Loan Parent & Maintenance Question

LegacyUser

Quick Question

Split up with my GF a while ago, Due to work i dont get round much to see the little one much but that will change..

Anyhoo, she recieves loan parent of about €220 a week or something like that.(she's not working at the moment)

The Maintenance people have been onto me telling me i need to pay her €100 a week, which i already do (all i can afford at the mo), just they have never asked before, which i'm guessing why i got a letter.

My question is now that they know she recieves €100 a week from me, will see loose all this from her loan parent or just a percentage of it????

Any info would be much appreciated

LegacyUser

Yes she will loose 50% of what you give her now that it's all legal... Social Welfare will deduct €50.00 from her loan parents, so be sure you don't end up in court to pay more money cause the Family Court is a joke in Ireland and they don't care about the Dad's and what they live on.. so you could be asked in Court to pay the current max which I think is €150... good luck.. but don't worry, I am sure she has benefits coming at her in all directions, do YOU ?? didn't think so..

LegacyUser

Also, if you were paying €100 before Social Welfare contacted you and now that it's all above board, if she cannot survive on that, plus her housing allowance, plus her childrens maintenance and anything else going, they will suggest she take you to court for more money, be sure to bring as much paperwork with you regarding your earnings and expenditure etc., be careful from here on in and keep an account of everything you or your family buy for the little guy, and when you have him etc., the less you see of him, the more the court might award her but who cares what you live on.. AIR...

PS.. this reply is from a woman and not a man..

LegacyUser

Very harsh replies there???? are you a woman whose current boyfriend's ex is taking him to the cleaners......??? or is that what he is telling you?

So single mothers have it easy??? with all the benefits they can claim

Get a life........ or walk a day in the shoes of a single mother

Lone parents is a very small amount to live on when you consider rent, food, clothes and bills and when half your maintenance is taking from you

You cant go to work because creches or childcarers would cost in excess of what you are earning.

To help out the OP with a more useful reply.... Yes she will lose some of her Lone parents.

For your own sake, keep a record of all payments by electronic form e.g. cheque, money tranfers etc. Try and make an effort to see your child as often as you can with some routine as children like routine in their lives
And very importantly become a joint guardian of your child

LegacyUser

The above information is wrong. It wont affect her lone parents, or if it does it will minimally.

What it does affect is rent allowance. The HSE will take ALL of it and deduct it from their contribution towards the rent.

itz me

first of all i wana give u a pat on the back for been a father who looks after his kid....second i'm nearly a hundred per cent sure they deduct the same amount that ur givivg her!!!!

lalalulu

Ok i have just been talking to the one parent family helpline.. OP if it helps you can ring them and ask their advice as you are getting conflicting advice here. They told me rent allowance is NOT affected but the one parent family payment is. They calculate what you are paying in maintaince (sp?)
and deduct a very small percentage. It's very unlikely they will take 50 euro from her payment! As i said ring them and ask for advice as everyone's circumstance's are different.. Best of luck...

metrovelvet

From citizens info.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/social-welfare/social-welfare-payments/supplementary-welfare-schemes/rent_supplement

Income taken into account for Rent Supplement

* Net Income from employment (this is gross income less PRSI and reasonable travel expenses. Children aged 17 and under in full-time education will not have their income from employment assessed as means for Rent Supplement.)
* Social welfare payments (for exceptions - see 'Income not taken into account' below)
* HSE payments (for exceptions - see 'Income not taken into account' below)
* Family Income Supplement
* Cash Income (for example, maintenance)
* All income and the value of all property of which the claimant deprived himself/herself in order to qualify for SWA
* Capital (for example, property except your own home, savings and investments).

K-9

Unregistered wrote: »

Quick Question

Split up with my GF a while ago, Due to work i dont get round much to see the little one much but that will change..

Anyhoo, she recieves loan parent of about €220 a week or something like that.(she's not working at the moment)

The Maintenance people have been onto me telling me i need to pay her €100 a week, which i already do (all i can afford at the mo), just they have never asked before, which i'm guessing why i got a letter.

My question is now that they know she recieves €100 a week from me, will see loose all this from her loan parent or just a percentage of it????

Any info would be much appreciated

The person who needs to be careful here is your ex. She could end up losing the maintenance completely.

1. on Lone Parents, taken from here: http://www.welfare.ie/EN/Publications/SW82/Pages/8Howdoyouassessmymaintenancepayments.aspx

You can pay rent or mortgage up to €95.23 a week without it affecting how we assess your maintenance payments. However, we assess half the balance of any maintenance payments over this amount.

So, if her rent/mortage is more than €95.23 a week, she'd only lose €2.33 a week.


As Metrovelvet posted, the Rent Allowance will be affected.


This is where she and you need to be careful, http://www.solo.ie/info/3151.htm

If you got a letter like that, you could end up paying the maintenance to them and the child and your ex will not see it at all!

It sounds like she told the Lone Parents people that she doesn't get maintenance. A lot of people think it will be taken away if they report it.

Best thing is for your ex to tell the Social Welfare she is getting it and you can then tell them that.

MojoMaker

Unregistered wrote: »

The Maintenance people have been onto me telling me i need to pay her €100 a week, which i already do (all i can afford at the mo), just they have never asked before, which i'm guessing why i got a letter.

Something wrong with this. The 'maintenance people' don't arbitrarily contact people requesting monies. Presumably you were there in court when the order was agreed between you and your ex (or her representative) - whereby the amount and the schedule was fixed. Either which way it should all be documented in the court notes of which you should hold a copy.

metrovelvet

^ Im guessing that there is a court order in place which she has not submitted to the maintenance people so that the maintenance people still think he is contributing nothing and is therefore asking him to make a contribution. Where they come up with E100 a week, I have no idea.

K-9

Unregistered wrote: »

The Maintenance people have been onto me telling me i need to pay her €100 a week, which i already do (all i can afford at the mo), just they have never asked before, which i'm guessing why i got a letter.

My question is now that they know she recieves €100 a week from me, will see loose all this from her loan parent or just a percentage of it????

Any info would be much appreciated

I think it maybe an informal agreement.

sickpuppy32

if your taking your child home for at least one day a month i think and ur working, be sure to claim the single parent tax benefit for your self. Its not much but it helps with the bills. Been a single mother is not easy but been a single father is a lot worse cause your expected to pay for everything and not be able to see your kid everyday.

metrovelvet

sickpuppy32 wrote: »

if your taking your child home for at least one day a month i think and ur working, be sure to claim the single parent tax benefit for your self. Its not much but it helps with the bills. Been a single mother is not easy but been a single father is a lot worse cause your expected to pay for everything and not be able to see your kid everyday.

au au au contraire.

sickpuppy32

metrovelvet wrote: »

au au au contraire.

as i said , things are rarely great for the single mum too but to be honest she has a better deal in general, she's not expected to work, she gets a free house, child benefit, child support, lots of other benefits plus most of all she can have a normal relationship with her kids.

A responsible single dad on the other hand is expected to work, pay maintenance, pay for himself and a mortgage and what and only gets to see his children on predefined restricted times,

metrovelvet

^ Ah see... in that post you used the word "responsible." Changes the whole meaning, and hey they are not all that.

And it's not all as cut and dried as the rest of what you said.

LegacyUser

Me and my ex are in the same boat, although im the single mother!! Me and my Childs father get on fine and had a maintaince agreement between ourselves nd when i applied for my lone parents after my son was born 5mts ago, I told them how much we agreed on (which was 50Euro bcz he has our son 3days a week and he buys him everything) nd they said it was fine but last week they sent out a letter sayin the same thing that he has to pay me 100Euro a week and wen we called the number on the letter they told my ex that i had to go to my local social office with the letter to sort it bt wen i went in they said they had nothin to do with them.. i think it is stupid!! he pays me maintaince which is more than i can say for alot of fellas that i knw of who have several kids and dont pay a penny for any of them.. i think its ridiculas that their goin after the fathers who are makin an effort and takin responsibility for their kids and leavin lowlife dikheads away wid payin nothin!! We are not gna answer the letter and see will they actually send him a summons!!

sickpuppy32

it never is cut and dried, i'm taking "in general", as in the vast majority of single mothers and fathers. You have to agree with me that is what society expects

lalalulu

sickpuppy32 wrote: »

as i said , things are rarely great for the single mum too but to be honest she has a better deal in general, she's not expected to work, she gets a free house, child benefit, child support, lots of other benefits plus most of all she can have a normal relationship with her kids.

A responsible single dad on the other hand is expected to work, pay maintenance, pay for himself and a mortgage and what and only gets to see his children on predefined restricted times,

Are you for real???? She's not expected to work???? People who are on lone parent's are not allowed work for more than 20 hours per week without having their money cut! You make it sound like "ah sure just pop a few kids out and you'll get everything handed to you". I would give anything to go back to work and pay for myself and when i'm finally back up on my feet i will do just that and i certainly won't be thinking single parent's have it easy!

metrovelvet

^

I especially love when he says "isnt expected to work," as if raising a child isnt hard graft.

sicky puppy, if you really wanted to send the mammys out to work why dont you take it upon yourself to do all the baby sitting, and that includes nights, since performativity at the workplace is compromised by sleep deprivation.

LegacyUser

I too recently received a letter from the maintence recovery section of social welfare services, the reason being that my ex lost her job and has applied for loan parents. I have been paying maintenence for the my childs entire life 7yrs and take her on average of 3 nights a week I also pay all medical bills, clothes Santa presents etc and rightly so but I'm not sure they take this into account. My letter says that my liability is now being reviewed and they want pay slips, mortgage statements etc so that they can assess how much I am to pay. Anything extra that they deem I have pay I will have to pay direct to the Maintenence Recovery Section.
My advice would be to compile a spread sheet of all outgoings, basically send them as much info as possible, I woulnt ignore a letter from then as they will chase it and you will end up in court its better to co-operate as much as possible.

The Corinthian

lalalulu wrote: »

Are you for real???? She's not expected to work???? People who are on lone parent's are not allowed work for more than 20 hours per week without having their money cut! You make it sound like "ah sure just pop a few kids out and you'll get everything handed to you". I would give anything to go back to work and pay for myself and when i'm finally back up on my feet i will do just that and i certainly won't be thinking single parent's have it easy!

I think the point sickpuppy was making is not that she should be expected to work, but that she should be expected to financially support herself (or at least make some effort towards this).

The unfortunate reality is that while maintenance, LPA and all the other supports that are there can effectively become a 'wage' for a single parent, they don't last forever. When the child reaches 18 (or at the latest 23) it all dries up. What happens then? Long term social welfare and poverty? Or, as often happens, the child then begins to financially support the parent and effectively becomes a 'pension'.

No one is suggesting that raising a child is not hard work, only that it is not a career.

LegacyUser

I have read this thread with interest. I am a newly separated father (married for 23 yrs) with 4 children, 18,14,12,6.

Mt circumstances are as follows, 3 youngest children spend sun-fri with their mother and fri to 6pm sunday with me. My eldest son lives with me now and will be attending his 2nd yr in universty from sept 09. I had the children for 1 week(9 days) in July and 2 weeks (16 days) in August. We have joint custody. My ex-wife pushed for a court hearing and the outcome was a maintainance order and an access order and a direction that she should not have her 'boyfriend' stay overnight in the house while the children are there.

There had previously been a full barring order stating that he could not be in the house at all while the children were there, this was while we were waiting to get a court hearing.

I work full time (Mon-Fri office hrs) my ex-wife does not have a job outside the house.
She left the family home and got a rented house, she took the 3 children with her and then refused to let me see them until i agreed arrangements via a solictor (despite us having already agreed arrangement before she left the house)

She receives €100 per week per child and €125 per week for herself from me.
In June an order was made on the above. At court she tried to claim that my eldest lived with her and that she was financially responsible for him, she then withdrew this when challenged.

During the summer when the children were with me, she spent 1 week in the UK and the 2 weeks in August in Spain.

THe children returned to school on Friday came to me friday afternoon and said that mum told them to get me to buy a school bag for one and the other needed 20€ for school. Their mum had told them to get the money from me as she had none left after paying for school uniforms, books etc....

Iwasn't too pleased and txted wife regarding same she replied 'Get stuffed' and later another txt telling me she would be returning to court to get a variation order on the monies (increase) and she would be challenging custody arrangements (access).

Now, the point, I'm not saying its easy for any person to raise children, indeed I know from being married that its hard sometimes with 2 of you. But you must agree that the situation as outlined above definitly favours the woman. I have no social life as I work Mon to fri and care for children every week-end, she has opportunity for social life every week-end.
I do not have an opportunity to be involved in the normal family activities e.g kids coming home from school recounting their day, helping with homework and chatting around dinner.

I do have the benefit of every week-end however, I believe this should be shared and the kids shold also have week-end time with their mother, but not at the detriment of time spent with me.

She is introducing a third party to our children and trying to set him up as the male parental figure, she spends most of her time in his house and the kids are made to sit in his front room while her and him chat.

I offered to take the children full time but was advised that because 2 of them would require child care from 3:30 to 5pm there was no way the judge would go for it.

I want her to live up to her decision....she wants a separation....and separate and leave me alone. We were in court in June she has a weekly income from me that is more than some familes earn from employment in a week. Yet the law allows her to do and say what she wishes and to drag me back to court at a whim where I have to pay solictors fees and she is receiving legal aid. At this point I wonder when will it stop...when will the law waken up and develop a fair system for calculating maintenance, i used the UK calculator and according to it I should be paying no more than 70€ per week each child and the max is much less. I am aware of cases were the father pays 63€ per week for each of 3 children and he has a comparable salary to mine.

Despite showing the court that I would be in deficit each week paying the amount suggested he still made the order for that amount !


I repeat what i said earlier its hard for anyone to bring up children, however, the system is flawed and from where I am sitting is weighted in favour of the mother/woman/wife.

LegacyUser

I WAS A SINGLE PARENT FOR 3 YEARS AND I WORK 3DAYS THEY SAY YOU CAN ONLY WORK 20HOURS BUT I WORK MORE.. I WAS ONLY GETTING 146.80 OFF LOAN PARENT I GOT ROUGHLY 250.00 FROM WORK AND 20 EURO A MONTH FROM THE DAD AS HE WAS IN COLLEGE.. I WAS RENTING A FLAT WHICH COST ME 160.00 a week had her in a creche 3 days which cost me 105.00 a week plus i had t0 do shopping and pay bills,,,your entitled to a medical card if on loan parent money towards gas and electricity.. its tough but you can work but its tough going.. all i can say is thank god for my dad, i'd be lost without him..

metrovelvet

^ It may weigh in favor of the married woman, certainly not all women.

So you have three kids and she gets 300 for all three as well as 125 in alimony? So you are paying 425 a week? Is that correct?

LegacyUser

Metrovelvet asked "So you have three kids and she gets 300 for all three as well as 125 in alimony? So you are paying 425 a week? Is that correct? "/I]

No ...... I have 4 children, 1 (one) lives with me full time the other 3 spend time with their mum and me as outlined in previos post. I pay a total of 300€ per week for the 3 children and 125€ for her with an expectation that i will pay for other things as well.

Kildrought

I have to pay solictors fees

No you don't, you can represent yourself on maintenance issues.

when will the law waken up and develop a fair system for calculating maintenance

Start lobbying... my proposal is here

i used the UK calculator

Not a suitable comparator - there are social supports in education and medical care that we don't have, also our laws are different.

I am aware of cases were the father pays 63€ per week for each of 3 children and he has a comparable salary to mine.

All depends what you want for your children of course - personally I've never begrudged the money spent on them. If you were still married, you could expect that at least 25-35% of your salary would be taken up by the costs of raising your children.

LegacyUser

No you don't, you can represent yourself on maintenance issues.

Not sure this is the best idea, certainly in my case, the fact that a couple get to court to me suggests that they can/t agree fro one reason or another. My experience of court is it is a free for all and he or she who shouts loudest gets heard ! There is a saying somwthing like "the person who represents themselves has a fool for client"

Start lobbying... my proposal is here

Read it, interesting concept, one thought is that some people may not want their personal business shared among the staff in the pay office ! The other end of it is how the percentage is calculated this is the problem, a fair calculation that ensures a minium and if individuals wish to contribute more then they are free to do it. My issue is that there does not appear to be consistancy in the manner in which maintainance is awarded.

Not a suitable comparator - there are social supports in education and medical care that we don't have, also our laws are different.

Point taken, and correct our laws are different... are they better ???? not sure

All depends what you want for your children of course - personally I've never begrudged the money spent on them. If you were still married, you could expect that at least 25-35% of your salary would be taken up by the costs of raising your children.

I have not and do begrudge money spent on my children. However it si difficult to accept that the money is infact being spent on the children when they turn up in turn clothes and torn school uniforms and i replace the clothes and they return to their mother in these clothes and the next week they turn up againin torn clothes.
As i mentioned previously my ex spent 1 weeks holiday in the UK (july) and 2 weeks in Spain (august) and then advised the cildren to ask me for money for school bags and school lockers.

I accept your point that if still married a percentage of income would be spent on the children, however I'm not, I now have to financially support 2 homes and care for my children 3 days out of 7, there isn't as much money to go around as there was when there was one home........its simple everyones standard of living decreases.....however how much it decreases depends on how much each parent contributes to the equation.

The system does not provide any 'incentive' for the ex-wife to work even though she has every school day free and every week-end !

Splendour

AstraVectra wrote: »

I have read this thread with interest. I am a newly separated father (married for 23 yrs) with 4 children, 18,14,12,6.

Mt circumstances are as follows, 3 youngest children spend sun-fri with their mother and fri to 6pm sunday with me. My eldest son lives with me now and will be attending his 2nd yr in universty from sept 09. I had the children for 1 week(9 days) in July and 2 weeks (16 days) in August. We have joint custody. My ex-wife pushed for a court hearing and the outcome was a maintainance order and an access order and a direction that she should not have her 'boyfriend' stay overnight in the house while the children are there.

There had previously been a full barring order stating that he could not be in the house at all while the children were there, this was while we were waiting to get a court hearing.

I work full time (Mon-Fri office hrs) my ex-wife does not have a job outside the house.
She left the family home and got a rented house, she took the 3 children with her and then refused to let me see them until i agreed arrangements via a solictor (despite us having already agreed arrangement before she left the house)

She receives €100 per week per child and €125 per week for herself from me.
In June an order was made on the above. At court she tried to claim that my eldest lived with her and that she was financially responsible for him, she then withdrew this when challenged.

During the summer when the children were with me, she spent 1 week in the UK and the 2 weeks in August in Spain.

THe children returned to school on Friday came to me friday afternoon and said that mum told them to get me to buy a school bag for one and the other needed 20€ for school. Their mum had told them to get the money from me as she had none left after paying for school uniforms, books etc....

Iwasn't too pleased and txted wife regarding same she replied 'Get stuffed' and later another txt telling me she would be returning to court to get a variation order on the monies (increase) and she would be challenging custody arrangements (access).

Now, the point, I'm not saying its easy for any person to raise children, indeed I know from being married that its hard sometimes with 2 of you. But you must agree that the situation as outlined above definitly favours the woman. I have no social life as I work Mon to fri and care for children every week-end, she has opportunity for social life every week-end.
I do not have an opportunity to be involved in the normal family activities e.g kids coming home from school recounting their day, helping with homework and chatting around dinner.

I do have the benefit of every week-end however, I believe this should be shared and the kids shold also have week-end time with their mother, but not at the detriment of time spent with me.

She is introducing a third party to our children and trying to set him up as the male parental figure, she spends most of her time in his house and the kids are made to sit in his front room while her and him chat.

I offered to take the children full time but was advised that because 2 of them would require child care from 3:30 to 5pm there was no way the judge would go for it.

I want her to live up to her decision....she wants a separation....and separate and leave me alone. We were in court in June she has a weekly income from me that is more than some familes earn from employment in a week. Yet the law allows her to do and say what she wishes and to drag me back to court at a whim where I have to pay solictors fees and she is receiving legal aid. At this point I wonder when will it stop...when will the law waken up and develop a fair system for calculating maintenance, i used the UK calculator and according to it I should be paying no more than 70€ per week each child and the max is much less. I am aware of cases were the father pays 63€ per week for each of 3 children and he has a comparable salary to mine.

Despite showing the court that I would be in deficit each week paying the amount suggested he still made the order for that amount !


I repeat what i said earlier its hard for anyone to bring up children, however, the system is flawed and from where I am sitting is weighted in favour of the mother/woman/wife.

I too think the system is flawed-albeit I am the separated woman. I don't know why you don't go for custody if you really want it. My husband got custody of one of our kids and this kid was still in primary school at the time and needed after school care. Altough I don't see how a kid needing after school care should make a difference, after all there are plenty of Moms who need this facility too.
As with regards to maintenance? I agree it's a farce.My Ex managed to get maintenance reduced from 350 a month to 200 euro. All this despite the fact that he was able to pay 90,000 euro off his mortgage last year while I'm in debt and struggling from week to week. (And yes I'm working)

cee_jay

ANGEL AT HEART wrote: »

I WAS A SINGLE PARENT FOR 3 YEARS AND I WORK 3DAYS THEY SAY YOU CAN ONLY WORK 20HOURS BUT I WORK MORE..

For One Parent Family Payment, it does not matter how many hours you work - as long as your pay is under 425euro you still qualify for the payment, albeit at a reduced rate.
You can have up to 20,000 euro in Capital (i.e. savings, property etc.) before this is assessed against you.
Half your maintenance is assessable as means, however, your rent is allowable against this up to 95.23euro. If your maintenance per week is less than this then this will not affect your payment.

For someone to qualify for One Parent Family, if they were married, they have to show they are making efforts to obtain maintenance from their ex spouse. This is often in the form of a maintenance summons from the district court. If they were never married, they do not have to provide this proof at the time of application, and will be paid without it, however it may be requested later, and Maintenance Recovery Section will pursue this.

<State Benefits Mod Hat now off>

Kildrought

I don't know why you don't go for custody if you really want it. My husband got custody of one of our kids and this kid was still in primary school at the time and needed after school care.

In Ireland it is rare for sole custody to be granted to one parent, almost always the norm is joint custody with primary care being provided by the mother (I'm not arguing the rights & wrongs of this, just outlining the usual arrangements).

Unless there is compelling evidence (medical/police records etc.,) that the other parent is not a fit and proper person, it is most unlikely that a contested case for sole custody will succeed. Its also very rare for Judges to order that siblings be separated, unless it is in the best interests of the children.

@astravectra, as far as the 'pay office' goes - its an additional tax, what's the difference... re the 'what's the money being spent on'... you can't control that, don't get sucked into the games.