The Sub 3 Support Thread

Plodman

I've been following this thread with interest; best of luck to you all whatever your target.
Looking for a little advice. I've been running 6 days per week for the past 6 months and my original target was to break 3 hours but recent form suggests I am capable of more. In the last two months I did a 20M, 21M, 23M & 23M LSR. I ran a HM in 1:19 4 weeks ago and have done plenty of intervals, VO2 Max workouts etc. Did a 12 mile last night @ 6:26 pace and it felt comfortably hard. Any suggestions/feedback on a realistic target? 2:50/2:55?

Krusty_Clown

Plodman wrote: »

I've been following this thread with interest; best of luck to you all whatever your target.
Looking for a little advice. I've been running 6 days per week for the past 6 months and my original target was to break 3 hours but recent form suggests I am capable of more. In the last two months I did a 20M, 21M, 23M & 23M LSR. I ran a HM in 1:19 4 weeks ago and have done plenty of intervals, VO2 Max workouts etc. Did a 12 mile last night @ 6:26 pace and it felt comfortably hard. Any suggestions/feedback on a realistic target? 2:50/2:55?

Hi plodman, any opinions you get from us are just going to be pure speculation. The bottom line is that we can't tell you what you're good for. Having said that, if I ran 12 miles @6:26 a couple of weeks out from my goal, and had it feel comfortably hard, I'd certainly be leaning towards running at around that pace for my marathon. I've run sub 2:50, off of a 1:19 HM before.

robinph

Have been doing similar times and now have a couple of 1:19 halves under my belt and with a lot more longer runs than I've done previously. I think I'll be pushing it into the red and aiming for a sub 2:50 in my next marathon, possibly even setting out at 2:45 pace. I'm prepared for it all to go wrong and me to be in a world of hurt towards the end though.

From your paces it sounds like you should be good to go for low 2:5x and possibly quicker, but it depends on how big a target this is and how many marathons you already have done.

Is getting under 3 the main target? If so then go for a 2:55'sh pace and you should do it easily and even allowing for a slowing towards the end you can still make it round.

Is smashing a big pb the main target and going as fast as possible? Then if your prepared to risk it going badly wrong aim for a low 2:50'ish time.

All depends on what you are prepared to put yourself through and experience of the painful end of a marathon can help with figuring that out.

Plodman

Thanks Krusty Clown. I realise that any advice on time would be pure speculation. Just really looking for divine inspiration. Don't want to be grappling with pace decision the night before the big event. I appreciate the feedback nonetheless. Best of luck

Plodman

Thanks robinph. I have experience of marathon's going badly wrong in the past so I know what is potentially facing me. Think I'll aim for low 2:50 ish. It would be great if there were pacers for that level; it would make the decision that bit easier!!

Krusty_Clown

Plodman wrote: »

Thanks Krusty Clown. I realise that any advice on time would be pure speculation. Just really looking for divine inspiration. Don't want to be grappling with pace decision the night before the big event. I appreciate the feedback nonetheless. Best of luck

The one thing I will say is that it makes a lot of sense to get some experience running at your planned marathon pace, so last minute snap decisions can be counter-productive. Having said that, you got some good practise at running at 6:26/mile so that qualifies. Don't worry about there not being pacers available. There will be a good few runners at your target pace. Just start conservatively and pick up the pace over the second half of the course.

ooter

One week in to taper and I bagged a sub 38 min 10k this morning for the first time ever.struggled to go under 33 mins for 5 miles just 2 weeks ago.
Absolutely made up with that,thank you Mr pfitzinger.:)

Toblerone1978

ooter wrote: »

One week in to taper and I bagged a sub 38 min 10k this morning for the first time ever.struggled to go under 33 mins for 5 miles just 2 weeks ago.
Absolutely made up with that,thank you Mr pfitzinger.:)

Looks like the talk of going for 3.05 was only that, talk. Sub 3 is back!!

ArtieFufkin

Bagged my first sub-3 yesterday with a 2:57. Very happy with it, ran a consistent pace all the way with even splits and even managed a bit of a sprint finish.

yaboya1

ArtieFufkin wrote: »

Bagged my first sub-3 yesterday with a 2:57. Very happy with it, ran a consistent pace all the way with even splits and even managed a bit of a sprint finish.

Well done Artie.
Where was that? Did you finally find a flat course?

ArtieFufkin

yaboya1 wrote: »

Well done Artie.
Where was that? Did you finally find a flat course?

It was at the East of Ireland Marathon in Lusk yesterday. The course is definitely not flat, more undulating with a few long up hill drags but nothing really sapping.

yaboya1

ArtieFufkin wrote: »

It was at the East of Ireland Marathon in Lusk yesterday. The course is definitely not flat, more undulating with a few long up hill drags but nothing really sapping.

Ah, but you've had plenty of practice at that
Well done again

ice9

can someone help me with this because I've struggled to find the answer. I follow Hal's online plans. I have found they have really worked for me and so far have not deviated from them in 4 marathon attempts. Have PB'd each time so no reason to try a different plan yet!

But every time I follow a plan I learn a bit more, pay more attention to newer details etc. The one I'm struggling with currently is the tempo run.

Q: When Hal prescribes a tempo of 40 mins, is he including the warm up and warm down time in that or is he intending that the entire 40 mins be spent at LT?

The reason I ask is that I interpreted it as including the warmup/warmdown time for my last plan but it felt a little on the light side as you never get more than 20 to 25 mins at LT then.

What do you think please?

davedanon

ice9 wrote: »

can someone help me with this because I've struggled to find the answer. I follow Hal's online plans. I have found they have really worked for me and so far have not deviated from them in 4 marathon attempts. Have PB'd each time so no reason to try a different plan yet!

But every time I follow a plan I learn a bit more, pay more attention to newer details etc. The one I'm struggling with currently is the tempo run.

Q: When Hal prescribes a tempo of 40 mins, is he including the warm up and warm down time in that or is he intending that the entire 40 mins be spent at LT?

The reason I ask is that I interpreted it as including the warmup/warmdown time for my last plan but it felt a little on the light side as you never get more than 20 to 25 mins at LT then.

What do you think please?

I'm not familiar with Hal, but almost certainly a tempo run of 40 mins does not include either warm-up or cool-down. It's 40 mins at tempo/LT pace.

Netwerk Errer

Finally back on the roads . Sprained my ankle last Friday in a pothole, scary moment!! I thought my chances of running the DCM were gone.

I'm taking the silence on this thread as a good sign that everyone's is having a relaxed taper.

Bahanaman

Too relaxed! Injured ankle yesterday three weeks ago! Little running since. Longest taper ever. Sub three not looking good. I'll be looking to identify the boardsies on the day and hope the cameraderie will drag me around!

TFBubendorfer

Bahanaman wrote: »

I'll be looking to identify the boardsies on the day and hope the cameraderie will drag me around!

And if the camaraderie doesn't do it for you then just imagine the grief I'm going to give you should I catch you and use that as your incentive to run your proper sub-3!

Bahanaman

Oh sh1t I'd forgotten about that!:eek: The last thing I want to see through my tears is a sneery Austrian sniggering at me! Any amount of pain and suffering would be worth avoiding that scenario! :P

Toblerone1978

P&D plan called for an 8mi run today with 3 x 1mi @ 5k pace. I PBed last Saturday at Marlay's Parkrun at 18.21. So I thought straight forward enough, I'll run the 3m at 5.54, same pace as last Saturday.

I ran terrible, 12 sec off for first 2 mi and the last was even worse, just 3 secs off 1/2 marathon pace.

I don't get it, my mileage is decreasing so I expected to be much fresher. Due to do a 5mi recovery run tomorrow but I think I'll cancel it.

Anyone else feeling wiped?

paddybarry

Toblerone1978 wrote: »

P&D plan called for an 8mi run today with 3 x 1mi @ 5k pace. I PBed last Saturday at Marlay's Parkrun at 18.21. So I thought straight forward enough, I'll run the 3m at 5.54, same pace as last Saturday.

I ran terrible, 12 sec off for first 2 mi and the last was even worse, just 3 secs off 1/2 marathon pace.

I don't get it, my mileage is decreasing so I expected to be much fresher. Due to do a 5mi recovery run tomorrow but I think I'll cancel it.

Anyone else feeling wiped?

I would not worry about it. Much easier to hit those paces with company.

Netwerk Errer

Toblerone1978 wrote: »

P&D plan called for an 8mi run today with 3 x 1mi @ 5k pace. I PBed last Saturday at Marlay's Parkrun at 18.21. So I thought straight forward enough, I'll run the 3m at 5.54, same pace as last Saturday.

I ran terrible, 12 sec off for first 2 mi and the last was even worse, just 3 secs off 1/2 marathon pace.

I don't get it, my mileage is decreasing so I expected to be much fresher. Due to do a 5mi recovery run tomorrow but I think I'll cancel it.

Anyone else feeling wiped?

You'll be fine. It's normal for your legs to be a bit dead at this stage. Don't panic, There's still plenty of time for recovery.

Make sure you're getting enough vit C, Iron and magnesium and most importantly relax. Don't let the doubts cloud your judgment, remember all the training you have done.

yaboya1

Toblerone1978 wrote: »

P&D plan called for an 8mi run today with 3 x 1mi @ 5k pace. I PBed last Saturday at Marlay's Parkrun at 18.21. So I thought straight forward enough, I'll run the 3m at 5.54, same pace as last Saturday.

I ran terrible, 12 sec off for first 2 mi and the last was even worse, just 3 secs off 1/2 marathon pace.

I don't get it, my mileage is decreasing so I expected to be much fresher. Due to do a 5mi recovery run tomorrow but I think I'll cancel it.

Anyone else feeling wiped?

Maybe the 5k pb took more out of you than you think? I wouldn't worry about it anyway. You've another week of easy miles to freshen you up for the big day and you're not going to be running at 5k pace anyway. Chill
I don't think you should cancel your recovery run. Think it will do you good. Just my opinion mind.

ooter

Toblerone1978 wrote: »

P&D plan called for an 8mi run today with 3 x 1mi @ 5k pace. I PBed last Saturday at Marlay's Parkrun at 18.21. So I thought straight forward enough, I'll run the 3m at 5.54, same pace as last Saturday.

I ran terrible, 12 sec off for first 2 mi and the last was even worse, just 3 secs off 1/2 marathon pace.

I don't get it, my mileage is decreasing so I expected to be much fresher. Due to do a 5mi recovery run tomorrow but I think I'll cancel it.

Anyone else feeling wiped?

I did that session last night and hit pretty similar times to yourself,was hoping to hit 6 min miles but it just wasn't there.not worried about it though cos I ran a 10k PB last Saturday so I'm putting it down to that.:)

Toblerone1978

Thanks folks for the feedback, nice to hear its all good. It appears form ooter and yaboya's comments that it's a delayed effect of a 5k PB effort on Saturday. I decide to go with more of a compromise and to do the 6mi run late tonight instead of doing it tomorrow night.

Probably no harm that I'm feeling tired, it will remind a bit more to rest over the next week. And its good to get the "bad day out of the office" out of the way now :-)

Netwerk Errer

12 miler tomorrow on fresh legs:). Beats the hell out of a 3 hour slog or 30k at MP on thrashed legs from a couple of weeks ago. It's just like 10k training now.

wobblemouth

I did that 3 x 1m session today. Managed to hit 5.57 on average for the splits. Hard going, but knowing it was my last session made me give it a lash. I've been following the P&D 18 week up to 55m plan as best as I could. I did miss some training due to holidays and being sick, but that was a while back. Hoping to knock 80 seconds off my PB to go under 3 for the first time.

Wish it was this weekend, as much as I love running I want to get it over with now. Tapering mind, I suppose!

skeleton_boy

wobblemouth wrote: »

Wish it was this weekend, as much as I love running I want to get it over with now. Tapering mind, I suppose!

With the weather out there at the minute it's probably best it's not this weekend. That's what will be driving me nuts over the next week or so. Checking the weather for 9am, Oct 27th, every couple of hours.

Netwerk Errer

I didn't bother doing the 12 miler on Saturday, done it today instead. Those few days forced rest may have been a good thing, my legs feel stronger than ever!:)

How're you guys feeling now?

ooter

Did the 12 miler yesterday,planned on doing it around 8:10 pace but ended up doing it at 7:30 avg pace.closest I got to mp was a couple of 7:15's so the pace wasn't too tasty.
Felt I was only settling in to the run in the last few miles,pace felt fairly effortless.hopefully I'm feeling that way next week after 12 miles..

Bahanaman

Did my first major run in three and a half weeks yesterday. 12 miler with the last 6 at mp. Dunno if it was the right thing to do or not but I felt I needed to see where I'm at. I've only managed to get back doing a small bit these last few days with a few five and six mile easy efforts. The mp miles were a bit of an effort but not too bad considering the layoff. I just needed to see if I could still manage the mp effort. I reckon I did a few more miles later on in the afternoon prowling the sideline as my club won its 24th county hurling championship! didn't touch a drop during the celebrations and was home before 9! Must be a big race coming up!