MTL Dublin, Dock workers dispute

workers rights

Unregistered wrote: »

I drive a taxi these nights and wednesday and thursday night aswell. Due to the increase in licences and the downturn I am struggling to pay bills. I would love a salary to be paid every week for that shift. I think the recession is the wrong tome to strike. People are worried about their own job security, which is why they are passing the picket. I drop in there for a fare now and then. I havent been called lately but i will pass. Siptu wont pay MY bills. Sorry.

So its ok for Taxi men to bring the traffic to a stand still all over the city of Dublin when they want the regulator to stop issuing more taxi licences which I fully support by the way.But when someone else is fighting for their workers rights so as they can pay their bills,feed and clothe their children you dont like it.Have you even thought the reason that you have not had a fare from there in a while is because maybe just maybe the person or people that were giving you the money for their fare your wages to pay your bills are the people who are out on strike.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

theroadahead wrote: »

Haulier, if you really are a haulier, No truck drivers have been threatened at the gate, we are holding a peaceful protest and are not breaking any of the conditions laid down by the ridiculous injunction served on us!
In fact Haulier, if you respected Irish workers rights, you would'nt be going into MTL in the first place and passing a picket, If PEEL ports win this dispute, God help workers in Ireland, it'll be a huge step backwards, and in 20 years time Mr. Haulier, when your children come home and tell you they were sacked for no reason and have no grounds to appeal it, you hold your head up high and proud and say "Kids, because of people like me, this happened" and give them a big proud smile!
Mr. Portroe, If you're down in the docks 20 years then I dont see why someone like yourself would'nt be supporting us, are you jealous? are you spiteful?? Or are you not really a port worker at all??? Or maybe you are and your one of the scabs going into MTL in your blackened out bodyguard car????
THIS DISPUTE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WAGES, SO IF YOUR GOING TO POST A RESPONSE HERE PLEASE KNOW YOUR FACTS!!!!!!!!!

banned, 7 days for calling someone a scab

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

workers rights wrote: »

You must be blind if you didnt notice the people who went on the protest yesterday was that not support?There was over 100 people who took part in that march northsiders and southsiders united,plus ex dockers standing in solidarity with their ex co workers unlike the irish scabs that are stiil working for Peel Ports.A scab is someone that crosses a picket just incase you didnt know that, and that is what those that have croosed that picket line to work for Peel Ports are. Yes everyone knows there is a recession but answer me this how come Peel Ports gave the cleaner her redundancy notice on the Friday and by Tuesday of the following week they had someone in doing her work.After 11 years of working there her redundancy package was a joke and I dont think anyone in their right mind would accept it.
All you men and women on the picket line best of luck and I hope you all get what you are fighting for.My dad was a docker and he and his co workers were on many picket lines for their rights also.They were told that they would be put in prison if they didnt come off the picket line and prison they would have gone because they were not going to back down untill they got what they were on strike for.Be strong and keep up the fight.Im behind use 100%.

banned for seven days for use of term scab

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

Please do not use use the term scab or Judas to describe any workers. These are workers exercising their free will to do their job who either (a) disagree with the strike, or (b) need the money.

I will leave this thread open for now as long as it is not used to denigrate any workers. If new accounts sign up just to insult workers then the thread will be closed.

Maybe try and use the posts by the poster MTLDockers as an example of how you can be critical without insulting other people.

mtldockers

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Please do not use use the term scab or Judas to describe any workers. These are workers exercising their free will to do their job who either (a) disagree with the strike, or (b) need the money.

I will leave this thread open for now as long as it is not used to denigrate any workers. If new accounts sign up just to insult workers then the thread will be closed.

Maybe try and use the posts by the poster MTLDockers as an example of how you can be critical without insulting other people.

We appreciate your moderation here and thank you for your comments regarding our posts. We would think that the term "scab" would be acceptable in this matter as that is one of the words used to describe a strike-breaker and is possibly the most widely accepted term for these people. We are not trying to step on your toes here, we are just expressing our opinion and fully accept your opinion and input.

Regards,

MTL Dockers

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

Scab is a derogotary term for a strikebreaker according to wikipedia (couldn't find a better source!). I think we all know it is derogotary as well - that's why it is screamed at workers crossing the line during strike action. Please use strikebreaker if you wish.

The reason for being careful with potentially insulting words used is that this particular forum (Work Problems) is setup to be non-antagonistic. You would probably find that another forum on boards (e.g. After Hours) would have no problem with the use of the word.

mtldockers

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Scab is a derogotary term for a strikebreaker according to wikipedia (couldn't find a better source!). I think we all know it is derogotary as well - that's why it is screamed at workers crossing the line during strike action. Please use strikebreaker if you wish.

The reason for being careful with potentially insulting words used is that this particular forum (Work Problems) is setup to be non-antagonistic. You would probably find that another forum on boards (e.g. After Hours) would have no problem with the use of the word.

Ok thank you for clarifying that with us and again your input is very much appreciated. Would the term "blackleg" be ok to use? According to wikipedia it is slang for a strikebreaker and makes no mention of it being derogatory.

Can we just clarify that MTL Dockers do not associate with or condone any derogatory or defamatory comments made on this forum. We are simply trying to put our side of the story out there and inform people of the facts.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

mtldockers wrote: »

Ok thank you for clarifying that with us and again your input is very much appreciated. Would the term "blackleg" be ok to use? According to wikipedia it is slang for a strikebreaker and makes no mention of it being derogatory.

Can we just clarify that MTL Dockers do not associate with or condone any derogatory or defamatory comments made on this forum. We are simply trying to put our side of the story out there and inform people of the facts.

A blackleg is also used to mean a rat! Let's just call them strikebreakers and leave it at that!

mtldockers

Captain Obvious wrote: »

A blackleg is also used to mean a rat! Let's just call them strikebreakers and leave it at that!

Mea culpa, we were not aware of that connection, strikebreakers they are and shall always be!

LegacyUser

I would like to point out to Taxi driver that I am also a taxi driver.

I work long hours 14 or 15 hours per day, five days per week. My decision to drive a taxi, like yours, is my choice. If you would like to draw a salary every month then stop driving a Taxi and get a PAYE job like these dockers.

It's ironic that these dock workers are having very similar difficulties to taxi drivers when one compares the way these dockers are being treated with how taxi drivers have been treated since the appointment of this regulator.

Shame on you, "taxi driver" if you would be prepared to pass this or any official strike picket. When I read your comments it is no surprise to me why the taxi industry is in the state it's in with some drivers being prepared to step on all aroud them to get ahead.

I would say to the MTL dockers that the views posted by "taxi driver" would not represent the views of taxi drivers generally because as a group, taxi drivers have been battered both in working terms/conditions and earnings.

Having looked at both your website (when it was running) and these boards.ie comments I wonder what action has Dublin Port taken regarding the possible difficulties regarding cargo stowage and alleged health and safety breaches at this terminal and how regularly has this terminal been inspected for health and safety since the strike started also what notice is given prior to these inspections if they take place. In recent years there have been a number of serious vessel accidents in Dublin resulting in loss of life and injuries, namely M.V. Kilkenny, M.V. Bluebird, M.V. Sumbrough Head to name a few so I would assume that the port authority takes these questions about safety issues very seriously.

Something about the lack of publicity and government action over this strike has struck me : In the Ringsend and Irishtown areas, traditionally the main occupations were Seafaring, dock working , and the IGB (Bottle House).

The bottle house was a profitable company providing very good local employment then when the value of the D4 site was considered the company closed down lock, stock and barrel , regardless of this being a profitable operation and redundancies paid to the men. It appears to me that these jobs were lost because of site value. Now the MTL dockers are rightly striking for a deploreable attack on their workers rights and barely a murmour from any of the organs of the state. The more cynical part of me would start to think that this recession won't last forever and that a D4 site is a D4 site and will fetch a hansome sum for further more profitable house/ apartment shopping developement in the future thus the rumours of a new "terminal 5" being built on reclaimed land on the north side of the river at clontarf could be true. As we all know these things take some years to achieve so why not start with industrial unrest in the subject land. Could/ or are Peel Ports being considered to run this new terminal 5.

These workers cannot be allowed to fail in their dispute and I would call on all concerned, SIPTU, ICTU, Minister Coughlan, The Dublin Port Company and all interested bodies to examine the genisis of this dispute and further ensure that all is being done according to best practice inside that terminal and finally to force the employer to enter into proper discussions with the workers and stop this apparent atmosphere of threatening behaviour and the use of strike breaking labour as a negotiating tool.

LegacyUser

Nice too see some people like yourself still understand the facts and what's most important after Reading your post it lifted my spirits too know there's still a sense of humanity and fair play and money doesn't enter the equation it's all about terms negotiation and proper industrial relations, this strike we are doing is hard and the intimidation we are being hit with is sickening, hopefully peel will be told there's nothing wrong with talking to the men and to take a fair approach in negotiating with the people who helped build the place. We have people ready to take redundancy and people ready too negotiate a new working arrangement to suit the downturn we don't have demands we have ideas we could put forward after all we are the men and women who work the job why not take the good with the bad on both sides, is it that hard too ask?

LegacyUser

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/eycwkfojmhid/rss2/

LegacyUser

http://tv3.ie/news.php?video=12170&locID=1.2.141

LegacyUser

Well done to all involved in the picket for Irish workers rights at MTL. I am delighted to see that there is some good coming out of your hard fought picket. I wish you all the best in what lies ahead. Dont allow the company to set a precedent for all other Irish workers. We know that changes need to be made but what they have done and are doing is just wrong. They may get away with that kind of lark in the Uk but not here in sunny Ireland.

Justice for all Irish workers!!!!!!

LegacyUser

Lads, as a local I have seen your fight from close by, and I know some ex employees of MTL. I have the following points to raise and I think the union should be asked these questions.
1. What have we achieved by going outside the gate? The terminal is working away. The idea of a strike is to disrupt the companys business and thus force them to negotiate. I was always a believer that you keep your dispute inside, which seems to be haoppening more,thoms cook etc. It now seems that the problem is much bigger than at the start. Company have behaved appalingly but the union has played straight into their hands.

2. A court injunction prevents effective picketing. Did siptu never hear of this before? I believe the strike was only a day old when this came into force, effectively ruling the strike worthless.

3. What is the plan going forward? Do they expect you to stand outside the gate forever. It seems the company have decided that the first two batches of redundancies are set in stone. A union is supposed to look after the workers. It seems the longer this goes on the chances of most getting a job at all is getting slimmer.

I would suggest that anybody who thinks they have a chance of getting back in enquires about it themselves. A job is just a job. Keep the head down and leave in a few years when there are a few jobs about. I took siptu's advice in the bottle house dispute and have regretted it ever since. I know some of your workmates have been unfairly selected in your eyes. They can take an unfair dismissals case agaimst MTL, maybe collectively, and take them to the cleaners. But those who have not been made redundant yet would want to seriously consider their options.

MTL has changed alot in the last ten years. The big corporations behind this have the power to do what they like in a recession. They dont care about you and they dont care about the strikebreakers or the terminal managers inside either. Its all about cutting costs, getting one man to do everything on a site and expecting them to be grateful. They are a bad shower of bas****s, but they have some jobs on offer, and some of you guys can take them. Unfortunatly the unions strength has gone. look at element six and other disputes.

Good luck lads. Keep the heads up. Talk to the company yourselves and salvage what you can from this mess.

Just a bit of advice, from a man who listened to the wrong advice............

LegacyUser

These guys deserve zero support, as someone unfortunate enough to have to bring in goods through Dublin Port i know that the working conditions these guys enjoy are a joke, but even with that they were never happy , cash in hand to see things through. Its a farce, good luck to Peel the business comunity in Dublin need a professional reliable Port with staff who know the meaning of work.

cathy01

To be honest I cant believe this is even being allowed to happen.
The company are picking and chooseing who to let go.
My BIL worked hard there , for years. He deserves better then this.
Cathy

the_syco

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16328144/?view=Standard
http://breakingnews.ie/ireland/protestors-in-boats-try-to-block-dublin-port-424142.html

A group of protestors in boats have been attempting to block ships from entering and exiting Dublin Port this afternoon.

It is believed the group are demonstrating in support of workers who have been picketing for a number of weeks over redundancies and cutbacks.

They unsuccessfully tried to block a passenger ferry from leaving the port in the course of the protest.

Unknown if someone is stepping up the action, but it's a bit coincidental if it ain't.

LegacyUser

I think this sort of protest will get you places. Having rent a mob at your marches will not get you anywhere. A few boats in the river and its headline news. It will affect the port operations. Its a few weeks late but good to see. I hear discussions are back on. Keep it up, get a deal done. You have stayed out long enough.

the_syco

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16346588/?view=Standard
http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/ireland/company-secures-injunction-protecting-scab-employees-from-intimidation-424587.html

A cargo handing company involved in an industrial dispute has secured a High Court injunction preventing anyone harassing threatening its employees who have continued to work during the strike.

Marine Terminals have been involved in a dispute over pay and conditions and job losses with a number of its employees, who are members of SIPTU.

The firm sought the orders over what they claim is an unlawful escalation by the Unions and the strikers who have allegedly tried to coerce and intimidate employees of Marine Terminals who are not on strike to cease working by calling them "scabs".

Today at the High Court Mr Justice Kevin Feeney granted Marine Terminals Ltd South bank Quay Pigeon House Road, Ringsend, Dublin 4 an interim injunction against SIPTU, who represent most of the workers at the firm, the Irish Congress of Trade Unions and 10 named individuals.

Those individuals include ICTU's assistant general secretary Peter Bunting, SIPTU officials Oliver McDonagh and Christy McQuillan and SIPTU's General Secretary Joe O'Flynn, Ken Fleming an agent of the International Transport Workers Federation and five current and former employees of the company.

Under the terms of the order the defendants and their agents cannot intimidate harass or threaten any persons employed by the company who have continued to work during the strike by members of SIPTU that commenced in early July.

The Judge, who granted the injunction on an ex parte (one side only) basis, made the matter returnable to Thursday next.

By threatening the "scabs" the people on strike have made the company have a better hand of cards when it comes to courts.

the_syco

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16359322/?view=Standard
http://breakingnews.ie/ireland/initimidation-of-marine-terminals-workers-denied-425017.html

<article text snipped>

What a bunch of f**king scumbags. It's bloody easy attacking individuals, isn't it? I hope the strikers understand that very soon they won't have a leg to stand on, and are turning those who work there heavily against the strikers, to the point where the strikers will become the enemy.

mtldockers

the_syco wrote: »

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16359322/?view=Standard
http://breakingnews.ie/ireland/initimidation-of-marine-terminals-workers-denied-425017.html


What a bunch of f**king scumbags. It's bloody easy attacking individuals, isn't it? I hope the strikers understand that very soon they won't have a leg to stand on, and are turning those who work there heavily against the strikers, to the point where the strikers will become the enemy.

Not one "scab" working there has been attacked or otherwise threatened. Since when it is a threat or an attack to call someone a scab, which by the way after some research, is the legally accepted word for a strike breaker!

People seem to forget that the only documented attack was on a member of the strikers by one of the scabs, and the person who was threatened has since been fired from the company. Justify that!

unamed1985

the_syco wrote: »

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16359322/?view=Standard
http://breakingnews.ie/ireland/initimidation-of-marine-terminals-workers-denied-425017.html


What a bunch of f**king scumbags. It's bloody easy attacking individuals, isn't it? I hope the strikers understand that very soon they won't have a leg to stand on, and are turning those who work there heavily against the strikers, to the point where the strikers will become the enemy.

I would like to know what your on about who was threatned?? also who is going to take the strikeers legs that right there sounds like a threat, those who work there have turned a whole community against them i think i would favour the strikers odds, as regard to enemys personally those inside arent worth it they are a waste of time working in a community that wants them out.... best of luck in your miserable life....

LegacyUser

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGrMrS1MKAw

LegacyUser

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGrMrS1MKAw
Very good insight into this dispute, very informative too, Good to see the human side of it also, rather than just reading about it.
Great speech and well done.
All the best.

LegacyUser

Thought the speech was as ineffective as the strike is.You have been on strike now for 3 mths-what have you achieved?MTL is more efficient than it ever was,appears to be as busy as it ever was and the workers behind the gates are getting on with their work.You strikers are still outside the gate,not getting paid and no further on with your cause.For all the noise the unions have made and the support rallies you have held - What has changed? Hear mtl might be looking for replacements soon -for 60k basic i might just apply!

gigboat

service, its totally discusting, weve been robbed and the goverment is a sham and the TUPE rules which are worth a toss,

dudara

gigboat Your reply isn't very coherent - it's hard to know what you're driving at.

In addition, this thread is over a year old, so I'm going to close it.

dudara