forum and it was a great place to be and i hate to read that people are unhappy. There was great contribution to everyone who needed it and all users were eager to contribute. There was a great community ethos there really was. But lately i've been finding it hard to see any of this ethos or community activity on the forum. Instead the forum is now semi active and is a shadow of what it used to be.

Now this is not what has already been branded as a blatant attack on the moderators but i feel something has gone wrong if i'm actively being encouraged to return and moderate on the forum. Surely that should set the alarm bells ringing there. I'm simply airing my concerns on behalf of those who perhaps feel ill-equiped or too shy to do so. This is not an attack of any sort as i am on good terms with both mods as they will both agree. But when it is brought to my attention that people in the forum, a forum i helped build up, are unhappy well then i am going to give them a voice.

I want this thread to be viewed with a serious approach. If boards doesn't listen to it's community members then what sort of example is that setting. There are other forums that have changed and lost members over this sort of thing before, remember the big debate regarding the photography forum anyone? Members afterwards tended to post less frequently and lots of posters agreed the atmoshere that used to reside in the forum had gone. I just want to raise this concern. Can someone tell me what has gone wrong. Can the people involved please air their views on what they think has gone wrong in the forum in a constructive manner.I hate to see this happening.We need to pinpoint what is wrong and come up with solutions on how to fix it.

Regards
Dan

Below is my original comment from the carlow forum

Well to be honest and let this be a formal open letter to all in this forum. And i would not like it to be moved as it is random and also very relevant to the posters of carlow.

To be honest i am very disappointed in the forum. It is no longer what it used to be. It is blatantly obvious to anyone that myself and other users have been posting less frequently in this forum as well i speak for myself there is a loss of the community spirit here. There has become almost a censorship on this forum in the past few months and it has to stop. I don't want to question of point the blame at anyone but there are limits to what the rules can be applied to.

Moderation is to be about following and enforcing the rules but it must also go hand in hand with common sense. I started as mod sometime around last september i think and this forum had little or no traffic as to that fact you made comments to me in person sully about its lack of traffic. Myself and Patrick at the time worked on the forum, started interesting topics and posters joined in and then as time progressed we sat back as they started the topics and took the forum to the high happy sense of community togetherness that it experienced at its peak. The forum attracted new posters with its new lease of life and a fair few of these posters became regulars and a really strong community bond was formed. We are all on first name basis with each other. That is unheard of in any other county forum.

Where the hell did it all go wrong. What has happened to the carlow forum. This needs to be said. I'm speaking for the community of posters who make the carlow forum what it is. So no this shouldn't result in a ban. I've been contacted by posters of this forum airing their disappointment that they no longer find any pleasure posting here. THIS IS WRONG and it needs to change and quick because otherwards you can welcome back the early days of 2-3 posters maximum which certainly wont require the 3 active mods we have.

I've watched the forum grow and to be fair its pretty ****ty seeing it decline now. If you want move this to feedback but leave it here also for the carlow people to see because there are a lot who agree and without us you wont have a forum. It's a democracy for crying out loud, laugh bicker and snide remark if you want but i used to enjoy posting here and i no longer do. I'm not alone on this and if it warrants me getting a ban then to be honest i don't care because i couldn't be arsed posting here anymore.

Dan

aynon

i am in agreement and have my own thread addressing this, but i do have some different issues. i am putting down my backing publicly here now, aswell.

Sully

All noise and no signal Dan. If we were told what the problem was, maybe we could discuss it? Your lengthy post has talked about how some users have issues and your not happy, but you have yet to say the exact problems. As I said in my PM to you, I am stunned at your behaviour in the forum especially coming from an ex-mod. You keep going on about a "community spirit" and knowing everybody on "first name basis" which is unique on boards, as you say.

However, instead of contacting the mods, you instead had a go at me (I know you apologised over PM, but that's besides the point) and then had a big rant about how the lads were modding the forum. That does not show community spirit, but immature and childish behaviour. You stabbed your "colleagues" in the back effectively by acting like you did. I'm still shocked at it tbh.

If someone had at least tried to contact us, even just myself or Dub13, we could see if something can be done. As a community like you suggest, I would have expected you could have discussed it with the mods you know so well and tried to straighten it all out. If this was done, I wasn't informed anyway (nor was I about your recent on thread warning).

Queen-Mise

This is the first point I would like to mention in reply to Stick-Dan's post.

In the past six weeks since Dan resigned as the Mod of the Carlow forum there has been 178 posts in the Random Waffle Thread.

What is very interesting though in the previous six weeks while Dan was still a mod there was 350 posts.

I checked the six weeks previous to this again, and it was also around the 350-400 mark.

With the type of concern/complaint being made here by users of the Carlow forum, it may be hard to pinpoint exactly where the problem (problem may not necessarily even be the correct word) is but the above is a concrete example of the issues being raised.

I am using this thread as the example because it is one of the centre pillars of the Carlow forum.

stick-dan

Sully wrote: »

All noise and no signal Dan. If we were told what the problem was, maybe we could discuss it? Your lengthy post has talked about how some users have issues and your not happy, but you have yet to say the exact problems. As I said in my PM to you, I am stunned at your behaviour in the forum especially coming from an ex-mod. You keep going on about a "community spirit" and knowing everybody on "first name basis" which is unique on boards, as you say.

However, instead of contacting the mods, you instead had a go at me (I know you apologised over PM, but that's besides the point) and then had a big rant about how the lads were modding the forum. That does not show community spirit, but immature and childish behaviour. You stabbed your "colleagues" in the back effectively by acting like you did. I'm still shocked at it tbh.

If someone had at least tried to contact us, even just myself or Dub13, we could see if something can be done. As a community like you suggest, I would have expected you could have discussed it with the mods you know so well and tried to straighten it all out. If this was done, I wasn't informed anyway (nor was I about your recent on thread warning).

Well firstly i did not want to contradict my "colleagues" because they are just that, my colleaugues. I suggested who to pick in the first place remember for the moderators job. I will freely discuss it if you wish though. I merely started this thread to give the carlow boardsies a place to air their opinions as they were hesitant about doing it themselves so i started it off for them trying to be objective. I'm sorry if i have let you down with my bahaviour but people are not happy sully.it's as simply as that.

I will concede though that it is a little harsh that you seem to be fighting this on all fronts when really you shouldn't be. But the lads will log on soon and have their share to say.The main problems on the forum seem to be as i believe and also have been informed off.

1. Threads are being closed for being off topic when they are not. A recent example in my opinion is the speed trap thread. It was closed due to being off topic where as it was one of the only threads in the last few months that was actually turning into a proper discussion and being debated about speeding in general, which is a little different to a speed trap topic but still near enough to it and when it was worth debating should have been let run.When i was moderator i would have let topics that were properly being debated like that run. I would maybe have had a problem with a speed trap thread notifying users as i think that undo's a gardai's work at making the roads a safer place.

2. There is a general air of inconsistant moderation too. There seems to be days where you go off topic and not a thing is said to you but other days you go off topic and you nearly get a ban. There needs to be consistancy with moderation. Sometimes i say things and i get away with it and other times i am called up on it.

3. There also seems to be a air of if the moderators think it is ok then it's fine even if it is not. Recently i commented on a thread that a Gardai Speeding Checkpoint thread be closed because people who speed should be caught. I asked this on the basis that i had lost someone to speeding and maybe if people who do speed got caught then they would slow down. I was practically told to shut up in that thread by other posters and not once did they get told to cop on. Where is the justice in that? When i was mod i had a problem with a gambling thread as i have personal views on it so i asked patrick to not think of me as a mod in my replies and ban me if my replies warranted it.There seems to be none of that anymore.

4. The overall level of strictness has changed and as the ex mod i used to encourage conversation that i thought would veer back on track and it noramlly would in fairness but now that doesn't happen anymore.

Now sully as you put it so elequantly i have not stabbed my co-mods in the back.It is not my fault they were not online when i decided to act on the complaints. They undoubtably will have their say. I have aired the opinion of the people i used to moderate over. I feel a sense of responsibility to do so. On numerous occasions when i was mod i requested to post "how to improve the forum threads" but you yourself wouldn't allow it. I was a fair mod and i wanted to give the people a chance to speak on how they would like the forum to improve. i'd like to hear from one person on the carlow forum who thinks otherwise so don't attempt to bring down my judgement or character because i wont stand for that. I'm attempting to constructively talk this out, i suggest anyone who posts on this thread do the same. I am merely the representative of the forum.

I'll admit my approach to highlighting this was unorthodox and i shouldn't have posted it in the carlow forum but i wanted to show everyone that i had acted on their wishes. There was no hidden conspiracy. I always fully intended on making a feedback thread as i do, unlike what was otherwise stated, know the role and rules of boards.ie users and moderators alike.As with regard to my recent on thread warning to buy an item off another user i noted the warning graciously and that was the end of that. As i said via pm i have been warned many times before on many occasions by patrick and never once have i viewed the warning with an ill view or approach towards him. So that little fact there needs to be tossed out of the equation.

Regards
Dan

aynon

i must congratulate dan on his reply he has covered alot of the issues, mid draft of my reply i was preempted by this so not to waste it i am throwing my 2 cents into the ring.


the constant "head sticking in" of mods who know nothing about carlow and what makes it run
the same mods know "whats best" for a forum they do not mod on a day to day basis
The inconsistancy on the modding front mods being light and easy one moment then nazi the next.a continuation of that would be a lot of the local posters are now scared to post on it.
the carlow forum is for carlow posters and sometime we want to shar local laughs or what not,
the carlow forum is too strict and formal when it could be an more easy going place. this is showing us
the signs are on it.


main evidence:
there was double the amount of posts in the six weeks before dan
left than the last six weeks. 178 as opposed to over 350.

thats my thoughts on the matter.

SpitfireIV

Ermmm, personally this is all new to me, I had to do a quick catch up in the Carlow forum to see what the heck was going on! . I dont know, would you guys consider me a regular poster over there? Or a one time regular poster? I can say for my part the only reason I havent been as active on there as of late has been down to the weather, yes, its summer and I prefer to be outside then stuck in my room, even at night! As for the number of posts in the RW thread, I dont know, maybe like me more people are out enjoying the recent spells of good weather? Just a though.......

To be honest, all this stuff in the Carlow thread is'nt, nor has'nt affected me yet, I'm not seeing what the issue is, I'm on neither side nor saying good or bad about anyone.

Its just an online forum guys

stick-dan

Yeah croppyboy i haven't seen you around lately so you haven't noticed the change that some people have...apologies if my replies are short i'm on mobile.as i said the reason you wouldn't have noticed is because you have not been posting. There are 3 or 4 people who are just unhappy at the direction the forum is taking this is all dude.not a witch hunt or anything.these people haven't been away from the computer they just didn't feel comfortable posting in the forum...hence why i'm speaking up for them as it was said by a number of people.hope that brings you up to speed.

Super-Rush

I do think that the modding has become a bit too serious on the Carlow forum and it has stopped me from visiting there for the past few weeks. I think that common sense can be used by Mods regarding the direction a post is going/gone. Example would be the speed trap thread. It started with a post telling us where a speed trap is and spiralled(used very loosely) into a debate on whether that location was suitable for a speed trap. Then the thread was closed. Where else can Carlow people discuss the good or bad location of a speed trap in Carlow other than a thread titled Speed Trap Ballon in which the OP says

I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't passed it yesterday morning!
He was standing in the garden of the garda station in ballon behind a newly cut hedge pointing his camera/radar gun at traffic coming from the wexford direction - no car, no visibility, no public awareness, just typical fish in the barrel stuff.
I don't know if it was a camera or if he intended running out the gate to stop cars travelling over the 50 limit.

.

The thread did stay on the subject of a speed trap in Ballon so i can't see for the life of me why the thread was closed. This could have led to a good debate amongst the people of Carlow about something that was happening in Carlow.

Beruthiel

Dan,
As someone who never frequents that forum, your above comments are of no help to me.
I cannot sort out a problem without links to what you are talking about.

Perhaps in the future, you could drop a PM to Sully explaining your problem with a particular decision.
I'm not saying he has to act on it, but at least he would know what you are talking about.

Also, and this is my own personal opinion, (perhaps something we need to discuss for the future), smaller, community based forums like this one could be more relaxed when it comes to modding, a little leeway when it comes to some banter?
Off topic thread perhaps?
Just some suggestions.

Sully

stick-dan wrote: »

Well firstly i did not want to contradict my "colleagues" because they are just that, my colleaugues. I suggested who to pick in the first place remember for the moderators job. I will freely discuss it if you wish though. I merely started this thread to give the carlow boardsies a place to air their opinions as they were hesitant about doing it themselves so i started it off for them trying to be objective. I'm sorry if i have let you down with my bahaviour but people are not happy sully.it's as simply as that.

Your ignoring my point. The method you used to express your concerns (hardly any may I add) was completely unfair. Your all supposed to know each other and get on so well - this is what you always told me. Is this the behaviour of such a forum? I don't think so. There is no point in having a rant with no substance. Nobody can do anything until we know what the problems are bar "We don't like it, we don't know why, but we don't like it".

This thread smacks of a group gaining up on the lads, for no reason at all. Where is the community spirit in that?

I will concede though that it is a little harsh that you seem to be fighting this on all fronts when really you shouldn't be. But the lads will log on soon and have their share to say.The main problems on the forum seem to be as i believe and also have been informed off.

Well, I expected better behaviour/approach from everyone in the Carlow forum. Ill go back and refer to your constant talk about the "community". Personally, I don't see any community after what happened last night.

1. Threads are being closed for being off topic when they are not. A recent example in my opinion is the speed trap thread. It was closed due to being off topic where as it was one of the only threads in the last few months that was actually turning into a proper discussion and being debated about speeding in general, which is a little different to a speed trap topic but still near enough to it and when it was worth debating should have been let run.When i was moderator i would have let topics that were properly being debated like that run. I would maybe have had a problem with a speed trap thread notifying users as i think that undo's a gardai's work at making the roads a safer place.

Iv had a look, and from what I could tell Patrick closed the thread as the original point was turning into a debate (possibly started for that reason, its hard to tell) which was covered before (not only on Carlow, but on Boards in general). Whats the problem with that? I would have probably done the same judging on how things went the last time. As I said below, its hardly undoing the Guards work "making the roads a safer place".

2. There is a general air of inconsistant moderation too. There seems to be days where you go off topic and not a thing is said to you but other days you go off topic and you nearly get a ban. There needs to be consistancy with moderation. Sometimes i say things and i get away with it and other times i am called up on it.

Links? We cant comment until we see some substance. A broad whinge with no proof wont get us anywhere. Ill admit I was very easy going on you, and aynon initially, but with the community spirit ringing in my ear and thinking that this behaviour from you is very unusual I thought after a PM things would settle down and it could be discussed like adults amongst everyone over PM. Clearly not.

3. There also seems to be a air of if the moderators think it is ok then it's fine even if it is not. Recently i commented on a thread that a Gardai Speeding Checkpoint thread be closed because people who speed should be caught. I asked this on the basis that i had lost someone to speeding and maybe if people who do speed got caught then they would slow down. I was practically told to shut up in that thread by other posters and not once did they get told to cop on. Where is the justice in that? When i was mod i had a problem with a gambling thread as i have personal views on it so i asked patrick to not think of me as a mod in my replies and ban me if my replies warranted it.There seems to be none of that anymore.

The thread which you had a go at patrick for starting (here)? We have plenty of these on Boards, and like I said in the topic, the Guards actually publish common speed check zones. There are GPS POI files out there that show reported spots, and the Guards don't care. Sure, you think its outrageous that people would warn people but have you never seen a car flashing their lights to warn you that there is a speed check up ahead? Its common practise, and I guess there is a mentality behind the Guards concept of warning people in advance.

patrick closed it because, as the author, he didn't want a debate on the topic at hand. Ideally that debate should be in the Motors forum anyway, and not Carlow, but I think small pockets of room for off-carlow-topic should be permitted (within reason). But, the mod of the forum decided that enough was enough on the debate and closed it. Likewise, if you started a thread and it went off topic the lads would step in and ask people to get back on topic, etc. If thats your issue (closing rather then trying to get back on topic), maybe patrick will consider a different approach in future if you discuss it with him civilly.

4. The overall level of strictness has changed and as the ex mod i used to encourage conversation that i thought would veer back on track and it noramlly would in fairness but now that doesn't happen anymore.

You keep going on about being a mod, why the hell did you leave if your that fecking wonderful?! If you think the mods are doing a poor job, and different to you, why not just send them a PM and make some suggestions? Even to me, you know full well iv helped out the lads on occasion and advised them the best approach to topics. Why did you have to turn this into a witch hunt for their poor modding as you see it, having a rant about them rather then going face to face on the matter and discussing it? Not a very nice approach for a community forum.

Now sully as you put it so elequantly i have not stabbed my co-mods in the back.It is not my fault they were not online when i decided to act on the complaints. They undoubtably will have their say. I have aired the opinion of the people i used to moderate over. I feel a sense of responsibility to do so. On numerous occasions when i was mod i requested to post "how to improve the forum threads" but you yourself wouldn't allow it. I was a fair mod and i wanted to give the people a chance to speak on how they would like the forum to improve. i'd like to hear from one person on the carlow forum who thinks otherwise so don't attempt to bring down my judgement or character because i wont stand for that. I'm attempting to constructively talk this out, i suggest anyone who posts on this thread do the same. I am merely the representative of the forum.

Was it life threatening that you couldn't fire of a PM at a reasonable hour and try solve this? Did you REALLY have to go behind their backs and start this thread against them? You can polish that up all you like, but thats not on.

As for your suggestions - you wanted a lot more then what the Carlow forum could give, and as a second opinion Dub13 also agreed. You don't own the forum, or Boards - if thats how the site runs, you gotta live with it. If not, start your own Carlow forum where you can all happily discuss what you want, under your control which you keep going on about as being so damn good. Create your own rules, approach differently, etc. This is how things have worked on Boards, sucesfully, so I cant see them going to change it because a handful of people on Carlow are apparently unhappy (so far, its only you).

I'll admit my approach to highlighting this was unorthodox and i shouldn't have posted it in the carlow forum but i wanted to show everyone that i had acted on their wishes. There was no hidden conspiracy. I always fully intended on making a feedback thread as i do, unlike what was otherwise stated, know the role and rules of boards.ie users and moderators alike.As with regard to my recent on thread warning to buy an item off another user i noted the warning graciously and that was the end of that. As i said via pm i have been warned many times before on many occasions by patrick and never once have i viewed the warning with an ill view or approach towards him. So that little fact there needs to be tossed out of the equation.

Regards
Dan

You could have said to the people you keep reffering to "Lads, im gonna discuss this with the mods and see what we can do" or "Lads, have you tired to contact the mods? I'm nothing but a forum user, I cant do anything. If you have problems, why not get in touch with the mods and see what they can do? After that, Sully and Dub13 are always around to hear comments" rather then "Lads, im gonna go for them bald headed. Your all with me right? Ill go to Feedback also!" I wont say that sounds like to me.

Sully

aynon wrote: »

i must congratulate dan on his reply he has covered alot of the issues, mid draft of my reply i was preempted by this so not to waste it i am throwing my 2 cents into the ring.


the constant "head sticking in" of mods who know nothing about carlow and what makes it run

Sorry? It was me who asked for stick-dan to be given the modship, then we discussed it about patrick. I have been with the forum, as have all the mods in that forum, since it became active. We all know very well about Carlow and what "makes it run".

the same mods know "whats best" for a forum they do not mod on a day to day basis

That contradicts above, and your earlier claim about "mass banning" (which I proved wrong, 3 bans since the forum became active pretty much!).

The inconsistancy on the modding front mods being light and easy one moment then nazi the next.a continuation of that would be a lot of the local posters are now scared to post on it.

Here we have a point we can discuss. Can you give me as many links as you can, so perhaps we can see the problem or what is seen to be a problem and improve things for everyone?

the carlow forum is for carlow posters and sometime we want to shar local laughs or what not,
the carlow forum is too strict and formal when it could be an more easy going place. this is showing us
the signs are on it.

From what I can tell.. thats what has been done since the beginning. You were not given room, like you wanted yourself, to discuss other topics completely unrelated to Carlow and a lot more suitable for other forums. Myself and Dub13 both felt by allowing this it takes away from all the other forums and sets a trend for others to follow, effectively killing the ethos of Boards. There isn't even a big enough user base to even warrant a consideration of this. If you want though, feel free to discuss that and maybe the admins can consider it and may even change what we think ourselves?

main evidence:
there was double the amount of posts in the six weeks before dan
left than the last six weeks. 178 as opposed to over 350.

thats my thoughts on the matter.

Well, I cant see how Dan was the wonder-mod/user that brought everyone together. He chatted away like patrick and others. Nothing has changed, bar Dan decided to leave (apparently, nothing to do with moderation so he said). He told me wouldnt be on the forum as much due to work and summer and this trend is continued with another poster above who claims thats his reason for not being active.

Dan is not what makes the forum, never was and never will. No one individually can really "make a forum". There are many reasons why people have slowed down posting, the moderation has a tiny factor because its not that noticable, at least imo, whats wrong.

super-rush wrote: »

I do think that the modding has become a bit too serious on the Carlow forum and it has stopped me from visiting there for the past few weeks. I think that common sense can be used by Mods regarding the direction a post is going/gone. Example would be the speed trap thread. It started with a post telling us where a speed trap is and spiralled(used very loosely) into a debate on whether that location was suitable for a speed trap. Then the thread was closed. Where else can Carlow people discuss the good or bad location of a speed trap in Carlow other than a thread titled Speed Trap Ballon in which the OP says
.

The thread did stay on the subject of a speed trap in Ballon so i can't see for the life of me why the thread was closed. This could have led to a good debate amongst the people of Carlow about something that was happening in Carlow.

[/quote]

True, but I assumed thats because we had the debate before in Carlow. patrick wanted to close it because, as the topic author, he wasn't creating a debate nor did he want one. Though since its an issue, perhaps he will re-consider in future threads and we can tick that off as an improvement.

Looking over deleted/closed threads, just to see what the story is;
- A thread created in Carlow meant for After Hours (as per the topic authors request, may I add) - moved.
- "Name that Lyric game" because it has nothing to do with Carlow - deleted.
- "Off Topic ??" because it was questioning the mods in the wrong forum - closed (as all mods are told to do).
- "Anyone from Carlow Heading to AC/DC, Punchestown Sun 28th June???" - Merged with other threads (on request, may I add) on the same issue, kept in the Carlow forum as its Carlow related - merged.
- "Carlow to Slane Oasis 09" - as above.
- One thread removed on request by an admin, as it was requesting personal information on a Carlow individual - deleted.
- A thread posted across the South East forums, twice, deleted by myself and an Admin as thats against Boards.ie rules. He wasnt a Carlow user - deleted.
- "bus for oxegen 09??" as earlier threads - merged.
- "speedtrap" as discussed earlier, will discuss future ways of dealing and hopefully improve that.
- "Bulling problem in Carlow Primary school" moved to Parenting as its a better forum for it, and thats where he will get the best advise. Even Carlow forum users suggested that - moved.
- "Swans in immediate danger" merged with another thread on the same issue - merged.

Ill stop here as iv gone back three pages, which go into May and we are nearly in July. Only one thread which could have been approached differently, in my eyes. Anything iv missed?

Super-Rush

Looking over deleted/closed threads, just to see what the story is;
- A thread created in Carlow meant for After Hours (as per the topic authors request, may I add) - moved.
- "Name that Lyric game" because it has nothing to do with Carlow - deleted.
- "Off Topic ??" because it was questioning the mods in the wrong forum - closed (as all mods are told to do).
- "Anyone from Carlow Heading to AC/DC, Punchestown Sun 28th June???" - Merged with other threads (on request, may I add) on the same issue, kept in the Carlow forum as its Carlow related - merged.
- "Carlow to Slane Oasis 09" - as above.
- One thread removed on request by an admin, as it was requesting personal information on a Carlow individual - deleted.
- A thread posted across the South East forums, twice, deleted by myself and an Admin as thats against Boards.ie rules. He wasnt a Carlow user - deleted.
- "bus for oxegen 09??" as earlier threads - merged.
- "speedtrap" as discussed earlier, will discuss future ways of dealing and hopefully improve that.
- "Bulling problem in Carlow Primary school" moved to Parenting as its a better forum for it, and thats where he will get the best advise. Even Carlow forum users suggested that - moved.
- "Swans in immediate danger" merged with another thread on the same issue - merged.

Ill stop here as iv gone back three pages, which go into May and we are nearly in July. Only one thread which could have been approached differently, in my eyes. Anything iv missed?

The thread meant for AH was mine of and it was also me who suggested that the threads about bus travel be merged and both mods sorted things out. There was also a thread about the first music gig you went to that was moved to the music forum. This would have been a great thread for the Carlow forum and would have included everyone.

Super-Rush

True, but I assumed thats because we had the debate before in Carlow. patrick wanted to close it because, as the topic author, he wasn't creating a debate nor did he want one. Though since its an issue, perhaps he will re-consider in future threads and we can tick that off as an improvement.

Patrick wasn't the topic author

Sully

super-rush wrote: »

The thread meant for AH was mine of and it was also me who suggested that the threads about bus travel be merged and both mods sorted things out. There was also a thread about the first music gig you went to that was moved to the music forum. This would have been a great thread for the Carlow forum and would have included everyone.

Most of the music threads were merged, I must have missed/assumed one was merged. So, as you have experienced, the mods act on your Feedback. So, why the nonsense of a Feedback thread with a big rant about nothing? Why attack the lads in the Carlow forum?

super-rush wrote: »

Patrick wasn't the topic author

I was talking about this one; http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055579696

On after thought, the newer thread could have remained open (despite the Garda bashing in the first post!) and allowed continue into a local debate on speed traps, but its possible that patrick had a reason for closing it or he felt myself and Dub13 would be annoyed it wasn't in the Motors forum.

I think we both would agree, if any conversation is had that can also be covered in another forum but is specifically locally based discussion wise it should be left but its possible the mods might have misunderstood us. So, ill discuss that further with the lads just to clarify in case there was confusion. I also missed one locked thread for going off topic - often less experience or new(sh) mods may not know the best approach for that, typically you would try get it back on topic before closing it. I probably should have made myself more available to help, as I know patricks time is limited atm.

After that.. I genuinely see no problem with how the forum is run. Iv went back as far as May and iv little to review bar the obvious reasoned ones I discussed. Couple of areas that could be considered for improvement, but nothing major. At least, nothing warranting this Feedback thread and what seems to be a crusade against the local mods.

EDIT: Also note, I have went back as far was when stick-dan was mod. Simply because he seems to be suggesting everything went screwey when he left. From that date until this present day, very little moderation was needed and anything that was done I have mentioned in the form of a list, in an earlier thread.

Super-Rush

Most of the music threads were merged, I must have missed/assumed one was merged. So, as you have experienced, the mods act on your Feedback. So, why the nonsense of a Feedback thread with a big rant about nothing? Why attack the lads in the Carlow forum?

I never ranted about anything i just voiced my opinions about threads being moved when i felt that they could have remained in the Carlow section.

On after thought, the newer thread could have remained open (despite the Garda bashing in the first post!) and allowed continue into a local debate on speed traps, but its possible that patrick had a reason for closing it or he felt myself and Dub13 would be annoyed it wasn't in the Motors forum.

I see what you are saying but a thread about the location of a speed trap in Carlow should remain in the Carlow forum. Its common sense.

I think we both would agree, if any conversation is had that can also be covered in another forum but is specifically locally based discussion wise it should be left but its possible the mods might have misunderstood us. So, ill discuss that further with the lads just to clarify in case there was confusion. I also missed one locked thread for going off topic - often less experience or new(sh) mods may not know the best approach for that, typically you would try get it back on topic before closing it. I probably should have made myself more available to help, as I know patricks time is limited atm.

I agree with you 100%.

After that.. I genuinely see no problem with how the forum is run. Iv went back as far as May and iv little to review bar the obvious reasoned ones I discussed. Couple of areas that could be considered for improvement, but nothing major. At least, nothing warranting this Feedback thread and what seems to be a crusade against the local mods.

I don't see it as a crusade against the local mods, well its not on my part, but i thought the idea of feedback was for us to discuss this kind of thing.

Sully

super-rush wrote: »

I never ranted about anything i just voiced my opinions about threads being moved when i felt that they could have remained in the Carlow section.

Sorry, my comment was more aimed at Dan. It was being made out a lot worse, and so far the Carlow folk who posted here have acted in the complete opposite to what I was told to expect. I'm still waiting to here what the big crime that was comitted is.

I see what you are saying but a thread about the location of a speed trap in Carlow should remain in the Carlow forum. Its common sense.

I agree with you 100%.

I think it might be a misunderstanding from a previous discussion we all had, iv asked the lads to comment when they get a chance just so I know how to approach it.

I don't see it as a crusade against the local mods, well its not on my part, but i thought the idea of feedback was for us to discuss this kind of thing.

Feedback should be a last resort. Im constantly being told that their is a great community in Carlow, yet we seem to have a one mad crusade agains the mods who launched an attack in form on me and on the lads for no reason (at least what I can tell). It seems to be partly in response to a warning, which was justified. If there are small problems, why the need to create a big strom in a teacup? Why not just approach the lads, as a community, and try see if that can resolve things? Its the first approach to take!

Here we are, after an original post with the rant of the century, to discover there actually isnt a big problem at all. A couple of minor things happened, people didnt like it, and all hell breaks loose for the users (so far) to come in and act like "Erm, ya, nothing big or anything but id prefer..."

Super-Rush

I didn't post here to act as back up for anyone, i posted what i posted because i thought that i was following procedure. I didn't think of contacting the mods about it and i do apologise for that. I still reckon that the forum is being moderated too strictly. That is the only agenda i have.

Sully

super-rush wrote: »

I didn't post here to act as back up for anyone, i posted what i posted because i thought that i was following procedure. I didn't think of contacting the mods about it and i do apologise for that. I still reckon that the forum is being moderated too strictly. That is the only agenda i have.

Would it make any difference if the two points I mentioned were tweaked? There the only two examples of moderation I can see as being debatable, and the only two examples.

Super-Rush

Sully wrote: »

Would it make any difference if the two points I mentioned were tweaked? There the only two examples of moderation I can see as being debatable, and the only two examples.

As far as i am concerned yes. I just wish the mods were not so quick to lock or move a thread and give the threads a chance to see where they are going.

Sully

super-rush wrote: »

As far as i am concerned yes. I just wish the mods were not so quick to lock or move a thread and give the threads a chance to see where they are going.

Okay, well lets just wait until the lads get a chance to comment. Then hopefully we can resolve this and move on back to what the forum should have.

Super-Rush

Sully wrote: »

Okay, well lets just wait until the lads get a chance to comment. Then hopefully we can resolve this and move on back to what the forum should have.

Perfect

Villain

2 cents, been from Carlow I frequent the forum the odd time, but to be honest unless a topic is totally related to Carlow I wouldn't start a thread or reply even because threads get closed very quickly and to be honest I can understand why a lot of them are closed e.g. a discussion moves on from been just related to a Carlow topic to one thats on a topic that isn't just related to Carlow, i.e. the speedtrap.

The only thing I would say is I don't see why the threads can't be moved to the relative forum rather than closed that might help?

patrickc

well all that have posted just getting a chance to pop in now.


ive not a lot to say really, i'm disappointed by peoples belittling of the mods, and of the way its all kicked off without any warning.

we are not paid or anything else , we do it in our own free time and out of our own good will,.

as a mod, i make my decisions, purely by our forum charter and by boards rules and guidelines.

I do not think I'm a heavy handed mod, and I think I'm fair and equal , show me where I've been heavy handed.

with regards the speeding thread not my one but the Ballon one I locked it because it was debating into a thread that was suited to motors, I like the idea of been notified of speedtraps myself to be honest, but thats not for here.

Dan must be very special if everyone goes running to him with issues instead of airing them here or in our forum firs, I would appreciate if it was done that way, but it wasn't.

I can pin point why people haven't posted from observing the forum, not going through each issue, but my god theres a lot of pettyness in the forum.

If people don't wish to post in the Carlow forum thats their choice, it's an internet forum and if the "community feel" isn't there, well I'm sorry.



now I've nothing further to add on the matter

feel free to post here with any "nazi" or "harsh" decisions I've made and I'll happily respond to them.


Patrick

patrickc

Villain wrote: »

The only thing I would say is I don't see why the threads can't be moved to the relative forum rather than closed that might help?

if people want them moved I've no problem with that either.

Nead21

CroppyBoy1798 wrote: »

Ermmm, personally this is all new to me, I had to do a quick catch up in the Carlow forum to see what the heck was going on! . I dont know, would you guys consider me a regular poster over there? Or a one time regular poster? I can say for my part the only reason I havent been as active on there as of late has been down to the weather, yes, its summer and I prefer to be outside then stuck in my room, even at night! As for the number of posts in the RW thread, I dont know, maybe like me more people are out enjoying the recent spells of good weather? Just a though.......

To be honest, all this stuff in the Carlow thread is'nt, nor has'nt affected me yet, I'm not seeing what the issue is, I'm on neither side nor saying good or bad about anyone.

Its just an online forum guys

i agree with this completely. i haven't been online as much cause it is nicer to be outside when the weather is nice. also some people have exams and "actually" lives!! :rolleyes: i posted a few days ago on the RW thread, and now im wondering what the hell is going, and to be honest, because of all this agro, i am reluctant to post there. i am fairly new to boards still and not at regular poster as such, but i was under the impression that if you have a problem on the forum, then you pm a moderator.

Faith

patrickc wrote: »

If people don't wish to post in the Carlow forum thats their choice, it's an internet forum and if the "community feel" isn't there, well I'm sorry.

I'm going to disagree with you there. This thread caught my attention this morning, and I had a look through the Carlow forum to see what the fuss was about. I know I don't post there and I don't want anyone to feel that I'm sticking my oar in, but I'm just going to give my 2c.

To address your point above, as a moderator, you should be aiming to foster the community spirit. If people tell you that they're unhappy with the forum, then you should work to address that, rather than dismissing it as you did. I know you're just on the defensive, but moderators are not doing their jobs properly if they are happy to have their forum die, rather than address the concerns of the community. If the "community feel" used to be there, and is now gone, then you need to figure out why that is, and how to bring it back.

Secondly, I thought that locking a couple of those threads was excessive. I'd very rarely lock threads unless they're spam, pointless or breaking the charter. Discussions veer off-topic, that's the nature of them. A simple post saying "Okay folks, let's try to get back to the topic at hand" would have been much more effective and well-received. Imagine you're in the pub with a group of friends, discussing speedtraps. The conversation gradually takes another direction, as they do. Imagine how annoyed you'd be if someone then stood up and shouted "You've gone off-topic, this conversation is over" and forced you to stop talking. If that person had said, "Anyway, back to the speed trap in Ballon...", you'd take the point and the conversation would move back.

If someone started a thread asking about experiences of speed traps in villages throughout the country, then move it to Motors. But regional forums tend to be much more community-driven than other forums, so I feel that more leeway should be given when threads go off-topic or are not entirely related to the area.

Finally, don't forget you have a lot more tools available than just "lock thread". You can split threads and start new ones. You can move posts. In the case of the speed trap thread, you could have started a new thread debating them, and moved the relevant posts in there. If people start having very random conversations, you can move those posts to the off-topic thread without locking the original thread.

I'm not having a go at the moderators by any means, but I can see why some people thought that the moderation was a little heavy-handed. There's better ways to go about addressing this than starting a feedback thread, but you might as well take the suggestions on board. Many forums like AH and tLL have threads asking for input about how the forum could be better run, you could try that. I think the users are just feeling a bit powerless and controlled, so they'd probably appreciate being able to give input into how the forum is run in a constructive manner.

Again, sorry if you think I'm sticking my oar in, I'm just genuinely trying to be helpful.

Super-Rush

patrickc wrote: »

with regards the speeding thread not my one but the Ballon one I locked it because it was debating into a thread that was suited to motors, I like the idea of been notified of speedtraps myself to be honest, but thats not for here

Why would a thread about the positioning of a speed trap in Carlow be suited to the motors forum?

The original post in that thread was about the OP's disbelief at the positioning of a speed trap and not one post after that went away from this topic.

I can pin point why people haven't posted from observing the forum, not going through each issue, but my god theres a lot of pettyness in the forum.

I have never witnessed this

Sully

Faith wrote: »

I'm going to disagree with you there. This thread caught my attention this morning, and I had a look through the Carlow forum to see what the fuss was about. I know I don't post there and I don't want anyone to feel that I'm sticking my oar in, but I'm just going to give my 2c.

To address your point above, as a moderator, you should be aiming to foster the community spirit. If people tell you that they're unhappy with the forum, then you should work to address that, rather than dismissing it as you did. I know you're just on the defensive, but moderators are not doing their jobs properly if they are happy to have their forum die, rather than address the concerns of the community. If the "community feel" used to be there, and is now gone, then you need to figure out why that is, and how to bring it back.

Secondly, I thought that locking a couple of those threads was excessive. I'd very rarely lock threads unless they're spam, pointless or breaking the charter. Discussions veer off-topic, that's the nature of them. A simple post saying "Okay folks, let's try to get back to the topic at hand" would have been much more effective and well-received. Imagine you're in the pub with a group of friends, discussing speedtraps. The conversation gradually takes another direction, as they do. Imagine how annoyed you'd be if someone then stood up and shouted "You've gone off-topic, this conversation is over" and forced you to stop talking. If that person had said, "Anyway, back to the speed trap in Ballon...", you'd take the point and the conversation would move back.

If someone started a thread asking about experiences of speed traps in villages throughout the country, then move it to Motors. But regional forums tend to be much more community-driven than other forums, so I feel that more leeway should be given when threads go off-topic or are not entirely related to the area.

Finally, don't forget you have a lot more tools available than just "lock thread". You can split threads and start new ones. You can move posts. In the case of the speed trap thread, you could have started a new thread debating them, and moved the relevant posts in there. If people start having very random conversations, you can move those posts to the off-topic thread without locking the original thread.

I'm not having a go at the moderators by any means, but I can see why some people thought that the moderation was a little heavy-handed. There's better ways to go about addressing this than starting a feedback thread, but you might as well take the suggestions on board. Many forums like AH and tLL have threads asking for input about how the forum could be better run, you could try that. I think the users are just feeling a bit powerless and controlled, so they'd probably appreciate being able to give input into how the forum is run in a constructive manner.

Again, sorry if you think I'm sticking my oar in, I'm just genuinely trying to be helpful.

Agree with you there and plan on actually discussing this with the lads. I think when you moderate a small forum, with little moderation, you don't get the feel for how things probably should be done. I should have been helping them out better, but I was tied up on other forums for a while and didn't think it was a critical issue. We have a lot more experience and are actively moderating busy(sh) forums so we can help the smaller based mods.

I do think this thread was taken the wrong way, and I know if I was contacted about it we could have sorted it quickly without the mess. Plus, im sure the lads would feel the same. I'm assuming there a bit peeved at how they were launched at for what really is minor issues with their moderating which isn't the end of the world. First feedback threads, especially with the type of first post and comments passed already in the forum, can be pretty tough on some.

stick-dan

Sully wrote: »

Your ignoring my point. The method you used to express your concerns (hardly any may I add) was completely unfair. Your all supposed to know each other and get on so well - this is what you always told me. Is this the behaviour of such a forum? I don't think so. There is no point in having a rant with no substance. Nobody can do anything until we know what the problems are bar "We don't like it, we don't know why, but we don't like it".

I made out a list of things that i was informed was wrong. I would like to add the fact that threads are now being closed way too quickly.

Sully wrote: »

This thread smacks of a group gaining up on the lads, for no reason at all. Where is the community spirit in that?

The group of people airing their views on this thread are the community, don't be nit-picking at phrases. The community spirit is held in the fact that the group are voicing their concerns together in a constructive manner in this thread yet you seem to be making snide remarks back at every opportunity. Where is the sense in fairness in that.

Iv had a look, and from what I could tell Patrick closed the thread as the original point was turning into a debate (possibly started for that reason, its hard to tell) which was covered before (not only on Carlow, but on Boards in general). Whats the problem with that? I would have probably done the same judging on how things went the last time. As I said below, its hardly undoing the Guards work "making the roads a safer place".

Who are you to decide if it is undoing the guards work? You yourself probably actively speed daily so you would have no say in this matter.This was my opinion i made in a strong manner very clear and i was ridiculed for it and no mod stepped in and even mentioned to the poster who attacked me to stop attacking the poster and attack the post. Mod's are really following the rules there aint they? see this thread
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055579696
And here also the thread was left open nearly a week when all that wanted to be achieved was to warn everyone. Surely make the post and lock straight away would have been proper order. Or was it a case of getting as many thank as possible. It's inconsistant

Links? We cant comment until we see some substance. A broad whinge with no proof wont get us anywhere. Ill admit I was very easy going on you, and aynon initially, but with the community spirit ringing in my ear and thinking that this behaviour from you is very unusual I thought after a PM things would settle down and it could be discussed like adults amongst everyone over PM. Clearly not.

Your the one taking the snide remark and digs route in this thread, i have aired my opinions, back them up now and also made a list of the problems. How in the blue hell is that not discussing it like adults.

patrick closed it because, as the author, he didn't want a debate on the topic at hand. Ideally that debate should be in the Motors forum anyway, and not Carlow, but I think small pockets of room for off-carlow-topic should be permitted (within reason). But, the mod of the forum decided that enough was enough on the debate and closed it. Likewise, if you started a thread and it went off topic the lads would step in and ask people to get back on topic, etc. If thats your issue (closing rather then trying to get back on topic), maybe patrick will consider a different approach in future if you discuss it with him civilly.

Both speeding threads were relative to carlow only, they did not belong in the motoring forum.

You keep going on about being a mod, why the hell did you leave if your that fecking wonderful?! If you think the mods are doing a poor job, and different to you, why not just send them a PM and make some suggestions? Even to me, you know full well iv helped out the lads on occasion and advised them the best approach to topics. Why did you have to turn this into a witch hunt for their poor modding as you see it, having a rant about them rather then going face to face on the matter and discussing it? Not a very nice approach for a community forum.

The only reason i said i was mod was so that people would know that i had a strong association with the forum. I never said i was fecking wonderful i said i was fair, end of. I myself , my only problem is the fact that the community users have a problem. As you quite rightly pointed out i left the forum for my own reasons which i damn sure need not explain to any of ye here. I have a life and things i wanted to pay more attention to rather than my virtual self thank you very much.Where was it turned into a witch hunt and when did i ask them to leave. I said people no longer found the forum enjoyable and asked what the hell has gone wrong. Stop twisting words.

Was it life threatening that you couldn't fire of a PM at a reasonable hour and try solve this? Did you REALLY have to go behind their backs and start this thread against them? You can polish that up all you like, but thats not on.

Ah here how many times have i to say that i am only airing the opinion for crying out loud. Stop trying to make me out to be a flippping back stabber of sorts. It's a very childish approach to take.

As for your suggestions - you wanted a lot more then what the Carlow forum could give, and as a second opinion Dub13 also agreed. You don't own the forum, or Boards - if thats how the site runs, you gotta live with it. If not, start your own Carlow forum where you can all happily discuss what you want, under your control which you keep going on about as being so damn good. Create your own rules, approach differently, etc. This is how things have worked on Boards, sucesfully, so I cant see them going to change it because a handful of people on Carlow are apparently unhappy (so far, its only you).

What's this alot more that i wanted eh? I wanted to improve the forum, oh sorry my bad, sure leve it inactive is what we should have done.And i'm sorry things do not work "successfully" on boards, if they did there would be no feedback threads like this one and this isn't only a carlow forum problem. so far its only me? so super-rush, aynon and queen mise arent people now no?

patrickc

yes i admit i speed when i see fit, where and when on boards does it say mods can't do that????


i locked both threads because the initial thing was to warn people about the speed traps locations and not to have a debate on speeding, the motors forum is for that IMO.

anyhow this thread is solving nothing, it's turned into a bitch fest, and I will not be replying further on it, unless it's direction from the bitchiness changes.