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The BCL good enough for Harvard masters?

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  • 07-07-2009 9:57pm
    #1
    the_wheel_turns
    Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭


    Hey all,

    Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on whether the UCD BCL degree in Law would be good enough for admission to Harvard's masters (LL.M.) programme.

    I know a lot of UCD Law peeps head over to Cambridge and the like, but I've only ever heard of the Trinity Law heads getting into Harvard.

    Any ideas/thoughts/whatever?!


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    #2
    themont85
    Registered Users Posts: 2,608 ✭✭✭themont85


    It should be if the grades are up to their ridiculous standard. I didn't do law myself but know of a couple of guys from the business end of UCD who went there. I presume the BCL in UCD and TCD is the same standard, I mean don't UCD have a far greater number of judges ect? Or are my friends telling me porkies?

    To get into Harvard Budsiness school I know they needed money(of course) and a lot more besides good test results. They're gonna have a lot of applicants and you need to set yourself a part.


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    #3
    Time Magazine
    Registered Users Posts: 8,452 ✭✭✭Time Magazine


    the_wheel_turns wrote: »
    Any ideas/thoughts/whatever?!

    To not bother your head about getting into Law School in Harvard when you've just done the Leaving Cert.

    UCD may have more judges, but at least a part of that is because of its higher student population (substantially higher in the 60s, etc.) and also because judges are political appointments. Good judges don't necessarily make good legal academics.

    And although I'm not a lawyer, I suspect you'd have a better chance from Trinity, given its much stronger international reputation.


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    #4
    RandolphEsq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,296 ✭✭✭RandolphEsq


    The Economist wrote: »
    To not bother your head about getting into Law School in Harvard when you've just done the Leaving Cert.

    UCD may have more judges, but at least a part of that is because of its higher student population (substantially higher in the 60s, etc.) and also because judges are political appointments. Good judges don't necessarily make good legal academics.

    And although I'm not a lawyer, I suspect you'd have a better chance from Trinity, given its much stronger international reputation.

    GTFO! Blasphemy!

    /gets pitch fork


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    #5
    superficies
    Closed Accounts Posts: 165 ✭✭superficies


    Plenty of people get into Harvard LL.M from the BCL in UCD. They don't care what institution you come from--they only care about whether you have the grades (i.e. a First) and whether you can pay the tuition.


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    #6
    Time Magazine
    Registered Users Posts: 8,452 ✭✭✭Time Magazine


    superficies wrote: »
    They don't care what institution you come from

    I am told this isn't true. By lecturers in UCD from other countries, by lecturers in UCD who went to UCD, by my friend who goes to Harvard, by my friend whose grades are awesome but thinks her NUI degree is holding her back.

    But hey let's not tell the OP this and pretend that there's no chance that the institution has any bearing.


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    #7
    seraphimvc
    Registered Users Posts: 3,356 ✭✭✭seraphimvc


    ^and i thought UCD is good enough to be considered as a reputated college :pac:i mean UCD is surely considered as a good/world class university right?or else,this country has only 1 'real' college - THE trinity then?

    and then imo it would be shallow to judge the quality of the undergrad from any of these 'good' universities - we all know that undergrad doesnt related to the uni ranking at all.does Harvard really not know about this?

    please do tell if your trinity/ucd/any 'good' colleges degree does have a big factor on this master application thingy after your application,OP.


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    #8
    *littlestar*
    Registered Users Posts: 30 ✭*littlestar*


    Trinity just has a higher ranking in the QS World University Rankings, thats all. It's number 49 whereas UCD is 108


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    #9
    Time Magazine
    Registered Users Posts: 8,452 ✭✭✭Time Magazine


    seraphimvc wrote: »
    and then imo it would be shallow to judge the quality of the undergrad from any of these 'good' universities - we all know that undergrad doesnt related to the uni ranking at all.does Harvard really not know about this?
    They do know this, and it is shallow, but that doesn't change whether they care about it or not. They either do or don't.

    And from what I've heard, they do. I'm looking a lot at doing a PhD in the States next year so I've spoken to a lot of people about the selection process. When you get 900 applications for a course with 20 places, the first thing they do is strip out anyone who didn't get a first. Then they look at your GRE scores and strip out anyone who didn't get in the top 10%. You could still be seriously still looking at 200-300 applications for a remaining 20 places. So they strip out anyone who didn't get a first from an Ivy League or, if them applicatant is foreign, the best university in their country. Trinity's "name recognition" far exceeds UCD's, even if its quality doesn't.

    I'm not saying it's the major contributor here, but I'm saying it does matter in some cases. And I'm not basing that on any Trinity-pride or UCD-jealousy, just stating what I've been told.


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    #10
    DJDC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 365 ✭✭DJDC


    Its true that Trinity is better know internationally on a relative basis but on an absolute basis there's not too much to worry about. Trinity still would not be in top 5 or even top 10 in the UK so graduates from both institutions are treated fairly comparable. TCD is at the seconf tier of universities and nowhere near Oxbridge as most sensible trinners will admit. In fact if you go onto any UK student forums, you will usually see A Level students accepting KCL, Durham, Edinburgh, UCL etc. offers above TCD. There has been a slow erosion in the reptuation of TCD since the 1950's due to funding problems and an increase in competition from abroad.


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    #11
    seraphimvc
    Registered Users Posts: 3,356 ✭✭✭seraphimvc


    DJDC wrote: »
    Its true that Trinity is better know internationally on a relative basis but on an absolute basis there's not too much to worry about. Trinity still would not be in top 5 or even top 10 in the UK so graduates from both institutions are treated fairly comparable.

    exactly what i have in mind:p

    is just kinda sad at some point the top2 uni in ireland aka trinity ucd,are in fact some sh!tty colleges overall:P


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    #12
    superficies
    Closed Accounts Posts: 165 ✭✭superficies


    Institutions are likely to matter for doctoral applications alright--these are whole other kettle of fish--but Ivy League LL.Ms are very much cash cows for those universities. There is no real tradition of LL.Ms over there as the JD is already a graduate degree, and so Harvard and other places have ENORMOUS LL.M programmes (hundreds of students) where most classes are taken with the JD students. It's not '900 applications for 20 places'...grades are the most important thing. Institution might matter if you're making funding applications, but if you are self-funding then wouldn't worry too much.


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