Would you tell a friend?

Fugly

After reading the "real women" thread I began to think about women commenting on each others figures. And how it can be done in a caring way to a friend etc if we're worried about their health, a woman can quickly spot a friend in need and would want to help.

As in if a friend lost a lot of weight and was underweight most women I know would comment {In a non bitchy way just ask if they were ok, etc}. But if that weight was in the other direction would we say it?

Lets say the health implications were equally as dangerous. That is the weight gain/ loss not equal but levels of "unhealthiness" the same, if that makes any sense.

I know my friends would notice and enquire either way, as they know my eating and exercise are a very good indicator of how things are with me.

Just wondering would other women? would you comment on one and not the other and why?

Wasn't sure where to post this - sorry if wrong forum.

metaoblivia

I think this is a great question. I don't usually like to comment on someone else's weight because even the most innocent of comments can be twisted by the over sensitive. But I'd be more inclined to bring up a friend's weight loss than I would a weight gain.

I have a very good friend who is extremely overweight and quite young - early 20s. Already though, both of her knees have given way and one required major surgery to fix. I worry about her health, but I just don't see any way to bring the issue up. Firstly, she's very sensitive and insecure about her looks. Secondly, she never ever talks about her weight. And finally, I'm quite slim myself, and I just have this idea that overweight ladies probably don't want to talk about their weight issues with someone who's been a size 6-8 their whole life. I just don't see that going over well. There's a big possibility in my mind that she may think I'm lecturing her without really knowing what I'm talking about, i.e. her relationship with food and exercise. I may be completely wrong, though.

Fugly

Yes, it's really hard to talk to someone about weight even though it would just be a health point of view as it's so much about appearance and their self esteem. I once lost 7lbs in 6 days and everyone commented yet have at times put on a stone in a couple of weeks and no one batted an eyelid.

It's difficult as the person who lost weight could be as self concious as the other lady but we only tend to think of an overweight person as being insecure. I know that if a slender lady expresses insecurities she's told "but you've nothing to worry about, you're so slim etc".

I guess it can depend on how close you are to the person and if they bring it up. I feel bad for you and your friend, and I understand your predicement.
I know that regarding to weight it can be difficult to talk to someone who hasn't experienced it, but I guess that can be said about any health issue.

cuckoo

I suppose part of it might be due to all the 'issue based' dramas we saw as teenagers. If someone on Biker Grove, or 90210 or something had a storyline regarding extreme weight loss a big part of it would always be the "when i look in the mirror i see a fat person" line.

Whereas when someone puts on a lot of weight we never actually think that when they look in the mirror they're seeing a slim person, do we?

It's such a sensitive issue that i don't know if i would ever discuss it with a friend, but i would suggest we do some exercise together...it's a tricky one now that i try and imagine ever bringing that subject up with someone!

Abi

If I'm to answer in all honesty, my concern would to to the under weight friend first. It doesnt nessesarily mean there is an ED involved, there could be an over active thyroid or other health implications. I would be sensitive but honest about it with her.

On the flip side, if I noticed a female friend putting on a lot weight I'd be more inclined to ask her first is everything ok with her. In a lot of cases women over eat as they are struggling emotionally with something, and its what I would suspect to start off, then advise her to see her doctor after the obvious is ruled out.

If you are a true friend, you'll stick by her side until the problem is resolved. Even if she doesn't like what you have to say, and sometimes be nasty about it.

SeekUp

Would I tell a friend if she was gaining weight? No . . . I mean, it's not as if (s)he wouldn't notice!

If (s)he were gaining/losing weight fairly quickly, I'd assume it was because of something -- a new medication, a change in lifestyle, etc. -- so I'd ask about what's happening in her/his life as opposed to focusing on the weight gain.

Tbh, I generally try to stay away from making negative comments to someone, whether it's regarding weight or not. And because weight is such a sensitive issue for so many people, I'd make sure that the topic gets the green light before wI opened that can o'worms.

Fugly

Interesting, but just to clarify regarding the weight gain, I don't mean in a situation where she gains an few extra pounds, I mean if she gained so much so that her health was just as much endagered as if she was underweight. {I realise that these amounts of weight would be not be equal.}


I would never comment on the weight (gained/lost) directly to begin with. I'd focus on what I'd be concerned about their health.

I guess I do niggle my friends about health a little bit more than most, regarding breast/testicle checks, smears, general sexual health etc:o. They haven't complained too much yet. :P

I'm not quite sure what I'd do. It's never been an issue thankfully. Just an unusual wondering I have. :rolleyes:

Malari

Fugly wrote: »

As in if a friend lost a lot of weight and was underweight most women I know would comment {In a non bitchy way just ask if they were ok, etc}. But if that weight was in the other direction would we say it?

It's a good question, and I think the readiness of people to comment on weight loss rather than weight gain is the association with attractiveness. This is not a slur on overweight people, just my observation. I think most people would think it better to be thin and unhealthy than fat and unhealthy.

It's almost a social taboo to comment on weight gain because of this, I think. People are not afraid to comment on people getting old, although this too is considered to be less attractive, because it happens to everyone. You can see this from the amount of "humourous" birthday cards about age.

Again, not endorsing this opinion, I just think the taboo pattern has developed because of this.

MysticalSoul

Personally I wouldn't, as weight for many women is a sensitive issue anyway. Growing up I was always too fat or too thin, according to my mum, so for that reason I hate people commenting on my weight at all, even if it meants as a compliment.

EastWallGirl

Good Question. I have just spent 2 weeks with a recovering anorexic and although she has gained weight, she still looked unhealthy. Funny how they do not like any food that is fattening. It just so happened she did not like bread, paasta, avocados, most cheeses, pastries, bought low fat milk and still watered it down. She looked great in clothes but awful in her knickers, but I did see the battle every day. I think though she will be fine in the long run.

Bigger question: your overweight/obese SIL eating habits are obviously very bad and the little girl is picking it up and is overweight/obese for her age. At the age of 8 she is commenting on her weight and how unhappy she is with it. What to do?

neuro-praxis

I've been overweight for years (currently shrinking). None of my friends have ever taken me aside to express their worry at my weight, but then I am not the kind to either (a) moan about my weight or (b) pretend I am not overweight. I don't cut the labels off my clothes or anything. I have slim friends and fat friends. I have no underweight friends. The slim friends are encouraging with the up-down-up-down nature of my weight over the years, and will come for runs and walks with me sometimes. The fat friends don't go there...because they're not ready to yet, I guess. They also know they are fat, so why would I tell them?

But ultimately nobody really cares except me, and when it comes down to it, it's me that has to say no to the takeaways and bbqs and the cakes and home-baked cookies and wine that permeate our social lives...

My body is my business - everybody else's body is their own. If someone were actively killing themselves with starvation or severe gorging, yes, I'd advise them to see the doctor, or just try to talk through their crap. But ultimately we are all responsible for ourselves and there is nothing we can do for anyone else on these matters.

There is something about these incessant conversations that irks me. Everyone seems to be obsessed with fat people...

Oh The Humanity

No, I deffo wouldn't comment at all.

I think the person is only to aware themselves that they have gained or lost weight.

People are much more forward to tell you you've lost too much weight etc rather than you are too fat and I think thats wrong.

If a person is dangerously underweight I think its the familys place to intervene. As far as I understand most people with ED's do not respond well to even well meaning interference so I would definitely leave it to the family.

Fugly

What if you were family?

I just get the impression the majority would feel comfortable to comment on the weight loss quicker even if both were just as unhealthy. Which means you're assuming the overweight person will be more sensititive to the comment and considering I'm referring to a situation where both are in equal health risk, can that be justified?

And if you just view both as unhealthy habits would you treat them the same as other unhealthy habits with smoke/drugs/drink?

Oh The Humanity

Fugly wrote: »

What if you were family?

I just get the impression the majority would feel comfortable to comment on the weight loss quicker even if both were just as unhealthy. Which means you're assuming the overweight person will be more sensititive to the comment and considering I'm referring to a situation where both are in equal health risk, can that be justified?

Hm, people definitely do comment quicker on weight loss even strangers. Which can be quite irritating and invasive, so I suppose for that reason I would not comment either way, IF it was a family member who seemed in danger of starving to death (I cant imagine a situation where it would be down to me) but IF that was the case I would try to intervene probably with the help of a professional agency somehow. I understand people with eating disorders can be extremely resistant to help so I would do so with a heavy heart.

If the person was overweight, I would say nothing. Its none of my business. If they were morbidly obese and again it was down to me (for some reason no one else responsible) and their life was in danger then I would try much the same thing. I am talking about someone in Gilbert Grape's Mother type territory. If they were just fat I would keep my nose out.

But then again if I was responsible for such a person I would never have enabled them to overeat to such an extent anyway. I mean people in the 50-60 stone weight range cant leave the house anyway, so who is buying them all th food? I would also take away the phone so they could not order food in either.

Fugly wrote: »

And if you just view both as unhealthy habits would you treat them the same as other unhealthy habits with smoke/drugs/drink?

I would only intervene in any of these situations if I felt the persons life was at risk. But at the end of the day if someone is killing themeselves with drink/drugs/food/starvation and they are determined there is not much you can do.

The Big Red Button

If someone is gaining or losing weight, they'll generally be well aware of it themselves.

If it was one of my close friends, they'd be very likely to comment on it first and then I might talk about it. If they didn't bring it up, I'd probably take their overall health and happiness into consideration.

If it was a case that a friend was eating healthily and exercising, but was still putting on weight, I'd probably advise them (tactfully!) to see a doctor in case there's something physically wrong. If, however, a friend was going through a tough time and binge-eating as a result, I'm not going to point out that they're getting fat, because they'll already be well aware of it and drawing attention to it would only make them feel worse! I'd just do what I could to help them get through whatever's happening that's making them overeat.

Fugly

I'm not sure what I'd do, But I think some people here think I'm refering to a person who puts on an unattractive amount of weight. Just to clarify again I'm talking about health not regarding appearance.

Also I have heard of cases of obese people with an ED. It just seems odd that for loss health concerns are more likely to be raised but weight gain people leave it to the person.

I'm not picking on the overweight person, both situations are just as dangerous.

I would only intervene in any of these situations if I felt the persons life was at risk. But at the end of the day if someone is killing themeselves with drink/drugs/food/starvation and they are determined there is not much you can do.

That's what I'm refering to, but I agree people can only get help if they want it.

There is something about these incessant conversations that irks me. Everyone seems to be obsessed with fat people..

.

This conversation is intended to be about unhealthily under and over weight person and would a friend/loved one mention a seriously unhealthy habit simply as weight is usually refered to in terms of appearance {which has nothing to with this topic} rather than health.

I feel nowadays weight {under/over} is commonly considered in terms of appearance firstly with health as a second thought.

Bigger question: your overweight/obese SIL eating habits are obviously very bad and the little girl is picking it up and is overweight/obese for her age. At the age of 8 she is commenting on her weight and how unhappy she is with it. What to do?

This I feel is a huge issue today.Look at the U.K who have to show ads about "me sized meals".FFS! It really annoys me when people set bad eating habits for their kids. I've heard that 5 yrs :eek: have had to be treated for ED's. It's so sad, and it works both ways over feeding/feeding them crap quality food or encouraging them to deny themselves and focus on appearance rather than health. Both the same problem ~ unhealthy habits. It does grind my gears and in extreme forms is a form of abuse.

I know the "my kids my choice" but in some cases the health issues are just too important to ignore. I did have this issue with a family member. No clue of nutrution or portion size, even the basics. Very tactful gifts of healthy eating recipe books for kids etc, eventually her mother gave her a very stern advice and things improved.

LouOB

I had a friend years ago that took the view, if you were skinny/slim you were successful - regardless of social standing, career, education etc
It is a dim witted and narrow minded view. But unfortunately I think its an undercurrent in our society.

You see a slim woman walking down the road neatly dressed - you assume she has her sh*t together.
Do the same with a person overweight (im talking fold's rather than roll's) or under weight (you can see the nodules of their spine through clothes)

Why do women in associate weight with level of 'success'?
Why are they interlinked?
Why should they be?

But to answer the questions, being a person who was greatly overweight 15+stone at one stage - none of my friends made any comments. I was aware of my situation only after I had long hard look at myself - then changed my 'habits'.
Now, currently shrinking also, my friends have noticed and commented. As some of them have seen me at 15+ stone mark. They know how hard I have worked and continue to work.
But my father 'irked' me by asking if I had eating disorder. After years of commenting on my size of being bigger - they are now 'concerned' by me loosing weight. Might I add is a healthy weight and I am in weight watchers. They would know difference healthy and unhealthy weight.

But I am interested to see insights into why women or specific women identify slenderness with success in life?

Malari

LouOB wrote: »

But I am interested to see insights into why women or specific women identify slenderness with success in life?

I would guess it has something to do with the fact that if you are slender you have control over your eating and that is extrapolated to assuming there is control over other aspects of your life.

Fugly

I don't regard a woman less "succesful" or intelligent in any way if she wasn't
"slender". I regard being healthy as important. Not an extra in life, I just think that one should respect oneself.

sickpuppy

metaoblivia wrote: »

I think this is a great question. I don't usually like to comment on someone else's weight because even the most innocent of comments can be twisted by the over sensitive. But I'd be more inclined to bring up a friend's weight loss than I would a weight gain.

I have a very good friend who is extremely overweight and quite young - early 20s. Already though, both of her knees have given way and one required major surgery to fix. I worry about her health, but I just don't see any way to bring the issue up. Firstly, she's very sensitive and insecure about her looks. Secondly, she never ever talks about her weight. And finally, I'm quite slim myself, and I just have this idea that overweight ladies probably don't want to talk about their weight issues with someone who's been a size 6-8 their whole life. I just don't see that going over well. There's a big possibility in my mind that she may think I'm lecturing her without really knowing what I'm talking about, i.e. her relationship with food and exercise. I may be completely wrong, though.

o

Without sounding harsh i think your letting your friend down by talking about her very obvious problem.

When do you think is gonna be right time to talk to her when shes on a hospital bed half dead froma heart attack.

If she has had surgery on her knee already she must be very obese and all the problems that this condition causes are just round the corner heart disease, diabetes, strokes all horrible stuff.

The reality is overweight people die younger and tough as it would be for you as a friend to bring this subject up you might regret doing nothing about it.
Clearly this girl needs help and if you cant rely on your friends or family who can you seek help from
sometimes people need to be told straight whats the problem before its too late
try and encourage her before she eats herself too death

LouOB

Malari wrote: »

I would guess it has something to do with the fact that if you are slender you have control over your eating and that is extrapolated to assuming there is control over other aspects of your life.

In one respect yes, that does make sense
But should it?!

But why would we automatically just assume this?
Cant an overweight person have their life together and be content/sucessful?
eg Oprah for one or for that matter Nicole Kidman (she needs a hangsandwich but is content with her life)

Most slim women have the same food issues like every other mortal person i.e. what to have for breakfast/dinner/lunch? Just because their outter appearence gives the message they choose healthily doesnt make it true internally - where it counts.

Eg One day I was in a car park trying to find a space. There was a woman beside a lovely new mercedes. My friend in the passenger seat commented on car and said her husband must have good job
Why would we automatically assume it was her husbands car? Could it not be her car?

Why just concentrate on the 'appearence' of success?
Or associate slender/slim with 'success' - does the picture of a woman size 10 to 8 give the global picture of goal engineering to youth?? Why?

sickpuppy

Malari wrote: »

I would guess it has something to do with the fact that if you are slender you have control over your eating and that is extrapolated to assuming there is control over other aspects of your life.

I myself wouldnt automatically assume someone slim is successfull however
if say you were doinga job interview with two candidates one normal one very weight with the same quailifications who ya gonna pick.

I see someone overweight and i see a lack of control in themselves not a low metabolism etc.

I am sick of hearing grossly obese people saying there happy with themselves when in reality they cant walk 100metres without being out of breath
look terrible and have shortened life expectancy and all the health problems related to carrying loads of extra weight.

People need to walk more and eat less simple way to keep a normal helthy weight.

Malari

sickpuppy wrote: »

I myself wouldnt automatically assume someone slim is successfull however
if say you were doinga job interview with two candidates one normal one very weight with the same quailifications who ya gonna pick.

I see someone overweight and i see a lack of control in themselves not a low metabolism etc.

I am sick of hearing grossly obese people saying there happy with themselves when in reality they cant walk 100metres without being out of breath
look terrible and have shortened life expectancy and all the health problems related to carrying loads of extra weight.

People need to walk more and eat less simple way to keep a normal helthy weight.

No, I'm not saying that assumption is correct, I'm just trying to say why I think people come to that conclusion.

Fugly

I agree that a woman's appearance is no clear indicator of level of insecurities. I feel people forget this when they feel they are free to make innecessary comments to slim women, with the mentaltity of "but it's not an insult". As if she is immune to being insecure as that person deems her attractive.

Oprah for one or for that matter Nicole Kidman (she needs a hang*sandwich but is content with her life)

For instance you commment on Nicole yet would you consider it ok to comment that Oprah could do missing one. {Not my opinion but I think it lends to double standards}
* I assume you mean ham?

Eg One day I was in a car park trying to find a space. There was a woman beside a lovely new mercedes. My friend in the passenger seat commented on car and said her husband must have good job
Why would we automatically assume it was her husbands car? Could it not be her car?

I could not agree with you more on this issue. Yet I fail to see it as relevant.

Why just concentrate on the 'appearence' of success?
Or associate slender/slim with 'success' - does the picture of a woman size 10 to 8 give the global picture of goal engineering to youth?? Why?

I made it very clear that I intended to avoid appearance in this discussion. I was curious regarding the health issue.
As for why they use a picture of a slender woman, it's marketing. Why it's found appealing is a basic human instinct, sexual attractiveness. Symmetry is attractive, as is a fit body, toned/ strong muscles with a healthy bf % as these are used as indicator of sexual health. This is found in all animals including us. However we also mix this as to what the individual finds personally attractive and what is deemed "in fashion". Not in a who's on vogue, I mean regarding what is considered more sexually attractive due to health. E.g; In pervious times a "sturdier" woman was deemed more attractive as she would be deemed a better chance of health young. Also we don't judge sexual partners purely on their physical appearence we judge on their personality etc as well.

This does not mean a size 16 who is perfectly symmetrical/ toned etc is less attractive, just that they are not favoured by certain marketing executives.

And again I really want this discuss the health issue not appearance, as frankly who the hell would comment on a friend's weight with regard to appearence.

Most slim women have the same food issues like every other mortal person i.e. what to have for breakfast/dinner/lunch? Just because their outter appearence gives the message they choose healthily doesnt make it true internally - where it counts.

Exactly health not just a size. Maintaining an healthy way with an unhealthy diet is not good. Lack of essential vitamins and minerals may be harmful. As well fitness is relevant.

Malari

LouOB wrote: »

In one respect yes, that does make sense
But should it?!

But why would we automatically just assume this?
Cant an overweight person have their life together and be content/sucessful?
eg Oprah for one or for that matter Nicole Kidman (she needs a hangsandwich but is content with her life)

Most slim women have the same food issues like every other mortal person i.e. what to have for breakfast/dinner/lunch? Just because their outter appearence gives the message they choose healthily doesnt make it true internally - where it counts.

Eg One day I was in a car park trying to find a space. There was a woman beside a lovely new mercedes. My friend in the passenger seat commented on car and said her husband must have good job
Why would we automatically assume it was her husbands car? Could it not be her car?

Why just concentrate on the 'appearence' of success?
Or associate slender/slim with 'success' - does the picture of a woman size 10 to 8 give the global picture of goal engineering to youth?? Why?

Well I agree that it shouldn't make a difference really, but subconsciously it does.

I wouldn't comment on anyone's weight gain because it's none of my business, even if they were damaging their health. Plus weight gain is very rarely anything other than a symptom of overeating. Sudden or dramatic weight loss can be a symptom of many other illnesses not associated with eating.

Handsome Bob

As someone who has lost quite a bit of weight, I think that looking back now I would have liked if someone had a word with me. I was overweight for my whole life until I started losing at 19. I wish that someone with good interpersonal skills had a word with me when I was a lot younger as I wasn't able to enjoy my teenage years as much as my friends.

So having been in the situation I would have appreciated someone intervening and encouraging me. But I must stress that you have to be careful when approaching the issue, if you have the tact of a patronising idiot then forget about it. My Dad and Brothers were absolute ***** to me over my weight and it only made be worse due to the feelings of worthlessness.

So in summary, approach your friend if you are genuinely worried, but don't try any of this "tough love" BS because it just doesn't work when dealing with the issue of weight.

lizzyvera

It depends on the person.

I hang out with a couple of obese people in college and I think they discuss their weight loss attempts fairly openly, and people congratulate them when they do lose weight. I think that's healthy. They have very good attitudes towards it, and the health benefits are obvious from their increased energy and confidence. It's best when it's out in the open and you can talk about the ups and downs.

On the appearance thing- I wouldn't be as happy if I was overweight. My OH wouldn't fancy me and it would wreck the sex life. Also, my weight plumetted one year while I worked in a pub and people were a BILLION times nicer when I was very skinny. If people do that so subconsciously, I imagine fat people get the elbow quite a bit more than they or others around them realise.

CathyMoran

lizzyvera wrote: »

It depends on the person.

I hang out with a couple of obese people in college and I think they discuss their weight loss attempts fairly openly, and people congratulate them when they do lose weight. I think that's healthy. They have very good attitudes towards it, and the health benefits are obvious from their increased energy and confidence. It's best when it's out in the open and you can talk about the ups and downs.

On the appearance thing- I wouldn't be as happy if I was overweight. My OH wouldn't fancy me and it would wreck the sex life. Also, my weight plumetted one year while I worked in a pub and people were a BILLION times nicer when I was very skinny. If people do that so subconsciously, I imagine fat people get the elbow quite a bit more than they or others around them realise.

I think that your other half should fancy you no matter what you weigh. I am in a very long term relationship and both our weights have varied over the years. I am now borderline underweight and am trying to gain weight but am doing it for me.

I would say it to someone that they were overweight/underweight but only as an issue of health and would support them if they decided to modify their eating habits accordingly. I have been following the weight loss journal of someone and am truely amazed and humbled by their weight loss journal - they have a lot of guts.

lizzyvera

CathyMoran wrote: »

I think that your other half should fancy you no matter what you weigh. I am in a very long term relationship and both our weights have varied over the years. I am now borderline underweight and am trying to gain weight but am doing it for me.

I would say it to someone that they were overweight/underweight but only as an issue of health and would support them if they decided to modify their eating habits accordingly. I have been following the weight loss journal of someone and am truely amazed and humbled by their weight loss journal - they have a lot of guts.

That's true, I wouldn't fancy him less if he lost or gained weight. I think it would affect my confidence though. I'd say when I'm older I won't care as much, I'm 21 and it could be a hangover from teenage years.
I'm trying to be healthier too, ugh it's hard!

CathyMoran

lizzyvera wrote: »

That's true, I wouldn't fancy him less if he lost or gained weight. I think it would affect my confidence though. I'd say when I'm older I won't care as much, I'm 21 and it could be a hangover from teenage years.
I'm trying to be healthier too, ugh it's hard!

You would be suprised though - I think that I actually take more care of my appearance now at 35 than I did at 21 but that is more to do with the fact that I finally have the money to do it I found that my shape changed from being a teenager to being someone in my twenties and I admit that I found it hard to get used to having a rear and hips but you do. I am trying to be healthier for my sake but also so that my husband and I can have as much time together as possible...

LouOB

Fugly wrote: »

For instance you commment on Nicole yet would you consider it ok to comment that Oprah could do missing one. {Not my opinion but I think it lends to double standards}
* I assume you mean ham?

It was in reference to their success
They are very successful women but if they were judged on their weight alone they would fail. I used Nicole Kidman as example off the top of my head as underweight example. But some people might not class her as being or looking under weight - hence the comment. Was in no reflection to Oprah - who IMO looks wonderful.

Fugly wrote: »

I could not agree with you more on this issue. Yet I fail to see it as relevant.

It was in ref to our preconceived judgments we make about people/women (weight is just one of them)

Fugly wrote: »

I made it very clear that I intended to avoid appearance in this discussion. I was curious regarding the health issue.

It was in reference to trappings or achievement in life. Rather than aesthetics

Fugly wrote: »

And again I really want this discuss the health issue not appearance, as frankly who the hell would comment on a friend's weight with regard to appearence.

A lot of people, who are narrow minded and nothing else to do. Each persons weight is personal to them. We each can look in a mirror, step on a scales and find clothes to accommodate ourselves. Our choices are our own healthily or unhealthily.
And if a person willingly chooses an unhealthy lifestyle via food, drink, smoking, drugs etc its their choice. But we equally have a choice not to witness them doing so


Ive never had anyone mulitquote me before:p
Thanks