The Great Big Lawnmower Thread

deezell

€3500. Assuming its a 2021 machine, 5112 ZL, it's about right price wise, with a bit of room to haggle and assuming at least 6 months warranty on engine, tranny and main deck components (though this might not include timing belt, as you can break these us you snag a root or clatter a post etc). See if you can push it to 3200, with a common sense warranty, maybe get it for 3300.

They'll pull up a decent slope, but the limit is safety, not its ability to climb or lube the engine. Too steep is dangerous if the front lifts and you go back pulling it with you. More of a risk on manual box mowers with belt clutch, sudden release facing up a steep slope woul easily flip these over assisted by a heavy bag and heavy driver. 15° or 1 in 4 is the recommended maximum slope on a tractor mower.

redseat1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120147398#Comment_120147398

Thanks, have messaged them to ask about any warranty...

redseat1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120147398#Comment_120147398

Said he'd give 3 months warranty. Tbh not bothered about the warranty too much as I know someone who can take engines apart in his sleep anyway. I offered 3,000, he said he wouldn't budge on 3,500, might go back with the usual "split the difference" proposal.

Neverat

Hi Folks, I'm new to this forum and I think I dropped my original post in the wrong channel so I'm giving it another shot.

I have a question for lawnmower experts. I'm looking at buying a Stihl RM655 V mower (4 wheel version).

A dealer (that had Stihl models in stock but not this one) told me there were problems with the variable speed model and he wouldn't be stocking them in future. These mowers are also sold under the Viking brand (afaik). I searched net but could only find problems with the chain drive on the rear drum roller models, (Viking MB 655 ?/Stihl RM655R model). STIHL are a premium brand, (not a guarantee of anything anymore !), I liked the spec on this 4 wheel model and i am wondering if anyone has any experience with this or similar variable speed Stihl/Viking models?

My second question is if anyone has experience with my second choice the Toro and their "Personal Pace" auto drive system they use?

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can provide.

Neverat

deezell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120158085#Comment_120158085

You shouldn't have a problem with the variable drive. No chain on these. These drives are well proven, horizontal belt to vertical pinion drive gear and clutch on the rear axle, with a variable diameter v pulley on the pinion shaft. I've had to replace one of these drives on a high quality Stiga I owned, but it had been in continuous use for 16 years, so it owed me nothing. More common issues would be the variable speed bowden cable which pulls the belt tighter and opens the pulley faces reducing its effective diameter, thus speeding up the mower. I've had these break a few times in the life of various mowers, a bit like a bicycle brake cable. It is an extra thing to go wrong, but the choice of speed is very useful, and the only difference between a fixed speed and variable is the split pulley on the gearbox, and the cable mechanism.

I think the Toro mechanism is a composite of the speed variator operated by the clutch bar which also engages the drive to the wheels, so that the harder you push the drive bar forward, the higher the belt ratio and speed. How well it works I couldn't say, but the mechanics of it are the same.

Stihl are high end, they are actually the Viking brand rebadged when Stihl bought the Viking company some years ago. You won't find any green Viking walk behinds at this stage I reckon. I see the 655 VS and 655 VM on offer at mower.ie , the website of ISE Forest and Garden. Both have variable speed, aluminium deck, mono bar handle, but the VS has a B&S engine, and a blade brake clutch. The VM has a Kohler engine. Blade brake means you can leave the mower idling while emptying the bag. They're only asking an extra €100 for this option, which just about covers the parts used. At €1190 though, you should look at all options and higher end brands, Honda, Harry, etc. The Stiga 55s Twinclip, https://mower.ie/product/stiga-twinclip-55-s-h-bbc-self-propelled-petrol-lawnmower is a contender in your price range, with a Honda engine, variable speed, unique double faced Twinclip blade for finer cutting, and blade brake, and it still has the dna of the original Swedish brand before the Castelgarden merger. Happy hunting.

Neverat

Hi Deezell,

Thanks for reply, was impressed with some of your comprehensive posts in this section. Just looking for guidance really from someone in the business. I'm only domestic but I like good reliable equipment. I cut my mother's rough garden also so need to factor weight for lifting into back of an estate, Stihl approx 46kg, Weibang 52 kg for 21" plus the Alu decks versions only go to about 70mm high. Stihl goes to 85mm, My current old Toro goes 90mm +10mm modification. The height , weight, and collection bag rules out a good few machines for me.

Heard issues with variable speed Stihl, was surprised at dealers view on Stihl. I do most of my own servicing on self prop and ride on and trimmers so glad to hear it's a simple mechanism. Would like the BBC version but can get a new RM655V on offer at €950 at moment so that's tempting. The Kohler engine is my preference rather than the lower powered B&S, read there were problems with the 675 series B&S.

The Toro Alu deck at same money, goes to 108/115 mmm high which I like but I'm doubtful of the Personal pace, i understand the concept but how does it handle around shrubs, kerbs and tight corners, you push handle for drive but if you only want manual push around fiddly bits how do you push it without engaging drive. I also tilt up the front for some manovers without drive engaged so would that be a problem? I know its good on large open lawns.

The Honda HRX have good spec but are a longer machine (bad in tight corners) not as reliable as previous and overpriced I think.

Are there any problems getting Stihl mower parts in Ireland?

As some guy said on one site you get 90% of reviews from 10% of users (and some of them may have no experience), most people who are happy with the product don't go on sites to leave feedback so its nice to get balanced feedback. Unfortunately machines that were well made and reliable 10 yrs ago their current crop may be rubbish so your views are appreciated.

Thanks

deezell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120159059#Comment_120159059

You have your research well done, and all your observations are spot on. I wondered was height an issue, you're on the money there, and I see you've done a height rack mod like myself for good clearance. I also wondered if weight was an issue, 53cm mowers can be an awkward lift into a car. I've a Cobra alu deck machine which I used to have to collapse into the boot of the car for mowing an elderly relatives garden, but thats history now, (the relative, not the mower). Some mowers are better than others for lifting and folding the handles. I had considered the Husqvarna composite deck LC353 mower at one stage, I checked it out and was satisfied with its simple, open but robust construction, quality of its drive, wheels and handles, and it's light composite deck at 30kg. It had a cutting height of only 75mm, which is fairly low. I opted for the electric start Cobra in the end as it was mostly used by herself. The Husqvarna brand has suffered in recent years though as it tries to compete at the lower end, and is exiting that segment afaik.

You're also accurate in describing how some robust brands have sourced some models from the generic pattern market, in order to have an economy range. Others may have downgraded quality due to mergers. The almost unaffordable Stiga brand did shift downwards when the company was bought by GGP, aka Castelgarden. Over time though the Castelgarden products seemed to improve from their big box days, and they have attained a quality level and price in their larger models. It seems though that they are trying to differentiate the Stiga models again. GGP is now Stiga Group. I was impressed with their electric start model when I viewed it some years ago, it was second on my list, but I regret not going for it. Deck fitting, wheels, handles and controls were very well made.

Stihl have a large network of dealers, based on their hand tool legacy, and often only keeping parts stock for the smaller stuff, unless they were also Viking dealers, but they have a main distributors in the city. Parts through dealers are very expensive, but their iron grip on simple things like part manuals and part numbers has loosened thanks to the Internet. I rang a Viking/Stihl dealer a few years ago and asked for a price on a tractor mower deck timing belt by its part number. After a telling pause, he said, defensively, " where did you get that number?". I asked was it a trade secret, was I not supposed to know it. The Viking manual actually was, for main dealers eyes only, but the web is your friend. He never rang me back with a price. If you fix your own stuff you'll be well able to hunt for competitive prices further down the road should you need them. If you choose well, hopefully you won't need any for a long time.

s_carnage

When looking at mowers I noticed some dealers had different numbers at the end of the model number. Is this to do with the year of the machine? For example 1 dealer had Stihl RT5112.0Z while another was RT5112.1Z. Both were same price

redseat1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120147398#Comment_120147398

Not budging of the €3,500, most he will take off is €50 luck money! Will leave it a few days and see...though I do like it and they don't seem to come up that often.

Neverat

Hi again, I'm on Ozi time here!

Thanks for that info, heard delays with Stihl parts ok but one site referenced a few dealers near Hamburg for parts ( but you probably need specific part No's) hopefully wouldn't be a problem for a few yrs. Yes most decks are single point height adjustment, this leaves modification difficult due to the lateral connecting bar hitting the bottom or top of the deck. I just bought a scythe sickle bar mower yesterday with a Honda GCV170x engine so that will take some of my height concerns out of the equasion!

Most of the steel decks i looked at are paper thin with a heavier rim to hold shape and dreadful welding work that will last 2 to 3 seasons for the average punted who doesnt clean regularly hence my alloy Toro 5hp OHV heading into its 33rd season and still rocking with little maintenance, but drives other half scatty if she's watching a soap on terrestrial TV channel when i start it up, but plans must be made for that inevitable day she dies ( not the wife, the mower!).

Not just convinced on the composite/plastic/Xenoy decks with "lifetime " guarantee yet, i have seen the effects due to UV light , fatigue with bolt mounting points, also bolts been under or over tightened and even inconceivable deck holes due to a stone or piece of metal in the garden. The dealer says "I have seen 8 -10 yr old ones still running" but as Shania Twain says "that don't impress me much".

I have had no responders on the Toro Personal Pace drive systems or plastic wheel gear problems despite there being a good few of them about. My Toro experience is good (30yr old,) but that doesnt count for much on modern builds.

Brand name build quality and reliability flucuates with mergers, take overs and cost cutting from season to season and model to model all we can do is due diligence and as the banking industry will advise you after the fact (not when their selling the product) "previous returns are no guarantee of future gains" or some such pearls of wisdom.

Some would say I'm a pessimist, I'd say realist.

Thanks again for your help and advice.

deezell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120159746#Comment_120159746

It may refer to the change of engine to Stilhl badged engine from the B&S legacy engine of the Viking 5112. What does the dealer say.

deezell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120163523#Comment_120163523

33 years together ❤ Man and Machine! Better get Toro some new plugs for February 14th. Some flowers for the other half also.

Igotadose

I have an area of lawn around 13 meters by 10 meters that needs occasional mowing, but I can't run anything heavy out there, no big power mowers. Strimming it can be done but....ugh... that means it doesn't get strimmed too often!

I looked at a push mower at Woodies, looked like junk, frankly, cheap and plasticky. Anyone got a good quality, not too massive a push mower they'd recommend, or some other mower? There's a septic field below it with pipes and all and all we can do is walk on it, no motorized equipment at all.

Neverat

Thanks Deezell, good advice as usual.

redseat1

Kinda getting to the end of the line in the Stihl and Viking hunt, they are thin on the ground and still slightly beyond what I had planned to spend.

Any thoughts on the John Deere X155R? This one is €400 cheaper than another on DD, and has 150 less hours on it. Thanks.

https://www.donedeal.ie/gardenequipment-for-sale/john-deere-x155r-ride-on-lawnmower/33300304?campaign=3

deezell

Old machine, 2016-17? 6 seasons work. Asking price suggests it was over €6000 new, they were £3500 in the UK in 2017. https://www.mytractorforum.com/threads/x155r-or-x350r.1198057/

Nothing special, domestic level machine. The deck says it's the older model too. See this review of that very machine bought 2017 by a user with 140 hours up. https://youtu.be/4dWUEjYBlEY

Too much money for ordinary quality and high enough hours. Pity you missed the Stihl.

redseat1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120220032#Comment_120220032

After your reviews here, I ruled out Snappers, Castlegardens and Husqvarnas. That's very lukewarm praise for John Deere. I think I'll hold out and wait for another Stihl or Viking so. Thanks for the help, knowing what NOT to buy is just as valuable as knowing what to buy!

deezell

I'd have no problem with a decent Castelgarden, they improved immensely after they merged with Stiga. Even before that they were ok, I had one that was nearly 20 years old when I sold it. It was almost their first generation Twincut, 98 vintage, Italian made, cheapish but fit for purpose with care, kind of like the Fiat of lawnmowers. After 20 years it had general wear and tear and looseness, but the B&S V twin engine was perfect. I did replace a good few structural parts over its life. It was worth €400 to a happy buyer.

Again, used prices should be based on depreciation and condition from new. I don't think it was me who dissed the Snapper, the issue with more expensive machines is that they get bought for semi commercial use. I seen quite a bit of criticism of Huskies from more recent era. They werec always pricey and premium, perhaps their attempts to get a bite of the lower domestic market compromised parts and build quality. You'd have to inspect any mower such as that JD and decide if it was still solid, not loose and wobbly jointed. JD also chased the dragon in terms of market share, they had budget models in Europe that were actually green painted Castelgardens.

I'm not saying that the JD is not decent, its just that one was their lower offering for the cut size, and any other 42" of decent brand that used and old wouldn't command €3.3k. Put in perspective, their current X350R is roughly the same size machine, but a 3 series to the 1 series of the X155R. Its €9k new.

deezell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120220407#Comment_120220407

Alko are a robust European made brand, plenty of dealers here, and a main distributors in Portarlington. They use some common deck parts on some models to the Viking and Stihl, This 103cm cut V twin B&S equipped Hydro machine is a few hundred more for brand new than the used JD. https://www.donedeal.ie/gardenequipment-for-sale/solo-by-al-ko-ride-on-lawnmower-t16-103-7/30319020

Used ones are scare, which says something about owner retention. There's this private ad but for a new machine, €2650, probably an older model. Seems to be some kind of trader as he says 'last one'. I don't know if there's vat to be added, what the warranty is, but its decent cut and spec. https://www.donedeal.ie/gardenequipment-for-sale/alko-power-lawnmower-brand-new-40-cut/31938423

Gardner

Have done a bit of homework and I've exhausted all avenues in trying to source a decent hyundai lawnmower in Ireland.I've a large sloping Site approx 2500m2. Anyone know anyone that supply's the below?

Looking at 2 models.

Hyundai 22”/56cm 196cc 4-in-1 Electric-Start Self-Propelled Petrol Lawnmower | HYM560SPE

Or

Hyundai 21”/53cm 224cc Electric-Start Self-Propelled Petrol Lawnmower | HYM530SPE

deezell

I last seen those blue Hyundai versions in Chadwicks. They're a pattern Chinese made mower, available in other generic brands. Heres the Woodies Pro Lawn version of the HYM530SPE, bang for your buck. Identical in every way. I think they have the big 56cm also. Solid enough, the one in Naas was on display with the battery wired, I turned it over and it had a powerful starting clatter off it. Good job it had no juice in it, but it would take your fingers off even with the starter. Shouldn't have been wired up!

There's also a Victor 51cm Electric-Start available from Glanbia or Tirlan as they're now know. It has the B&S instart engine with the clip in power tool style battery and charger. https://www.tirlanfarmlife.com/shop/product/Victor-Self-Drive-Lawnmower-Drive-Instart-20in/9093212

Same mower here in Sligo for only €450, pretty good for an aluminium deck (they claim) electric start B&S. https://nwg.ie/product/victor-electric-start

The GMan

Hi All - Servicing / repair question.

I have an AMA ride-on. Need to remove the deck to replace the broked drive belt.

Deck has two big springs holding it in place, I can't see an easy way to get these off.

I have searched the web for it and found no good instructions.

I can provide pictures and diagrams if there would be of any use.

thanks

deezell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120243132#Comment_120243132

Put up a few images. I think Ama decks might be common to Castelgarden. Heres two images from the few Amas you'll find for sale, the first appears to be a very open design non synchronous drive, just one big double sided V belt that curls around a series of pulleys to drive the left and right blades in opposite directions. The second image is of a synchronous deck, a small V belt drives the left blade, then a second toothed timing belt under the cover transfers the power to the right blade but rotating in opposition to the left, and with the blades overlapping, but not striking due to the timed belt between them.

Non synchronous

Synchronous.

It should not be necessary to remove the deck to replace the drive belt in either case, but attach a few images of the deck, the springs etc.

The GMan

Hi Dezell,

Thanks for coming back to me.

Mine looks a lot like the symchronous version above.

The mower deck belts are Ok, but the tractor drive belt has broken.

The mower is fairly old 2007, model AMA SG 12-102H, S/N 007240117

This is the parts document

http://www.ama.it/img-catalog/TRATTORINO%20SG%20200-102H%20-%20TRACTOR%20SG%20200-102H%20-%20code%2013895.pdf

The only service manual I could find was in another language (which I am guessing is Czech) so it has some diagrams but no understandable instructions (I suppose I could type it all in to Google translate)

I couldn’t find an english service manual for the AMA, but the Serial Number label showed it to manufactured by Karist

Following that I found some comments indicating that they were part of the Seco Group of mowers “Seco Group: AGS, Starjet, Lawnboss, Turbo Green, Turbo Cut, Agri Jet and Karsit.”

This eventually led me to a service manual for a Masport AJ-102, which looks to have the same deck setup. Below are some extracts from this service manual.

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRgWQbPEBC4ba9E0us3pWFLA7FVO5TuDmjj2QcLK2iJd3FOc-6cLXixWBdW-cMqwoiwp4c&usqp=CAU

thanks for taking a look at this.

deezell

You wouldn't have to release the deck counterbalance springs, as they're attached to the deck mounting levers. You just unbolt the levers from the deck itself, and the lifting cables if they are attached directly to the deck, at the back. which I'd say they are. You also have to release the deck clutch cable, and unhook the deck V belt, which needs to be removed engine side anyway to replace the transmission drive belt above it. It may be convenient to drop the engine pulleys to clear guide rails also.

If its a hydro, which the diagram shows it as, it should be possible to remove the drive belt without taking off the deck. Sliding out the rear chute will expose the hydro box to lift the belt off the transmission pulley. The tensioner is mid mounted (no 3), and the belt will lift off the 4 guide pulleys behind it. These may need to be loosened as they are generally close fitted to the frame, so the belt won't clear the outer edge of these pulleys . If there's a floor cover in front of the seat this may help with access. Even with the deck off it can be a Knuckle Skinner of a job.

I done my Viking drive belt over the winter, several of the small guide pulleys were noisy, bearings poor, it helped to have the deck off, the Viking has a tool free deck mounting, just pull two pins and drop the deck belt engine side, but loosening the four small drive belt guide pulleys was a pita. As always, swearing helps.

That image of the synchronous deck came from an ad on Donedeal btw, it looks identical to a Castelgarden 102 deck, which I removed many times from a CG I had.

The GMan

Thanks deezell.

I want to be able to get he deck off anyway for maintenance, and trying to put on the drive belt with it in the way will be a pain I think.

I'm 99% certain that the spring connecting to the deck tensioner arm to the deck raise/lower mechanism will have to be removed, it's just very difficult to get at and get any pressure on it.

I'm 80% that there are no cables going to the deck, and there are none showing in any of the diagrams I have found, but I will double check.

I'll have a search for a Castelgarden 102 service manual and see i if it tells me anything.

thanks again.

deezell

TC102-2002-.pdf

I think the deck lift by bowden cables was revised aftee 2000 to the lever lift shown in this 2002 diagram. I had a lot more of these downloaded but I cleared a huge amount off my Google Drive last year. Some similar diagrams to be had here

https://www.diyspareparts.com/parts/castel-twincut-lawnking/diagrams/tc-102-lawn-tractor/ . One of these sites had all TC102 from 97 to 2008/9, the all of the subsequent 102cm cut mowers with different numbering system, but I can't find it in my bookmarks. Even if the deck is identical, the lifting mechanism may be unique to Ama.

deezell

Looking at the diagram you linked, I don't see much similarities to the CG deck of that era tbh.

In the photo I can see the large spring which pulls up on the deck lift levers, I don't see why this should be uncoupled if you just disconnect the levers from the deck housing. lift the deck and lower it onto blocks, then releasing the lift lever will make it easier to uncouple it by taking the weight off the levers.

One way to find commonality of brands is to run a part number in Google. Running the timing belt number 410201760 for example, brings up the belt, but listed as suitable for other brands, AGS, Starjet, Axxom, which probably use that deck, and also Snapper, being the most familiar name. There's a good chance this mower had other common construction to these brands, albeit most are as obscure here as Ama.

I was able to source parts and save quite a bit using this trick, when I discovered my 48" Viking deck was very similar in construction to an Al-Ko 48"deck. I was able to buy deck shafts and a timing belt using the Alko equivalent part numbers for substantially less. One supplier was even quoting two different prices for the same inventory depending on whither you gave the Alko or Viking number.

Gardner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120242179#Comment_120242179

Thanks for this. Might give the pro lawn a go, another I've compared it with is the Cobra MX534SPH. I've about 2500m2 to cut and sloped in areas but the beer holder on the Pro lawn is drawing me to it 😁

deezell

It's said that Volvo owes its current market position to being first in Europe to introduce cup holders way back. It's the little things...