Men who haven't had kids yet - do you want them someday?

Dudess

bronte wrote: »

I was told I had a psychological problem because I didn't want them.

Seriously? Wow, some people really are cuntbags.

bronte

Dudess wrote: »

Seriously? Wow, some people really are cuntbags.

Yeah, on here. He got banned.
Rightfully so tbh.

Latchy

raah! wrote: »

I'd like to some day have a dog. :P/

Some people have both although some dogs and adults should never be allowed around babies :pac:

Dudess

Actually, I'm thoroughly convinced that those who have a problem with other people not having kids/not wanting kids are just bitter about something themselves and projecting it.

Same goes for people who are actually sad enough to get bothered by other people being single/in relationships but not married.

Saibh

dearg lady wrote: »

yeah, dogs are lovely!!
I'd long ago decided I never wanted kids for a variety of reasons, and it was something I no longer though about at all, all my friends were well aware, and never really bugged me about it.
Recently a lot of work friends have been having kids and I decided to have a think about it again(even though either way, it still wouldn't be for quite a few years) and I looked around at kids, and yeah, they do cute things sometimes, but IMHO about 95% of the time they're just annoying little brats.
On top of that, I honestly think I would make a terrible mother, so I'm reasonably confident it'll be never for me.
Dread breakin the news to my mother.....

You shouldn't be dreading to tell your mother.
It will be your decision and no one else's whether you want to have children or not and people should accept it.

bronte

Dudess wrote: »

Actually, I'm thoroughly convinced that those who have a problem with other people not having kids/not wanting kids are just bitter about something themselves and projecting it.

Same goes for people who are actually sad enough to get bothered by other people not being in relationships.

There is something fuelling the rage alright...just don't know wtf it is.

footloose jen

im 33yrs old and have four kids and i hate the fact that some people think its abnormal for men or women not to want kids, its a though decision to make either way "to have or not to have":D

b3t4

I will be absolutely devastated should we not be able to have kids. Himself would be equally as devastated.

I only wish that the people who didn't want kids had kids. Not because I think it'd be good for them but because it'd be good for society. Ya see from the people I've read that don't want kids they really have their heads screwed on. They've really thought about this whole having a child business. So many people just don't think long and hard enough about whether to have a child or not. A little part of me thinks that the people who don't want kids would make the best parents

That said if a person doesn't want kids. They don't want kids. No biggy. More room in schools for my sprogs

It does surprise me though the number of 'I definitely don't want kids' men who haven't had a vasectomy and women who don't have an IUCD or IUS fitted (or for over 30 women tube ligation). Any reasons for this folks?

Dudess

Why should they? These are expensive, a huge hassle and not exactly pleasant, and it's not as if there isn't an alternative.

b3t4 wrote: »

I only wish that the people who didn't want kids had kids. Not because I think it'd be good for them but because it'd be good for society. Ya see from the people I've read that don't want kids they really have their heads screwed on. They've really thought about this whole having a child business. So many people just don't think long and hard enough about whether to have a child or not. A little part of me thinks that the people who don't want kids would make the best parents

It wouldn't be good for the kids though - their parent(s) not wanting them...

bronte

b3t4 wrote: »

I will be absolutely devastated should we not be able to have kids. Himself would be equally as devastated.

I only wish that the people who didn't want kids had kids. Not because I think it'd be good for them but because it'd be good for society. Ya see from the people I've read that don't want kids they really have their heads screwed on. They've really thought about this whole having a child business. So many people just don't think long and hard enough about whether to have a child or not. A little part of me thinks that the people who don't want kids would make the best parents

That said if a person doesn't want kids. They don't want kids. No biggy. More room in schools for my sprogs

It does surprise me though the number of 'I definitely don't want kids' men who haven't had a vasectomy and women who don't have an IUCD or IUS fitted (or for over 30 women tube ligation). Any reasons for this folks?

Doctors won't even look at me for any kind of permanent solution ( I'm 25)
On the pill for now, but would much rather something more foolproof and permanent.

MagicMarker

I don't think I should have to have my nut sack cut open to ensure I don't have kids.

There are condoms and there is the pill, there's also the morning after pill and if they don't work there is abortion.

b3t4

bronte wrote: »

On the pill for now, but would much rather something more foolproof and permanent.

You sound perfect for an IUCD or IUS. Have you looked into them? I really want children but have an IUCD fitted. It's 99% effective and if you were to use condoms as well, getting pregnant would certainly be a miracle. You should definitely look into it, anyways.

MagicMarker wrote: »

I don't think I should have to have my nut sack cut open to ensure I don't have kids.

But it's OK for a female to have to take artificial hormones. Or should the pill + condom fail for her to have to take a 6month hit of hormones to prevent pregnancy. And should the morning after pill fail it's ok for the female to have to under go a potential invasive procedure to end the pregnancy? Your logic fails me.

sam34

b3t4 wrote: »

It does surprise me though the number of 'I definitely don't want kids' men who haven't had a vasectomy and women who don't have an IUCD or IUS fitted (or for over 30 women tube ligation). Any reasons for this folks?

tubal ligation is pretty big surgery.

a lot of doctors wont consider permanent sterilisation in those who are childfree, in case they later change their minds, as it is pretty much irreversible.

and as others have pointed out, there are much less invasive alternatives to sterilisation out there.

b3t4

sam34 wrote: »

tubal ligation is pretty big surgery.

I know that alright.

and as others have pointed out, there are much less invasive alternatives to sterilisation out there.

Ya, but ya see this is what I don't get or understand. The not invasive alternatives have a higher chance of causing pregnancy than sterilisation. If I was of the mind that i didn't want kids I'd do absolutely everything in my power to prevent pregnancy.

Generally, it's two people having the sex. If the two people are heterosexual chances are that a pregnancy might occur. If both parties are definite about not wanting children before a pregnancy occurs that's fine and dandy but should a pregnancy occur, all bets are off at that stage.

bronte

I've asked about pretty much everything and my doc recommended the pill I'm currently on as the best choice given my medical history.
He seemed a tad reluctant to suggest anything else, which I was a bit disappointed by.
Y'know yourself what the pill is like and what a pain it is to remember.
I'll def enquire again about that and see how far I get.
Some older docs can be an absolute nightmare to ask about contraception though.

Snowie

I have to find a woman thats first capable of manging me ......

PGstudent

I dont know if I necessarily want kids but i do want to experience as much of life as I can before I die and I suppose having a kid would be one of the BIG life experiences.

b3t4

Dudess wrote: »

It wouldn't be good for the kids though - their parent(s) not wanting them...

Wholeheartedly agree with ya there. A lot of the 'i don't want kids' people who end up having kids are great parents though. I like the thought process to come to a conclusion to not have kids and still have them anyways.

footloose jen

PGstudent wrote: »

I dont know if I necessarily want kids but i do want to experience as much of life as I can before I die and I suppose having a kid would be one of the BIG life experiences.

is the begining of a whole world of them,:D

b3t4

bronte wrote: »

Some older docs can be an absolute nightmare to ask about contraception though.

They are aren't they. So you know, they can be very reluctant to fit an IUCD or IUS in women that haven't had children in Ireland. I haven't had children but had mine fitted in New Zealand. In New Zealnd, there wasn't a question about it and no fuss at all. I've heard the younger doctors are better with this kind of thing. But obviously I don't know your medical history.

Info on the IUCD http://www.ifpa.ie/eng/Info/Fact-sheets/Copper-Intrauterine-Devices-IUCD and IUS http://www.ifpa.ie/eng/Info/Fact-sheets/Intrauterine-System-IUS-Mirena

dearg lady

Saibh wrote: »

You shouldn't be dreading to tell your mother.
It will be your decision and no one else's whether you want to have children or not and people should accept it.

ah no, I was only messin really, she's quite open minded my ma, it's just kinda funny that she spent years when I was younger warnin me not to get knocked up, then she comes to me recently and says, shock horror, she's the only one of her friends without a grandchild!!! I said say it to the bros, they're older than me!

stovelid

Have one child.

Adore him and enjoy being a parent, but the only thing more irritating than hearing people proselytising for parenthood is people ranting about not wanting any.

Who give a shit what either group choose to do?

Do it or don't do it; don't broadcast it.

bronte

b3t4 wrote: »

They are aren't they. So you know, they can be very reluctant to fit an IUCD or IUS in women that haven't had children in Ireland. I haven't had children but had mine fitted in New Zealand. In New Zealnd, there wasn't a question about it and no fuss at all. I've heard the younger doctors are better with this kind of thing. But obviously I don't know you're medical history.

Info on the IUCD http://www.ifpa.ie/eng/Info/Fact-sheets/Copper-Intrauterine-Devices-IUCD and IUS http://www.ifpa.ie/eng/Info/Fact-sheets/Intrauterine-System-IUS-Mirena

This is my big problem.
I don't have children, and they want you to have them before giving you one of these methods.
I'm attempting to get it because I do not want any!
I feel like banging my head off a desk half the time.
It's unbelievable.

realmadrid

For once I prob have to agree with stovelid!

sam34

b3t4 wrote: »

I know that alright.


Ya, but ya see this is what I don't get or understand. The not invasive alternatives have a higher chance of causing pregnancy than sterilisation. If I was of the mind that i didn't want kids I'd do absolutely everything in my power to prevent pregnancy.

Generally, it's two people having the sex. If the two people are heterosexual chances are that a pregnancy might occur. If both parties are definite about not wanting children before a pregnancy occurs that's fine and dandy but should a pregnancy occur, all bets are off at that stage.

the chances of pregnancy may be higher, granted, with condoms/pill, or even condoms and pill, than with sterilisation, but they still would not be high. when compared to the risks involved in the tubal ligation procedure, i'd be happy to take a daily pill.

why are "all bets off" once a pregnancy occurs???
being pregnant does not automatically mean that one will suddenly change a long held opinion about parenthood.

or did you mean something else - that sentence makes no sense to me.

sam34

stovelid wrote: »

the only thing more irritating than hearing people proselytising for parenthood is people ranting about not wanting any.

Who give a shit what either group choose to do?

Do it or don't do it; don't broadcast it.

should have just stayed away from the thread then, tbh.

the thread title did kinda give the topic away!

Prof.Badass

Dudess wrote: »

Being a parent doesn't automatically mean you'll become/you have a licence to be so grossly lacking in self-awareness as to assume others will worship your child as you do.

Yes, but it does make one more likely to momentarily forget. If this happens i don't think it's something to get worked up about.

LOL - the jealousy card was bound to be pulled sooner or later. Here's the thing: not everyone feels the same way about stuff as you do.

i know, that's why we're having this debate. But I'm lost for an explanation as to why someone would get so worked up over a parent thinking their child is the best in the world. Surely this is understandable, no?

Why just work? A noisy child is unpleasant on the ears for some of us, no matter where we are. Any shrill, piercing noise is unpleasant - I don't see how this noise being made by children automatically means it's exempt.

Because in work it might stop you from doing work. Otherwise it won't. Unless you happen to be RIGHT beside the child then it's crying is easy to ignore, if you are you can just move away a few metres.

Even if you think children can be annoying at times, i still don't see how you dislike them on the whole.
If a 4 year old relative came up to you do you not feel an overwhelming desire to pick them up and hold them?
If your friend brought their child along, would you not feel like being nice to the child and asking them a few questions about school/their dog ect?

Or would you feel all uptight and say to yourself "god, why did they bring their kids along :mad:" and ignore the child, at which point the child starts making a fuss because they feel uncomfortable around you and want to leave.

I haven't been in a situation where a child was crying so loud that i couldn't hear myself think in absolutely ages. At least 3-4 years. In that time how much have i enjoyed bonding with my nephew? enough to outweigh it 1000 times.

As i said i can understand not wanting to have kids, i just can't understand how someone could see a child and feel the exact opposite of what i feel.

stovelid

sam34 wrote: »

should have just stayed away from the thread then, tbh.

the thread title did kinda give the topic away!

I'm criticising over-advocation of either position.

Which doesn't preclude me from giving an opinion in the thread.

Davidius

I hope I end up starting a family.

What else am I going to do to fill up my free time after I turn 30? :pac:

Pro-Tip: The answer is nothing.

b3t4

sam34 wrote: »

why are "all bets off" once a pregnancy occurs???
being pregnant does not automatically mean that one will suddenly change a long held opinion about parenthood.

Because a long held position is all well and good till faced with the situation that calls you on it. Sometimes faced with a pregnancy long standing 'I don't want a pregnancy folks' change their minds, this is definitely not always the case, definitely, but in those cases where it happens it'd be devastating for either/both party should one want to continue the pregnancy.

If I didn't want a child I'd have an IUCD/IUS + condoms / tubal ligation/vasectomy (pushing more for the vasectomy as it's a less invasive procedure) + condoms.

b3t4

bronte wrote: »

I don't have children, and they want you to have them before giving you one of these methods.

It's definitely possible. My advise would be to ring around to find a doctor that is experienced enough to fit one. There was bad press in previous years with it but in the last few years it's gotten great press.

Get onto a well woman clinic or even a family planning group. Good luck with it. I was lucky to be living abroad when I got mine fitted. Have a look at the contraceptives thread in the Ladies Lounge. Some other women who haven't had kids have had one fitted in Ireland

Helix

id rather have aids than children tbh

bronte

b3t4 wrote: »

It's definitely possible. My advise would be to ring around to find a doctor that is experienced enough to fit one. There was bad press in previous years with it but in the last few years it's gotten great press.

Get onto a well woman clinic or even a family planning group. Good luck with it. I was lucky to be living abroad when I got mine fitted. Have a look at the contraceptives thread in the Ladies Lounge. Some other women who haven't had kids have had one fitted in Ireland

I'm living in London the last year, and I don't know if that's better or worse, but will try my luck.

stovelid

realmadrid wrote: »

For once I prob have to agree with stovelid!

Shut it or I'll scan my Madrid ticket into my signature.

titan18

Yes,I'd like to have kids.Always have and always will.I'm only 19 so a few years yet before I'd like them but whenever is grand to me.

Dudess

stovelid wrote: »

the only thing more irritating than hearing people proselytising for parenthood is people ranting about not wanting any.

In my case I'm simply defending people who have answered "no" to the question posed by the OP from some breathtakingly patronising and quite insulting comments.
My answer to the OP's question is "I don't know".

vinylmesh wrote: »

Yes, but it does make one more likely to momentarily forget. If this happens i don't think it's something to get worked up about.

Of course, if we're talking purely about "momentarily forgetting"... except we're not. We're talking about insufferable waxing lyrical about one's child(ren).

I'm lost for an explanation as to why someone would get so worked up over a parent thinking their child is the best in the world. Surely this is understandable, no?

Nobody said anything against a person thinking their child is the best in the world.

Because in work it might stop you from doing work. Otherwise it won't. Unless you happen to be RIGHT beside the child then it's crying is easy to ignore, if you are you can just move away a few metres.

To say a child screaming should only put out a person at work and in no other situation is just disingenuous.

Even if you think children can be annoying at times, i still don't see how you dislike them on the whole.

I'm going to assume you mean the general "you" because I said earlier on this thread that I like kids and am good with them. I actually think babies are the most beautiful things ever. But being unsure about parenthood (which can be very tough) does not = disliking children.

If a 4 year old relative came up to you do you not feel an overwhelming desire to pick them up and hold them?

Yeah, a relative. I thought we were talking about children in general, in which case it would depend on the child. You're resorting to a lot of putting words in my mouth and shifting the goalposts to suit your argument.

If your friend brought their child along, would you not feel like being nice to the child and asking them a few questions about school/their dog ect?

Yes I would.

I haven't been in a situation where a child was crying so loud that i couldn't hear myself think in absolutely ages. At least 3-4 years.

Oh well, if that's the case, nobody else must have...

In that time how much have i enjoyed bonding with my nephew? enough to outweigh it 1000 times.

As i said i can understand not wanting to have kids, i just can't understand how someone could see a child and feel the exact opposite of what i feel.

The two sentences above imply other people should feel the way you feel - you are wrong.

Super-Rush

Yes i would love kids. That is all.

Demonique

bronte wrote: »

This is my big problem.
I don't have children, and they want you to have them before giving you one of these methods.
I'm attempting to get it because I do not want any!
I feel like banging my head off a desk half the time.
It's unbelievable.

I heard Marie Stopes/Stropes (sp?) in the UK have no problem steralising young women, but then again the UK is progressive on other aspects of reproduction, like abortion

bronte

Interesting to know, My own country has provided nothing but obstacles.

Will contact them and see what their take on things are.

kowloon

Helix wrote: »

id rather have aids than children tbh

Why force yourself to pick a favorite when you can get both from the same act?

Darlughda

Oh the kids argument.

Rationally, reasonably from a logical point of view they are the utmost in indulgence by people who should know better: overpopulation of the planet vs. animal desire to recreate your own little minnie me

If you must have them, please make sure they have manners. It is so tiresome trying to install the mediocrity of manners and civility into your little animals you breed unless parents take upon themselves the task.

Broody men are the worst. Speaking as a female mise. desperate to see if you can be manipulated into utilising your nurturing instinct into their spawn. :eek:

midlandsmissus

I do want kids but I'm scared I'll get the 'aren't they cute' disease.

For example I was sitting at a table seat on a train, when a man and his toddler sat down opposite me. I had a tube of pringles on the table and the kid kept taking them and knocking them over. Your man just kept going 'ah isn't he cute'.

The kid was also carrying this bunch of helium balloons (no idea) and proceeded to start whacking me around the head with them. Cue Daddy going 'ah isn't he cute' again. I moved seats.

Its crazy how what is extremely annoying becomes adorable when it is your own kid.

Thank God not all parents and kids are like that. I know some lovely kids and definitely want some sometime.


Snip

Darlughda

Yes i would love kids. That is all.
Super -Rush You will be a great parent!kids need them.

If you want to have kids have them, if you can't and still want them- nurture the unwanted kids everyone likes to forget about.

Otherwise, get off the fence. Have kids because you want them or else have them and figure out what will be the best upbringing for your spawn.

In your own time, forget the nonesense, they won't arrive until they are ready. Whatever state you are in.

Tar.Aldarion

midlandsmissus wrote: »

I do want kids but I'm scared I'll get the 'aren't they cute' disease.

For example I was sitting at a table seat on a train, when a man and his toddler sat down opposite me. I had a tube of pringles on the table and the kid kept taking them and knocking them over. Your man just kept going 'ah isn't he cute'.

The kid was also carrying this bunch of helium balloons (no idea) and proceeded to start whacking me around the head with them. Cue Daddy going 'ah isn't he cute' again. I moved seats.

Its crazy how what is extremely annoying becomes adorable when it is your own kid.

Thank God not all parents and kids are like that. I know some lovely kids and definitely want some sometime.


Snip

Don't go spamming that link in any posts please, I have removed it from that one. You are not allowed to.

Thanks.

Kernel32

MagicMarker wrote: »

I don't think I should have to have my nut sack cut open to ensure I don't have kids.

There are condoms and there is the pill, there's also the morning after pill and if they don't work there is abortion.

I had one done last Friday. Granted I am married with two kids but it's a very simple procedure that I wouldn't even call a surgery. There is no nut sack cut open either and recovery has been very simple and pain free. As a man in a committed relationship I would never ask my wife to continue on the pill, take a morning after pill or have an abortion when a very simple and highly effective option for me to take care of the issue exists. I also would not even think of asking her to undergo a surgery for tubal ligation when a much simpler and less invasive option exists for me.

On Saturday we toasted the next chapter of our life which is without the need for contraception and no chance of another child and it feels great. We love our two children. They are beautiful and they are loved by us and they will do great things even if it's just little things. They have screamed and bawled at times and still do on occasion and have probably annoyed people here and there but we have always done our best to remove them from situations like that. Personally I am looking forward to a future without having more kids but watching the ones I have grow and learn and become productive and happy members of society.

Darlughda

That was a lovely post, Kernel, much more heartwarming , in my opinion,than any sight of a stressed friend or relative uncoiling their snarling brat from a tantrum.

Your wife is very lucky she has someone as strong and decent as yourself to truly consider what this surgery means to undergo

MagicMarker

b3t4 wrote: »

But it's OK for a female to have to take artificial hormones. Or should the pill + condom fail for her to have to take a 6month hit of hormones to prevent pregnancy. And should the morning after pill fail it's ok for the female to have to under go a potential invasive procedure to end the pregnancy? Your logic fails me.

Do you hear that? Sounds like voilins....

b3t4

MagicMarker wrote: »

Do you hear that? Sounds like voilins....

Little boy, have a read of Kernel32's post there will ya?

MagicMarker

b3t4 wrote: »

Little boy, have a read of Kernel32's post there will ya?

Point being?

dearg lady

MagicMarker wrote: »

Point being?

you didn't make an especially articulate point yourself there!

I think the point is fairly obvious, I'm only 25 but I'm already fed up of taking the pill, ok it's not as strong as it used to be, but it still affects my moods, my weight etc. It's not especially pleasant but it's an excellent method of contraception.

the morning after pill is a much higher dose of hormones, some people may be ethically opposed to it, and it's definitely not recommended as a regular form of contraception. it is really only intended for emergencies. Abortions, even more people ethically opposed, depending on when it's done can be quite invasive surgery, and can be very traumatic for a woman.

And finally as Kernal32 pointed out a vasectomy is MUCH less invasive than the femamle equivalant.

No violins playing, simple facts