Harney refuses to rule out cuts in minimum wage

Run_to_da_hills

Harney refuses to rule out cuts in minimum wage. The Minister for Health has refused to rule out a reduction in the minimum wage.

Mary Harney said that that for Ireland to remain competitive in spite of current economic difficulties, every option must remain on the table.

Ms Harney was speaking following comments by economist Peter Bacon, who said downward adjustments of the minimum wage could not be avoided.

Minister Harney, who introduced the national minimum wage when she was Tánaiste in 2000, said nothing can be ruled out.

"Clearly, we have to remain competitive in Ireland," the minister said.

"The minimum wage is the base wage in this country. If, for example, we're going to contemplate cutting social welfare payments in the context of the very serious budgetary situation we find ourselves in, then I think everything has to be examined quite honestly.

"Given the economic challenges that this country faces, everything has to be on the table."

http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/ireland/harney-refuses-to-rule-out-cuts-in-minimum-wage-419455.html

If the Minimum wage is dropped too much people might think they would be better off signing on.

Mr Benevolent

Ah the ignore list. Makes life so much easier.

AckwelFoley

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Mary Harney is about to axe the min wage...
Harney refuses to rule out cuts in minimum wage.]

You are almost as good as Newstalk for misquotes.

Run_to_da_hills

snyper wrote: »

You are almost as good as Newstalk for misquotes.

Edited

jumpguy

Yerr, abit of hyperbole going on here. If this was to be done, it'd have to be intelligent. We must make our country attractive to foreign investors by offering them lower operating costs. Basically, deflation is good in the long term.

Run_to_da_hills

jumpguy wrote: »

Yerr, abit of hyperbole going on here. If this was to be done, it'd have to be intelligent. We must make our country attractive to foreign investors by offering them lower operating costs. Basically, deflation is good in the long term.

They would also have to drop the dole rate to make the gap less attractive.

TheZohanS

They'll screw this up too.

There is no point cutting minimum wage unless you cut social welfare. They should drastically cut social welfare for the longterm unemployed.

Leave the benefits of those that have lost their jobs in the last 18 months alone.

AckwelFoley

Bottom line is...

if there were no minimum wage, people have the choice to work or not.

If it becomes a case where its better for someone to sit on their arse and draw the dole rather than work for 300 quid a week, well then the government are going to have to have a rethink of the social welfare rates.

Min wage in this country is rather high.. but so is the cost of living. However the cost of living is dropping slowly perhaps the min wage and social welfare rates should reflect that, as they did when inflation increased.

NewApproach

If they cut the minimum wage, and I think they should, they will need to cut social welfare in a greater ratio, say 2:1 imo.

Run_to_da_hills

The alternative is to get people on the dole off their ass and working and have that as the minimum wage.

easyeason3

TheZohan wrote: »

They'll screw this up too.

There is no point cutting minimum wage unless you cut social welfare. They should drastically cut social welfare for the longterm unemployed.

Leave the benefits of those that have lost their jobs in the last 18 months alone.

Ah yes, but if you do that then Johnny-I've -never-had-a-job-&-I'm-proud-of-it will start complaining that he couldn't work due to 'back problems' so why should he be left wanting?

Then you will also have the teenage mothers who make a career out of getting benefits wailing that the poor babby hasn't enough food to eat & isn't dressed in the latest Nike tracksuit.

And then you will have the usual do gooders wading in to defend the 'vunerable' in our society & calling it all a disgrace.

swingking

Harney has an alter ego for doing this.

If she cuts minimum wage, then she knows that the fast-food restaurants won't have as much expenses and they will be able to remain in business, meaning Harney is not gonna miss out on her Burger and chips

Sir Molle

Can't wait to see what the minimum wage for retail is going to be if they drop the national minimum wage. Currently it's at 7.14 or something. Don't know how they expect people to live on that.

AckwelFoley

easyeason3 wrote: »

Ah yes, but if you do that then Johnny-I've -never-had-a-job-&-I'm-proud-of-it will start complaining that he couldn't work due to 'back problems' so why should he be left wanting?

Then you will also have the teenage mothers who make a career out of getting benefits wailing that the poor babby hasn't enough food to eat & isn't dressed in the latest Nike tracksuit.

And then you will have the usual do gooders wading in to defend the 'vunerable' in our society & calling it all a disgrace.

apparently, an unemployed husband and wife with 3 kids are entitled to, if claiming all benefits and allowances 42K per yer.

sweet deal

thelordofcheese

easyeason3 wrote: »

Ah yes, but if you do that then Johnny-I've -never-had-a-job-&-I'm-proud-of-it will start complaining that he couldn't work due to 'back problems' so why should he be left wanting?

Then you will also have the teenage mothers who make a career out of getting benefits wailing that the poor babby hasn't enough food to eat & isn't dressed in the latest Nike tracksuit.

And then you will have the usual do gooders wading in to defend the 'vunerable' in our society & calling it all a disgrace.

That's because straight cuts across the board would be fucking retarded and would be a disgrace if not done correctly.

Apparantly basic maths and the ability to apply critical thinking to a situation makes one a "do gooder".

easyeason3

snyper wrote: »

apparently, an unemployed husband and wife with 3 kids are entitled to, if claiming all benefits and allowances 42K per yer.

sweet deal

Just got to find me a husband & three kids so & I'm rolling in it...

Kess73

I'm surprised that the joke that is Harney was even able to take her snout from the trough for long enough to make any comments.

easyeason3

thelordofcheese wrote: »

That's because straight cuts across the board would be fucking retarded and would be a disgrace if not done correctly.

Apparantly basic maths and the ability to apply critical thinking to a situation makes one a "do gooder".

Down off your high horse there Cheese & cop on a bit.

thelordofcheese

easyeason3 wrote: »

Down off your high horse there Cheese & cop on a bit.

I'd suggest you'd take your own advice, but i know i'd be wasting my time.

TheZohanS

thelordofcheese wrote: »

I'd suggest you'd take your own advice, but i know i'd be wasting my time.

I'd actually like to hear your view on this, might not agree with it but would like to hear it.

easyeason3

thelordofcheese wrote: »

I'd suggest you'd take your own advice, but i know i'd be wasting my time.

Maturity at it's best.

thelordofcheese

TheZohan wrote: »

I'd actually like to hear your view on this, might not agree with it but would like to hear it.

This will probably be long....

My point is that "long term unemployed" are a great beating stick for people, as they're usually painted as pasasites on society.

Like all stereotypes it has some element of truth, i'm not going to say that there are no long term unemployed who are not scrounging would be in denial of basic human nature.

However, simply going "cut all long term unemployed dole" is wrong for two reasons

firstly, it's a punitive measure against the people who are scrounging that affect those who are genuine. For every long term unemployed who is faking, you have people who have been rendered incapable of working through no fault of their own.

Secondly - an this is kind of an aside, but still. Single mothers. Once again, there are those that view the dole as a viable career, lord knows i've talked to people who do, but once again, we are talking about punitive measures against that minority that will hurt everyone, and that would include the children. (yes, i realise i'm skirting the edge of "think of the child-huur-en!", let me counter by saying i hate the little bastards)

Now, this leaves us with a problem, you can't cut the rates without screwing over genuine cases, but you can't leave them be as it can be taken advantage of.

A possible solution that i think would be the least awful would be to first move to a system that is closer to the english one. For those that don't know the base jobseekers is something like 220 a month. however on top of that you can claim seperatly for rent, travel to and from interviews etc etc.
This system, in theory, allows for you to claim what you need, and for the DSS to in turn means test what you claim more effectively.

This system would also apply to long term unemployed, who would have to be able to support the claim of being long term unemployed to maintain that status, but they'd be still get the base money (plus whatever else they claim for).

The downside of this is it would create more beaurocracy, dealing with the DSS can try the patience of a saint, and i won't pretend that it would solve everything, any system is capable of being exploited, but overall i think it would strike the balance of protecting the weakest in society and reducing fraud.

TheInquisitor

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Harney refuses to rule out cuts in minimum wage. The Minister for Health has refused to rule out a reduction in the minimum wage.

Mary Harney said that that for Ireland to remain competitive in spite of current economic difficulties, every option must remain on the table.

Ms Harney was speaking following comments by economist Peter Bacon, who said downward adjustments of the minimum wage could not be avoided.

Minister Harney, who introduced the national minimum wage when she was Tánaiste in 2000, said nothing can be ruled out.

"Clearly, we have to remain competitive in Ireland," the minister said.

"The minimum wage is the base wage in this country. If, for example, we're going to contemplate cutting social welfare payments in the context of the very serious budgetary situation we find ourselves in, then I think everything has to be examined quite honestly.

"Given the economic challenges that this country faces, everything has to be on the table."

http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/ireland/harney-refuses-to-rule-out-cuts-in-minimum-wage-419455.html

If the Minimum wage is dropped too much people might think they would be better off signing on.

Your dead right man, i agree with you fully, when we correctly drop by minimum wage by 2 euro we should also cut the social welfare benefits by 25% to 50% minimum. Like everything they have become way too bloated, and they need to be sharply cut!

stepbar

No need to cut the minimum wage....... reduce the tax bands so that they pay more tax. AFAIK, someone on the mimimum wage only pays the income levy.

ejmaztec

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Harney refuses to rule out cuts in minimum wage. The Minister for Health has refused to rule out a reduction in the minimum wage.

Mary Harney said that that for Ireland to remain competitive in spite of current economic difficulties, every option must remain on the table.

Ms Harney was speaking following comments by economist Peter Bacon, who said downward adjustments of the minimum wage could not be avoided.

Minister Harney, who introduced the national minimum wage when she was Tánaiste in 2000, said nothing can be ruled out.

"Clearly, we have to remain competitive in Ireland," the minister said.

"The minimum wage is the base wage in this country. If, for example, we're going to contemplate cutting social welfare payments in the context of the very serious budgetary situation we find ourselves in, then I think everything has to be examined quite honestly.

"Given the economic challenges that this country faces, everything has to be on the table."

http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/ireland/harney-refuses-to-rule-out-cuts-in-minimum-wage-419455.html

If the Minimum wage is dropped too much people might think they would be better off signing on.

Surely you have to be competitive to remain competitive.

The_Minister

swingking wrote: »

Harney has an alter ego for doing this.

If she cuts minimum wage, then she knows that the fast-food restaurants won't have as much expenses and they will be able to remain in business, meaning Harney is not gonna miss out on her Burger and chips

That's not what alter ego means.

I think you mean to say that she has an ulterior motive.

And when are the Harney jokes going to stop?
Yes she is a woman, and yes she is fat, and she refuses to sit in a corner and make way for someone prettier, but the crap jokes are getting sooooo boring.

stepbar wrote: »

No need to cut the minimum wage....... reduce the tax bands so that they pay more tax. AFAIK, someone on the mimimum wage only pays the income levy.

The reason for cutting the minimum wage is o create more jobs not bring in more money.

OwenM

stepbar wrote: »

No need to cut the minimum wage....... reduce the tax bands so that they pay more tax. AFAIK, someone on the mimimum wage only pays the income levy.

The motivation to cut minimum wage is to reduce employers bills, not put less money in minimum wage employees pockets, although that's a ridiculously obvious side effect.

thelordofcheese

The_Minister wrote: »

And when are the Harney jokes going to stop?
Yes she is a woman, and yes she is fat, and she refuses to sit in a corner and make way for someone prettier, but the crap jokes are getting sooooo boring.

Limed for truth

Rented Mule

That's the way to turn this economy around.

More people making less money, paying less taxes and in turn having less money to spend.

We should have this ship turned around (and back to the 80s) in no time at all.

Sephiroth_dude

She should be on minimum wage herself :pac:

galwayrush

I think TD's / minister's(and the rest of them in the Dail ) minimum wage is grossly excessive.

phantom_lord

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

If the Minimum wage is dropped too much people might think they would be better off signing on.

just cut benefits too. ireland needs a deflationary cycle to become more competitive.

Run_to_da_hills

phantom_lord wrote: »

just cut benefits too. ireland needs a deflationary cycle to become more competitive.

With the CPI falling 2.6 per cent this year I would say it is only a mtter of time.

phantom_lord

so whats your problem with wage cuts then?

Run_to_da_hills

phantom_lord wrote: »

so whats your problem with wage cuts then?

They can't be minimum wage cuts unless there is a proportional cut in social welfare benefits.

phantom_lord

isn't it practically a given that there will be cuts in social welfare?