Pint prices to rise again?

BraziliaNZ

How on earth can they even be considering this? I used to go to my local once or twice a week a few years ago, now i never go, I'd usually just go out once a week in town. And they wonder why business is so bad? Raising the price of a pint is the solution? Are these people drop-dead stupid or what? I love when i see pubs closing down due to lack of business, they deserve it the greedy pigs. If prices go up again I'm saving my money and drinking abroad every couple of months, or driving up north!

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/pubs-ponder-dearer-pints-after-price-freeze-breach-1846071.html

By Tim Healy and Breda Heffernan


Thursday July 30 2009

Publicans were last night mulling over whether to raise the price of a pint after a High Court case which forced the end of a price freeze.

It was still unclear last night whether the price of a pint would go up or, more unlikely, go down, following the High Court ruling that a price freeze by publicans amounted to a breach of competition rules.

Industry sources admitted to having "no idea" what the outcome of the court decision would be for drinkers, although some sources suggested it would be "insane" for publicans to put up the price of drink in a recession.

The Licensed Vintners' Association and the Vintners' Federation of Ireland announced a 12-month price freeze on December 1 last year in a bid to encourage drinkers back to the country's pubs.

However, the High Court last week found the two groups were in contempt of court by recommending the pricing initiative.

Mr Justice Liam McKechnie yesterday ruled that an announcement by the publicans' organisations reversing the price freeze was a sufficient response; however, he ordered that they should take out advertisements in three Sunday newspapers outlining that the freeze is no longer in operation.

The court was told that the LVA and VFI had issued a press release on Tuesday countermanding the freeze announcement and had also sent letters to all their members notifying them of the countermanding decision.

Contempt

The Competition Authority had brought the action seeking to have the organisations found in contempt of court because the price freeze breached an undertakings previously given by them in a 2003 settlement of previous proceedings over alleged drink price fixing.

The court heard the Competition Authority was not looking for any penal consequences for the publicans and was only interested in upholding the law.

Yesterday, after being told by counsel for the organisations that they unreservedly apologised for their contempt, the judge said he was satisfied with their unconditional apology and with the press release/letters countermanding the original announcement.

"I am satisfied the steps taken by both associations countermanding the 2008 announcement, and the letters sent to their members, is a sufficient and adequate response to my judgment given last Friday," he said.

Counsel for the Competition Authority argued publicity for the countermanding notice should be equivalent to the amount of publicity the price freeze announcement received last year, through some form of advertising in the national press.

The judge said the publicans should place advertisements containing the press release in three Sunday newspapers this week.

He also gave permission to the Competition Authority to put his judgment in the matter on its website.

- Tim Healy and Breda Heffernan

AnonoBoy

About bleedin' time. The Vintners Association has been taken advantage of by the Irish people for long enough.

It's a shocking outrage that they've kept their prices so low for so long and now even with the hint of a small, almost miniscule increase, the public get all annoyed? No way man. No fuppin' way.

Publicans deserve our respect and admiration for the service they provide and they deserve to profit handsomely from it.



















Today is Backwards Day, right?

unwyse

+1 anonoboy,these sterling citizens have been helping irish peeps forget their problems since noah was a boy and they do indeed deserve a "round" of applause,but unfortunately i cant pay!cheers to all ye publicans,may all your troubles be small ones.

ejmaztec

AnonoBoy wrote: »

About bleedin' time. The Vintners Association has been taken advantage of by the Irish people for long enough.

It's a shocking outrage that they've kept their prices so low for so long and now even with the hint of a small, almost miniscule increase, the public get all annoyed? No way man. No fuppin' way.

Publicans deserve our respect and admiration for the service they provide and they deserve to profit handsomely from it.





















Today is Backwards Day, right?

I raise my glass of water to you sir.

EdgarAllenPoo

I love when i see pubs closing down due to lack of business, they deserve it the greedy pigs.

So you like seeing people that work for the publicans lose their jobs, how nice.

If prices go up again I'm saving my money and drinking abroad every couple of months, or driving up north!

Go up north or just go into your local supermarket, most people I know just drink at home because you can get a better selection in a shop and bring it home, it's cheaper and you don't run the risk of a random stranger puking on your shoes on the way home.

anti chris-t

Just goes to show that these price freezes and these price reductions by other companies are all a facade and they're just waiting for the day they can rip us off again.

Time Magazine

Relax. The High Court case was taken because the Vintners' oh-so-lovely "price freeze" was really a "lads let's all agree to not lower prices, even though the whole country is f*cked and demand has fallen." It's a subtle, but awful, move. And was rightly ruled illegal.

Deflation is running at 5%. So a price freeze is basically the same as all the pubs agreeing a 5% increase when inflation is flat. We woudln't accept that, so well done to the Competition Authority.

Prices can now fall. Consumers, you know what to do if any publican raises their prices!

unwyse

if anyones going up north to drink may i recommend the queens arms on the shankhill road, a fine pint served here just ask for sammy,cheers.:D:D

Slow Motion

So, the price freeze is considered to be illegal and has been overturned! Every other business in the country is looking for ways to reduce costs and pass the saving on to the ever decreasing number of punters with money in their pockets in the hopes of retaining their business. And the publicans are mulling over wether to increase prices or not? I go to my local less and less and if they up the prices instead of bringing them down I will stop completely. Time to start thinking seriously about home brew again. These bastids have been gouging regulars for years and profiteering so much they make politicians and bankers look like philantropists (sp?). Talk about living on another planet. The unfortunate thing is that when (not if) more pubs start going out of business the only losers will be the staff and the public. The owners have already made their money many times over and obviously don't give a fcuk about the people who run and drink in their premises!

BraziliaNZ

GDM wrote: »

So you like seeing people that work for the publicans lose their jobs, how nice.



Go up north or just go into your local supermarket, most people I know just drink at home because you can get a better selection in a shop and bring it home, it's cheaper and you don't run the risk of a random stranger puking on your shoes on the way home.

Wow you sound like tonnes of fun, PM me for beers!!!

Wazdakka

Looks like it's back to getting drunk on turpentine again for me..

Time Magazine

Slow Motion wrote: »

So, the price freeze is considered to be illegal and has been overturned!

(Just to be clear: it was that they all banded together to agree to a price freeze that was considered illegal. For obvious reasons competitors aren't allowed to all meet up and set prices because consumers always get raped.)

Vim Fuego

There's two pubs in Dublin now doing €3 pints all day every day - The Scene under Stephen's Green Shopping Centre and The Russell Court Hotel bar I think. More of this please!

Seaneh

It's about time thw VFI were done for anti-competitive practices.

There is a well known case of a publican in Athlone who sold all pints for €3 everyday.

He was a member of the VFI and the chairman of the Athlone brance and two other publicans came into the pub one day and demanded to speak to the owner, so they wait while the owner arrives and when he gets there start going on about "if you want the protection of the VFI you will have to bring your prices into line with the rest of us etc..." owner opens his wallet, takes out a cheque that he'd made out for his next membership fee and riped it up, threw it at them and told them to get the **** out of his pub.

They, VFI-Athlone had basically admitted, infront of an entire pub full of people, that they fix prices amongst themselves, they have no shame at all.

EdgarAllenPoo

BraziliaNZ wrote: »

Wow you sound like tonnes of fun, PM me for beers!!!

Was that a weight joke?:pac:

Mossy Monk

I am so seldom in a pub these days a price increase will keep me out of it even more. Greedy assholes.

Slow Motion

The Economist wrote: »

(Just to be clear: it was that they all banded together to agree to a price freeze that was considered illegal. For obvious reasons competitors aren't allowed to all meet up and set prices because consumers always get raped.)

I am well aware of the reasoning for doing it and the implications and agree with the court. I am also aware that many pubs just happened to have price increases a couple of weeks prior to the vintners gesture.

Saruman

Probably a good thing (court ruling). I would imagine the story about publicans considering a price increase is sensationalist tripe by the indo though. Any pub that increases prices in a recession should be boycotted.

Thankfuly I do not think the pub I frequent in Dublin (when there) is a member and the type of beer I drink in a pub is not something that an increase by breweries such as diagio, heineken or any of the other multinationals effects either.

Even still, regardless of the price of beer I am lucky enough to be a home brewer so I always have a ready stock of beer that is better quality than anything you get in an average pub I do still buy premium beer though.

gurramok

The Economist wrote: »

Relax. The High Court case was taken because the Vintners' oh-so-lovely "price freeze" was really a "lads let's all agree to not lower prices, even though the whole country is f*cked and demand has fallen." It's a subtle, but awful, move. And was rightly ruled illegal.

Deflation is running at 5%. So a price freeze is basically the same as all the pubs agreeing a 5% increase when inflation is flat. We woudln't accept that, so well done to the Competition Authority.

Prices can now fall. Consumers, you know what to do if any publican raises their prices!

You probably know the exact figures but off the top of my head, bar sales were reported to be 10%+ down year on year but prices for alcohol went up i think around 3% considering off-licence prices have plummted, it makes you think where that price rise was.

They never cop on. They think we are stupid.

I only go to the homebrew pubs as they always have their lovely pints at 4quid a pop, OR i do go to the cheapest Diageo/Heineken themed pubs which are few and far between.

A pint of lager/bitter/stout would struggle to hit 3 pounds in the UK even in the poshest districts. Serious rip-off here.

BraziliaNZ

that's the thing, they'll start going on about wages, costs of services etc. The UK is pretty much the same as here for all these things (probably cheaper) and you can find pints for under £2 all over the place, the dearest ones will be £2.80 or so, which is probably only 3.50 euro.

Slow Motion

Every time I come back from a trip abroad I almost feel physically ill when I have to pay for a round in the pub! I am by no means a tightwad but the sheer blatent pay up or fcuk off attitude of publicans in this country is simply staggering. I can only speak for Dublin pubs here I don't know what it's like in the rest of the country. Anyone remember Witherspoons wanting to come into the Irish market with their cheap pints. Didn't get very far did they, I wonder why?

super_furry

No publican in Ireland can justify the €5 to €6 per pint that they often charge. I now refuse to drink in pubs that charge these prices and honestly, couldn't care less if these rip-off places go bust.

JohnK

The Economist wrote: »

Relax. The High Court case was taken because the Vintners' oh-so-lovely "price freeze" was really a "lads let's all agree to not lower prices, even though the whole country is f*cked and demand has fallen." It's a subtle, but awful, move. And was rightly ruled illegal.

Was it not the case that the price freeze was an upper limit on the price they could charge? In other words that they could charge whatever price they wanted but couldnt exceed a certain amount so in effect there was nothing stopping them from dropping prices all along?

Nick_oliveri

Slow Motion wrote: »

Anyone remember Witherspoons wanting to come into the Irish market with their cheap pints. Didn't get very far did they, I wonder why?

When was that? Witherspoons ft****ingw!
The meal specials... Gorgeous.

Time Magazine

Just some more background information on this folks: this is a long-running fight between the Competition Authority and the publicans, going back at least ten years.

But unfortunately TDs seem to favour the publicans over consumers. When this High Court action was announced, Chris Andrews TD said the Competition Authority were worse than a skinhead organisation, Ned O'Keeffe TD agreed. Dara Calleary TD really didn't grasp the thing at all, saying: "I understand the Competition Authority are taking action against the Vintners Association and the Licensed Vintners Association because they want to keep prices down. I cannot understand this. We are banging our heads, as I am sure the officials are, to try to bring down prices. However, when organisations come together to bring prices down, the Competition Authority decides to take them to court."

It should come as no surprise to anyone that all three of these anti-consumer buffoons are in Fianna Fáil.

JohnK wrote: »

Was it not the case that the price freeze was an upper limit on the price they could charge? In other words that they could charge whatever price they wanted but couldnt exceed a certain amount so in effect there was nothing stopping them from dropping prices all along?

It's complicated, but basically no. Even the High Court (which is notoriously crap at enforcing competition policy tbh) ruled that it was basically a bunch of businessmen agreeing to freeze prices to stop anyone from lowering them.

JONJO THE MISER

I used to go to the pub 4 to 5 nights a week, now i go once every 2 weeks, why? the price of a pint is a rip off, 4 bleddin euro for a pint, i stopped going to the pub when it rose from 3.20 to 3.30 in my local 1 year and half ago now its bleedin 4 euros, so i dont want to hear pubs complaining there just too greedy, now i just go to Lidl and get my 6 pack of beamish for 1.68 a can:cool:

El Siglo

The Economist wrote: »

Relax. The High Court case was taken because the Vintners' oh-so-lovely "price freeze" was really a "lads let's all agree to not lower prices, even though the whole country is f*cked and demand has fallen." It's a subtle, but awful, move. And was rightly ruled illegal.

Deflation is running at 5%. So a price freeze is basically the same as all the pubs agreeing a 5% increase when inflation is flat. We woudln't accept that, so well done to the Competition Authority.

Prices can now fall. Consumers, you know what to do if any publican raises their prices!

Thank you Economist, it's like a breath of fresh air reading that post!*

*And I am saying this in all sincerity I do take my pint prices seriously.

gurramok

According to here http://www.soldiersofdestiny.org/tddrinklobbyscandal.htm

40% of FF TD's are publicans.(2006)

BraziliaNZ

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

I used to go to the pub 4 to 5 nights a week, now i go once every 2 weeks, why? the price of a pint is a rip off, 4 bleddin euro for a pint, i stopped going to the pub when it rose from 3.20 to 3.30 in my local 1 year and half ago now its bleedin 4 euros, so i dont want to hear pubs complaining there just too greedy, now i just go to Lidl and get my 6 pack of beamish for 1.68 a can:cool:

Where are you drinking where 4 euro is dear for a pint? Malin head or something?

Saruman

I think my local is something like €3.80 for Guinness which is not bad by Irish standards, though its more (for less volume) for bottles of muck like Coors etc.

Matches

A few years ago you could hardly get in to a pub in Dublin City on a friday evening, ooooooo how things have changed now. I agree they should drop the price of drink to get people in the door. 6.60 for a pint on templebar, daylight robbery.

For 2 pints and a glass of wine on the cill airne boat at spencer dock is €18.50, never again am I giving them my money.

tommyfitz

4.70 for pint of carlsberg in most pubs in Navan.
rip-off or what?

Aidric

You really have to stop and wonder what logic these goons are working off.

Time Magazine

El Siglo wrote: »

Thank you Economist

Don't thank me, I had nothing to do with it. I'm sure the Competition Authority would appreciate it if you said thanks, though

rubadub

GDM wrote: »

So you like seeing people that work for the publicans lose their jobs, how nice.

You are twisting what he means. It was shocking to see all those people with jobs in nuclear arms losing jobs, and the poor gas suppliers for the Nazis, my heart and lungs bleed for them.


I thought this price freeze was just a suggestion to pubs? i.e. it had no legal bearing at all and pubs certainly have been upping and lowering prices, I thought it was formally stated soon after it was announced that it was just a mere suggestion.

If so WTF are the high court getting involved?, and who footed the bill for the courts time on this ridiculous waste of time & effort. The taxpayer probably....

Will

Let them raise their prices, see where it gets them. People are way more price conscious now, hence the huge drop off in people heading out and going to pubs.

On the rare occasion I do now, I go to the off license first get a few beers and enjoy them at home with my mates. It's common place now. I hated paying between €4 - €6 for a pint or even a bottle of beer when same can be got from an off license way cheaper.

BraziliaNZ

4 cans of Karpackie/Hackenberg for me later on, 5 eur!!! this thread will just make me enjoy them even more

Time Magazine

rubadub wrote: »

I thought this price freeze was just a suggestion to pubs? i.e. it had no legal bearing at all and pubs certainly have been upping and lowering prices, I thought it was formally stated soon after it was announced that it was just a mere suggestion.

If so WTF are the high court getting involved?, and who footed the bill for the courts time on this ridiculous waste of time & effort. The taxpayer probably....

This is what JohnK was getting at when he said...

JohnK wrote: »

Was it not the case that the price freeze was an upper limit on the price they could charge? In other words that they could charge whatever price they wanted but couldnt exceed a certain amount so in effect there was nothing stopping them from dropping prices all along?

...to which I replied "It's complicated, but basically no." Now I'll try and explain the jist of the complicated bit.

Cartels rip people off. They go out of their way to charge higher prices to rip people off. It's stealing. Everyone agrees that over-charging the people of Galway and Mayo by €4m a year is wrong. I think it's worse than robbing €4m from a bank -- at least a bank has insurance, etc.

But unlike bank robbers, cartels don't leave much evidence behind. There's no smashed window, finger-prints, or opened safe. It's five lads in a pub or sitting-room talking for ten minutes a year. They don't even have to say anything illegal. "Hi Ted, I hear you're charging €5 this year. Me too. Anyone else?" That's it.

Five men can't do that much damage. They might be the five men who own pubs in Thurles, and if that's the case Thurles takes a bit of a hit. What's really dangerous is when somehow all the pub owners in the country agree on prices. So you have "trade associations".

Trade associations do some good. If you want to build a road, asking the engineers' association is a good idea. They can enforce standards and kick out bad members. Grand. But they can also do a lot of harm.

This is why section 4 of the Competition Act explicitly forbids any agreements by trade associations (such as the Vintners) that tries to "directly or indirectly fix purchase or selling prices".

Businessmen aren't idiots. They know well if they come out saying "Let's all raise prices" that they'll be prosecuted. So cartels come out with notices "advising" or "suggesting" members do this that or the other to prices. The only thing that's missing is the wink and the nod.

Section 4 of the Competition Act (and Article 85 of the EC Treaty) is phrased precisely to outlaw any of these "suggestions". Why? Because we all bloody well know that there are cartels robbing us blind, but we don't have enough evidence to convict them. So we bring in a law saying you cannot even talk about prices. It doesn't stop the five lads in Thurles, but it prevents scum changing things nationwide with "suggestions" of their competition should set their price.

So you ask why did the High Court get involved and who paid for it. The High Court got involved because the Competition Authority brought the Vintners there. They didn't bring the Vintners to court under the Competition Act, they did it under contempt of court proceedings. Why? Because it's not the first time the Vintners have done something like this. When they did, rather than go the full legal route, the Competition Authority reached an agreement with the Vintners (with a court order) essentially saying "Down with this sort of thing." The Vintners weren't careful now, blatantly broke the terms of the agreement, and that's why the High Court got involved.

Who paid for it? The Competition Authority have legal advisers who are paid by the State so I guess you could say the taxpayer paid for it. This is exactly what taxpayers should be paying for: a few quid to make sure they're not robbed blind. And save us from being robbed blind they do: be that by vintners, home heating oil, grain importers, car sales, or a €250m government beef scheme.

Though you rest easy, the Vintners will have to pay costs seeing as they lost.

Tubberadora

What people are forgetting is the extorsionist taxes placed on publicans by the government.
It is true that you can get a 24pack of Miller etc in the off licence for 20euro, however a publican will be paying around 40euro for 24 bottles. On top of this there are rates and service charges, wages, prsi, entertainment, etc. The bar I run is one of the cheapest in town but still couldnt really afford to drop prices much more unless a gauranteed increase in volume of sales.
What some publicans are doing are buying drink direct from off licences and selling it at a huge profit. These are the places that should be avoided and the first to close down IMO.
PS My bar is not affiliated to the vitners.

Red Sleeping Beauty

The Economist wrote: »

(Just to be clear: it was that they all banded together to agree to a price freeze that was considered illegal. For obvious reasons competitors aren't allowed to all meet up and set prices because consumers always get raped.)

All Ireland's pubs are run by a cartel of about 5 basterds!

As far as I know yer not allowed advertise cheap drink so even if a pub lowers its prices it can't tell you. Poxy cuntry. Ironic though considering we're famous alchies!

Saruman

Alan Rouge wrote: »

All Ireland's pubs are run by a cartel of about 5 basterds!

As far as I know yer not allowed advertise cheap drink so even if a pub lowers its prices it can't tell you. Poxy cuntry. Ironic though considering we're famous alchies!

How does that work Alan? Pubs have to advertise their prices so if someone sticks a big poster in the window saying all draught beers are €3 they are complying with the law and the fact it is pretty cheap does not matter. You can not have one law saying you have to advertise your price and another saying you can not advertise your price if it is too cheap

Quint

The Economist wrote: »

This is what JohnK was getting at when he said.....................................
...to which I replied "It's complicated, but basically no." Now I'll try and ............they lost.

Great posts, cheers!

Time Magazine

Alan Rouge wrote: »

As far as I know yer not allowed advertise cheap drink so even if a pub lowers its prices it can't tell you. Poxy cuntry. Ironic though considering we're famous alchies!

And of course it is the vintners who want to ban cheap alcohol because it means more competition because it means lower prices for consumers because it means less profits for publicans because WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN.

Of course the Vintners turn up at the Dáil and get big hugs from their Fianna Fáil TD buddies. Here's a few nice quotes:

Deputy Dara Calleary, FF: "I thank the delegation from the VFI. It never ceases to amaze me that politicians are not supposed to talk to publicans in some quarters."

Deputy Chris Andrews, FF: "I welcome the delegation. As someone who served his time with Charlie Chawke in The Goat, I have an affinity with publicans. As Deputy Calleary said, the Competition Authority rigidly adheres to a philosophy of deregulating absolutely everything and ignores the social consequences of its actions ... I am pressing for its dissolution."

Deputy Ned O'Keeffe, FF: "I welcome the representatives of the Vintners’ Federation of Ireland. They have my sympathy because their business is falling." (Followed by the Chairman replying "Deputy O’Keeffe, you should declare your interest in this matter"!)

Deputy Michael Fitzpatrick, FF: "I welcome the delegation from the Vintners Federation of Ireland. I have a little knowledge of the business as a few years ago I did a costing with a view to purchasing a pub in a rural area."

Senator Ivory Callelly, FF: "I welcome the delegation from Vintners Federation of Ireland. I particularly welcome my good friend and colleague, Mr. Val Hanley, whom I have known for a number of years and who has done trojan work for the federation."

Sigh.

ShooterSF

A lot of this could be solved in my opinion if they removed the need for a license. If you or I could but a location turn it into a pub and get going it would make things more competitive. As it is if a pub goes on sale (in Navan lately anyway) it and it's license is snapped up by a current publican who then sells the pub without the license so it can be turned into a bookie or a car park and there's one less competitor in town.
It's not helped either that pub's hands are tied when it comes to promotions as you can no longer do happy hour or such. That move should be repealed to help.

senordingdong

Typically Irish.

Customers are dropping off like flies so they make the remaining customers fork out more to make ends meet.

Same with the fags imo.

Biggins

The Economist wrote: »

Just some more background information on this folks: this is a long-running fight between the Competition Authority and the publicans, going back at least ten years.

But unfortunately TDs seem to favour the publicans over consumers. When this High Court action was announced, Chris Andrews TD said the Competition Authority were worse than a skinhead organisation, Ned O'Keeffe TD agreed. Dara Calleary TD really didn't grasp the thing at all, saying: "I understand the Competition Authority are taking action against the Vintners Association and the Licensed Vintners Association because they want to keep prices down. I cannot understand this. We are banging our heads, as I am sure the officials are, to try to bring down prices. However, when organisations come together to bring prices down, the Competition Authority decides to take them to court."

It should come as no surprise to anyone that all three of these anti-consumer buffoons are in Fianna Fáil.


It's complicated, but basically no. Even the High Court (which is notoriously crap at enforcing competition policy tbh) ruled that it was basically a bunch of businessmen agreeing to freeze prices to stop anyone from lowering them.

Much appreciated this post and others here that you've brought to our attention. Much grateful thanks.

Many years ago I used to work for a Louth publician who was a member of the FF party and a leading member of the VFI. He used to laugh all the way to the bank with the huge profits he was making (and purely as a business man, rightly so) but as the prices increased with the LVA and the VFI support/methods he just made the customers pay more and more. His attitude was "fcuk 'em!"

I note recently that he acknowledged the nations current disgust at FF memebers in general - so what did he do? He ran in the latest local elections as an "Independent" as to avoid being found out to be still a FF member. By the way, he is still a pub owner and off licence owner.

Long story short, the tactics being used to keep prices inflated are NOT in the best interest of the public. FF does NOT want the Competition Authority to have any "teeth" despite what they might claim for the cameras (if they truly meant it, they would reinforce the organisations ability to enforce change which the org' has been crying out for, for years!) but rather have it floundering as a partly ineffective organisation. Only that way will FF members with business interests in bars, restaurants and other economic non-alcohol related businesses, etc continue to do what they want, when they want and as far as they are concerned - screw the public!

VFI, LVA and RGDATA (the shower that tried to (and did) keep Lidi, Aldi out of Ireland for years) are nothing but big boys club looking after their own profits - not giving a damn about basic staff and their jobs now more so at risk, at all across the nation.

Red Sleeping Beauty

Isn't there a subsidised bar in the Dail ?

Slow Motion

Tubberadora wrote: »

What people are forgetting is the extorsionist taxes placed on publicans by the government.
It is true that you can get a 24pack of Miller etc in the off licence for 20euro, however a publican will be paying around 40euro for 24 bottles. On top of this there are rates and service charges, wages, prsi, entertainment, etc. The bar I run is one of the cheapest in town but still couldnt really afford to drop prices much more unless a gauranteed increase in volume of sales.What some publicans are doing are buying drink direct from off licences and selling it at a huge profit. These are the places that should be avoided and the first to close down IMO.
PS My bar is not affiliated to the vitners.

See this is the problem. Publicans attitudes to falling custom has always been to put the prices up, whereas every other business drops their prices to increase footfall, look at any of the retailers! No one can guarantee an increase in the volume of sales, however I can guarantee that as long as publicans have this attitude sales volume will decrease! I have never come across a pub that lowered it's prices other than the occasional promotion which is a rare occurrence these days, I am open to be corrected on this.

tommyfitz

ShooterSF wrote: »

A lot of this could be solved in my opinion if they removed the need for a license. If you or I could but a location turn it into a pub and get going it would make things more competitive. As it is if a pub goes on sale (in Navan lately anyway) it and it's license is snapped up by a current publican who then sells the pub without the license so it can be turned into a bookie or a car park and there's one less competitor in town.
It's not helped either that pub's hands are tied when it comes to promotions as you can no longer do happy hour or such. That move should be repealed to help.

You mean Finnerty's pub being turned in Boylesports. Just what town needed... another Boylesports. We already have 3 others.

BraziliaNZ

senordingdong wrote: »

Typically Irish.

Customers are dropping off like flies so they make the remaining customers fork out more to make ends meet.

Same with the fags imo.

The LGBT community is the PC term, homophobe

ShooterSF

tommyfitz wrote: »

You mean Finnerty's pub being turned in Boylesports. Just what town needed... another Boylesports. We already have 3 others.

Exactly. Which was bought originally by the owner of Ryans pub. The Foresters was bought by the then owner of the Newgrange Hotel and turned into a car park.