CAD Files of Plans

Mixupat

I am the end of design phase and about to submit for planning. I've requested the CAD Files from my architect but they will not supply them to me.

I'd like the CAD File versions rather than just PDF.

Is it standard practice for the CAD files not to be supplied to architects clients?
Is the client not entitled to the CAD files as the plans belong to the client?

Thanks
Mixupat

DOCARCH

Very simply, the client is entitled to a paper copy but not (necessarily) entitled to a copy of the CAD files. The CAD files are the architects intellectual property.

Jimbo

It's quite common practice to withold CAD files from clients.

Our office wouldn't do it, but it's in the interest of the architects to keep CAD files so the client isn't able to easily change architect.

sydthebeat

Mixupat wrote: »

Is the client not entitled to the CAD files as the plans belong to the client?

where did you hear that??

The design of the building is the intellectual property of the designer, not the person who commissions the design.... thats what i have always been lead to believe anyway.....

Personally, i have no problem giving out CAD files.... there are ways and means out there anyway to convert from most formats to cad, so its a bit of a moot point.... and i also understand that a lot of sub contractors use cad when designing up their particular systems.... ie UFH, HRV etc....

why do you want the CAD files?? do you want to send them out to subcontractors for tendering?? if so, why not simply ask the architect to email them from his end.....

however, if you want the cad files to start making design changes etc, then its understandable why the architect would not be happy to provide them...

foundation10

Personally my view is that you are entitled to the CAD files. I would explain to them nicely that you will not to use it for a revised planning application or anything and you just need it for information purposes. The CAD file will be extremely useful when taking off dimensions etc which are not marked up on drawings.

archtech

sydthebeat wrote: »

The design of the building is the intellectual property of the designer, not the person who commissions the design.... thats what i have always been lead to believe anyway.....

this is my understanding too.

As for providing CAD files to clients,, with one off's it is not a normal occurrence in our experience for clients themseleves to look for the CAD drawings. However Clients would often ask that the drawings be forward to maybe window suppliers/insulation suppliers ber assessors etc, which we have no problem doing. On commercial projects clients often request the drawing to facilitate work on site (eg setting out etc)

However, either way the client would firstly have to be be paid upto date for services provided to before we would release the CAD files.

BTW any client who demands the CAD drawings and claims its their right to have them, usually won't get them too easily or in the most user friendly fashion;).

Mixupat

Cheers Lads...I'd like the option of having the plans to send out during tendering but if they can be converted easily then i wont worry about it. It seems like a bit of a grey area to be honest. I dont have any true reason to put up a massive fight if there are other options. A quick google confirmed this..

pseudo-tech

Most clients would not have the software to open the CAD files!!!!!!

ToyotaF1

just to throw this in the mix...


what if the Architect was a bit stubborn and didn't send on the CAD file....can the client redraw, with the help of a technician, and use them for tendering? Is there any copyright infringement there?

sinnerboy

yes

KingPuck

I. had my architect draw up my plans. Planning is granted. I want to him to email me the drawings in pdf and as a CAD file so that I can send them for tender.

He will email them in pdf but not in CAD. He is paid in full.

I am I right to consider myself well within my rights to make this request. Afterall I would expect that I could consider them my property after pying him to draw them.

I welcome your feedback.:mad:

muffler

KingPuck wrote: »

I. had my architect draw up my plans. Planning is granted. I want to him to email me the drawings in pdf and as a CAD file so that I can send them for tender.

He will email them in pdf but not in CAD. He is paid in full.

I am I right to consider myself well within my rights to make this request. Afterall I would expect that I could consider them my property after pying him to draw them.

I welcome your feedback.:mad:

Moved to thread on same topic

sinnerboy

KingPuck wrote: »

I. had my architect draw up my plans. Planning is granted. I want to him to email me the drawings in pdf and as a CAD file so that I can send them for tender.

He will email them in pdf but not in CAD. He is paid in full.


I am I right to consider myself well within my rights to make this request. Afterall I would expect that I could consider them my property after pying him to draw them.

I welcome your feedback.:mad:

They aren't your property .

You got the service you paid for - you got your PP

Very unwise to use planning documents for tender - they will not be detailed enough

KingPuck

sinnerboy wrote: »

They aren't your property .

You got the service you paid for - you got your PP

Very unwise to use planning documents for tender - they will not be detailed enough

What does the architect need to do to produce working drawings from planning drawings?

Are you saying that I will have to pay more for working drawings?

sinnerboy

KingPuck wrote: »

What does the architect need to do to produce working drawings from planning drawings?

Are you saying that I will have to pay more for working drawings?

Yes . This is in your own best interests .

KingPuck

Sinner Boy,

Any idea of how much extra I can expect to pay.

BTW, This guy wanted (and got, i might add) a 10% "successful application" fee on top of his fee per sq ft.

My fault for not reading the small print. I belive that if I signed it I would pay it, which I did. Against my better judgement though. Unfortunatley I couldn't recommend him, for this reason, because I feel I got stung.

muffler

KingPuck wrote: »

BTW, This guy wanted (and got, i might add) a 10% "successful application" fee on top of his fee per sq ft.

10% of what?

picorette

KingPuck wrote: »

I. had my architect draw up my plans. Planning is granted. I want to him to email me the drawings in pdf and as a CAD file so that I can send them for tender.

He will email them in pdf but not in CAD. He is paid in full.

I am I right to consider myself well within my rights to make this request. Afterall I would expect that I could consider them my property after pying him to draw them.

I welcome your feedback.:mad:

When I was younger, and not so (street) wise, I used to give clients copies of CAD drawings at any request. Then i had a client who took my CAD drawings, gave them to a project manager, who made changes to MY drawings, and then took over the project. Never again.

pseudo-tech

muffler wrote: »

10% of what?

It could also be seen as a 10% reduction if planning was not granted. Sometimes i will do a deal with my clients where i will defer some of my fees until i receive a positive permission. That's for the benifit of the client and not me!

It is me taking a risk with the client. I don't see any problem with that!

sinnerboy

KingPuck wrote: »

Sinner Boy,

Any idea of how much extra I can expect to pay.

BTW, This guy wanted (and got, i might add) a 10% "successful application" fee on top of his fee per sq ft.

My fault for not reading the small print. I belive that if I signed it I would pay it, which I did. Against my better judgement though. Unfortunatley I couldn't recommend him, for this reason, because I feel I got stung.

Take ft2 x €100 as approx build cost

3.5% fee for drawings , issue to tenders , examine tenders and advise on contractor selection

Same again to take project through the build taking care of payment certs and sign off at completion .

At least that was a typical arrangement during the good times - a guide all the same

Good luck .

Poor Uncle Tom

picorette wrote: »

When I was younger, and not so (street) wise, I used to give clients copies of CAD drawings at any request. Then i had a client who took my CAD drawings, gave them to a project manager, who made changes to MY drawings, and then took over the project. Never again.

If they hadn't your permission, and you know about it, that means you sued them and won, right...:)

(don't answer that

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legal discussion)