DART+ (DART Expansion)

cgcsb

Schadenfreudia wrote: »

If they give the go-ahead for DU I'll vote for the Coalition :eek:

Up to now I was looking forward to seeing them butchered at the next election.

Me too

Sam Russell

If they gave the go ahead for most of these big projects, they will not impact the budget sums for a few years. DU could not start for at least 18 months even if it was announced now, so safely past next years outcome and safely past the next election.

Ren2k7

annfield1978 wrote: »

The NTA are compiling a report entitled the Fingal/ North Dublin Transport Study which looks at a number of transport options (Heavy Rail/ Light Rail/ BRT to serve Dublin Airport and the commuter suburb of Swords., Co Dublin). These options have been put forward by the RPA/ NTA and Irish Rail.

Phase 1 of the report was published in November last year

https://www.nationaltransport.ie/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Appraisal_Report_19112014_final.pdf

The finalised version is due to be published shortly and following this recommendations will be made to Government on how to proceed. The rumour is that a light rail option (LR3) put forward by the RPA is the preferred option.

A bloody joke.

Idbatterim

A bloody joke

I just read up on the light rail options again! They are worse than a joke! I think the MN revised option isnt bad, but do not for the sake of €79.000.000 i.e. nothing, reduce the platform length from ninety something meters down to 60m! Its insane!

jd

D.L.R. wrote: »

Here'e the excerpt from Newstalk. The context is the current govt conference at Lissadell House in Sligo.

"So they're going up to Lissadell to talk about tunnelling Dublin, to talk about the Dart Underground, and whether or not that project is dead or whether or not that should be a big announcement of this government. Also connecting Dublin Airport - our main airport, our capital city, and no train line. This is also going to come up today."

So we're finally going to hear something today, one way or another.

Not a squeak out of Paschal about anything..?

Sam Russell

jd wrote: »

Not a squeak out of Paschal about anything..?

... and he does squeak.:)

cgcsb

So transport didn't get a foot in yesterday in Sligo?

monument

Schadenfreudia wrote: »

When is that Facebook page going live?

It's live at https://facebook.com/BuildDartUnderground

D.L.R.

jd wrote: »

Not a squeak out of Paschal about anything..?

Who knows. They're so damn coy about these projects. They've been prevaricating for 5 years, whats another few days or weeks.

Whatever they announce, it'll be in the context of an election manifesto at this stage. Nothing will be "green lit" under this govt.

cgcsb

DARTu as part of an election manifesto would indeed make things interesting. Even if the decision to make DARTu happen was made now, it'll be some months before work can actually begin anyway.

Grandeeod

jd wrote: »

Not a squeak out of Paschal about anything..?

He wasn't even at Lissadell House yesterday.

Grandeeod

cgcsb wrote: »

DARTu as part of an election manifesto would indeed make things interesting. Even if the decision to make DARTu happen was made now, it'll be some months before work can actually begin anyway.

There are no votes in transport projects. Just look back on the celtic tiger days. Dublin was at gridlock levels. Transport made the media, but on the doorsteps it was tax decreases and social welfare increases that delivered the vote. While people in Dublin in particular went on ad nauseum about traffic problems, only a small group actually tried to make it an election issue. The Greens, when in Government were an outright disaster and simply capitulated under FF.

murphaph

There's no political pressure to build any major infrastructure in Ireland. I'm amazed the motorway network was built at all actually.

Banjoxed

murphaph wrote: »

There's no political pressure to build any major infrastructure in Ireland. I'm amazed the motorway network was built at all actually.

I'm not!

Think of all those happy people who benefitted from boosts to land value.

Ren2k7

murphaph wrote: »

There's no political pressure to build any major infrastructure in Ireland. I'm amazed the motorway network was built at all actually.

That's because this country is populated by terminal whingers and me feiners who will bleat on endlessly about the cost of big ticket infrastructure projects.

"But sure, why does Dublin even need so many motorways fer feck sake? Where's MY fooking dual carriageway?"

Schadenfreudia

Ren2k7 wrote: »

That's because this country is populated by terminal whingers and me feiners who will bleat on endlessly about the cost of big ticket infrastructure projects.

"But sure, why does Dublin even need so many motorways fer feck sake? Where's MY fooking dual carriageway?"

But let's be clear the "whingers and me feiners" are probably even more common in the Greater D4 Area than in the rainy rural realms

Idbatterim

That's because this country is populated by terminal whingers and me feiners who will bleat on endlessly about the cost of big ticket infrastructure projects.

"But sure, why does Dublin even need so many motorways fer feck sake? Where's MY fooking dual carriageway?"

I get the case, that this may be the opinion of some outside Dublin. But at some point, I think you have to have some tiny degree of faith in politicians to actually do what is right. Most people at the door, will have a laughable understanding on most issues...

there is far too much, give the people what they want here, rather than what they need!

namloc1980

So is it likely at this point that the DU is going to be shelved indefinitely? Doesn't seem to be too many positive noises about it going ahead.

Irish Steve

Idbatterim wrote: »

I get the case, that this may be the opinion of some outside Dublin. But at some point, I think you have to have some tiny degree of faith in politicians to actually do what is right. Most people at the door, will have a laughable understanding on most issues...

there is far too much, give the people what they want here, rather than what they need!

Faith in politicians? You have to be joking, the ONLY thing that's been very evident over a long period of time is that politicians look after their own interest, and anything else that happens is a coincidence. Nothing that is going to happen beyond the next election is important, as is only too clear from all the positioning and posturing that's going on now in preparation for the next general election.

If I look at how the "political system" works, there is no way that it is fit for purpose any more. There is no way to move non performing civil servants out, so the only way to deal with incompetence is to "reorganise" on a regular basis, so that the dead wood gets moved to a "new" department, with glowing references of course.

Politicians and civil servants are "not accountable". There are so many examples of monumental failures across a number of sectors, but has anyone resigned, or lost their job as a result of getting it badly wrong? No, they get platinum plated inflation proofed pensions, despite costing US a fortune in failed projects that don't deliver.

Just a few examples. Irish Water. HSE, Local Authorities in general, and that's only a small cross section of the areas of major problem. I was at a meeting of the local authority recently where some of the permanent staff from the Planning department were presenting some information. The local councillors asked some "leading" questions, which the planners didn't like, and one of them looked up and said "We are from the Planning department, but we are not responsible or accountable for what happens".

In a sentence, that's the fundamental issue that's wrong with so much in Ireland now, there is NO accountability or responsibility for the actions taken by state bodies, and it is the ordinary people that end up paying massive premiums for the neglect and malpractice that is an ongoing problem, and that's without taking into account the many examples that have been reported where corruption has influenced the decision making process.

It's not going to change any time soon, there are too many people with very strong motivation to ensure that "the system" keeps on working (for them) in the way that it has for the last few decades, the people inside the system are very secure and provided for regardless of the way that things are going, but the rest of the people, they will continue to see a decline in just about everything that "the state" does on their behalf.

Schadenfreudia

Check this:

http://www.historyireland.com/20th-century-contemporary-history/fifty-years-of-busaras/

It seems objections all and any new transport developments have a rich dysfunctional history in the Free State! :rolleyes:

The Irish Times today celebrates the Scott Talon Walker building as a national treasure - it wouldn't exist today if the IT and FG has their way.

Ditto almost any bit of national infrastructure we've constructed since the Shannon scheme at Ardnacrusha.

GerardKeating

Saw this on Facebook, kid of sums up why we need good public transport.

Thrashssacre

Would it be possible after dart underground is build (if it's built) to add terminating platform to the St Stephens green station for future inter city services?

Schadenfreudia

Thrashssacre wrote: »

Would it be possible after dart underground is build (if it's built) to add terminating platform to the St Stephens green station for future inter city services?

I doubt it.

Imagine the storm you'd get going if they had to dig up even more of Stephen's Green! Frank McD almost has a seizure (spread across thousands of words in dozens of articles) at the thought of even temporarily removing the Traitor's Gate.

It would make burrowing under the Fenian dead in Glasnevin seem like a lark in the Park

Sam Russell

Thrashssacre wrote: »

Would it be possible after dart underground is build (if it's built) to add terminating platform to the St Stephens green station for future inter city services?

Why would you do that? The tunnel would only take electric trains and why terminate them in the middle of the city? Surely you would take them onto Clondalkin or Docklands.

Thrashssacre

Schadenfreudia wrote: »

I doubt it.

Imagine the storm you'd get going if they had to dig up even more of Stephen's Green! Frank McD almost has a seizure (spread across thousands of words in dozens of articles) at the thought of even temporarily removing the Traitor's Gate.

It would make burrowing under the Fenian dead in Glasnevin seem like a lark in the Park

I was thinking that myself adding anymore platforms would be putting then dangerously close too the basements of the old Georgian houses, there was another idea that was in one if Irish rails plans too turn clondalkin into an intercity stop too allow interchange with dart but there hasent been any word on that since so I'm assuming that's dead too

D.L.R.

Thrashssacre wrote: »

Would it be possible after dart underground is build (if it's built) to add terminating platform to the St Stephens green station for future inter city services?

Surely it would make more sense to continue on to Pearse and Docklands and terminate there.

AngryLips

D.L.R. wrote: »

Surely it would make more sense to continue on to Pearse and Docklands and terminate there.

It would make ultimate sense to terminate them at Dublin Airport via Clongriffin spur so that Dublin Airport can better serve as a hub for the entire country ...given that it's fast becoming that already.

Sam Russell

They would not need to go through the Dart Underground Tunnel - they could get there through the PPT.

D.L.R.

AngryLips wrote: »

It would make ultimate sense to terminate them at Dublin Airport via Clongriffin spur so that Dublin Airport can better serve as a hub for the entire country ...given that it's fast becoming that already.

Northern Line capacity is the achilles heel there.

Schadenfreudia

D.L.R. wrote: »

Northern Line capacity is the achilles heel there.

I guess if we spent on infrastructure like our international competitors a branch underground from Inchicore/Heuston to MN would be an obvious move....