B12 shots on a medical card

Sapsorrow

Hi I'm just wondering does anyone have any experience of using vitamin B12 shots? I'm a long term veggie and recently turned vegan again, I've had IBS for a few years now and am concerned about my ability to absorb b12 from oral supplements.
Has anyone managed to get a doctor to agree to giving them without a diagnosis of deficiency? Are they available on the medical card under any circumstances?
Thanks!

ButterflyGirl23

I was told not to worry about B12 for years as your body needs very little of it and does store it for a large number of years.
I know that doesn't answer your question but just thought it might ease you a bit to know that if you don't get some soon, it doesn't mean that you will be very deficiant in it.

Sapsorrow

Hi butterfly girl, thanks for the reply, Cllinical deficiency takes around 5 years to show itself usually but sub-clinical deficiency of B12 can have quite serious side-effects over time too due to it'd effect on homocysteine levels which Is why I want to look into it, I should've done this years ago when the IBS started really. I also have a history of B2 vitamin deficency and iron deficiency anaemia so it may be even more pertinant for me to get onto a suuplement!

ButterflyGirl23

Oh thanks for letting me know that, I should look further into it too then! I'll keep an eye on this thread to see if anyone who knows posts about it!

biZrb

whats the link between B12 and IBS, I have IBS, just wondering if its something I need to know about!

Tar.Aldarion

Do you have something that makes you absorb less B12 than other people? (Dunno what IBS is) Maybe we can focus on what foods have it, as well as on supplements/injections?

Sapsorrow

Theres a two-fold connection with IBS, first of all if you regularly have loose bowels or diarrhoea or if your intestinal microflora is out of whack (as is considered to be a possible cause/symtom of IBS in some ppl) then your ability to absorb nutrients that are assimilated in the large intestine is compromised, thats why B12 absorbtion in IBS sufferers can be very badly impaired.
This is why for people with poor colonic health (including Chrohns disease and possibly ulcerative colitis sufferers) may benifit more from a parenteral source of B12 as orally taken supplements may be so poorly utilised by their bodies.
Considering that I'm a vegan my food sources of B12 are extremely limited and most non-animal food forms are actually very unreliable sources. Furthermore B12 analogs in food can actually impair your absorbtion of true B12 by altering B12 metabolism as well as mask a B12 deificiency. Research of vegan diets that are high in supposed plant sources of B12 suggest that these are actually B12 analogs rather than true B12. Vitamin B12 is actually distinguished from all other vitamins by the fact that plant foods are a poor source of it.
Secondly some research and a lot of anecdoatal evidence is indicating that some cases of IBS are actually a misdiagnosis or vitamin B12 deifieciency as B12 is involved in proper regulation of intestinal function.
I'm trying to get some links to scientific journals for ya's re: the IBS/B12 connection n plant sources of B12 but my college e-resurce database seems to be down so I can't get at any journals for free, I'll try again monday!

Tar.Aldarion

Since all b12 comes from bacteria, time to start cultivating your own! hehe.
Would like to see journals, cool. I've always seen studies saying there was little b12 analogues in things, yet, things always contradict. :S

Sapsorrow

I know it can be very difficult to judge which information is reliable and from an unbiased source more than than anything. The confounding side of science can drive you mental esp when you're trying to write a review or something. The best bet is to always consult your own common sense before incorporating anyone elses opinions into your own.
I'll get cracking on finding some good papers after the weekend anyway, In the mean time can anyone answer any of my original questions!? :pac:

Sapsorrow

here a nice little article on veganism with a brief mention of B12 deficiency: http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/89/5/1627S

This ones a bit heavy going if your not a science nerd (like me! ) but very good coverage of digestion and assimilation of B12 and also has a good discussion of the effects on homocysteine levels. http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/89/5/1693S

This one also mentions studies on raw foodists and studies which focused on functional biomarkers of B12 status in vegans highlighting that while some conventional blood tests used in some studies may indicate that B12 status is adequate, that a reliable result cannot be determined unless we look at the functionability of the B12 (ie: is it just a B12 analog)

This one looks at raw foodists and B12 specifically: http://jn.nutrition.org/cgi/content/full/135/10/2372?ijkey=fc9f26a02ac2d0eb665bcebda7416b6e4062c890

This is a really nicer one thats not too sciency, scroll down to the B12 section: http://www.lpda.pt/vegetarianismo/ada_dc_veg.pdf

Still working on the IBS stuff for ye's will get back to ye (i'm supposed to be working right now)
Hope that stuff helps ye's in some way sorry if some of it's a bit too hardcore for some ppls liking!