The rugby forum has gone to pot...

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Amabokke wrote: »

Now see, you're making an assumption and twisting my words. Read the post again and you'll see I refer to the French league that there are lot of fights in it more so than other countries and I can back it up. I mentioned I saw on a site that he was in a fight with this teammates and I was asked by Oracle "how would the other players let the assault thing happen" where I pointed to the French fighting.

Amabokke wrote: »

No disrespect to you Des but you already twisted my words here when you thought my explanation is not helping anyone.

Fair enough. I misinterpreted you.

Apologies.

Amabokke

Size=everything wrote: »

Did you explain that though? Or did you just say 'because they are french'

I don't think I have to explain a whole paragraph about French rugby when I refer to their fighting. True rugby supporters know what they are like in the leagues, few clips on youtube available. If a poster is unsure of what it means they should just ask me.

mikedragon32

I appreciate, that some mods are away, but Des relying on reported posts isn't enough. If you knew that you were going to be modding alone, during what is one of the biggest events in the Rugby calender, why not seek assistance from a mod who is already there and contributing. At least that way there is someone actually reading the threads and (hopefully) being proactive in dealing with troublesome posts when they happen.

I've no problem with how Des moderates, and certainly have no issues with the actions he's taken, but under the current circumstances, the forum does need someone to give it a little more tlc.

Eoin

Ruggie only went on holidays the other day I think, he's been around up until then.

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mikedragon32 wrote: »

I appreciate, that some mods are away, but Des relying on reported posts isn't enough. If you knew that you were going to be modding alone, during what is one of the biggest events in the Rugby calender, why not seek assistance from a mod who is already there and contributing.

I actually thought Crash was back tbh.

But that's neither here nor there.

The blame for people acting like children is not with the moderation or lack thereof, it's with the childish acting people who are posting on the forum.

mikedragon32 wrote: »

At least that way there is someone actually reading the threads and (hopefully) being proactive in dealing with troublesome posts when they happen.

Again, if people reported posts instead of posting "IBTL" in them, then this wouldn't even need addressing. See the locked thread on the first page of the Rugby forum for just one example

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055606892

mikedragon32 wrote: »

I've no problem with how Des moderates, and certainly have no issues with the actions he's taken, but under the current circumstances, the forum does need someone to give it a little more tlc.

I'd agree with you, I do think that forums need at least one active mod who has an interest in the topic, especially volatile forums like Rugby seems to have become.

I will re-state though, that the main problems as outlined in this Feedback thread, by the complainants, would go a long way to being solved if people would actively use the Report Post feature, instead of being childish.

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eoin wrote: »

Ruggie only went on holidays the other day I think, he's been around up until then.

That's true actually. Ruggie has been around lately, just not this week.

Size=everything

mikedragon32 wrote: »

I appreciate, that some mods are away, but Des relying on reported posts isn't enough. If you knew that you were going to be modding alone, during what is one of the biggest events in the Rugby calender, why not seek assistance from a mod who is already there and contributing. At least that way there is someone actually reading the threads and (hopefully) being proactive in dealing with troublesome posts when they happen.

I've no problem with how Des moderates, and certainly have no issues with the actions he's taken, but under the current circumstances, the forum does need someone to give it a little more tlc.

I don't think thats the problem. The forum never got overrun and besides 99% of the time posters don't go into bannable terroritory i.e are very subtle in their approach to bait. Not Des' fault at all IMO.

Even in the threads listed no opinion in there is bannable so how is that des fault? Its the posters fault for taking issue with perfectly legit opinions that is the problem!

Stev_o

Size=everything wrote: »

I don't think thats the problem. The forum never got overrun and besides 99% of the time posters don't go into bannable terroritory i.e are very subtle in their approach to bait. Not Des' fault at all IMO.

Even in the threads listed no opinion in there is bannable so how is that des fault? Its the posters fault for taking issue with perfectly legit opinions that is the problem!

Matchdays the forum is always at full capacity.

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Stev_o wrote: »

Matchdays the forum is always at full capacity.

I may be mistaken, but I think there were something like 4 reported posts from the weekend.

Now that says two things to me.

Either

1. The forum is not as bad as is being made out

or

2. The people who are complaining are content to sit on their arses and not report these post/posters who are causing the malcontent.

It's one or the other. How are the mods supposed to know there is a problem, if nobody points it out.

The majority of people who post in the forum will know I'm not a regular contributer, and the only posts I make in the forum are moderation related.

Stev_o

Des wrote: »

I may be mistaken, but I think there were something like 4 reported posts from the weekend.

Now that says two things to me.

Either

1. The forum is not as bad as is being made out

or

2. The people who are complaining are content to sit on their arses and not report these post/posters who are causing the malcontent.

It's one or the other. How are the mods supposed to know there is a problem, if nobody points it out.

The majority of people who post in the forum will know I'm not a regular contributer, and the only posts I make in the forum are moderation related.

Probably more then 4 tbh.

This was Ruggie's action http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055603195&page=34 the last 3 pages then just go a bit crazy.

Then you had the various ROG threads that spread up as a result of the match a day after.

Honestly id say it's number 2. Generally people on the forum prefer to have a typing battle with each other rather then reporting a post which offends them or whatever.

Again really it lies in the fact that you really need to have a interest in rugby to know when to draw the line on debating a player when it starts to cross over into provincial bickering and the like.

SpAcEd OuT

My problem is with one poster in particular, thehighground who turns every discussion into childish, provincial ****e. He does it very subtly so its hard to spot and even harder to ban for but go to nearly every locked thread and you will see it is his or premierstones input that spirals the discussion out of control. They are worse than rugbyfanatic, inquitus and dc69 were but more intelligent at disguising it IMO

Wreck

therecklessone wrote: »

Lads, the soccer forum access request mechanism isn't designed to screen new users as such, the original intention was to make it harder for banned users to rereg and cause more problems.

Yes we look at a prospective new members posting history, bans/infractions earned etc, but it is hard to gauge whether somebody might be troublesome from their posts across boards (anything from PI to photography to satellite etc etc) and it is not fool proof.

The users of the forum have to take responsibility for helping to ensure it runs smoothly, that means reporting offending posts instead of responding to them. No amount of moderators will result in 24/7 cover unless you guys want to start paying the people who volunteer so that they will work a roster, and I don't see that happening any time soon :P

I'll also suggest you look at the SF use of the infraction system here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56561140&postcount=4

Cliff notes version:

Red card = 2 yellows.
6 yellows picked up in one year = 6 month ban.

One of the major benefits of the soccer forum screening process is it prevents people from signing up to troll when important or controversial events occur. The 50 posts rule stops people from creating accounts just to slag off O'Gara or whatever. And if you know that even if you can get away with a re-reg, you have to have another 50 posts to get let back in, you are going to value the privilege of posting that little bit more.

The constant inter-provincial bickering really puts people off posting in the forum imo. To continue the contrast with soccer, I love rugby, played the game at decent levels for 15 years, attend live games and watch loads of it on TV, but I have far more posts in the soccer forum than the rugby forum.

therecklessone

Wreck wrote: »

One of the major benefits of the soccer forum screening process is it prevents people from signing up to troll when important or controversial events occur. The 50 posts rule stops people from creating accounts just to slag off O'Gara or whatever. And if you know that even if you can get away with a re-reg, you have to have another 50 posts to get let back in, you are going to value the privilege of posting that little bit more.

I know all of that.

However, is there any evidence to suggest that people are signing up simply to troll the rugby forum? Or are banned users re-regging and causing more trouble?

I'd hate for people to think a screening process will solve all your problems.

On the SF, the aftermath of the forum closure saw a sponsorship system, existing users had to sponsor a new member, with their own access at risk if the new member acted up once they were granted access. The problem with that was that it meant people new to to boards struggled to attract sponsors as they were not known. There is a fine line between trying to prevent muppetry and closing the forum to all newcomers.

The current system prevents immediate re-regs for banned users, but that only works if you actually ban troublemakers in the first place.

You guys need to help the rugby mods by reporting the offending posts rather than reacting to them. The latter course of action does nothing to solve the problem, from my experience it usually exacerbates it.

I've had a look at the thread Stev_o linked to above, and all of the posters infracted by Ruggie were either members for years or had plenty of posts to their name. Ironically, it was a guy with 59 posts and who joined in May who was appealing for calm. Go figure.

thomond2006

Firstly, I have been guilty of slapping down on opinions that I feel are wrong and I apologise to anyone I pissed off or annoyed. I've calmed down by now (i hope ).

Secondly, I do believe that there should be more mods. Since I have a lot of time on my hands, I would volunteer to be a new moderator on the rugby forum
I do think Jackass, Stevo or Toomevara would be good candidates as well, if they are willing.

Thirdly, I wish people would stop giving out about ROG. Yes, I am a Munsterfan and therefore a ROG supporter but the problem is the constant ROG bickering is ruining the entire forum tbh.

There are others who come on the forum just to annoy other users
i.e. a user beginning with A and ending with C is always criticising my posts for some unknown reason.

Finally, have a nice day!

Amazotheamazing

I think we should make it an offence to compare Munster or Leinster to each other. There's dozens of teams in Europe, around 10 or 12 at the same level as either of the above, if you're trying to make a point you shouldn't always have to compare to Leinster or Munster.

Hyperbullet

I may not have very many posts on boards, I joined recently, but I do enjoy the debate and different viewpoints expressed on this forum, and I'd like to be part of it in future. Seems this week though its all about O Gara, some of it has been good, some lively debate, but it does boil down to slating, both him, and other board members. If there was a complete ban on talking about O Gara until the Lions tour is over, then that might help things. I have taken part in the most recent thread, it was fine for a while but has gone sour yet again. Think everyone is up in arms after last Saturday. Myself included.

ch2008

Glad to see this issue has been raised,its made the rugby forum quite ridiculous at times.
Perhaps posters should have to have at least 10 posts approved before being allowed post at will? Whenever a ban is placed on someone they should have to have posts approved 20 times. Not sure if this is possible but it could work.
I'd also like to add that a prominent poster in this thread has been often overly aggressive on threads and seems more inclined to ridicule people than make their point in an intelligent way. I feel this sets a tone for other posters.
In saying all of this I think its also vital that the forum doesnt become closed off to everyone but a select group

thomond2006

ch2008 wrote: »

I'd also like to add that a prominent poster in this thread has been often overly aggressive on threads and seems more inclined to ridicule people than make their point in an intelligent way. I feel this sets a tone for other posters.

If you are referring to me, then you are correct and I whole-heartedly apologise.

ch2008

thomond2006 wrote: »

If you are referring to me, then you are correct and I whole-heartedly apologise.

I'm actually not, but its not the point. I think rugby is a game based on an honour code so why not introduce that same ethic to the forum. The posters and not just the moderators should intervene when comments eh...stray.

Like egg-chasing vigilantes, so to speak

I also think this icon :rolleyes: should be banned. It makes my blood boil

thomond2006

ch2008 wrote: »

The posters and not just the moderators should intervene when comments eh...stray.

Like egg-chasing vigilantes, so to speak

I don't agree.

I think armchair modding is part of the problem and contributes to users not reporting trolling/abusive posts.

ch2008

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't agree.

I think armchair modding is part of the problem and contributes to users not reporting trolling/abusive posts.

Thats a good point.

d'Oracle

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't agree.

I think armchair modding is part of the problem and contributes to users not reporting trolling/abusive posts.

+1.


My thoughts on the issue.

1) Many of those who protest here are implicit in the problem.

2) There is way too much gun jumping and mud slinging. People being accused of saying things that they are not saying. That is the biggest problem as I see it. Its ignorant and poor form. Amabokke (for example) who was much quicker than De Villiers to condemn Burger, is still being accused of making excuses for it. Thats wrong and IMO it should be punishable.

3) You could put a stickie about all issues O'Gara seeing as he is such an inexplicably polarising figure. Then have mods come down hard on O'Garaising other threads.

ch2008

d'Oracle wrote: »

+1.


My thoughts on the issue.

1) Many of those who protest here are implicit in the problem.

2) There is way too much gun jumping and mud slinging. People being accused of saying things that they are not saying. That is the biggest problem as I see it. Its ignorant and poor form. Amabokke (for example) who was much quicker than De Villiers to condemn Burger, is still being accused of making excuses for it. Thats wrong and IMO it should be punishable.

3) You could put a stickie about all issues O'Gara seeing as he is such an inexplicably polarising figure. Then have mods come down hard on O'Garaising other threads.

I think that is a massive problem, perhaps the biggest.

Tim Robbins

The forum is good, RuggieBear is a superb mod.

Teg Veece

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't agree.

I think armchair modding is part of the problem and contributes to users not reporting trolling/abusive posts.

In your last 25 posts, the are 3 or 4 requests for mods to close various threads.

The biggest problem with the forum at the moment is that too many relatively new posters are jumping down the throats of others when they express a different opinion of them.
A worrying amount of people seem to think that if they berate a player over a long enough period of time then they'll somehow get dropped from the team.

It's a opinion on an internet forum. Just accept that there will be others who won't agree with you and move on. Constantly telling them that they're wrong and you're right isn't actually going to bring them around to see things from your point of view. If anything, it'll have the opposite effect.

Eoin

Tim Robbins wrote: »

RuggieBear is a superb mod.

I agree 100%, and maybe we should wait until he has a chance to read this thread rather than people volunteering themselves and others (who haven't even posted on this thread) as extra mods.

thomond2006

Teg Veece wrote: »

In your last 25 posts, the are 3 or 4 requests for mods to close various threads.

Yes, I am frustrated with all the sh1te. I do report those posts though.

Let's just leave this here.

Honey-ec

d'Oracle wrote: »

3) You could put a stickie about all issues O'Gara seeing as he is such an inexplicably polarising figure. Then have mods come down hard on O'Garaising other threads.

And another one for Sexton for the Munster fans, and then I think the Rugby forum would happily return to normality...

All joking aside, I've more or less stopped even browsing the forum, as since the Heineken Cup semi it has pretty much boiled down to this:

Munster fans: Fcuk off

Leinster fans: No, you fcuk off

Munster fans: No, you fcuk off...

Repeat ad nauseum...

thehighground

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

My problem is with one poster in particular, thehighground who turns every discussion into childish, provincial ****e. He does it very subtly so its hard to spot and even harder to ban for but go to nearly every locked thread and you will see it is his or premierstones input that spirals the discussion out of control. They are worse than rugbyfanatic, inquitus and dc69 were but more intelligent at disguising it IMO

Any examples of what you mean here - because I'm not aware of trying to do anything in particular.

I try not to insult, abuse or show disrespect to any posters, no matter what team they support. I have stopped posting to threads when they have got too ridiculous (IMO).

In general I don't think the rugby board is too bad - its the number of threads dedicated to O'Gara bashing that I find most irritating - particularly when its looks like the thread starter has just signed up to have a go at him.

A solution to that might be to have an O'Gara thread that anything to do with him is posted to - that way posters can avoid it like the plague if they want to and its kept at the top, unlocked and the Mods can go in every now and again to delete the abusive comments.

other 2 cents - could posts that just make statements/meaninless (with no debate) within reason be just deleted.

thomond2006

I think having a ROG specific forum is a bad idea, this means there will a spot for loadza trolls to lay their eggs on, so to speak.

We should discuss ROG, but at the same rate as we discuss POC, DOC, BOD, D'Arcy, Sexton, Kearney, Earls, Quinlan et al.