referees in the loi

paulcorr

It seems every tread on here involving teams in the loi has one thing in common .The standard of referees. so come on lets have your worst referees and your best IF THERE ARE ANY. Tell us the worst decisions you have seen this season be it your team or your opponents.And shame the refs lets see whos names pops up the most. I for one think alan kelly is a joke richie winters is not fit to ref in the leinster senior league and anthony buttimer is past his sell by date.

dreamers75

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/mns/features/droghedauniteday.html

Drogs keeper smashing his knee into Mark Quigleys face and breaking his jaw and knocking out 3 teeth and getting a free out takes some beating tbh.

More akin to Schumacher nailing battison back in the day.

DSB

Really wanna give the barstoolers even more to scoff at?

adamski8

seems like half of them are terrible to me and are big homers! dont remember their names im afraid!

dreamers75

DSB wrote: »

Really wanna give the barstoolers even more to scoff at?

They dont go to your games, they wont go to your games, why is there an obsession with people who dont even go to see their own teams games.


Makes no sense.

Galways peno last night is another. tbh refs all over the world are crap, we just have the crappest ones

TheBigLebowski

Referees get too much stick for a very difficult and thankless job.

The amount of abuse they are subjected to by players and fans is absolutely disgusting. What gives people the right to think that just because the guy is on a football pitch and your in the stand that you can shout "you stupid fat cunt, where the fuck are you trained you fucking gobshite". Seriously, in any other walk of life, can you imagine taking that abuse off the public? It's not like they make a bad decision on purpose. They make a split second decision and sometimes it's wrong, get over it.

DSB

dreamers75 wrote: »

They dont go to your games, they wont go to your games, why is there an obsession with people who dont even go to see their own teams games.


Makes no sense.

Galways peno last night is another. tbh refs all over the world are crap, we just have the crappest ones

Obsession is a pretty strong word there.

ntlbell

DSB wrote: »

Obsession is a pretty strong word there.

strong but warranted.

paulcorr

TheBigLebowski wrote: »

Referees get too much stick for a very difficult and thankless job.

The amount of abuse they are subjected to by players and fans is absolutely disgusting. What gives people the right to think that just because the guy is on a football pitch and your in the stand that you can shout "you stupid fat cunt, where the fuck are you trained you fucking gobshite". Seriously, in any other walk of life, can you imagine taking that abuse off the public? It's not like they make a bad decision on purpose. They make a split second decision and sometimes it's wrong, get over it.

Richie sadlier said it 2 weeks ago on mns that refs in this league were a joke and he is right . They get well paid to do a job if they cant do it get rid of them . If you or i were doing a job and doing it badly we wouldnt be there very long.Fans have the right to shout and moan if a ref makes a bad descision THEY PAY FOR THAT RIGHT DONT THEY.

adamski8

paulcorr wrote: »

Richie sadlier said it 2 weeks ago on mns that refs in this league were a joke and he is right . They get well paid to do a job if they cant do it get rid of them . If you or i were doing a job and doing it badly we wouldnt be there very long.Fans have the right to shout and moan if a ref makes a bad descision THEY PAY FOR THAT RIGHT DONT THEY.

hmmm ive never seen that "right" on my match tickets. while i dont mind shouting a ref after a bad decision, i hate to see morons shout all sorts of abuse at half time and full time at them, especially in front of young children. i agree they are pretty poor refs but personal abuse isnt really on(not saying you are doing this)

dreamers75

TheBigLebowski wrote: »

Referees get too much stick for a very difficult and thankless job.

The amount of abuse they are subjected to by players and fans is absolutely disgusting. What gives people the right to think that just because the guy is on a football pitch and your in the stand that you can shout "you stupid fat cunt, where the fuck are you trained you fucking gobshite". Seriously, in any other walk of life, can you imagine taking that abuse off the public? It's not like they make a bad decision on purpose. They make a split second decision and sometimes it's wrong, get over it.

I agree some abuse is out of order, but when you see a player chase a long ball into the box the keeper completley misjudge it and jump with his knee out and literally smash his face in. He then gives a free out!!!

To make matters worse the opposing player is stunned, spitting out teeth and his jaw is in the wrong part of his face the ref tells him to WALK off the pitch so the keeper can take the free.

Seriously should fans applaud that? or shout "bad decision good sir" ?

DSB

paulcorr wrote: »

Richie sadlier said it 2 weeks ago on mns that refs in this league were a joke and he is right . They get well paid to do a job if they cant do it get rid of them . If you or i were doing a job and doing it badly we wouldnt be there very long.Fans have the right to shout and moan if a ref makes a bad descision THEY PAY FOR THAT RIGHT DONT THEY.

Haha no, they do not pay for that right. I pay for things in many establishments where I wouldn't be allowed hassle the employees.

I'm not saying I don't hassle **** refs, I do. But lets not act like its our god given right.

Guy:Incognito

Refs in general get lots of abuse for makeing crap decisions. Look at any match thread from the PL or CL last season. More often than not theres a good few mentions of the ref being crap.


Refs seem to be getting increasingly out of touch with how the game is played and making more and more ridiculous decisions. Dont know if they are so afraid of getting things worng that its making them worse or what.

applehunter

Jim O'Neill will always be remembered by this young Cork City supporter.

He came from an era when being blind, overweight and thick was no obsticle to getting to referee up and down the country.

Being a dub he was of course a prick and would usually be put in charge if Cork City were playing any important game against a Dublin club.

dreamers75

applehunter wrote: »

Jim O'Neill will always be remembered by this young Cork City supporter.

He came from an era when being blind, overweight and thick was no obsticle to getting to referee up and down the country.

Being a dub he was of course a prick and would usually be put in charge if Cork City were playing any important game against a Dublin club.

RRS?

Angelicus_22

Richie Winters is a terrible ref, ive seen him at several games this year and it generally seems as if he's watching another game with the decisions he gives, also the incident with the Drogs keeper and the Rovers player warranted no action, there was no malice in that, a 50/50 ball where Skinner jumped and the Rovers player ducked....

ArmaniJeanss

Theres a grading system in place, so in theory (and possibly in practice) these guys are the best referees that the country has to offer.

I don't know the situation nowadays but back when I was playing the FAI were a bit stupid about referee recruitment.

Mid twenties, merrily playing away in Division3 Sunday of the AUL, I decided to become a referee. Really felt I could do better than most of the refs at that level anyway. Planned to do the course, then assumed I'd be started off in Saturday U12s DDSL games, work my way up through Saturday reffing, and see where I was when I gave up playing.

However during the course it was made clear to me that I wouldn't actually be given a game to referee at any standard so long as I continued playing Sunday ball. Bizarrely they said they couldn't give me a game because of 'potential conflict of interest'.

I could understand that I wouldn't be given an all-aged game because it could cause hassle if, for example, I sent off a player whose team played mine in a cup game two weeks later etc.

But conflict of interest with an U12s game seemed a stretch.. they gave me examples of 'what if the manager of a team you were reffing was also an opponent you played against regularly on a Sunday, you wouldn't be able to ref impartially'.

Obviously no contest between playing and reffing, and when I gave up playing 6 or 7 years later I couldn't be bothered to start from scratch again.
I often wondered how many potential good refs were passed over because of that silly rule (not sure if that rule is still in place).

_blank_

There are no good refs in the loi, end of.

You are guaranteed at least one absolouty horrible decision against you in every game.

They aren't against certain teams, but they are, without doubt, the worst refs ever.

there is a reason for this.

No-one takes ref courses.

in the main, irish people complain about EPL or CL refs, then expect loi refs to be even that standard.

We have refs to suit the level. the players are shít, so are the refs

dfx-

Do you need to take a course to avoid some of the decisions they give? Alan Kelly's ghost goal for Bohs in Bray?

The worst performance I've been at is this one from Tom Connolly last season. The early penalty and ~3.50 the ball a foot over the sideline. Even the Cork player stops until he realises the linesman hasn't given it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4HGV_SS50F4

I'm not sure, but I think he apologised for those decisions, but a few weeks later then ruled out a seemingly perfectly good goal from the halfway line for UCD up at United Park that no coverage could guess why..

applehunter

Des wrote: »

There are no good refs in the loi, end of.


We have refs to suit the level. the players are shít, so are the refs

TheBigLebowski

paulcorr wrote: »

Richie sadlier said it 2 weeks ago on mns that refs in this league were a joke and he is right . They get well paid to do a job if they cant do it get rid of them . If you or i were doing a job and doing it badly we wouldnt be there very long.Fans have the right to shout and moan if a ref makes a bad descision THEY PAY FOR THAT RIGHT DONT THEY.

No. They certainly don't pay for that right.

When I go to McDonalds and pay for a large fries, do I pay for the right to go purple in the face screaming abuse at him if gives me a small fries instead of a large?

Anyone know how much LOI refs get paid. Not that it matters to me, I wouldn't do what they do for any money. Maybe if people eased off with the abuse, more people might be encouraged to become refs and thereby increase the pool of refs and presumable the standard of refereeing.

I don't mind a collective bit of moaning and groaning to get your point across to the ref or linesman. But the sight of some moron standing 3 foot behind a linesman amongst a crowd of children screaming abuse at the top of his voice into the linesman ear turns me off going to games to be honest.

Töpher

applehunter wrote: »

Being a dub he was of course a prick

oldyouth

Everyone, including the FAI, knows that the standard is very poor. The problem lies with the fact that there are so few people willing to do the job. How can the FAI suspend or demote a ref after bad performances if there is no one to take their place.

My biggest gripe is with the standard of Linos. I refuse to call them Assistants because they do not 'assist' the ref. particularily in the 1st Division. How often do you see the flag go up to confirm a decision the ref has already blown the whistle for? How often do you see a Lino make a call on a foul 2 yards in front of him/her, when the refs view might be obstructed. They are all terrible without exception.

For me, the poor standard of officials will see fans drifting away from the game. We all hate it when our team loses, especially if it is against the run of play, but that's football. However, when the game is decided by the officials on a regular basis, well that is not acceptable

SectionF

applehunter wrote: »

Being a dub he was of course a prick and would usually be put in charge if Cork City were playing .

Pathetic and paranoid.

Refs are human, and I think the abuse is excessive. You can disagree with a ref or lino's decision without personalising it.

But I do think some LoI refs have a special talent for digging themselves in deeper and becoming the centre of attention. Alan Kelly springs to mind. (He's from Cork.) Remind me to post Here (at 2:15) is his infamous howler in that match v Bray: it' s a couple of years back but it's going to be a long time before it's outdone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjLGTgHF_Cw

TheBigLebowski

SectionF wrote: »

Alan Kelly springs to mind. (He's from Cork.) Remind me to post Here (at 2:15) is his infamous howler in that match v Bray: it' s a couple of years back but it's going to be a long time before it's outdone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjLGTgHF_Cw

What happened there? It's kind of hard to see and I've no sound. Was that a good goal given offside or something.

dreamers75

Not sure who it was but when Rovers were in santry they scored a goal and the ball rolled out under the net and ref gave a kick out

SectionF

TheBigLebowski wrote: »

What happened there? It's kind of hard to see and I've no sound. Was that a good goal given offside or something.

Rocket of a volley goes straight in on the full, bounces off a net stanchion and comes back out again. Everyone in the ground sees a goal, but for Alan Kelly, who gives a kick-out, and his lino, who loyally supports him. He proceeds to dismiss the Bohs manager for having the temerity not to live in the Kelly parallel universe.
A true classic.

bohsman

Seem to remember this equally bad decision going against us the week before/after.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCshUH6wKSc

dsmythy

So what do we recommend to help improve standards?

TheBigLebowski

SectionF wrote: »

Rocket of a volley goes straight in on the full, bounces of a net stanchion and comes back out again. Everyone in the ground sees a goal, but for Alan Kelly, who gives a kick-out, and his lino, who loyally supports him. He proceeds to dismiss the Bohs manager for having the temerity not to live in the Kelly parallel universe.
A true classic.

Classic indeed. I don't understand what he was thinking. I mean if he thought it hit the post or the bar, the ball would be still in play but he stopped play for some reason. Who knows....

TheBigLebowski

bohsman wrote: »

Seem to remember this equally bad decision going against us the week before/after.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCshUH6wKSc

That is equally shocking. Actually possibly even worse. At least the other one happened very quickly. This one happened in slow motion.

Either way, no excuse for abusing refs. I'd like to see stewards and gardai doing more about all that. The refs should be dealt with by their employers.

super_furry

Alan Kelly is without a doubt, the worst referee I've ever seen in my life, but as his father is on the referee board, he never, ever gets pulled up over his mistakes.

monkey9

I thought Alan Kelly was bad, but he's being rivalled by Nigel Doyle after his performance in the Pat's - Galway game on friday

Mr Maroon

The refs aren't good enough but they're not the main problem with LOI officiating. The linesmen are terrified of making decisions. They are so reluctant to use their flags, usually they just wait for the ref to make the decision and then agree with him.

fh041205

Mr Maroon wrote: »

The refs aren't good enough but they're not the main problem with LOI officiating. The linesmen are terrified of making decisions. They are so reluctant to use their flags, usually they just wait for the ref to make the decision and then agree with him.

Best linesperson in the country is actually the woman (Hilda is it??) IMO. I think there are two women at least but shes the best one out of everyone if u ask me.

On Mark Quigley, EVERYONE in the ground that night said it was a peno. And i mean everyone, both sets of fans, people on opposite sides of the ground, absolutely everyone. And that comes from a Drogheda fan so I'd say its pretty conclusive. Even the announcer in the clubhouse said so.

paulcorr

The worst of them all has to be richie winter. He is a ref who wasnt fit to ref in the leinster senior league. He was a bully then and still is .How many penos how many red cards how many bad decisions has he made. He gave a pen last week in a match when it was cleary 2 yards outside the box only to be saved by his linesman. despite the fact he was only 5 yards away . he sent off the dundalk player on fri nite when it was only a yellow . even when he is fourth offical he is more in the limelight than the ref. he is only there because he had a rep in the leinster senior league for sending players off . so obviously the fai thought he took no nonsense. were in fact he was been a bully throwing his size around. and what else makes me laugh at the fai is the fact he gets to ref bray matches when he is from shankill. unreal.

simonw

paulcorr wrote: »

The worst of them all has to be richie winter. He is a ref who wasnt fit to ref in the leinster senior league. He was a bully then and still is .How many penos how many red cards how many bad decisions has he made. He gave a pen last week in a match when it was cleary 2 yards outside the box only to be saved by his linesman. despite the fact he was only 5 yards away . he sent off the dundalk player on fri nite when it was only a yellow . even when he is fourth offical he is more in the limelight than the ref. he is only there because he had a rep in the leinster senior league for sending players off . so obviously the fai thought he took no nonsense. were in fact he was been a bully throwing his size around. and what else makes me laugh at the fai is the fact he gets to ref bray matches when he is from shankill. unreal.

In fairness to him at least he listened to the linesman, and fair play to the linesman too for making sure the peno wasn't given. The right decision was given in the end, so save the venom for the decisions that cost someone a game

Paparazzo

Does anyone have a link to the incident at a Dundalk game, think it was last season. A dundalk winger player hits in a cross from inside the box and is fouled after he passes the ball in. The ball goes straight to the striker and he scores. But the ref disallowed it, and gave a free kick to dundalk for the foul. Probably the worse decision I've seen, if some Dundalk fan has a link to the clip it'd be great!

paulcorr

simonw wrote: »

In fairness to him at least he listened to the linesman, and fair play to the linesman too for making sure the peno wasn't given. The right decision was given in the end, so save the venom for the decisions that cost someone a game

So its now only a bad decision when it costs someone the game.

paulcorr

Paparazzo wrote: »

Does anyone have a link to the incident at a Dundalk game, think it was last season. A dundalk winger player hits in a cross from inside the box and is fouled after he passes the ball in. The ball goes straight to the striker and he scores. But the ref disallowed it, and gave a free kick to dundalk for the foul. Probably the worse decision I've seen, if some Dundalk fan has a link to the clip it'd be great!

I remember that it was about 3 yards inside the box and he pulled it back and gave a free kick.

Paparazzo

paulcorr wrote: »

I remember that it was about 3 yards inside the box and he pulled it back and gave a free kick.

That's the one.

dfx-

dreamers75 wrote: »

Not sure who it was but when Rovers were in santry they scored a goal and the ball rolled out under the net and ref gave a kick out

Happened during the mid-90s with Derek Tracey in Oriel. 1-1 result, Tracey had put in the bottom corner/side-netting, went through a hole in the net and was given as a goal-kick.

Since then, the linesmen have checked the nets before every game, but the result stood..

DmanDmythDledge

dfx- wrote: »

I'm not sure, but I think he apologised for those decisions, but a few weeks later then ruled out a seemingly perfectly good goal from the halfway line for UCD up at United Park that no coverage could guess why..

When was that?

SectionF wrote: »

Everyone in the ground sees a goal, but for Alan Kelly, who gives a kick-out, and his lino, who loyally supports him.

In fairness to the lino he signalled for a goal when the players went over to him. Why he didn't intervene and tell the ref though is pure incompetence.

TheBigLebowski wrote: »

Classic indeed. I don't understand what he was thinking. I mean if he thought it hit the post or the bar, the ball would be still in play but he stopped play for some reason. Who knows....

He obviously thought it hit it from the outside and came back into play. Happens more regularly then you think.

20 Times 20 Times

dfx- wrote: »

Happened during the mid-90s with Derek Tracey in Oriel. 1-1 result, Tracey had put in the bottom corner/side-netting, went through a hole in the net and was given as a goal-kick.

Since then, the linesmen have checked the nets before every game, but the result stood..

HAHAHAH , I think i remember that one :-)

dfx-

DmanDmythDledge wrote: »

When was that?

It may not have been UCD. Was around April and almost certain it was in Drogheda - I remember MNS going through it (as much as they do). It was straight from the kick-off after a goal.

As for that Bohs goal, obviously he thought it went out and came back in, but looking at the angle, it's just not possible for the ball to come back out at that angle. Having said that he was put off duty for a month or so afterwards for that decision, so it's not quite as bad as what goes unpunished.

SectionF

dfx- wrote: »

As for that Bohs goal, obviously he thought it went out and came back in, but looking at the angle, it's just not possible for the ball to come back out at that angle.

It's his job to see it going in or not. It's not trigonometry.

Actually (and I understand the risk in saying this as he will surely make a liar of me in our next must-win), Kelly has improved more recently and currently is not the worst.

DmanDmythDledge

dfx- wrote: »

It may not have been UCD. Was around April and almost certain it was in Drogheda - I remember MNS going through it (as much as they do). It was straight from the kick-off after a goal.

The one straight from kick off? That was Cobh.