Public workers earn 48 per cent more than others

jimmmy

Ms Happy wrote: »

Thought someone would try to be smart on that....

I'm on my holidays, 2 weeks at home no Costa del whatever for me I'm afraid.

I did not pull you up on it or be smart about it lol

It never ceases to amaze me how many public servant overpay supporters there are between 9.30 and 5 pm, .....I remember here on this very board about a month or 6 weeks ago questioning another poster about how he was able to post so much during his working day, as he admitted he was at his public service work that day lol lol... he must have got a bit embarassed, as he did'nt post much after that.
At least you are getting paid while you are on holidays.....and in general public servants get longer holidays than those elsewhere too...but holidays are of course a seperate issue. This thread is about Public workers earn 48 per cent more than others

Riskymove

still waiting for the answer to my question jimmmy....

Riskymove

jimmmy wrote: »

public servant overpay supporters

?:pac::rolleyes:

donutheadhomer

How many public sector workers ear minimum wage? I had a look in fás today and seems that munimum wage is the norm in the private sector.

Ms Happy

jimmmy wrote: »

I did not pull you up on it or be smart about it lol

It never ceases to amaze me how many public servant overpay supporters there are between 9.30 and 5 pm, .....I remember here on this very board about a month or 6 weeks ago questioning another poster about how he was able to post so much during his working day, as he admitted he was at his public service work that day lol lol... he must have got a bit embarassed, as he did'nt post much after that.
At least you are getting paid while you are on holidays.....and in general public servants get longer holidays than those elsewhere too...but holidays are of course a seperate issue. This thread is about Public workers earn 48 per cent more than others

Oh... Did I take over you bashing thread? I do apologise, I only answered a feckin question.

You must have your head in the clouds if you think only Public Sector workers get paid holidays. Also, many Private sector employees use the internet during the day too.

I'll stop now before I rant.

P. Breathnach

jimmmy wrote: »

... This thread is about Public workers earn 48 per cent more than others

So it is. Why have you been ranting about staffing levels, productivity, sick leave, the length of the working week, and holidays?

Riskymove

EurasianBadger wrote: »

minimum wage is the norm in the private sector.

:rolleyes:

jimmmy

There is scope for saving 8 billion plus , given overstaffing in the public service ( eg 6000 in the dept of agriculture for only 100,000 farmers ), current poor productivity / short working hours ( sickies, 32 hour weeks, longer holidays etc ). Save 8 billion there , and cut our politicans numbers and pay too to more like international standards. If this had been done before now, we would not be in as big a mess economically.

Riskymove wrote: »

sorry jimmmy, €8bn saved where exactly?

erase the Dept of agriculture?

Nope, nobody suggested erasing the dept of Agriculture. Just cutting numbers to sensible ratios. Not paying a vet in Donegal over 100,000 euro per year when his counterpart in Fermanagh, with the same qualification,experience and job ( and who has to work longer hours ) gets paid only stg £ 51,000. There were numerous articles in the papers over the last 8 days ago about where the cuts should be made. Educate yourself and read them.;)

jimmmy

P. Breathnach wrote: »

So it is. Why have you been ranting about staffing levels, productivity, sick leave, the length of the working week, and holidays?

They need to be tackled as part of public service reform. Oh, and because riskymove has asked questions like that....see above.

irish_bob

dbready wrote: »

In fairness I think jimmy is getting a bit over hyped by the latest reports.

However, it is common knowledge whether Public Sector workers wish to admit it or not, that our Public sector is grossly overpaid for the services the public receive.

I don't blame the employees, I blame the unions 100%. Their benchmarking exercise never took into account the pensions gauranteed to Public Sector workers (I know of no-one who is guaranteed a lifetime pension in the private sector).

I also believe the frontline staff Gardai, Nurses, Firefighters etc.. should be given an increase at the expense of lazy administration staff who just get moved around because there is no specific jobs for them, and to make it worse the culprits KNOW this. Again thanks to our brilliant unions in this country no one can be let go in the Public Service.

Major overall neede to get a worldclass service which we deserve, and in the process we could save billions and enjoy a quality Health service for example!! Time to wake up the Irish Electorate.

garda , nurses and teachers are already over paid by interntational comparisons to the tune of over 30% , what makes them so special that they deserve a rise in a time of deflation

Riskymove

jimmmy wrote: »

Nope, nobody suggested erasing the dept of Agriculture. Just cutting numbers to sensible ratios.

I did nto see any such suggestion by you in your post

There were numerous articles in the papers over the last 8 days ago about where the cuts should be made.

i am interested in where you see the €8bn savings you have mentioned (preferably with some back up)

Educate yourself and read them.;)

now I know you are losing the debate when you stoop to such comments jimmmy

in any event if you are basing your views on the woefully lazy indo reports and articles its no wonder you cannot back up any claims

P. Breathnach

jimmmy wrote: »

They need to be tackled as part of public service reform.

But you pointed out that this thread was about public service pay.

Oh, and because riskymove has asked questions like that....see above.

No, jimmmy, you were the first one to move the discussion away from pay levels, here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=61120081&postcount=38

You should have some regard for truth.

Jugs82

I have always wondered why publuic sector pay was ever linked to private sector pay as in my view their are few comparable positions

Personally i do think that the Public Service should be trimmed down, mad more efficient and importantly the 'job for life' mentality must be ended.

However, the public service is more than just pencil-pushers that the Indo like to depict, we have teachers, guards, nurses etc.. who I feel haven't got a fair deal - ask any newly qualified teacher (2-3 years qualified) what their cahnaces of a FT Permanent post are? or newly qualified Occupational Therapists, Nurses etc... most i know have gone to the UK

My view on things is that everything went out of control during the 'boom' and while the private sector is reacting/contracting, the public service is remaining as it always as which to me seems unfair

Also, i really dont think the unions have the best interests of anybody but themselves in mind - it seems like they are battling to retain and in some cases increase pay in certain areas which from my view seems more than a little unrealistic

jimmmy

Riskymove wrote: »

i am interested in where you see the €8bn savings you have mentioned (preferably with some back up)

I have already indicated where savings are to be made eg by cutting public service pay and pensions substantially. P. Breathnach indeed has accused me of " moving the discussion away from pay levels " lol ...I am damned if I do and damned if I do'nt.

Gumbo

jimmmy wrote: »

I have already indicated where savings are to be made eg by cutting public service pay and pensions substantially. P. Breathnach indeed has accused me of " moving the discussion away from pay levels " lol ...I am damned if I do and damned if I do'nt.

if you cut pension payments can the contributions be cut too?
i pay more money into my PS pension than i will ever get back, if i could opt out of the PS pension scheme i would in a heartbeat.

VO

Another round of benchmarking is neeed in the public sector with slaaries being reduced to the levels of the private sector. Benchmarking should work both ways but you won't see the unions or politicians advocating this as there are no votes in it.

We are paying the price now for stupid political decisions which were made over the past 8-10 years.

jimmmy

VO wrote: »

Another round of benchmarking is neeed in the public sector with slaaries being reduced to the levels of the private sector.

Why not reduce them BELOW the levels of the private sector, as is the case in most developed countries ?

jimmmy

kceire wrote: »

if you cut pension payments can the contributions be cut too?

It is still heavily subsidised. Ask the hundreds of thousands of people receiving public service pensions now ( or who will receive them in the next 5 or 10 years ) how much they paid in to the pension fund over a lifetime working. This pension debate is a seperate debate + if you want to revisit it or open a new thread then do so.

Gumbo

jimmmy wrote: »

It is still heavily subsidised. Ask the hundreds of thousands of people receiving public service pensions now ( or who will receive them in the next 5 or 10 years ) how much they paid in to the pension fund over a lifetime working. This pension debate is a seperate debate + if you want to revisit it or open a new thread then do so.

you brought up the idea of cutting pensions.

jimmmy wrote: »

I have already indicated where savings are to be made eg by cutting public service pay and pensions substantially. P. Breathnach indeed has accused me of " moving the discussion away from pay levels " lol ...I am damned if I do and damned if I do'nt.

Riskymove

jimmmy wrote: »

I have already indicated where savings are to be made eg by cutting public service pay and pensions substantially. P. Breathnach indeed has accused me of " moving the discussion away from pay levels " lol ...I am damned if I do and damned if I do'nt.

well you have posted some nonsense so I feel I must react to it otherwise it may be taken as fact. if you stop and start your own thread I'll respond there


so you think we can save €8bn by reducing levels of staff

of course no figures, how many guards, teachers etc you would fire etc

same old stuff..no substance

your one example is the department of agriculture (using material posted by someone else)

you say there are 6,000 staff and 100,000 farmers and thats it. you show no basis for whether or not thats an appropriate number or indeed what you think it should be. in your view its too many but no evidence to support it


from my general understanding of that Department it not only deals with farmers but with areas such as the wider agri-industry, forestry, fisheries, food safety and other areas

in addition it has many inspectors and other technical staff for which i would imagine the number of animals owned by farmers would be more important than the number of farmers.

Rob67

jimmmy wrote: »

Why not reduce them BELOW the levels of the private sector, as is the case in most developed countries ?

Why? So as that instead of castigating public servants you can laugh at them instead? Maybe it's because you want to feel superior?

I decided a while ago to stop putting my opinions on boards.ie because of threads/posts like these, but I feel that I should add my voice in defence of the PS.

If I can say one thing about you jimmmy, you are consistently on message, of course you are generally consistently inaccurate.

(slightly off the point here, but please bear with me)
Having just retired from the Defence Forces after 21 years, I can categorically state I did not receive a lump sum gratuity of 50% of my pay, it was closer to 38%. My pension is even less than that again, but manages to just fall into the threshold for incurring the Income Levy on my total pension reducing its worth even more.

I'm lucky that I have found alternative employment in the private sector, where I am getting paid a proper wage for the skills I developed in the DF. (No, I'm not telling you where, it's a secret)

Stop generalising jimmmy, be specific when quoting your sources, and, please, not ones from populist claptrap that pass as 'newspapers' or a friend whom may or may not have met, one day a while ago, perhaps.

P. Breathnach

VO wrote: »

Another round of benchmarking is neeed in the public sector with slaaries being reduced to the levels of the private sector. Benchmarking should work both ways but you won't see the unions or politicians advocating this as there are no votes in it...

You should not decide in advance that a new round of benchmarking will result in all public service salaries being reduced (even though that would probably be the outcome). While pay levels in general seem to be going down, there are possibly some exceptions. Benchmarking entails aligning public sector pay with private sector pay for comparable employment.

Yes, let it happen, and let us see what the results are. It seems to me to be fairer than an unconsidered tactic of slashing everything by X%.

irish_bob

kceire wrote: »

if you cut pension payments can the contributions be cut too?
i pay more money into my PS pension than i will ever get back, if i could opt out of the PS pension scheme i would in a heartbeat.

utter nonesense , you pay less than a fifth of what you will get back

irish_bob

Riskymove wrote: »

well you have posted some nonsense so I feel I must react to it otherwise it may be taken as fact. if you stop and start your own thread I'll respond there


so you think we can save €8bn by reducing levels of staff

of course no figures, how many guards, teachers etc you would fire etc

same old stuff..no substance

your one example is the department of agriculture (using material posted by someone else)

you say there are 6,000 staff and 100,000 farmers and thats it. you show no basis for whether or not thats an appropriate number or indeed what you think it should be. in your view its too many but no evidence to support it


from my general understanding of that Department it not only deals with farmers but with areas such as the wider agri-industry, forestry, fisheries, food safety and other areas

in addition it has many inspectors and other technical staff for which i would imagine the number of animals owned by farmers would be more important than the number of farmers.

im from a farming backround and i assure you that one civil servant at the dept of agri for every 16 full time farmers is an extrordinarily high number , as for evidence , even you were shown it , how would you recognise it , after your comment that the amount of civil servants could be dicatated by the number of animals on farms , i highly doubt you would know evidence if it came up and hit you

Gumbo

irish_bob wrote: »

utter nonesense , you pay less than a fifth of what you will get back

utter nonesense, i have posted figures of my salary and payments in other threads and i would be much better off saving the money in a decent high intrest account. i will not have 40 years service if i do indeed last in the PS until i am 65, so i will never, i say never get the 150% lump sum or the 50% pension as i wont have the service to get it.

so please check you facts before shouting your head off while its in the clouds!

Riskymove

irish_bob wrote: »

im from a farming backround and i assure you that one civil servant at the dept of agri for every 16 full time farmers is an extrordinarily high number , as for evidence , even you were shown it , how would you recognise it , after your comment that the amount of civil servants could be dicatated by the number of animals on farms , i highly doubt you would know evidence if it came up and hit you

so no need for evidence then at all, just your opinion and thats what counts...i see where you are coming from now

also joining jimmmy in laughable attempts at cheap comments to those who are debating with you, you make a good team and show your own true colours


so let me get this right, if there are inspectors whose job is to inspect animals, the number of animals to be inspected has no bearing on how many inspectors are needed?

newname

Posted at 4pm on a Monday

Most people on here giving out about the lazy public servants seem to be doing very little themselves. Maybe if the PS workers were as idle as the anti PS posters on here we could get a more even debate.

How much do you expect to get paid for browsing boards all day ranting about the PS and CS.

Get back to work, your boss knows all about your antics

jimmmy

newname wrote: »

Most people on here giving out about the lazy public servants seem to be doing very little themselves. Maybe if the PS workers were as idle as the anti PS posters on here we could get a more even debate.

If you look at the posters you will find most of them are actually p.s. employees, or retired ones like P. Breathnach. As said before, it never ceases to amaze me how many public servant overpay supporters there are between 9.30 and 5 pm, ....is there an add for boards.ie on the noticeboard of all p.s. offices ? I remember here on this very board about a month or 6 weeks ago questioning another poster about how he was able to post so much during his working day, as he admitted he was at his public service work that day lol lol... he must have got a bit embarassed, as he did'nt post much after that.

Riskymove

jimmmy wrote: »

If you look at the posters you will find most of them are actually p.s. employees, or retired ones like P. Breathnach. As said before, it never ceases to amaze me how many public servant overpay supporters there are between 9.30 and 5 pm, ....is there an add for boards.ie on the noticeboard of all p.s. offices ? I remember here on this very board about a month or 6 weeks ago questioning another poster about how he was able to post so much during his working day, as he admitted he was at his public service work that day lol lol... he must have got a bit embarassed, as he did'nt post much after that.

hmm...strange...that post seems very familiar for some reason...could I have seen it before?

oh ....and I'll say it again while I am at it......

public servant overpay supporters ....:rolleyes::pac:

jimmmy

Thats why I wrote " As said before". Oh, and if you really like the term
"public servant overpay supporters" why not shorten it to psos ( pronounced pozzos ) ....so the majority of people in the country will know how to refer to them in conversation.