How close are you to boiling point?

DTrotter

dotsman wrote: »

Umm, since when did Fianna fail become a "right-wing" party? It's been all their left-wing bull$hit for the past 12 years that has gotten us to where we are today. And I wouldn't really regard Fine Gael as "right-wing". They're pretty much in the center. There's no political party in this country with the balls to be right-wing.

Those bloody socialist property developers.

bonzos

People had a chance to sort this out on the 5th of june . anyone who voted FF has no right ot complain on the state of the country,roads,unemployment,health etc..YOU VOTED FOR THIS:mad:these clowns are laughing at you!

dotsman

DTrotter wrote: »

Those bloody socialist property developers.

...whose taxes, and the taxes generated from the trade of property fueled the left-wing spending policies of the Fianna Fail government, leaving us with a massively inflated public sector (which despite all the money, is still very under-productive), a ridiculously high minimum wage, a huge welfare class, and the rampant inflation associated with this.

It's not the fact that a house/apartment is not worth as much now as it was a couple of years ago that's causing all this $hit. It's the fact that our entire economy was dependent on the taxes/employment associated with this (now collapsed) sector.

sells

go to the RSA ad thread...that pisses me off.......

Biggins

Reached boiling point a long time ago. I could rant but I won't.
It would be wasted on the too complacent dumb sheep of this country anyway.

DTrotter

dotsman wrote: »

...
It's not the fact that a house/apartment is not worth as much now as it was a couple of years ago that's causing all this $hit. It's the fact that our entire economy was dependent on the taxes/employment associated with this (now collapsed) sector.

Which was never sustainable in the first place.

Acacia

I just don't watch the news anymore. It depresses me.

I'm getting my relevant college degrees and fcuking right off out of here, hopefully. Wish I could do it sooner, tbh. I was just looking at all the Spanish students here today and thinking "Why the fcuk are you wasting your youth visiting this sh1tehole?" I know the recession's as bad everywhere else, but at least I won't be in Ireland. Always a plus. And the fcukin' cheek of the government bringing in student loans to be paid back ''when the graduates get jobs''. There's not a job to be had in the country. What a bunch of thicks.



Btw, did anyone else think the name ''An Bord Snip Nua'' was a joke name? Is it actually called that or what?

/rant over.

This is why I don' watch the news- it angries up the blood.

Biggins

It all reminds me of a very famous poem by Pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984)

When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

Then they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
I did not protest;
I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
I did not speak out;
I was not a Jew.

When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out for me.

When the elderly had to take to the streets, they were on their own ...and the public looked on.
When the parents of children medically affected (Crumlin, etc) by cuts take to the streets, they are generally on their own ...and the public looks on,
When the chemists protest, they are on their own ...and the public looks on.
When the schools are more jammed per room and teachers numbers are cut ...and the public looks on.
When the REAL poorest of the poor gets their basic money cut, they try to protest ...and the public looks on.
When the student raise their voices and cry out at the increased charges for a basic education ...and the public looks on.
(Some quick simple examples about how we are being picked off one by one...)

Well guess what public!
If ye don't get up off your frigging arses, SPEAK UP and very frackin' soon ...YOUR NEXT!!!

DON'T SAY YE WEREN'T WARNED OR THE SIGNS WASN'T THERE.

seanwhite20

dotsman wrote: »

Umm, since when did Fianna fail become a "right-wing" party? It's been all their left-wing bull$hit for the past 12 years that has gotten us to where we are today. And I wouldn't really regard Fine Gael as "right-wing". They're pretty much in the center. There's no political party in this country with the balls to be right-wing.

I suppose it depends on your perception of what a right wing party is dotsman. Im not saying they are far right exrtremists like bnp in England or anything, just conservative and out for the better off in our society. Take the proposed privatisation of hospitals for example or the new blasphemy act, would you consider these to be things a left wing party would do? i think not. And i dont see how FG could be considered a central party they are basically FF's shadow, they have very similar policies (although i know they would go into coalition with LAB, but thats just because they'd do anything for power!). I think to be classed as left is not about throwing money at everything as was done by FF under Bertie for 10 yrs, its about spreading wealth to create equality. I dont think FF or FG could ever claim to have have ever done that! a proposed cut of 5% in social welfare as well as cuts in education, health and closing half our garda stations,um yeah thats real liberal or as you put it so elequently "left wing bull$hit"????

Biggins

bonzos wrote: »

People had a chance to sort this out on the 5th of june . anyone who voted FF has no right ot complain on the state of the country,roads,unemployment,health etc..YOU VOTED FOR THIS:mad:these clowns are laughing at you!

No one will be laughing if the following cuts comes in...

H. Primary (health) care €577.0m
I. Acute hospitals, including cancer care €96.0m
J. Disability and mental health €50.0m
K. Care of older people €74.0m

Page 128 - Table 11.3 Health - Total measures identified by Programme

Seriously! Just shoot us all in the head now Cowen and get it over with.

Report in full.
Part 1: http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0716/Volume%201.pdf
Part 2: http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0716/Volume%202%20FINAL.pdf

Acacia

Biggins wrote: »

Seriously! Just shoot us all in the head now Cowen and get it over with.

We would probably have to pay for the privelege...

Biggins

Acacia wrote: »

We would probably have to pay for the privelege...

Aye and don't forget the v.a.t. for the bullet and then the further death tax after that!

seanwhite20

Biggins wrote: »

No one will be laughing if the following cuts comes in...

H. Primary (health care) care €577.0m
I. Acute hospitals, including cancer care €96.0m
J. Disability and mental health €50.0m
K. Care of older people €74.0m

Page 128 - Table 11.3 Health - Total measures identified by Programme

Seriously! Just shoot us all in the head now Cowen and get it over with.

Report in full.
Part 1: http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0716/Volume%201.pdf
Part 2: http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0716/Volume%202%20FINAL.pdf

Makes for very depressing reading alright Biggins will Irish people ever wake up? gd idea to post it mayb the realisation of whats upon us will hit people...although its highly doubtful

Biggins

seanwhite20 wrote: »

Makes for very depressing reading alright Biggins will Irish people ever wake up? gd idea to post it mayb the realisation of whats upon us will hit people...although its highly doubtful

Aye.

...and what amazing timing too that not just this report but two on the same day are released to the public.
The people have questions and little answers.

Let ask our TD's to ask them questions in the Dail - darn - O' wait...
We have just missed them. They have JUST gone on holiday. What a coincident! :rolleyes:

Jesus Juice

Insurgent wrote: »

Theres a recession!! First I've heard of it!!

Say hello to Stephen then...

R.D. aka MR.D

I boiled over a long time ago.

I'm out of here.
Its just a pity its taking so long to organise.

I've never been so disappointed in my fellow country women and men.

No matter how much I try to point out to people whats happening and whose fault it is people seem to be in denial.

Gear9992

Only thing I really care about is if they bring in college fees, and if they do, I'm out of this god-forsaken country

seanwhite20

Biggins wrote: »

Aye.

...and what amazing timing too that not just this report but two on the same day are released to the public.
The people have questions and little answers.

Let ask our TD's to ask them questions in the Dail - darn - O' wait...
We have just missed them. They have JUST gone on holiday. What a coincident! :rolleyes:

Is'nt it just! I was thinking about that earlier how sneaky it was to bring out a report which can't be debated on until september. and even when the time comes to debate on it the opposition will be guillotined! :mad:

JimmyMolloy

boardsies causing civil unrest???

What have they cut off the broadband or something?

ScumLord

This isn't a recession thread by the way, it's a revolution thread. I just wanted to you know, see who's up for it.

thelordofcheese

ScumLord wrote: »

This isn't a recession thread by the way, it's a revolution thread. I just wanted to you know, see who's up for it.

Unless your plan consists of more than the usual boards revolution circlejerk of

1: revolt
2: murder fantasy about cowen
3: Wellnowwhat
4: ????
5: GOTO 4

then count me out.

Oh The Humanity

delop wrote: »

Humanity, your in IT ill bet, its amazing that everyone forgot about the IT recession in 01, and in my view in IT we never really recovered, although I believe most IT companies who survived that will hopefully handle this one...

But one thing that hasnt been said, is that the IT recession was tough but it didnt crash the country...

The IT recession in 01........!!! rofl I don't remember much starvation around then, although they did take the plants out of the office......it was like Les Miserables indeed !!!

lol er yeh but I was referring to the recession in the 80's, now that was a proper recession....Thrift food, lino in your shoes, no copies in school, ah they were the days!!!

ScumLord

thelordofcheese wrote: »

Unless your plan consists of more than the usual boards revolution circlejerk of

1: revolt
2: murder fantasy about cowen
3: Wellnowwhat
4: ????
5: GOTO 4

then count me out.

First I plan to get the farmers on side, and create local co-op farming communities that control their own resources and exchange them with the cities, most of the cities will have to be disbanded as their just unworkable in their current state. It's all in my manifesto "Me Plan" available nowhere at the moment because nobody will accept a book written on refill pad. There shall be no murdering of anybody.

Biggins

Biggins wrote: »

...and what amazing timing too that not just this report but two on the same day are released to the public.
The people have questions and little answers.

Let ask our TD's to ask them questions in the Dail - darn - O' wait...
We have just missed them. They have JUST gone on holiday. What a coincident! :rolleyes:

seanwhite20 wrote: »

Is'nt it just! I was thinking about that earlier how sneaky it was to bring out a report which can't be debated on until september. and even when the time comes to debate on it the opposition will be guillotined! :mad:

Of course the usual gullible, lazy arsed people out there will just accept it like the dumb sheep they are.
O' sure, they will grumble over their more expensive pint at the week end and gripe about it at the bus/train stops as they pay their more expensive fares and don't forget that they will have nice cosy chats about it too at the doctors waiting room while they hope to get an hospital appointment from him/her in about two years time
...but hey, the same schmucks will still vote Fianna Fail at the next general election. Sure aren't they doing a great job!

Ya reap what ya sow.

thelordofcheese

ScumLord wrote: »

First I plan to get the farmers on side, and create local co-op farming communities that control their own resources and exchange them with the cities, most of the cities will have to be disbanded as their just unworkable in their current state. It's all in my manifesto "Me Plan" available nowhere at the moment because nobody will accept a book written on refill pad. There shall be no murdering of anybody.

On one hand, thats more than most people have thought of
on the other, it's a fucking awful plan.

I'm out.

me-skywalker

ScumLord wrote: »

I have friends that will turn off the news or bin the paper in disgust at the state of this country, roads and hospitals or talk of bankers and politicians because it just makes them to angry

.

how do they knwo what a state its in if they keep tunrign of the tv or not even read the paper? surely ild be more pissed off at them for being so ignorant to it all...

mathie

engrish? wrote: »

I'm just pissed off listening to people whinge all the time.

Ah meta-whinging.
The most inane of all the whinges.

ScumLord

thelordofcheese wrote: »

On one hand, thats more than most people have thought of
on the other, it's a fucking awful plan.

I'm out.

That's only a small part of the plan, ultimately I want to bring the monetary system to an end. I haven't really thought it all out though. I'm now of the opinion anything better than the current setup (bar the systems we've already proved don't work).

thelordofcheese

ScumLord wrote: »

That's only a small part of the plan, ultimately I want to bring the monetary system to an end. I haven't really thought it all out though. I'm now of the opinion anything better than the current setup (bar the systems we've already proved don't work).

And now i actively oppose you, because christ that's dumb.

Soldier

probably explode when the next budget comes out ka boommm!

ScumLord

thelordofcheese wrote: »

And now i actively oppose you, because christ that's dumb.

Whats so great about the monetary system? With todays technology there's many different ways we could run things.

fluffy.death

ScumLord wrote: »

Whats so great about the monetary system? With todays technology there's many different ways we could run things.

Not to be Captain Obvious or anything, but how do you think today's technology came about?

Monetary systems are a requirement of progressing civilization. Well, unless you can either come up with something that's better than a monetary system (good luck with that), or invent a new type of human that exists on doing things solely for everyone else. And then replace every current human with the new type. In which case you wouldn't be around to see it.
Also there'd be free blowjobs.

thelordofcheese

ScumLord wrote: »

Whats so great about the monetary system? With todays technology there's many different ways we could run things.

How do you propose we run anything without a way to determine the value of goods and services?

Wertz

fluffy.death wrote: »

Also there'd be free blowjobs.

Where do I sign up?

ScumLord

fluffy.death wrote: »

Not to be Captain Obvious or anything, but how do you think today's technology came about?

Monetary systems are a requirement of progressing civilization. Well, unless you can either come up with something that's better than a monetary system (good luck with that), or invent a new type of human that exists on doing things solely for everyone else. And then replace every current human with the new type. In which case you wouldn't be around to see it.
Also there'd be free blowjobs.

Technology was being developed long before the current monetary system, technology has always been about fulling a need. The current monetary system has high jacked that and in fact destroyed the purity of technology. Instead of us making the best possible piece of technology we build in a life span for the "product". in stead of making something that will last a life time we make it to die so it needs replacing.

The monetary system itself started out to fulfill needs buts has been corrupted and abused. Most people dismiss any other way of doing things because they can't see how we'd get from the current setup to a new one. It doesn't mean we shouldn't try or have a goal of something better.

An Fear Aniar

Oh The Humanity wrote: »

lol er yeh but I was referring to the recession in the 80's, now that was a proper recession....Thrift food, lino in your shoes, no copies in school, ah they were the days!!!

Yup, and you try and tell the young people of today that ..... they won't believe you.

.

fluffy.death

ScumLord wrote: »

The monetary system itself started out to fulfill needs buts has been corrupted and abused. Most people dismiss any other way of doing things because they can't see how we'd get from the current setup to a new one. It doesn't mean we shouldn't try or have a goal of something better.

Aye that's fair enough. Don't get me wrong I'm all for finding something better, but I'm just pretty darn skeptical that anything better exists.
Not to be too philosophical about it, but the problem is essentially human beings themselves. Hell world peace would be easier to pull off than convincing people to give up their money.

I say we just use pieces of string. I bet that guy in the Guinnness World Records for having the most amount of string would be nicer to get a loan from than a bank.

Fighting Irish

The only thing i'm pissed about atm is the Carlow Tescos isn't 24 hours anymore

Biggins

I for one having reached boiling point some time ago, am off to the local newspapers shortly to advertise for folk to join a new united protest movement (unitedpeople.ie).

Its about time the sheep of this country got the fcuk up, stopped useless bitching and actually did something.
Its time to stand up for each other like never before.

If the lazy schmucks don't arise up in the next few months, they deserve everything that is coming to them!

Whiskey Devil

It's incredible how every man and his dog is anti-Fianna Fáil all of a sudden.. C'mon own up ye crooks!

The real problem in this country is that there are no real alternatives. FG will carry on with more or less the same policies as Fianna Fáil. The only difference between the two parties is tribal and too historical to matter. I'd take Biffo over Enda Kenny any day. FG really need to ditch that pompous little creep.


Anyway, I'm grand.

tech77

BVB wrote: »

About 99.9 degrees

You poor thing, you're nearly freezing.
(^the pedants will appreciate it anyway)

ScumLord

thelordofcheese wrote: »

How do you propose we run anything without a way to determine the value of goods and services?

I could see that venus project/zeitgeist working for basic products and technology. There are very few factories that couldn't be automated completely, the only obstacle at the moment is money. Money holds back allot of things really.

I don't see how it would work for human artistic endeavors. If you have a great chef it's impossible to share out his talents to everyone that want's his services. It's the same for a piece of art unless you make all art public.

There are gaping holes in it from what I've seen but it does work for certain other things.

The monetary system is just that, a system. It only works because everyones prepared to go along with it. I don't see why they do though. It's totally unbalanced with all the money resting at the top and allowing certain people regardless of their talents or worth to the system to hold power over the majority. It's corrupted in my opinion maybe sorting out that corruption would go along way but that doesn't seem to be happening either.

Fighting Irish

Whiskey Devil wrote: »

It's incredible how every man and his dog is anti-Fianna Fáil all of a sudden.. C'mon own up ye crooks!

The real problem in this country is that there are no real alternatives. FG will carry on with more or less the same policies as Fianna Fáil. The only difference between the two parties is tribal and too historical to matter. I'd take Biffo over Enda Kenny any day. FG really need to ditch that pompous little creep.


Anyway, I'm grand.

The problem is most people overspent and now we're all ****ed. You can say "the banks" "the government" all you want but each person is responsible for their own selves

chezzer

ScumLord wrote: »

I have friends that will turn off the news or bin the paper in disgust at the state of this country, roads and hospitals or talk of bankers and politicians because it just makes them to angry. Everyones pissed, lots of people are out of work thanks to the narrow mindedness of the people in charge of this country and our money. I've heard many people say if this was any other country there'd be riots in the streets and calls for blood but we've stayed the course even though some high ups rub our noses in the dirt by making everyone take pay cuts bar them selfs.

Just how close are you to giving up on this country? What else would it take for the Irish to turn nasty and oust the government? Would it ever happen in this country?

I reckon we'll toe the line indefinitely if the worst does happen most will just abandon this country and move on, it's tradition after all. I've pretty much given up on this current regime I have no faith in the government or the people to be honest.

What i find amazing everytime i come home is how the Irish people put up with this CRAP !!!!

I mean the DART is a joke ... a JOKE ...

12 minutes wait ?? in RUSH HOUR ??

are you having a f*cking laugh!!!!

and 3 times more expensive then the equivalent service in barcelona - which runs 7 or 8 times more frequently !!!

Transfers ???? a radically advanced concept in Ireland .. cost of journey from Raheny to Rathmines ..

DART single -- €2.00
LUAS single - €2.00
Takes the best part of 2 hours ...

2 HOURS !!!!
€4 one way !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i mean ... how come people don't take to the streets (not just over that, but this is a drop in the ocean)

In Barcelona equivalent journey transferrign between metro, bus and tram (all considered one journey) - €0.70 .. (using a 10 journey ticket - but this doesn't exist in IReland -- another advanced concept that the inbred mucksavage politicians couldn't think of)
30 minutes or so ..

30 minutes v 2 hours
€0.70 v €4.00 !!!


IRELAND COP THE FUUCK ON !!!

ScumLord

chezzer wrote: »

and 3 times more expensive then the equivalent service in barcelona - which runs 7 or 8 times more frequently !!!

Everywhere in Europe is better value than here. I get a return train ticket from Brussels to Brugge that cost €12 got back to Galway and had to get a bus home which cost €16 one way to do 30 miles.

dotsman

DTrotter wrote: »

Which was never sustainable in the first place.

Agreed, but as long as Fianna Fail were cutting taxes, letting people feel wealthier because their homes were worth more (and then borrowing based on the rice of their home) and hiking up public sector pay, social welfare and minimum wage without any justifaication or economic reasoning, everybody (well, the vast majority), were happy to go along for the ride and toasted to Ireland's brilliance/success.

seanwhite20 wrote: »

I suppose it depends on your perception of what a right wing party is dotsman. Im not saying they are far right exrtremists like bnp in England or anything, just conservative and out for the better off in our society. Take the proposed privatisation of hospitals for example or the new blasphemy act, would you consider these to be things a left wing party would do? i think not. And i dont see how FG could be considered a central party they are basically FF's shadow, they have very similar policies (although i know they would go into coalition with LAB, but thats just because they'd do anything for power!).

You'll find for every mild right-wing policy, they have 2 left-wing policies. They have been talking about privatisation of some hospitals for ages, but actually haven't done so. In the meantime a huge amount of the country's population are getting the medical treatment for free (or very cheap). To me that is a left wing policy. I'm not saying that it is wrong (I am left wing on certain issues), but although not complete communist/socialist, it is certainly left of centre.

seanwhite20 wrote: »

I think to be classed as left is not about throwing money at everything as was done by FF under Bertie for 10 yrs, its about spreading wealth to create equality. I dont think FF or FG could ever claim to have have ever done that!

In theory, not it's not precisely left wing, but it is the practical reality of left wing policies. With regards the "spreading wealth to create equality", what do you think the high taxes/social welfare is about? What do you think the complete disaster the benchmarking policy was trying to achieve?

seanwhite20 wrote: »

a proposed cut of 5% in social welfare as well as cuts in education, health and closing half our garda stations,um yeah thats real liberal or as you put it so elequently "left wing bull$hit"????

The 5% cut in social welfare is extremely left wing. The fact is that social welfare needs to be cut by a hell of a lot more. Whatever your views may be on what you would like social welfare to be, the reality is that we can't afford it, nor anything close! To get to levels that we can actually afford, you would need to cut social welfare by 10 times that amount.

Anyway, with the current rate of deflation (and cutting these costs will drive prices down even further), the fact of the matter is that a person on the dole will be far better off after these cuts than they were 2 years ago.

As for the cuts in everything else, the fact is, like the social welfare, WE CANNOT AFFORD IT! If you have no money you can't pay for something. Ireland Inc has no money, yet we are paying ridiculous amounts for a terrible service. Every other sector has had much larger cuts and will still get by (it'll be a struggle, but we must make do with what we can afford).

The fact is the Bord Snip report was to introduce cuts to save €5 Billion. We need to save 4 times that amount just to balance the budget.

DTrotter

dotsman wrote: »

Agreed, but as long as Fianna Fail were cutting taxes, letting people feel wealthier because their homes were worth more (and then borrowing based on the rice of their home) and hiking up public sector pay, social welfare and minimum wage without any justifaication or economic reasoning, everybody (well, the vast majority), were happy to go along for the ride and toasted to Ireland's brilliance/success.

But no one had the sense to look ahead, last general election people voted FF in again because they thought the good times then were the product of FF and FF could keep it going. We don't elect people baed on skills or qualifications, what do we expect in return?

dotsman

DTrotter wrote: »

But no one had the sense to look ahead, last general election people voted FF in again because they thought the good times then were the product of FF and FF could keep it going. We don't elect people baed on skills or qualifications, what do we expect in return?

Precisely. One of the biggest failures of democracy (and especially in this country) is that democracy works on the premise that the electorate are greatly informed, intelligent, hold no loyalty to any particular party/person and vote in the interests of the country as a whole. This country's electorate are pretty much the polar opposite of this. Result? A bunch of farmers, teachers, publicans & barristers who have no concept of how to run a complex economy and got to where they are based on BS.

OPENROAD

chezzer wrote: »

What i find amazing everytime i come home is how the Irish people put up with this CRAP !!!!

I mean the DART is a joke ... a JOKE ...

12 minutes wait ?? in RUSH HOUR ??

are you having a f*cking laugh!!!!

and 3 times more expensive then the equivalent service in barcelona - which runs 7 or 8 times more frequently !!!

Transfers ???? a radically advanced concept in Ireland .. cost of journey from Raheny to Rathmines ..

DART single -- €2.00
LUAS single - €2.00
Takes the best part of 2 hours ...

2 HOURS !!!!
€4 one way !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i mean ... how come people don't take to the streets (not just over that, but this is a drop in the ocean)

In Barcelona equivalent journey transferrign between metro, bus and tram (all considered one journey) - €0.70 .. (using a 10 journey ticket - but this doesn't exist in IReland -- another advanced concept that the inbred mucksavage politicians couldn't think of)
30 minutes or so ..

30 minutes v 2 hours
€0.70 v €4.00 !!!


IRELAND COP THE FUUCK ON !!!

Spot on, and the Luas, the lines don't even connect

ScumLord

OPENROAD wrote: »

Spot on, and the Luas, the lines don't even connect

That's because they'd only crash into each other. :pac: