Electricians Strike

ixoy

Are all electricians part of this TEEU? Do you need to be to be certified - which makes it like some sort of cartel. Or is there now a gap for non-unionised members (or those who leave) to take up the void left behind by this planned action?

Spudmonkey

My dad used be part of the union when he was working years ago for a company. When he set up on his own and left, he wasn't able to do work for companies when there were any strikes, even though he wasn't part of it anymore. Only private residences. So not being part of the union doesn't mean you will automatically get more work..

This is what he told me anyway.

brianthebard

Perhaps he did that out of choice though, rather than scab on the striking workers?

Boggle

Is it still scabbing if you disagree with the strike?

I dont think so anyway. Let the sparks strike and hopefully it'll break the corrupt unions.
Put down a marker for the PS strikes yet to come.

Spudmonkey

Nah this was back when he was happy to get work, he had nothing against the workers but despised the unions. I think there was something in place that stopped him doing the work.

brianthebard

Boggle wrote: »

Is it still scabbing if you disagree with the strike?

I dont think so anyway. Let the sparks strike and hopefully it'll break the corrupt unions.
Put down a marker for the PS strikes yet to come.

Why do you say the unions are corrupt? Please provide evidence to back up this absurd claim.

Spudmonkey wrote: »

Nah this was back when he was happy to get work, he had nothing against the workers but despised the unions. I think there was something in place that stopped him doing the work.

Fair enough I was just thinking out loud. Thanks.

peterako

What time on Monday are actions/pickets expected to start?

I'm particularly thinking of Dublin Airport.

population

Anyone I knew who was in the Union and went on and on about it was pretty much unemployable. They just didnt pull their weight on site.

Riskymove

irish_bob wrote: »

gammy leg or not , we need thatcher over here to take on the unions before the country goes under

ah yes the great Thatcher boom with full employment, joy everywhere, a paradise on earth!!

I think you need to revisit that!:pac:

Riskymove

Spudmonkey wrote: »

No I don't want my wages reduced, but if given a choice between losing my job and that, I'd happily take a paycut! I would have imagined there were more people with that frame of mind.

But thats my point really, it should be about the ability of your industry to pay it

there are plenty of areas where paycuts are NOT being applied

Darsad

Will the last person to leave the country please turn off the lights !
Oh sorry the electricians have already taken care of it :mad:

Jip

What this unions seems to be forgetting is that many of the large electrical contractors have already let alot of staff go over the past year or so and those that remained accepted voluntary pay cuts or freezes.

I said it in the after hours thread but this Devoy fella will be the ruination of the electrical trade. As he's only president designate or whatever it's all a load of posturing to try show how tough he's going to be to deal with but instead makes him look like the most arrogant, ignorant stereotypical union rep you could ever meet.

brianthebard

Have you met him Jip? All I see from the people opposed to unions is a lot of empty opinions and rethoric.

Jip

I've heard him on pratcially every news bulletiin and chat show since Thursday. I have no problem continuing to say he's the most arrogant and ignorant union rep/leader I have ever heard.

And try come up with an original argument, not the usual "empty opionions and rethoric" line.

P. Breathnach

Jip wrote: »

I've heard him on pratcially every news bulletiin and chat show since Thursday...

If that is the case, how come you don't know what his job is?

Jip

All I need to know is that he's officially representing the TEEU smart arse. He's the incoming boss which means until he's officially in he's still a trade unionist. He could be the post boy for all I care but as long as he's their official representative and speaker on this issue he's still a twat.

LoLth

pay increase in this climate is a bit ambitious but havign said that, if they were promised a pay increase several months ago (or a year ago) then you can be pretty certain that this increased expense was factored in by the large contractors (Sisk size) when tendering for a job. To cut their pay now, if they are still working on an ongoing project, will only serve to increase the profit margin of the large contractor.

I reckon, they should get their pay increase, backdated to when it was agreed and paid for the hours they worked on the building projects. Then they should take the cut if they want to get in on any new projects starting from here on out. (unless the contractor - at Sisk size level - is willing to re-negotiate the pricing on teh job they are workign on to reflect the downturn. I mean, if the electricians etc are being paid 10% less, then surely the cost of supplying that part of th econtract is 10% less and this should be relfected in the end price presented to the consumer.

this way, they receive fair compensation for work completed and in progress and the lower wage/cost applies for new projects which will be tendered at a lower price level to reflect the current economic climate. If priced right the profit margins all the way up should stay the same just amounting to that much less than they did a year ago.

Electricians doing domestic jobs have already dropped their rates (quite considerably, based on a quote I received for some wiring at home) and the slowdown in the building trade , as sites come to an end etc, will see more competition in the domestic market which will drive the prices down further.

Riskymove

LoLth wrote: »

pay increase in this climate is a bit ambitious but havign said that, if they were promised a pay increase several months ago (or a year ago) then you can be pretty certain that this increased expense was factored in by the large contractors (Sisk size) when tendering for a job. To cut their pay now, if they are still working on an ongoing project, will only serve to increase the profit margin of the large contractor.

I reckon, they should get their pay increase, backdated to when it was agreed and paid for the hours they worked on the building projects. Then they should take the cut if they want to get in on any new projects starting from here on out. (unless the contractor - at Sisk size level - is willing to re-negotiate the pricing on teh job they are workign on to reflect the downturn. I mean, if the electricians etc are being paid 10% less, then surely the cost of supplying that part of th econtract is 10% less and this should be relfected in the end price presented to the consumer.

It has been suggested that the new rates were being factored into tenders but not passed on to workers

the basic idea now is that the foregone increase should cancel out the pay cut sought, i.e. rates stay the same

P. Breathnach

Jip wrote: »

All I need to know is that he's officially representing the TEEU smart arse. He's the incoming boss which means until he's officially in he's still a trade unionist. He could be the post boy for all I care but as long as he's their official representative and speaker on this issue he's still a twat.

The discussion of public affairs is impoverished when people speak from a position of ignorance and don't even consider that to matter, and when they use abusive language in referring to people rather than reasoned arguments to deal with the positions those people take.

Jip

P. Breathnach wrote: »

The discussion of public affairs is impoverished when people speak from a position of ignorance and don't even consider that to matter, and when they use abusive language in referring to people rather than reasoned arguments to deal with the positions those people take.

Hypocritical much ?

P. Breathnach

Jip wrote: »

Hypocritical much ?

???

Scofflaw

Jip wrote: »

Hypocritical much ?

Enough handbagging. You obviously feel strongly about the subject, but if you can't discuss it civilly, then it would be better to stay out of the discussion.

moderately,
Scofflaw

joolsveer

I am not a union member and am self employed. My understanding of this dispute is that the employers are reneging on a signed agreement and that they want to decrease electricians' wages further. If this is correct I don't know how any worker could side with the employers.

mike65

Whats the strike pay like these days?

Riskymove

mike65 wrote: »

Whats the strike pay like these days?

from what i have seen over the years strike pay fund is usually kept back for serious long-term action (in reality it simply would not be up to replacing pay)

there is rarely strike pay for a one-day stoppage like this (but am not in TEEU so cannot say for sure in today's case)

Spudmonkey

joolsveer wrote: »

My understanding of this dispute is that the employers are reneging on a signed agreement and that they want to decrease electricians' wages further. If this is correct I don't know how any worker could side with the employers.

Perhaps in order to keep their business afloat. I would have thought some guys would be happy to keep their job.

Was listening to a contractor on with Pat Kenny who had ~40 lads working for him, they are all working today, he said because they were happy with their lot and they were treated well. I suppose these are just guys happy to be able to pay the mortgage.

Riskymove

Spudmonkey wrote: »

Perhaps in order to keep their business afloat. I would have thought some guys would be happy to keep their job.

Was listening to a contractor on with Pat Kenny who had ~40 lads working for him, they are all working today, he said because they were happy with their lot and they were treated well. I suppose these are just guys happy to be able to pay the mortgage.

there is no doubt that a lot of people in the construction industry must be thinking like this given the situation

but at the same time its important that people are not allowed to be just walked over with the recession used as an excuse to do anything so I can see where the TEEU are coming from

there are still sectors of the economy where pay cuts/redundancies are not neccesary

other sectors may be using the recession as a "smokecreen" to make savings/re-locate abroad etc in order to make more profits rather than stay afloat

techdiver

I think the entire construction sector is getting a sharp dose of reality at the moment. They were over paid for a long time and now they need to realise that the good times are over.

Top graduates in highly skilled areas don't make near €21 per hour and these guys expect to be paid more than that?? Laughable!

Too many left school and saw this as a quick way to earn big bucks without a third level education and now these decisions have come home to roost!

Spudmonkey

Thats true, I agree with you and unless you see their accounts you aren't going to know if they are using this for a smoke-screen for increasing their profits. That information is just between the employer and their accountant.

I don't think though employers would be getting rid of employees too easily if they weren't finding a steady stream of business tough to maintain

Riskymove

Spudmonkey wrote: »

I don't think though employers would be getting rid of employees too easily if they weren't finding a steady stream of business tough to maintain

perhaps but how many firms are trying "oh its a recession, the workforce better take a 10% cut or we are finished" without having to prove anything

I remember recently the decision by Erikkson to relocate some part of its business was criticised as simply being to move it to lower wage environment while using the recession as cover. It was not in trouble or likely to be bankrupt or anything.