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Shooting Forum - Firearms licencing information


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NARGC director's report on the Firearms Act

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    #182
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    Clash wrote: »
    .........And bunny complaining about snide posts. The world sure is becoming a strange place ;)

    I wasn't complaining about snide posts :p

    If you read my post properly...............I stated I was answering snide posts with snide posts :pac:


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    #183
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    MortgageMan wrote: »
    Bunny I don't know if you actually read the content of posts that are made or if you just jump in with comments that you can make to attack the posts and make yourself look like you know it all !

    Fair play to you if you do know it all, you are a better man that everyone else in the shooting community if that be the case.

    But whats happened in our community is very serious and will have far reaching effects not just for my sport but for my childrens sport, if it is still around at that time :mad:

    I am sick to the back teeth of people making comments and trying to spoil !!, spoil things for everybody else just to make themselves seem important.

    A group of dedicated shooters spent almost six months recently putting in long days and nights trying to lobby the minister and provide correct information for the purposes of fair play, at almost every junture there were attempts to scupper their efforts, from within their community :eek: this is what saddens me the most.

    At a time like this all proper shooting sports men and women need to pull together and help each other. I have spoken to many UK shooters who have told me exactly what happened in their country and how similar we are.

    We were given two ears, two eyes and one mouth, its a shame that we don't use them in the percentage that they were given us. and most important of all we engage our brains before we open our mouths, as what we say within our community effects the whole community, and it is viewed extremely closely by those outside of our community, who have the ability to change our sport on a whim :eek:
    12392-Funny-Man-With-A-Zipped-Mouth-Clipart-Illustration.jpg

    :P See Sparks, keeping my promise :)


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    #184
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    Clash wrote: »
    I think you should expand on that.

    Not nice to make accusaations without foundation and leave everyone pointing fingers at each other. Paranoia rules, is that your game?

    You had to do that didn't you :rolleyes: :P That's how I got started and now look where I am :)


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    #185
    MortgageMan
    Registered Users Posts: 126 ✭✭MortgageMan


    I am not going to even bother


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    #186
    Clash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 188 ✭✭Clash


    bunny shooter wrote: »
    You had to do that didn't you :rolleyes: :P That's how I got started and now look where I am :)

    Mmmmm we do have a habit of this alright. Usually with each other mind ;)


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    #187
    Clash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 188 ✭✭Clash


    MortgageMan wrote: »
    I am not going to even bother

    Of course not. Just pull the pin and run away with your fingers in your ears.

    La, la, la, la.....


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    #188
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    Clash wrote: »
    Mmmmm we do have a habit of this alright. Usually with each other mind ;)

    :confused: really ?


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    #189
    Clash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 188 ✭✭Clash


    bunny shooter wrote: »
    :confused: really ?

    Well it was a long time ago and I've got over it now. :p

    Found it :DHere


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    #190
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    Clash wrote: »
    Well it was a long time ago and I've got over it now. :p

    Found it :DHere

    Aw, the good old days :eek: :D

    Confession :( .............................................................

    Since found out one of my sources who supplied some of the info for that particular thread has a habit of talking sh**te :(


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    #191
    Mr Mole
    Closed Accounts Posts: 106 ✭✭Mr Mole


    I note that I have been termed "disgruntled" in a couple of posts. It is not really an apt verb to describe how I should feel over the way the whole handgun issue has been twisted beyond reason to achieve the simple aim of reducing the number of handguns within the state for nothing more than political gain and some personal gain.

    I have had the misfortune to see the inner workings of the political system close up for the past six months and especially over the weeks just prior to the bringing of the Act in question into law. I was horrified at the manner in which business was done.

    Some criticised me and others for pushing so hard on issues of concern, but we worked hard for ALL shooters, and not to the exclusion of any. This can be verified by the Motion that we got before the Fianna Fail Parliamentary Party for vote. Over twenty members of the F.F Party supported it openly, but the vote on the Bill in both Houses was lost on the party whip. In real terms, our lobbying was close to having the Bill defeated. The reason it passed, was as a result of blatant misinformation that was fed from various sources. These inaccuracies are shown in the Press Releases, Dail Committee transcripts, and in the minutes of the debates. I was present during Committee Stage, and also witnessed it first hand. Semmelweis Reflex was very apparent (look it up, its interesting).

    Not disgruntled, just disappointed, as all of you should be. It will be interesting to see if the thirty pieces of silver finds its way to anyone in the passage of time.

    On a personal note, I want to thank each and every one of the shooting community the members of various associations, media personnel, and of course the individual members of political parties who had the courage to represent us ALL in recent times.


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    #192
    BornToKill
    Registered Users Posts: 1,053 ✭✭✭BornToKill


    Mr Mole wrote: »
    reducing the number of hanbdguns within the state for nothing more than political gain and some personal gain.

    For nothing more than that? Political gain AND personal gain? How did it happen at all?


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    #193
    Mr Mole
    Closed Accounts Posts: 106 ✭✭Mr Mole


    The percieved political gain is quite apparent. Watch for the personal gain.


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    #194
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    Mr Mole wrote: »
    but we worked hard for ALL shooters, and not to the exclusion of any. This can be verified by the Motion that we got before the Fianna Fail Parliamentary Party for vote.
    Not that we aren't very grateful or anything, but who exactly died and made some unnamed individuals spokespersons for ALL shooters in this country?

    I don't remember being asked for my mandate or being apprised of the contents of this motion.

    Just curious.


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    #195
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    rrpc wrote: »
    Not that we aren't very grateful or anything, but who exactly died and made some unnamed individuals spokespersons for ALL shooters in this country?

    I don't remember being asked for my mandate or being apprised of the contents of this motion.

    Just curious.

    Now that is good ;)


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    #196
    Mr Mole
    Closed Accounts Posts: 106 ✭✭Mr Mole


    I will ignore Bunnys usual well thought out post, and answer RRPC's queries.

    Who made some unnamed individuals spokespersons for ALL shooters in this country?

    Shooters made us spokesmen for matters that concerned them.
    Shooters who were concerned that the FCP on which you have sat did not represent their concerns properly.
    Shoters that were being represented by people who never consulted with them or their Clubs.
    Shooters who were concerned that some represented only their own disciplines to the detriment of others.
    Shooters who felt that their firearms and sports were being sold down the river.
    Shooters who were proven right.

    We have seen the result of the "consultations" resulting in the content of CJA Misc Provisions Act 2009, and we will see more in the S.I's to be published on Monday.

    We will see even more when some parties see fit to supply their membership with copy of the submissions that have been supposedly made on their behalves to the DOJ&LR.

    Submissions that recommend banning of firearms with certain barrel lengths, submissions which seek to ensure that certain types of pistols (Glocks etc) will not be licenced in the future, submissions that outline how names will be supplied of persons who have taken part in their official shooting competitions in order to cull others.

    "Not that you aren't grateful" is a bit cynical. Its late in the day for comments like that.

    The motion was widely circulated, and had you signed the online petition, it would have been emailed to you. Obviously, you didnt sign the petition that was linked here on Boards.

    When is it wrong to have represented genuine decent peoples concerns? Instead of being cynical and critical, perhaps you could enlighten the membership of boards on the work of the FCP?

    I had a notably kind and positive response from you by email some time back, indeed it was one of two responses from FCP members who I wrote to so I am surprised at cynical your comments here.

    I hope this answer satisfies your curiosity.


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    #197
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    Mr Mole wrote: »
    Shooters made us spokesmen for matters that concerned them.
    Shooters who were concerned that the FCP on which you have sat did not represent their concerns properly.
    Shoters that were being represented by people who never consulted with them or their Clubs.
    Shooters who were concerned that some represented only their own disciplines to the detriment of others.
    Shooters who felt that their firearms and sports were being sold down the river.
    Shooters who were proven right.
    So not ALL shooters. I'm glad you cleared that up.
    We have seen the result of the "consultations" resulting in the content of CJA Misc Provisions Act 2009, and we will see more in the S.I's to be published on Monday.
    And we ALL stated that the CJA 2009 was unnescessary and yet the Minister went his own way. I'm on the record here and elsewhere as stating it. You said in your earlier post that the political process opened your eyes. My eyes were already opened and regardless of how good a reception we got with the opposition or the backbenchers (and quite honestly the arrogance of your assertion that you were effectively the only people making any running on this is quite breathtaking), the end result was that the whip was going to fall and the bill passed.

    We even got that stupid meaningless amendment by Charlie Flanagan on penalties for people who fail to report a missing firearm regardless of the fact that it is completely and utterly unenforcable.
    We will see even more when some parties see fit to supply their membership with copy of the submissions that have been supposedly made on their behalves to the DOJ&LR.

    Submissions that recommend banning of firearms with certain barrel lengths, submissions which seek to ensure that certain types of pistols (Glocks etc) will not be licenced in the future, submissions that outline how names will be supplied of persons who have taken part in their official shooting competitions in order to cull others.
    I think you're making this stuff up. How in the hell can any individual organisation 'ban' something that has already been effectively banned, or did you not read the CJA 2009 that you've complained of above?
    "Not that you aren't grateful" is a bit cynical. Its late in the day for comments like that.
    My cynicsm was directed at you purporting to represent me. That level of hubris deserves far greater exposure than available here on boards.
    The motion was widely circulated, and had you signed the online petition, it would have been emailed to you. Obviously, you didnt sign the petition that was linked here on Boards.
    I never saw a motion to the Fianna Fail Party here nor any link to support it. I don't doubt it was there, just that I never saw it. But you can clear that up with a simple link.
    When is it wrong to have represented genuine decent peoples concerns? Instead of being cynical and critical, perhaps you could enlighten the membership of boards on the work of the FCP?
    That information was posted on boards and on many websites. As for being a member of the FCP, I am not. I am merely the primary stand in for the NTSA representative. And before you mention it I allowed my name and email address to be attached to a report from the shooting organisations on the FCP to deal with queries arising from it.
    I had a notably kind and positive response from you by email some time back, indeed it was one of two responses from FCP members who I wrote to so I am surprised at cynical your comments here.
    My response to that email was not out of character, nor is my response to your post. I lose patience when people start hurling around unfounded accusations in all directions without a care for the damage they cause. Stating as fact that other shooting organisations were responsible for (a) the inception of the bill, (b) it's passing into law and (c) that they will somehow benefit from this is arrant nonsense.

    This bill is now law and we will have to deal with its consequences. Many of us have not given up the fight to reverse some of the more draconian measures contained within it, but that fight isn't helped by constant slandering of people who are doing this work in their own time and at some personal sacrifice.

    I'll conclude with much the same advice that I give to people with 'baby on board' notices in their back windscreens with regard to your advice to read up on Semmelweis Reflex: It might be better placed on your front windscreen.


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    #198
    Mr Mole
    Closed Accounts Posts: 106 ✭✭Mr Mole


    Thanks for the update. It is by far the most extensive update anyone has had from someone connected with the FCP and explains a lot. I never purported to represent you personally, no more than you have represented me. Nor would I wish you to, if possibly during any negotiation, you did a rant like you just posted.


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    #199
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    Mr Mole wrote: »
    I will ignore Bunnys usual well thought out post, and answer RRPC's queries.

    So I can presume you will ignore the following too :)
    Mr Mole wrote: »
    Who made some unnamed individuals spokespersons for ALL shooters in this country?

    Pot & kettle me thinks
    Mr Mole wrote: »
    Shooters made us spokesmen for matters that concerned them.
    Shooters who were concerned that the FCP on which you have sat did not represent their concerns properly.
    Shoters that were being represented by people who never consulted with them or their Clubs.
    Shooters who were concerned that some represented only their own disciplines to the detriment of others.
    Shooters who felt that their firearms and sports were being sold down the river.
    Shooters who were proven right.

    I am a shooter and I wasn't consulted or asked to submit my proposals and when I did on a thread here the Opening Post on that thread was deleted :rolleyes:
    Mr Mole wrote: »
    We have seen the result of the "consultations" resulting in the content of CJA Misc Provisions Act 2009, and we will see more in the S.I's to be published on Monday.

    TBH the minister just did what HE wanted as far as I can see :(
    Mr Mole wrote: »
    We will see even more when some parties see fit to supply their membership with copy of the submissions that have been supposedly made on their behalves to the DOJ&LR.

    Which NGO's/organisations are you referring to here?
    Mr Mole wrote: »
    Submissions that recommend banning of firearms with certain barrel lengths, submissions which seek to ensure that certain types of pistols (Glocks etc) will not be licenced in the future, submissions that outline how names will be supplied of persons who have taken part in their official shooting competitions in order to cull others.

    Proof please ?
    Mr Mole wrote: »
    The motion was widely circulated, and had you signed the online petition, it would have been emailed to you. Obviously, you didnt sign the petition that was linked here on Boards.

    That thread calling for support for a motion to the FF party was deleted nearly as soon as it was put up. There was no link to a motion or online petition from what I can remember. I remember posting on that thread that IMO it was misguided to further push for PP to be allowed in the light of the Ministers/DOJ's threat to ban ALL pistols if it were not stopped.

    I'm sure the mods can post the threads contents if you require.


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    #200
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    Mr Mole wrote: »
    Thanks for the update. It is by far the most extensive update anyone has had from someone connected with the FCP and explains a lot. I never purported to represent you personally, no more than you have represented me. Nor would I wish you to, if possibly during any negotiation, you did a rant like you just posted.
    :D:D
    I think I'll just echo bunny's post.

    Pot, kettle..:rolleyes:


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    #201
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    rrpc wrote: »
    I think I'll just echo bunny's post.

    Pot, kettle..:rolleyes:

    We will have to get a room :) :eek:


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    #202
    It wasn't me!
    Registered Users Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    bunny shooter wrote: »
    We will have to get a room :) :eek:

    Ah here, that level of enthusiasm is just creepy...


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    #203
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    It wasn't me! wrote: »
    Ah here, that level of enthusiasm is just creepy...

    :D

    Ya and the fact RRPC and I agree on something..............creepy & freeky all at the same time :pac:


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    #204
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    bunny shooter wrote: »
    :D

    Ya and the fact RRPC and I agree on something..............creepy & freeky all at the same time :pac:
    Yeah, well we've been around this barbecue a few times before ;)


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    #205
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    rrpc wrote: »
    Yeah, well we've been around this barbecue a few times before ;)

    True ;)


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    #206
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    bunny shooter wrote: »
    True ;)
    Anyway, what's the weather like down in Tipp?

    Pretty crap here in Wicklow.


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    #207
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    rrpc wrote: »
    Anyway, what's the weather like down in Tipp?

    Pretty crap here in Wicklow.

    Crap here too :(

    I presume my identity is known to you :) subtle as ever ;)


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    #208
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    bunny shooter wrote: »
    Crap here too :(

    I presume my identity is known to you :) subtle as ever ;)
    Fraid so, only one person shooting with a xxxxxx was a dead giveaway. Though I remember you saying you were in Tipp some time ago, so I could have bluffed :D


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    #209
    Sparks
    Registered Users Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    Wow, if I use this telescope, I can see the point from here...


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    #210
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    rrpc wrote: »
    Fraid so, only one person shooting with a 17 rem was a dead giveaway.

    Ya, it was :D
    rrpc wrote: »
    Though I remember you saying you were in Tipp some time ago,

    Among other things :D
    rrpc wrote: »
    so I could have bluffed :D

    Which wouldn't be your style ;)


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    #211
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    Sparks wrote: »
    Wow, if I use this telescope, I can see the point from here...
    Too subtle Sparks, it's late :confused:


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