DOE for campers

Billy Bunting

Before i done my conversion i bought a Talbot Autosleeper, didnt realise new owners needed to test / engineers report, i made the mistake of putting it into the DOE, it was wrecked by them and then given a fail.
No bloody way do i want them battering ****e out of another one. :mad:

:eek:

Karg

Apparantly the HGV is really tough on the vehicles, it's not necessary for vehicles that probably do less than 5k a year!! I don't think anyone is arguing a fair test - thats all we want!

Slidey

I dont think the HGV is really tough on vehicles. No more so than the LGV.

Infact I would probably be more leniant with a HGV then with some builder who lands in with a transit full of half eaten sambos and tea stains.

The only real difference between the 2 tests really is the fact that brakes are worked out on the presented weight in LGV and on the manufacturers DGVW in the HGV.

This in essence means that the HGV's get chained down to get them to the GVW where as the LGV gets its brake readings worked out from it weight on the day of the test.

Karg

Hi Slidey, the local DOE centre today that the HGV is far more rigourous on the vehicle suspensions/underworkings etc as designed to take up to and in excess of 20 tonnes - I wouldn't like to be subjecting something 4 -5 tonnes under that level of shaking!

Billy Bunting

My camper did 2500 miles last year, i don't want my kids in an unsafe vehicle, i would volutery test it, but it needs to be sympathetic to what the vehicle actually is and does, maybe its milage between test could be an indicator of the severity of a test. .

Slidey

Its relative really, as a tester you test vehicles on their design.

Yes, that plates can put a lot of pressure on the vehicle but using common sense is what is key. Most (I know there is thickos out there too) testers wont dog a lighter vehicle like you would a 7.5t axle on a tipper.

The sprinter that falls into the heavy category is virtually the same at the front as the lighter version and I have never come close to damaging one.

Slidey

Billy Bunting wrote: »

My camper did 2500 miles last year, i don't want my kids in an unsafe vehicle, i would volutery test it, but it needs to be sympathetic to what the vehicle actually is and does, maybe its milage between test could be an indicator of the severity of a test. .

Well I would normally take this into account and every year I get a cattle truck in that does less than that in the 12 months but you when you dont know a vehicle who is to say what mileage it is doing or if it has been clocked...

Karg

If all testers take that stance wouldn't be so bad...here's hoping

Karg

Billy Bunting wrote: »

My camper did 2500 miles last year, i don't want my kids in an unsafe vehicle, i would volutery test it, but it needs to be sympathetic to what the vehicle actually is and does, maybe its milage between test could be an indicator of the severity of a test. .

I think that would be satisfactory to everyone, I still can't get over that there has been nothing from officialdom about this though as I was saying earlier above

killalanerr

the more i think about this the less it stands up ,our camper vans are not comercial vehicles and should not be tested as one,this again doing it the irish way,

the DOE will have to quote the EU law this test comes from and not just send a directive,just cos the rsa make a directive does not make it a law ,their is a need for a lobby group to represent the motorhome people ,as has been asked what are the clubs saying on the matter

stapeler

I favour the introduction of some form of test to ensure the safety of vehicles. I'm sure there's MHs & Campers out there that would never pass a test.
Having had a look at the Light Commercial Vehicle Testers Manual on www.transport.ie I think it covers all the basics, I do feel however that the test should go further to ensure the safety of gas appliances and the electrical system (after all we have to have certified electrical and gas installations in our homes).
I think the Government/RSA has blundered the introduction of the test. There should have been some form of consultation with the manufacturers/clubs etc to determine best course to take.
As yet, I've not received any official notification that my MH needs testing, my tax is due for renewal in Feb so perhaps by then they may have notified me. Until I'm told officially that I need a test I won't be going out to book one.

I know of one club that plans to legally challenge this introduction, I feel a better action would be to sit with the RSA/Dept of Transport etc and reach a compromise on the test.

loobylou

A legal challenge will be utterly pointless. It's just a kneejerk reaction and will go nowhere. Whats wrong with campers being tested for safety? Why should we be treated more preferentially than anyone else on the road? When I bought my camper in Germany it had to have a valid TUV, ditto for UK and probably every other country in the EU.
The issue of DOE v NCT, Private v commercial, VRT etc. is also just a smokescreen. I would imagine the reason it is proposed to conduct the test at a DOE centre is that the NCT centres would not be properly equipped to test vehicles as large as motorhomes, regardless of their tax classification.

paddyb

i think most people dont have a problem with the test, its the lack of warning/information that is the issue.

dollydishmop

stapeler wrote: »

As yet, I've not received any official notification that my MH needs testing, my tax is due for renewal in Feb so perhaps by then they may have notified me. Until I'm told officially that I need a test I won't be going out to book one.

Agree wholeheartedly with this :thumbsup

For what its worth, I taxed my campervan today....this afternoon, in the local motor tax office, over the counter, dealing with a real live human being.

Wasn't asked for a DOE cert.;)

And when I made tentative enquiries (*after* she'd handed me my disc!) she didn't know what I was talking about, and neither did her supervisor.

So that should be another 12-months DOE-free motoring for me

zagmund

Gah, now you've alerted them . . .

It wasn't Nutgrove, was it ?

z

Aidan_M_M

We rang the SIMI last week , as a member for years .. And they didn't know what we were talking about in relation to the Motorhome DOE . Useless twats...
I agree in principle with a test , but I fear the DOE/NCT aren't "proper" tests for our Motorhomes . I'd be much more concerned with the Gas and 200v Electric's installation than the stamp on the Polycarbonate windows.. WE've been hammering the RSA every few days in work over the cock-eyed way they're going about this. At least they've relaxed their stance on Motorhomes over 3500kg needing Comercial Vehicle Reflective stickering...

About the only good thing that I can see coming is that all the dangerous vehicles will be taken off the road and either fixed or retired .. At least we'll get a better class of trade-in in the next few years..

One thing I will point out to all you Ducato owners...as a mechanic.. Check your Metal Brake Pipes , and Front Crossmembers , before you go to the DOE . On all Ducatos up to about 1997 , the pipes rot like you wouldn't believe.. and on the 94/95 to '02 Ducato , the front crossmember rots away also .

Karg

loobylou wrote: »

A legal challenge will be utterly pointless. It's just a kneejerk reaction and will go nowhere. Whats wrong with campers being tested for safety? Why should we be treated more preferentially than anyone else on the road? When I bought my camper in Germany it had to have a valid TUV, ditto for UK and probably every other country in the EU.
The issue of DOE v NCT, Private v commercial, VRT etc. is also just a smokescreen. I would imagine the reason it is proposed to conduct the test at a DOE centre is that the NCT centres would not be properly equipped to test vehicles as large as motorhomes, regardless of their tax classification.

Most people are not arguing a safety test, it is the fact that they have effectiviely made us drive illegal even though we have engineers report, tax and insurance without any official warning - people are only hearing about this on the grapevine

Slidey

Aidan_M_M wrote: »

One thing I will point out to all you Ducato owners...as a mechanic.. Check your Metal Brake Pipes , and Front Crossmembers , before you go to the DOE . On all Ducatos up to about 1997 , the pipes rot like you wouldn't believe.. and on the 94/95 to '02 Ducato , the front crossmember rots away also .

Also the top shock bearings are renowned for breaking up. You will hear a cracking or banging noise as you lock and they may start to drift to one side when driving if it is only one side.

Aidan_M_M

Slidey wrote: »

Also the top shock bearings are renowned for breaking up. You will hear a cracking or banging noise as you lock and they may start to drift to one side when driving if it is only one side.

Very true...It still amazes me the amount of hopeful trade-ins I test drive and the LHS one is completely shot! Or , like you said , with the thrust bearing seizing.



On another note.. where would one actually go to get a tachograph fitted to a newer Vehicle , like say a twin rear axle'd Ducato powered A-class?

Billy Bunting

That also goes for Citreon Relays, just done my nearside top bearing.

Slidey

Aidan_M_M wrote: »

Very true...It still amazes me the amount of hopeful trade-ins I test drive and the LHS one is completely shot! Or , like you said , with the thrust bearing seizing.



On another note.. where would one actually go to get a tachograph fitted to a newer Vehicle , like say a twin rear axle'd Ducato powered A-class?

Any HGV DOE centre I would imagine would be able to fit one.

They are not cheap and if it was registered after July '06 (AFAIR) it will need to a digital tacho that is fitted. You are lookin at 1000 minimum

Karg

Aidan_M_M wrote: »

We rang the SIMI last week , as a member for years .. And they didn't know what we were talking about in relation to the Motorhome DOE . Useless twats...
I agree in principle with a test , but I fear the DOE/NCT aren't "proper" tests for our Motorhomes . I'd be much more concerned with the Gas and 200v Electric's installation than the stamp on the Polycarbonate windows.. WE've been hammering the RSA every few days in work over the cock-eyed way they're going about this. At least they've relaxed their stance on Motorhomes over 3500kg needing Comercial Vehicle Reflective stickering...

About the only good thing that I can see coming is that all the dangerous vehicles will be taken off the road and either fixed or retired .. At least we'll get a better class of trade-in in the next few years..

One thing I will point out to all you Ducato owners...as a mechanic.. Check your Metal Brake Pipes , and Front Crossmembers , before you go to the DOE . On all Ducatos up to about 1997 , the pipes rot like you wouldn't believe.. and on the 94/95 to '02 Ducato , the front crossmember rots away also .

Couldn't agree more with the gas/electrics part - the test is necessary to get the wrecks off the road, but it needs to be fair and proportionate to the type of vehicle...and as per my first post, they've known about this for nearly five years - should've warned us!!!!!

loobylou

Karg wrote: »

Most people are not arguing a safety test

Most here are not, but my post referred to the threatened legal challenge from one of the motorhome clubs. In their view it's even a reason to vote against the Lisbon Treaty. Let's all keep a sense of proportion on this.

Karg

Hi there - I know we have to keep a sense of proportion but I know plenty of camper/motorhome owners that would have appreciated the opportunity of having been warned in the last four years. From the legal standpoint, can this be enforced to the letter of the law if there, still to date has been no official notification of this? Do you remember when the NCT came out first, there was endless warning about it.

Karg

paddyb wrote: »

you wont need a cert if the windows are glass (only non-glass):


Non-glass glazing: The owner / presenter of the vehicle must produce a certificate or documentation from
the manufacturer or glazing installer stating that the glazing material is not likely, if fractured, to produce
fragments capable of causing severe cuts. A copy (not the original) of such documentation should be
retained by the test centre.

Hi Paddy, our local DOE centre says that unless the glass (real glass or plastic) is safety stamped between the two layers with specific marks (see the HGV DOE user manual on RSA website) that it will not pass unless you can produce a certificate from the manufacturer. I know people who bought proper non glass camper windows from a camper accessories supplier, they are marked with a sticker and they have been told this is not sufficient. These are legit camper windows and they still won't pass them, its maddening!

loobylou

Nothing (much) has changed. As far as I understand, this has been in effect since 2004 but nobody has paid a blind bit of notice to it.
As I have posted before, commercial vehicles must have a DOE in order to get roadtax disc. Ergo, to the Guards, a current tax and insurance disc displayed are all that are legally necessary. There is NO requirement to display anything else.
You do NOT require a DOE cert to tax a campervan. Therefore,
if stopped, once you have a valid tax and insurance disc displayed you are within the law.
I accept that it is not altogether as simple as that according to the regulations but this has been the way it has been for the last number of years and nothing has changed overnight.
Anybody driving a camper with valid tax and insurance has nothing to fear!

Karg

somewhere on the attorney general website it says that there are penalty points for non display of the DOE, I'll try find the link again and post it. While what you are saying about the 2004 thing is true (link on my first post). It was not applicable to campers until the RSA came along and said that campers are to be classed as goods vehicle in their circular dated 21st July. So this really is new to most camper owners.

Karg

mickwor1111 wrote: »

http://www.attorneygeneral.ie/esi/2009/B26834.pdf

doesn't list the amount of points but as per this persons earlier post...

paddyb

i know someone whoes camper passed the doe today. Test centre had never heard of getting campers tested but did it anyway.
It has plastic windows and nothing was mentioned.

blue42

mickwor1111 wrote: »

its true , all motorhomes need to have a DOE , traffic corps in Limerick are enforcing it big time

I would have tought the cops in limerick would have more to worry about than campervans!!

Billy Bunting

paddyb wrote: »

i know someone whoes camper passed the doe today. Test centre had never heard of getting campers tested but did it anyway.
It has plastic windows and nothing was mentioned.

I have tried 3 DOE centres for a test, all have told me they dont test campers, i enquired with the local licencing authority and was told that there is no catogory for campers and if i wanted to test it i would need to take it back to a van, he also said that all campers are taxed as private vehicles for pleasure purposes, how can a commercial vehicle be classed as a private vehicles for pleasure purposes. :rolleyes:

:eek:

Macspower

Back to the local DOE centre today and they said they definately won't be testing campers as they know nothing about them...

I'll wait and see how it pans out in due course..

I too agree with some form of testing but it has to be relative to use... every year is too much and the cost also need to be relevant

while on the subject of Ducatos my leaf spring bushings are creaking... when I spray them with WD40 they stop for abouyt a day... when i greased them with spray grease I thought that was it but it lasts about 3 days.. Do I need to replace them or are thye just "dry"?

Karg

Macspower wrote: »

Back to the local DOE centre today and they said they definately won't be testing campers as they know nothing about them...

I'll wait and see how it pans out in due course..

I too agree with some form of testing but it has to be relative to use... every year is too much and the cost also need to be relevant

while on the subject of Ducatos my leaf spring bushings are creaking... when I spray them with WD40 they stop for abouyt a day... when i greased them with spray grease I thought that was it but it lasts about 3 days.. Do I need to replace them or are thye just "dry"?

Probably just dry - soapy water just as good!

zagmund

Last time I checked the government didn't need to tell everyone about every law (other than, you know, enacting it and stuff), so I wouldn't be relying on the "but they never told me, yer onor" line in court. They don't have to . . .

Having said that, I still plan on not worrying about it until I get stopped or it really, really does get clarified somewhere.

Aidan/Slidey - any chance of a photo of a cross-member for the less technically aware among us ? That way I can check if mine is rotting or not. I got the van serviced a while back and I'm pretty sure they said something about the brake pipes rotting away (which they fixed) so I'm good on that front.

It was a bit scary at the time hearing that the brake pipes were rotting. I had images of driving down the M50 or something with brake fluid pumping out, in a panic, like in the movies . . .

I can't imagine the cross-member rotting being much better. I have images of the engine falling through the floor now or the van losing stability and one side falling off as I tootle down the M50, assuming the cross-member is something that holds the engine in/sides together.

z

Aidan_M_M

zagmund wrote: »

Aidan/Slidey - any chance of a photo of a cross-member for the less technically aware among us ? That way I can check if mine is rotting or not. assuming the cross-member is something that holds the engine in/sides together.

z

Don't have a pic... but if you find your front tow-hook , its welded to the crossmember . Right behind the bottom of your plastic bumper . Generally its a black pressed steel item , it doesn't locate the engine , instead it ties the two chassis legs together at the front . It also supports the Radiators. Held on with 3 long bolts , either side , you'll need an 18mm socket to open them .

mickwor1111

I got my 97 Hymer doe'ed Friday in Limerick , €100 for test , €120 for weight plate €30 to get it weighed , it costs €120 for them to put on the side and rear reflective strips so I bought the strips myself and a little extra for €120 and put them on myself ,if anyone wants to buy strips of me ofr the camper feel free to mail me ( €50 for the 2 sides and back and if u r around clare area call in and i will put it on 4 u even ( rather than give them €120 to supply and fit ) , and also once u finish the doe and pass it they give u a cert which still is not the finished product .... u have to bring it to tax office and exchange it for a certicicate of roadworthiness which will cost u €20 to buy , .....thank god we live in a country that traet their people justly

Macspower

mickwor1111 wrote: »

I got my 97 Hymer doe'ed Friday in Limerick , €100 for test , €120 for weight plate €30 to get it weighed , it costs €120 for them to put on the side and rear reflective strips so I bought the strips myself and a little extra for €120 and put them on myself ,if anyone wants to buy strips of me ofr the camper feel free to mail me ( €50 for the 2 sides and back and if u r around clare area call in and i will put it on 4 u even ( rather than give them €120 to supply and fit ) , and also once u finish the doe and pass it they give u a cert which still is not the finished product .... u have to bring it to tax office and exchange it for a certicicate of roadworthiness which will cost u €20 to buy , .....thank god we live in a country that traet their people justly

Limerick seems to be the spot for the DOE's

Let me ask you... why did you go for the DOE? were you asked to go? Or did you decide to do it yourself...

I'm all on for some sort of test but a yearly DOE is not the answer IMO.. After some of the efforts at campers I've seen this weekend a test is necessary to get these off the road or safe!

mickwor1111

Macspower wrote: »

Limerick seems to be the spot for the DOE's

Let me ask you... why did you go for the DOE? were you asked to go? Or did you decide to do it yourself...

I'm all on for some sort of test but a yearly DOE is not the answer IMO.. After some of the efforts at campers I've seen this weekend a test is necessary to get these off the road or safe!

Because a friend of mine got stopped and was told if he did not produce this cert he would get fined and points , its fine sying not to do it but unfortunately the legislation is there (albeit noone but the limerick gardai knows about it ) and until they change this law you will get done for it , but i agree totally about the annual DOE , thats fine for trucks doin 50,000 miles a year but a motorhome that will possibly do 3000 or 4000 its rediculous

mickwor1111

blue42 wrote: »

I would have tought the cops in limerick would have more to worry about than campervans!!

lol i kno feck sake , maybe we should start an outlaw motorcaravan club !!! THE HELLS CAMPERS !!!!!

Slidey

Just got an e-mail from the RSA.

Side markings, for the moment, do not have to be fitted to campers over 3.5t

peasant

Is it just me or is this whole affair just another example of a typical Irish farcical mess?

Let's make it up as we go along and tell no-one about it ....

I'm all for testing of campers, after all it's in our own interest, but not like this.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm going to wait until someone official (i.e. the motor tax people) tells me in writing that I have to get my camper tested.

*Kol*

+1

I have absolutely no intention of getting that test done. It's like a chinese whisper at the moment.

Malta1

Like the majority on here, from a safety stand point I have no problem getting the van tested. I do have a problem with the test criteria and how the story seems to be evolving.

I wont be getting my van tested until I am told to

Macspower

I have just written a mail to bill at the RSA outlining my views on the test..

My understanding of the situation is as follows

No one seems to have a problem with a test.
Just the test needs to be fair and designed to make sure the vehicle is safe for the purpose it was intended for... ie Leisure Vehicle with low mileage

How do we suggest getting such a test designed/agreed with the RSA?

It does seem they are willing to listen a little (re markings for example) so where to from here...

A legal challenge against a test is not a viable option however an action group with a properly constructed committee might be an option... A spokesperson to meet with the RSA and discuss the matter

We are very much a minority group but should still make our opinions known to the RSA or whoever is dealing with it...

Any opinions?

spaceHopper

This will be fun going in to tax my camper for the first time, won’t get a vehicle licensing cert till I tax it and bet I can’t DOE it till I have the cert. But I bet it will be fine as I don’t need a DOE to tax it ;-)

Karg

Macspower wrote: »

I have just written a mail to bill at the RSA outlining my views on the test..

My understanding of the situation is as follows

No one seems to have a problem with a test.
Just the test needs to be fair and designed to make sure the vehicle is safe for the purpose it was intended for... ie Leisure Vehicle with low mileage

How do we suggest getting such a test designed/agreed with the RSA?

It does seem they are willing to listen a little (re markings for example) so where to from here...

A legal challenge against a test is not a viable option however an action group with a properly constructed committee might be an option... A spokesperson to meet with the RSA and discuss the matter

We are very much a minority group but should still make our opinions known to the RSA or whoever is dealing with it...

Any opinions?

Definitely think something should be done - anyone got any further word from the camper club(s)? Wexford VTN centre now advertising on South East Radio that they are testing campers!

roryq

My father's Iveco F10 has failed the DOE test in Kilkenny.. They failed him on the windows.. As there were plastic and he did not have windows cert. The problem is I've spent the last 3 days looking to try and find the window makers but the have gone out of business See Thru plastics is the company and they are a contora window.. Is there anyway around this does anyone know. Can you get them inspected by someone and certified.

Macspower

Well speedy response from the RSA... It seems all is not written in stone as yet

Even though it was a private mail in response to my letter I think it is in the public interest.. ( if deemded inappropriate mods please delete)

My letter

Sent: 04 August 2009 12:05

Subject: Testing of Motorhomes and campers


Hi

Regarding the new proposed regulations about the testing of Motorhomes
and Campers.

Just to fill you in on the matter. I am a camper van owner now for
nearly 10 years and also recentyl purchased a motorhome and
I am well aware of the need for testing of all vehicles on the road but can I please bring a few matters to your attention..

Firstly as stated I am all on for testing as I personally know of some
campers and in particular conversions that should not be on the road.
But and it is a big BUT the test needs to be suitable for the purpose it
is intended... To make for safer motoring.


A DOE test for a camper with all the regulations of a Commercial Vehicle
is not a fair test for a motorhome.. It is not a commercial vehicle and
therefore should not and cannot be tested as one. These are leisure
vehicles and while some may have many similarities to commercial
vehicles they are a seperate category in their own right.... Leisure
Vehicles

In my opinion the following should be taken on board while designing a
test for these vehicles

1) The test can be carried out through the VTN as proposed

2) Due to the mileage ( I do on average 2000/3000 miles per year) an
annual test should not be required but instead one proportional to the
use... Every 2 years like the NCT or 3 years would be more appropriate.

Once every vehicle is tested once and it is deemed as roadworthy very
little is going to change in a year

3) For vehicles over 3.5 tonne (many are just over this) do you propose
that need to be treated like a commercial with a tacho and side marking
and weight plate, speed limiter etc?? Due to the purpose of the vehicle
I believe this is not necessary and completely complicates the situation
and the purpose of the test which is to have safe vehilces on our roads

4) On speaking to my local DOE centre they inform me thay a certificate
of some sort is required for the window glass.. In my vehicle the
windows are stamped by the manufacturer and are made from some sort of
double glazed perspex. While I understand the need to make sure that the
windows are safe a cert is not the answer in my opinion.. I have seen
some conversions with ordinary "house" window glass and this should be
outlawed... Why not leave it to the test centre to determine if the
windows are safe or not?

5) Is there a proposal for some sort of inspection of the gas and
wiring? This is every bit as important for safety as the rest of the
test and to overlook it would be contrary to the purpose of the test...
ie SAFETY



In Summary... The test needs to be designed for the purpose which it is
intended... To keep unsafe vehicles off our raods.. Campers/Motorhomes
are not commercial vehicles and should not be tested as one but instead
have a custom test designed for the purpose and frequency to fair to the
use.. every 2/3 years.... If every 2 years is good enough for a car
doing 50k per year every 2 years should be good enough for a leisure
vehicle..


While we are a minority group and whatever you decide we will have to
live with all I ask for is a FAIR test for my vehicle designed for the
purpose and use it was intended for.

Kind regards,




response from RSA




Thank you for your submission and views. The RSA will be conducting a review of the testing regime for motor caravans and we shall include in the discussion the issues you have mentioned.

Briefly, the RSA is considering these vehicles as goods vehicles for testing purposes only. A goods vehicle does not mean a commercial vehicle.

The legislation for tachograph use provides for exemptions including one for "vehicles or combinations of vehicles with a maximum permissible mass not exceeding 7.5 tonnes used for the non-commercial carriage of goods." I believe most owners who might otherwise be liable for a tachograph can legitimately claim this exemption. Each VTN centre has copies of the form to be signed prior to the test.

The RSA has already issued a circular to the test centres providing a temporary exemption (pending the review) from the requirement for conspicuity markings.

Non-glass glazing must be to an automotive standard; therefore, if the material is marked as such (e.g. E-marked 43R signifying type approval to UNECE Regulation 43 for automotive glazing) it will not require further documentation. The burden of proof is on the owner to show that that the glazing meets automotive standards for the reason you mentioned. It is not the responsibility of the test centre to investigate the source and quality of the glazing.

Again, thank you for your views. They will be considered and discussed during the upcoming review of testing motor caravans.

Regards,

XXX

Engineer

Standards & Enforcement





RSA_Official



Clonfert House, Loughrea , Co Galway

Aidan_M_M

there are between 9500 and 10,000 motorhomes registered in Ireland... So we deserve to be heard! In fairness to the RSA , they are good to reply , we've spoken to them a few times already .

zagmund

Umm, there's a loophole (a huge one in my view) in the 'glass' certificate thingie.

What's to stop me getting a certificate for a window and submitting it to the test centre saying it represents the one in my vehicle, when in fact it represents the one in someone elses vehicle, or a scrapped vehicle, or one in the UK or something ?

Also, I know it says the original must be stored by the test centre but that just ain't going to work. What happens if I get my vehicle tested in Smiths Garage and the next day they go on fire and my cert is lost forever ? Or they spill a pot of tea over it, whatever . . .

Will I not be able to get my vehicle DOE'd next year because I can't stump up the cert ? What if Smiths Garage closes down and someone dumps the pile of old certs they found mouldering in the corner ?

z