Nasty Accident

Jawgap

The main problem with that stretch is the amount of development that has gone on and the road has been dug up repeatedly. Maybe the council are planning to re-surface it once all the work is done, but in the mean time it's pretty atrocious - I hate coming up to it and try to get through as quick as possible.

To go slightly off topic for a moment - a friend who works in Dublin City Council was telling me about the top notch system they developed for co-ordinating digging up roads in the city so that, for example, if the ESB were opening a hole then the other utitiies might use the opportunity to do work they had planned but was scheduled for another time.

Anyway, the system fell flat on it's face. One utility refused point blank to have anything to do with it - Dublin City Council!!!! The water services people to be precise. You've got to love this country!

Jawgap

Beasty wrote: »

Yes it was me - the accident happened about 20 metres before the place I pulled up yesterday (first puncture in over two years of cycling Ireland's roads)

Nice to meet you Jawgap - hopefully I will be able to give you a longer pull next time:)

Hopefully next time I'll be able to return the favour!

Beasty

LeoD wrote: »

How much money are you hoping to get off the Council? Did you ever consider telling the Council before your accident about the dodgy road works you had cycled over many times previously without falling off? Sorry but the "some compensation for my pain and suffering would certainly not go amiss" is the bit that gets me. Yeah the roads are a bit crap in this country and you fell off your bike but you cycled this route many times before and were aware of the state of the road. A bit sad to see so many posters shouting for solicitors/compo but hardly a surprise in this country these days. Keep it up and we'll see what effect public liability has on road racing/sportives in the future.

I will get whatever the Personal Injuries Board Assess - that is their function.

I have been over that "lump in the road" many times, but on the day in question, because of the shadows, it was pretty invisible (and I have since taken photos in similar conditions which show this). What I had never appreciated was the tarmac in question had a large stone protruding from it (a centimetre or so), which was almost certainly my downfall.

As Jawgap has said, there are stretches on that road that are generally a nightmare, and it would require complete resurfacing (which is not going to happen for some time) to sort it out, hence I would have considered it pointless raising the issue with the council (as I would have thought there were many more serious defects to dealt with first, and the hard shoulder is not likely to be a priority).

LeoD

@blorg - Yes it is a disgrace that utility companies in this country appear to actively look for newly laid roads/footpaths to dig up but I have come to the conclusion we are a nation of idiots so I can't see this changing anytime soon. I don't see endless lawsuits that will only result in reduced funding for things like road repairs being the answer.

@Beasty, firstly let me say I'm glad you're okay after your spill - I wouldn't wish it on anyone. I don't know this road you speak of but it sounds like it's in a woeful state and definitely not a place to be doing 23mph which is fair old clip on a bike. I'm only saying that, as someone who was familiar with the poor condition of the road, you should maybe have adjusted your speed accordingly rather than blame someone else for your misfortune and seek financial recompense.

blorg

@LeoD- if I dug a hole in the road and just left it there... and then someone fell into the hole, breaking their leg. I would be blameless, right?

LeoD

Of course you'd be blameless. Now if you dug a hole and placed wooden spikes inside it causing someone to impale themselves then I would have to hold you some bit responsible for their death/injuries. Sorry, did I completely miss the point you were making with my exagerated fictional scenario?

Beasty

LeoD wrote: »

@Beasty, firstly let me say I'm glad you're okay after your spill - I wouldn't wish it on anyone. I don't know this road you speak of but it sounds like it's in a woeful state and definitely not a place to be doing 23mph which is fair old clip on a bike. I'm only saying that, as someone who was familiar with the poor condition of the road, you should maybe have adjusted your speed accordingly rather than blame someone else for your misfortune and seek financial recompense.

The particular road in question is just coming up to the M1 roundabout, and it is fine there for a stretch of just under 1km or so, except for two bits of roadwork that were only done in the last 6 months or so, which only cover the hard shoulder. Although I had gone over this many times (as indicated I had a couple of "wobbles"), it is so difficult to see, I only typically remembered it when I went over it (although I definitely look out for it now). It is perfectly reasonable to cycle at that speed along that specific bit of hard shoulder, except for the two roadworks in question. I have no memory of the accident in question, but if I had spotted it, I would have cycled more carefully over the "obstruction".

Ultimately this comes down to whether someone accepts fault in the road repair (and I think a lump of stone sticking out of the tarmac suggests this is not up to standard). If so, a compensation claim is entirely reasonable, given I am scarred for life, will have ongoing issues with some of my injuries, and have incurred costs as a result of the "accident". If not, then I will have no claim, and will get no compensation.

I suspect the Council accept there will, as a matter of course, be a number of personal injury claims coming their way on an ongoing basis as a result of defective roads. They choose not to repair every bit of defective road because they know, statistically, that only a small number of them will result in claims. They basically weigh up the cost of claims against the cost of repairs, and act accordingly. Clearly if specific danger points are drawn to their attention, they are more likely to deal with that specific piece of road. But my accident could just have easily happened a kilometre further back (along the most atrocious bit of road identified by Jawgap), at much slower speed, where there is no hard shoulder, and I could then have been run-over by a juggernaught - I would suggest the Council would still be the one facing a claim.

blorg

My point is, my digging a hole in the road is an action that creates a hazard, and one I would indeed be legally (and morally) responsible for. Your spike scenario would suggest intent to harm, and indeed would be judged more harshly, but intent to harm is not necessary for negligence.

A road that has simply deteriorated through wear and tear without any party actively creating the hazard is a different matter and indeed the responsibility is on the road user in this case.

Note in this case the party paying up will be the one that dug up the road; councils require utility companies digging up the road to indemnify them against liability for claims arising from the work (and indeed the utility must be insured against such claims.)

Pimp Ninja

Thank God you are OK!

I think I witnessed this. I was driving the inside lane probably 600-700 meters behind you. It happened about half way between the Topaz and the M1 roundabout.

What I thought I had first seen was a plastic bin bag being blown in a breeze after a car.
Then about 3-5 cars in the traffic pulled into the hard shoulder, and a number of people got out.
By the time I reached the site of the accident I could see you lying on the ground, trying to sit up, with blood running down your face.

I could see that whatever had happened was serious, but I didnt see exactly what happened.
I pulled in about 100 meters after where you were lying on the ground and called an ambulance. Once I had finished calling the ambulance I continued to work.


I am very very happy that you are in one piece.

Jawgap

LeoD wrote: »

@blorg - Yes it is a disgrace that utility companies in this country appear to actively look for newly laid roads/footpaths to dig up but I have come to the conclusion we are a nation of idiots so I can't see this changing anytime soon. I don't see endless lawsuits that will only result in reduced funding for things like road repairs being the answer.

/quote]

No offence LeoD, but it doesn't work like that. Local Authorities don't sit on a pile of money and decide to spend it on road repairs on the basis of need - they spend it on the basis of who shouts the loudest.

If enough residents complain to their local councillor about a pothole it gets fixed even if it's up the most obscure bohereen. This is a fairly significant route into the city with few residents, therefore who is going to agitate for it's improvement??

There won't be enough residents or cyclists, but a couple of chunky personal injury claims will make them take notice - unfortunately that means someone has to have an accident.

The other problem is that since the M1 opened this road has been relegated to "R" status and so it's left to the local authority to maintain it. To be honest it's in a complete state along significant portions of it's length (esp around where Beasty crashed and south of Balbriggan) and Fingal County Council are showing no signs of doing anything about it.

robs1

sorry to hear about your falls guys they sound very nasty.just speaking about the roads in the fingal area its really hit and miss.i came off my bike on the road from garristown heading towords swords.they have the road resurfaced for a good bit of a strech but of coarse only a couple of hundred meters after the resurfacing i came off the bike after hitting a crack in the road and this was the part i felt needed repairing the most.i would like to know how it is planned out.

Beasty

Pimp Ninja wrote: »

Thank God you are OK!

I think I witnessed this. I was driving the inside lane probably 600-700 meters behind you. It happened about half way between the Topaz and the M1 roundabout.

What I thought I had first seen was a plastic bin bag being blown in a breeze after a car.
Then about 3-5 cars in the traffic pulled into the hard shoulder, and a number of people got out.
By the time I reached the site of the accident I could see you lying on the ground, trying to sit up, with blood running down your face.

I could see that whatever had happened was serious, but I didnt see exactly what happened.
I pulled in about 100 meters after where you were lying on the ground and called an ambulance. Once I had finished calling the ambulance I continued to work.


I am very very happy that you are in one piece.

Thanks for that, and particular thanks for calling the ambulance. I know the accident happened at 7.22, and I was at the Beaumont by 7.54 (someone put the Garmin in my bag for me, and so I have been able to track every second of the journey), and so I am very impressed with the ambulance service. I cannot remember anything from about an hour before until a couple of hours after the accident, so any information is helpful (I do already have contact details of one person who helped). Nice to know I looked like a "plastic bin bag being blown in a breeze":)