Travelling community are behind Virgin Mary tree stump appearance in Rathkeale

Run_to_da_hills

To anyone that knows Rathkeale, it has one of the highest populations of travelers in the country. They practically own the town. They are also very superstitious and some of them are highly skilled at various crafts including carpentry..

What more could be better than to have more than half the nation descend on their town in their droves to watch a tree stump that supposing looks like the Blessed Virgin Mary.

No doubt during these recessionary times these people will be cashing in on this event to make as much out of it as possible with their chip vans, guided tours, various stalls etc. They might even make an offer to buy the church as they have done with most of the pubs in the town.

To look into this matter we would want to know who were the contractors involved in landscaping the church, were they locls? registered tradesmen ? VAT registered? what type of van they had, children present, was there vocabulary like "boss" used in conversation. Maybe the clergy can help us out with this investigation.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5goTWgFpCeqnNV2_guAtixou7bU7QD99B29T00

Undergod

Ah, back to a good old racist thread.

What does their being Travellers have to do with anything?

You remove that, this becomes "Creating fake religious event to rip people off." Pretty standard stuff, I would have thought.

King Mob

Classy stuff RtdH.

Why assume that they faked this when there is thousands of examples of images of religious icons being found in all manner of different things?
It's simple paredolia.

If I was faking something like this I'd make it look more convincing than what they have.

I wonder, why you are so convinced that it is a fake?

Run_to_da_hills

Updte, look at the cler lines of the cutting, this is obviously the work of skilled craftsmen and was doctered up to look like an image of Mary..

King Mob

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Updte, look at the cler lines of the cutting, this is obviously the work of skilled craftsmen and was doctered up to look like an image of Mary..

You really just showing your complete ignorance here.

1. The image is from a tree that was cut down hence why it's a stump and why it has "clear lines of cutting".
2. The outside of the stump is pretty much untouched. this is where the shape of the image comes from.
3. There is no evidence whatsoever (aside from your own bias) that this was fabricated.
4. The the shape thing is consistent with it being simply a coincidence.
5. if it was faked, wouldn't they do a more convincing job?

watty

Time to Burn out a few Travellers caravans again and put more rocks to stop them parking.

Why not make them wear an armband with a yellow star caravan on it?

Then you could really be sure.

Personally I think the whole Wells/Statues/Marian Images stuff tedious. The smarter thinkers in the Catholic Church have never much liked it either. These people probably buy Lottery Tickets too. Some are very genuine if misguided Believers.

karlog

I wonder will it be upgraded to a class II relic like the holy stone of Clonrichert?

coylemj

The OP's premise that the travellers in Rathkeale dreamt up this story to make money from selling chips etc. is nonsense.

Rathkeale has a large number of settled travellers i.e. they live in regular houses and they do not run chip vans or get up to the activities that we associate with travellers who live in caravans and move about the country. Secondly travellers are not skilled in carpentry, most of them have very little if any manual skills and anyway that stump was being cut down by regular workers, not travellers.

Run_to_da_hills

coylemj wrote: »

The OP's premise that the travellers in Rathkeale dreamt up this story to make money from selling chips etc. is nonsense.

Rathkeale has a large number of settled travelers i.e. they live in regular houses and they do not run chip vans or get up to the activities that we associate with travelers who live in caravans and move about the country. Secondly travelers are not skilled in carpentry, most of them have very little if any manual skills and anyway that stump was being cut down by regular workers, not travelers.

I travell to quite a lot of motorcycle rallies and festivals, you can be surprised the amount of travellers involved in catering, nothing wrong with them, the food can be a lot better than some of the high street burger joints.

The majority still drive panel vans, I passed by Rathkeale yesterday on my way to Abbeyfeale and noticed quite a few panel vans in the town.

As regards skills, the travelers are well able to adapt to any trade, and when they do they can be very talented. The State also offer special training courses for this community which would include metalwork, carpentry etc. Saying they don't do carpentry is a sweeping statement.

Looking at the stump myself I noticed there was a neat platform cut out for holding candles. I doubt if contractors could even be bothered dressing something like this thing up.

I also noticed that there was about six travellers present, they gave me a dirty look when I took out my phone camera to get a shot of it. It was mentioned in the press that there was an around the clock vigil of people present. I would say more like around the clock security in case someone takes an axe to it which is quite possible.

Undergod

And this indicates that this is a Traveller hoax how?

mikemac

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

The State also offer special training courses for this community which would include metalwork, carpentry etc.

They never heard of FAS so? Even if there is massive waste in FAS, it's still the best we have.

The community doesn't need special training, they can put up with courses that everyone else has to apply for.
And a time of huge unemployment and many people trying to get training courses before they cut off from the dole, then let everyone apply, not special courses for a small group and waiting list for others

Run_to_da_hills

mikemac wrote: »

They never heard of FAS so? Even if there is massive waste in FAS, it's still the best we have.

The community doesn't need special training, they can put up with courses that everyone else has to apply for.
And a time of huge unemployment and many people trying to get training courses before they cut off from the dole, then let everyone apply, not special courses for a small group and waiting list for others

About ten years ago there was an advertisement looking for a metalwork teacher with experience dealing with the traveling community. It was for the VEC and had nothing got to do with Fas. I went for that interview and one of the things pointed out was that patience with dealing with these people was of utmost importance even more so that the technical experience needed for the job.

They do need special training, some of these folk do not have any basic education, discipline and safety particularly in trade skills,. This would be very difficult to fit in with others that had.

scoil

I am from Rathkeale, I am not a traveller. Yes the majority of the town is travellers. No travellers are NOT behind this apperance it was members of the settled community that were working on the church grounds, there was no fancy carpentry work or anything else people might be thinking. It just happened. Maybe if this happened somewhere else you would not be so quick to judge.

lynski

if run-to-da-hills had read reports or seen reports on the holy tree they would realise that while there are travellers visiting this stump it is the local non traveler community who 'created', discovered and promoted it. while passing by yesterday and saturday IMHO the majority of visitors were neither locals or travellers.
IT is a bit of nonsense but there is no conspiracy here

bonkey

lynski wrote: »

there is no conspiracy here

I'm inclined to agree.

Anyone care to offer reason not to lock the thread?

toiletduck

Op interesting theory but Travellers are by and large very superstitious (and the women ultra religious). I really doubt they'd do something like this.

Gordon

Not dwelling on the Traveller issue, but I must admit that the first thing I thought when I saw the stump was: why was the stump cut vertically, surely if someone was cutting a tree down they'd do a horizontal slice, not a horizontal and (semi) vertical slice?

Ah, reading the article it says

When one willow was felled near the church entrance Monday, he said, a major branch cracked off and made "a funny shape." One worker cut through the stump at a near-vertical angle, revealing a wooden relief that inspires some to see the Virgin Mary.

Funny how the priest is saying that it's a load of nonsense!

The parish priest is away on vacation. His summer replacement, the Rev. Willie Russell, is not impressed. He says locals are letting their imagination run wild and threatening to violate the commandment, "Thou shalt not worship a false God."

"It's just a tree. You don't worship a tree," Russell said.

Run_to_da_hills

bonkey wrote: »

I'm inclined to agree.

Anyone care to offer reason not to lock the thread?

You can go ahead and lock the thread.

Wait and see when this stump is removed or vandalised who will be up in arms about it.

Bock the Robber

It seemed to hover for a moment, and then it moved off at great speed.

A_Fitz

coylemj wrote: »

or get up to the activities that we associate with travellers who live in caravans and move about the country.

Trust me, I live in a town full of them, n' near 3 other towns full of them, and 90%, at least, are ****ing scum, and that's not racism, that's a fact, simple as

lostexpectation

its was the builders who started it, are the builders travellors?

bonkey

A_Fitz infracted.

Abusive, bigoted comments are not going to be considered acceptable just because the poster claims they believe it to be a fact

Mahatma coat

As someone who has been known to wield a chainsaw for profit I can see no rational for cutting a tree like that, had the tree been broken at that point it is still the most dangerous aproach to the situation, imagine you have a spring in tension, this method of cutting is akin to slicing it in half and releasing all the energy in one hit, most sane lumberjacks would have started at the end and released the tension gradualy by reducing the leverage of the bough, ultimatley finishing with a nice clean horizontal stump. the mind boggles as to how they ended up with that unless someone saw the potential for a bit of religious mania akin to the Moving/Talking statues of the late eighties

6th

Mahatma coat wrote: »

As someone who has been known to wield a chainsaw for profit I can see no rational for cutting a tree like that, had the tree been broken at that point it is still the most dangerous aproach to the situation, imagine you have a spring in tension, this method of cutting is akin to slicing it in half and releasing all the energy in one hit, most sane lumberjacks would have started at the end and released the tension gradualy by reducing the leverage of the bough, ultimatley finishing with a nice clean horizontal stump. the mind boggles as to how they ended up with that unless someone saw the potential for a bit of religious mania akin to the Moving/Talking statues of the late eighties

Have to agree.

watty

Agreed, and more likely a spur of the moment thing than Conspiracy though. Many forked trees could be cut like this.

macgillicudy

does anyone know if the stump is still there?

bikeblues

The parish priest is away on vacation. His summer replacement, the Rev. Willie Russell, is not impressed. He says locals are letting their imagination run wild and threatening to violate the commandment, "Thou shalt not worship a false God."

"It's just a tree. You don't worship a tree," Russell said.



No father - you worship some invisible , intangible , big beardy guy in the sky that may or may not ( most likely NOT ) exist - worship a tree - the fools

Run_to_da_hills

macgillicudy wrote: »

does anyone know if the stump is still there?

I stopped off at it late summer to show someone, the ground around it was very mucky, someone tried to deface it, there was still a large presence of travelers at it.

studiorat

here's the photo, it looks like there may be some travellers behind it alright.

of course they could be fake travellers!

J MAN

I am a rathkeale traveler and before you go makeing raceist coments about us we owned any land that we put a caravan on we are extremly wellthy come down hoere and count how many 2009 top of the range BMWs Porches and Mercedes you see

J MAN

watty wrote: »

Time to Burn out a few Travellers caravans again and put more rocks to stop them parking.

Why not make them wear an armband with a yellow star caravan on it?

Then you could really be sure.

Personally I think the whole Wells/Statues/Marian Images stuff tedious. The smarter thinkers in the Catholic Church have never much liked it either. These people probably buy Lottery Tickets too. Some are very genuine if misguided Believers.

I am a rathkeale traveler and before you go makeing raceist coments about us we owned any land that we put a caravan on we are extremly wellthy come down hoere and count how many 2009 top of the range BMWs Porches and Mercedes you see

This thread is finished.